How to get faster?

[The35]

I'm actually not new in GT, I've playing with the series from GT 2, but about a year ago started to take it a bit more serious. Bought a playseat and an entry level wheel (DFGT) and tried to practice with all aids off. Now the thing is that I spend quiet few hours on track, try to learn precise cornering, hitting the APEX, shifting n’ things, but still I’m way behind the fast drivers (around 8 sec/course lap). Sometimes I feel that few of my fast laps are on the limit of the given car and track and cannot believe someone can complete 8 sec faster with the same setup, but the reality is disappointing when I check other’s lap times J.

Now I’m wondering, what could make the difference to be fast/faster driver besides of lot of practicing of course? Maybe just with some certain talent can be achieved to put real fast times on the table? I don’t know, but would be great, if someone can give some guideline, if there is any technique can be applied in order to gain some consistent development. What I can think about, maybe the car setting can help, I mean the Bake bias, suspension setup... I started to play around with these setting, helped a bit, but definitely not that much could make huge differences.


Sorry for the long post, maybe seems silly or too general, but these are questions I cannot answer by myself, but maybe someone from here...J


Thanks in advance.

 

[Gwenbors]

You'd be surprised at how much big differences can build over the entirety of a racetrack with nothing but small differences in each section. You figure if there are 10 corners and the other driver has you by 2/10ths in each one, that's a two-second gap by itself.

It makes a difference too who you're measuring yourself against. It sounds like you play a lot and could probably keep up with most other online drivers, but if you're comparing against Global Lap Leader times in Seasonal Events, the leaders are usually in a class of their own. I also find it frustrating how far off of the top-ten times I am in a lot of those seasonal events, but I usually don't spend lap after lap trying to wring out every last kph from the track.

As for tuning, you'd really be surprised. I can knock a few seconds at least off of my own best lap times just by fiddling with suspension setups, brake balance, and body-weight ballast to suit my driving style. (I tend to be a bit of a lead foot, so a little too late on the brakes and little too early on the throttle works for me, but not with most stock chassis set ups).

On the darker side of things, there ARE still a few physics exploits that some online drivers can exploit to gain extra advantage. The classic trick was (and still is) running with two tires in the dirt on the straight-aways to gain some extra speed (it's some glitch in the physics engine). Even I have been known to put my inside tires in the dirt on some corners and using the "grip reduction at track edge" to slow the car down rather than using my brakes.

Long story short, though, I'd suggest taking a closer look at tuning set ups and finding some that fit your driving style, and maybe watching some of the replay videos of the lap times you'd like to match (if possible). There's no better way to learn from somebody else's driving style than watching them do it!

Either way, good luck!

 

[The35]

Thanks for the explanation, it helps to understand a bit better how things work. You're probably right about the measurement, everybody want to compete against the best times, but that is just not realistic and negatively effect the motivation.

Anyway, I'll will try to take your advises and develop my skills in every perspective (definitely I have a lot to improve)

The tuning maybe the hardest part, I think you need lot of time to understand each parameters how will affect the car behavior. Honestly, I'm kinda lost in the setting, but found some good articles on the forum about suspension settings and non ABS guide, I guess all I need is to start implement it

Thanks again!

 

[sparkytooth]

Breaking your fingers and ring lapping, helped me understand the car better.

 

[Squanto]

I just checked your GT5 trophy list and saw you didn't put much effort into the special events, did you?
If you didn't you might like to go back there because there is a lot to learn from it ...
I particularly enjoyed AMG challenges and the grand tour ... they learn you so much about driving lines ... brake points and shifting gears ... you might want to deepen that experience too...

I think the good part of it there is that its a static environment ... you only measure yourself against that static environment ... if you don't progress as you would like ...there is a lot to read about how to progress ... on the fora around here ...

tuning is the next step after you completely own a certain track ... else its hard to check if the tune is working in your advantage or you just improve your skills on that track ...

Also golding your licenses are a good test ...

(but this is just my opinion ... )

Enjoy GT! 👍

Breaking your fingers and ring lapping, helped me understand the car better.

Yep ... I adore ring lapping.... the feedback is enormous

 

[The35]

What I do currently is lapping in time trial mode and try to learn the courses and beat my own times, unfortunately this activities give no trophies so not visible I guess.. maybe this is not the best learning method, what I've thought, if I learn the track and go around and around will do the trick, but maybe to step back and practice only stages instead of whole circuits you advise can help. I'll try it definitely!
Thanks!

 

[DolHaus]

If you are looking for a better understanding of the tuning aspects then myself and @Motor City Hami both have guides which will help you understand how to make your car go faster and suit your driving style better.
I would suggest reading mine first as it cover the parts and application in a simpler way and then move on to Hami's because it explains the application of tuning in a much more detailed way.

My guide :- https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/general-tuning-guide.297354/
Hami's :- https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/motor-city-tunes-gt6-miata-roadsters.291066/#post-9003798

Hope this helps

 

[Squanto]

What I do currently is lapping in time trial mode and try to learn the courses and beat my own times, unfortunately this activities give no trophies so not visible I guess.. maybe this is not the best learning method, what I've thought, if I learn the track and go around and around will do the trick, but maybe to step back and practice only stages instead of whole circuits you advise can help. I'll try it definitely!
Thanks!

The nice thing about the AMG challenges is that it cuts the Ring up in four sectors ... so you get the chance to learn every sector thoroughly.
(I just use the trophies as an indication on how you play the game ... )
If you like the GTR on the Ring there is a nice trophy to achieve ... in GT5 ... quite challenging and good practice ...
I think its useful to use trophies to your advantage .. or licences ... it gives a lot of feedback .. as a single player ... and its easy to compare to friends or other players ... and see how experienced they are...

I have a DFGT too I taped it on the "twelve o'clock" ... I found that really helpful ... especially on Rally tracks

 

[sparkytooth]

But isn't he supposed to be on GT6?

 

[Kitten]

Practice, Practice.

 

[sparkytooth]

Try to get handy with a difficult car so you'll acquire better car control.

 

[Squanto]

But isn't he supposed to be on GT6?

Yep ... but tell me where you can learn the ring in GT6 in the same fashion ...

 

[sparkytooth]

Yep ... but tell me where you can learn the ring in GT6 in the same fashion ...

By that logic he should be playing GTPSP, which divided the Ring into 8 sectors. GT6 has a better dynamics model over GT5, and some corners won't be the same as in GT5.

Like any other course, this one must be learned over time, the more you drive it, the less you endanger your A-spec Andy. This course is especiallly good given all the types of corners and elevation changes it offers.

 

[Johnnypenso]

Couple of things.

Can you post a video of one of your fast laps?

For now forget tuning. Use tunes from popular garages and save yourself the trouble for now....one thing at a time.

 

[SCClockDr]

...
Now I’m wondering, what could make the difference to be fast/faster driver besides of lot of practicing of course? ...

1. Have a look at Skip Barber - Going Faster. In fact watch a section and then practice that skill till you feel you have it in your muscle memory.
2. Re-compete in your career mode progression using only comfort hard tires and 20 less PP than max allowed. When you can control the car and win on occasion you are building your learned skills into your muscle memory.
3. Above all practice with more difficult conditions for you. (Make it hard on yourself vs easy)

Good luck in your quest for more speed!

 

[The35]

Thanks, guys did not imagine that much help so thanks! To not mess up completely the thread, try to react in 1 post.


@DolHaus,

Thanks for the links. I’ll go the guides starting with yours. Did not have too much time so far checked only, but seems easily understandable and this is mostly matters to me now! J


@sqanto,

I appreciate your support! Go to it AMG, got it! J

I Like GTR because at the beginning was challenging to handle, but after some time just got better. I think still got the GT5, if I find it check the challenges there too.

What I’ve modified on my DFGT is the pedals, put some sponge under the brake pedal, that helped a lot to make the brake harder, anyway, I’ll tape up my wheel today. J

@sparkytooth

Z370 basic and GTR I using to practice, I found that cars hard to handle (on my level), of course maybe not the most challenging ones.

@Johnnypenso,

I have no video to post currently, but I start implementing these great advices from now, and soon make a fast lap to publish. J About tune, I don’t want to get lost in the settings, but DolHaus’s guide seems something I could use. So fingers crossed. J

 

[The35]

1. Have a look at Skip Barber - Going Faster. In fact watch a section and then practice that skill till you feel you have it in your muscle memory.
2. Re-compete in your career mode progression using only comfort hard tires and 20 less PP than max allowed. When you can control the car and win on occasion you are building your learned skills into your muscle memory.
3. Above all practice with more difficult conditions for you. (Make it hard on yourself vs easy)

Good luck in your quest for more speed!

Thanks you! very helpful, will check the video too.

 

[DolHaus]

Thanks, guys did not imagine that much help so thanks! To not mess up completely the thread, try to react in 1 post.


@DolHaus,

Thanks for the links. I’ll go the guides starting with yours. Did not have too much time so far checked only, but seems easily understandable and this is mostly matters to me now! J


@sqanto,

I appreciate your support! Go to it AMG, got it! J

I Like GTR because at the beginning was challenging to handle, but after some time just got better. I think still got the GT5, if I find it check the challenges there too.

What I’ve modified on my DFGT is the pedals, put some sponge under the brake pedal, that helped a lot to make the brake harder, anyway, I’ll tape up my wheel today. J

@sparkytooth

Z370 basic and GTR I using to practice, I found that cars hard to handle (on my level), of course maybe not the most challenging ones.

@Johnnypenso,

I have no video to post currently, but I start implementing these great advices from now, and soon make a fast lap to publish. J About tune, I don’t want to get lost in the settings, but DolHaus’s guide seems something I could use. So fingers crossed. J

I hope it helps get you on your way, if you have any further questions or problems then feel free to ask
Best of luck

 

[nursemorph]

You may find that a lot of the faster drivers use different lines, shifts etc to most other people. I am not the worst driver around but I was pretty poor when I transitioned from GT5 to 6. However, I have improved massively over the last 2 months due to participating in the WRS Weekly Time Trial events...not only are some of the fastest drivers around involved but you get good advice on the laps and can see how you compare via the leaderboards. There are some cars that I would actively avoid (namely RWD cars that have a lot of power) as I could never control them but I can now control them quite well. Incidentally, I use a DS3 so if I can improve, then anyone with a wheel could improve. If you are interested in the WRS, then check here (this is the Qualifier everyone has to submit to participate):

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/gtp_registry-qualifier-gt6-submissions-open.294799/

You can also see our active events and past events:

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/board/gtp-weekly-race-series-time-trials.117/

 

[TRC GeorgiaDawg]

What I do currently is lapping in time trial mode and try to learn the courses and beat my own times, unfortunately this activities give no trophies so not visible I guess.. maybe this is not the best learning method, what I've thought, if I learn the track and go around and around will do the trick, but maybe to step back and practice only stages instead of whole circuits you advise can help. I'll try it definitely!
Thanks!

Seat time in the car and practice are always the most important things to getting fast. Time trialing against yourself is a good way to learn a little, but you'll probably just be repeating the same mistakes without any reference to tell you're doing something wrong. I'm not among the fast in GT6 just yet, but I climbed to the top in Forza just by practice and taking advantage of the learning tools that were provided. Unfortunately, GT6 doesn't have what I considered to be the most important learning tool from Forza. Which is a comprehensive leaderboard system. GT6 does have the 3 seasonal events every 2 weeks which you can use in the same way. But what I did was always race the #1 ghost on a couple of short tracks that provided differening types of corners (Suzuka East and NY short). Especially at first I didn't care that by corner 3-4 the ghost would be so far ahead I couldn't see anything. The whole idea was to learn how the fastest got through corner 1. Making sure to really pay attention the ghost and the drivers braking points and lines. After a while I'd find I was going through corner #1 just as fast, and sometimes faster, than the top ghost. So I moved on to corner 2. And so on. Eventually after months and months of hard work and harder driving I was posting #1 times. Some of them stood for long periods of time as well.

This method won't work as well on GT6 simply because of the lack of full LB's. But the seasonals can provide some of the same thing. Run the top ghosts and watch their replays and turn as many laps as you can. That's my best advice.

 

[nissman]

You could also try joining a racing league here on GTP. As you get to practice with faster drivers you will learn a lot from them by watching their driving lines, throttle control, etc. Also by watching the race replays from these events will get you tons of information as you can watch every driver exactly how he drives.

I remember in my case when I first started racing in organised GT500 races I was about 2.5 sec of the leaders pace. In the first season I got 1 second faster in 2nd season I found another second in 3rd season I was fighting for the championship and actually won it.

So my advice is to practice and practice against faster drivers and the lap times will surely come.

 

[Oshawa-Joe]

You could also join a league such as S.N.A.I.L SPEC Racing, where fast guys are willing and available to coach you. Below is a comment made today by a fairly new member.

.....


Fourth credit to the racers who took the time to teach me these last two weeks (This is the biggest part and why a racing league is so awesome, the other part being that they offer the practice/racing cycle). @K1utch (on breaking down the track, car physics & driving techniques), @VrapPlus (on breaking down the corners), @fizzer, @FloydC3, @Schmiggz, @Pifachu, @joe_diben, and others (the week before @TEX36 (Situational Awareness, Track boundaries and Passing responsibility). Sorry if I forgot someone. (Who was it that spent a half an hour inching our cars back and forth so we could figure out exactly when the side markers came on and changed colors and exactly when a car was half way up the side of our cars?) Credit here also goes to the racers in Division 7 who raced fair and did not let emotion get the best of them even when I made mistakes.

Last and least credit goes to my long and hard (enjoyable) work, but even that comes from points One and Two above.

btw, if anyone wants, I'd be glad to pass on what I have been taught.

p.s. I just finally broke 2.30 on SPA (2:28.729) due to @msgt-sd & @dgaf95integra helping me tonight. I don't know how they did it, I didn't think it was possible (a 2:29), but they actually changed my whole perception of the track. They made it happen. Thanks very much!

 

[cunny17]

Try not to overdrive the car. Going into a corner a bit to hot can mean wasting a few tenths before you can get back on the throtlle, and if it leads onto a long straight by the next turn you could have lost 3/4's of a second. This often happens to me when trying to keep up with racers who are quicker than me.

 

[86Debris86]

Great thread. You guys are all awesome. GTP's community rarely fails to impress me with the sound and friendly advice on offer.

One thing I'll add is something I read around here somewhere (may have been one of the guides DolHaus posted above) (correction - it was from Oshawa-Joe)

Look at which corners have the longest straights right after them. They should be the one's you concentrate on first as they will usually be where time is most easily gained and lost. Focus on getting good exit speed here since there isn't much else you can do to change your speed on the straights.

 

[waukazoo]

I'm actually not new in GT, I've playing with the series from GT 2, but about a year ago started to take it a bit more serious. Bought a playseat and an entry level wheel (DFGT) and tried to practice with all aids off. Now the thing is that I spend quiet few hours on track, try to learn precise cornering, hitting the APEX, shifting n’ things, but still I’m way behind the fast drivers (around 8 sec/course lap). Sometimes I feel that few of my fast laps are on the limit of the given car and track and cannot believe someone can complete 8 sec faster with the same setup, but the reality is disappointing when I check other’s lap times J.

Now I’m wondering, what could make the difference to be fast/faster driver besides of lot of practicing of course? Maybe just with some certain talent can be achieved to put real fast times on the table? I don’t know, but would be great, if someone can give some guideline, if there is any technique can be applied in order to gain some consistent development. What I can think about, maybe the car setting can help, I mean the Bake bias, suspension setup... I started to play around with these setting, helped a bit, but definitely not that much could make huge differences.


Sorry for the long post, maybe seems silly or too general, but these are questions I cannot answer by myself, but maybe someone from here...J


Thanks in advance.

The info in the above posts is really good stuff, and will help anyone to improve.

But are you being fair to yourself compairing times?
If you are you compairing your lap times with all aids off against the top guys on the leaderboard running with aids on. Are you compairing apples to oranges?

Their are very few in the top thousand or so running with no aids. I'm not saying they are not fast, they are fast, very fast with or without those aids.
Clicking on any name in the leader board will show what they have on or off.
So before you beat yourself up over the times make sure you compare apples to apples.

I have only been at this a short while gt5 and now gt6. So they above post are far more experienced than I running fast laps.

I have found useing a tune for a car in a partcular time trial in the tuning section or seasonal threads has help me alot to improve lap times and learning to tune a car to run on a specific track. I don't excpect to be able to drive a car well just because I now have a tune from someone that has a fast lap time though.

A tune has to suit your needs and abilities. I find tring different tunes then pick one I feel comfortable with my driving style and still puts me close to or better than my best lap and then use it. Use it alot, Adapt, get comfortable with it, tweek it, learn how to improve it for YOU.

Don't change multiple settings at one go. See and learn what it does for the car one setting at a time. Try to asses what I want or don't want the car to behave like while running laps and make one adjustment at a time tring to bring that result.

 

[mr_lab_rat]

Join a racing club. I would suggest GTP WRS as it focuses on time trials. You will be able to download other people's replays to watch or follow as ghosts.
For example I just learned I had a bad habit of keeping partial throttle under braking. I saved half a second on one minute lap.

 

[Oshawa-Joe]

You can always search GTP for "12 things to make you faster "

That thread started originally with the same question as this thread. At the time I was 6 seconds per lap slower than the fast guys.

 

[86Debris86]

You can always search GTP for "12 things to make you faster "

Just did. Got 3 results, first of which was your post just now.

 

[The35]

@nursemorph

Thanks a lot, did never attended restricted events only open lobbies. The qualifications seems kind of difficult, but will try it. I might drop you a PM if you don’t mind in case I’ll get lost.


@TRC GeorgiaDawg

Congrats for your results and thanks for the advices! I don’t know, but if possible will try to “ghost the ghost” to have braking point references.

@nissman

I’ll check the GTP events to along the others were advised. Thanks!

@Oshawa-Joe

I’ll check it too SNAIL, but I afraid that will not work for me due to time zone differences.

@cunny17

Thanks, I’ll keep in mind that.


@86Debris86

I’m very positively surprised, did not imaged that much help from you guys! Superb community! J

@waukazoo

In this case, maybe I’m not full fair with myself, didn't take this in account. Actually, I assumed that the fastest people going with all aids off because this is a simulator, and why you would go in “arcade mode” if you are looking for realism? That is good start for beginners who are not experienced enough for simulation jet. Never mind maybe is just my logic J, but thanks a lot highlight this important fact, and for the advises too!


@mr_lab_rat

Thanks for the advice, will check it!

 

[The35]

You can always search GTP for "12 things to make you faster "

That thread started originally with the same question as this thread. At the time I was 6 seconds per lap slower than the fast guys.

Roger that! Thank you again!