How's the "scooder"?

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Razzbar

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I haven't won an Escudo yet, and was wondering how it is in GT4 compared with the one in GT3... ?

In GT3, it was like a bad joke. Or a good one. It did win me a lot of prizes. It's just that the thing looks so goofy, and drives so goofy, it's well... goofy.

Is it as bad/good in GT4? Does anybody actually race it? I mean, I could see it easily winning all the dirt races like in GT3... but when you have a car than nothing can come even close to beating, it's not really that fun...

But see... I had this idea the other night, that it might be fun to take a lap on the Ring, entirely on the grass. Escudo is the most logical car for a goofy drive like that. Rubber band the Ring in a Skooder. Sick. 💡
 
Well all I can say of 5 minutes experience before I sold it is that its a challenge and does not suit my driving style IMO.
 
On dirt it has traction problems with all the power.
On tarmac it does not turn that well.
In a straight line it is fast.
It still is ugly as a brick and about as aerodynamic.
And you have to buy dirt and snow tires for it before you can go rally driving.
 
It isn't as good as it was in GT3. It understeers more and it only tunes to around 1200hp instead of 1800. It isn't too bad around Nurburgring as long as you stay off the gas in the corners and keep it in the right gear.
 
What a difference though, in GT2 it was a very good handling car....no? Atleast if my memory serves me right. But in GT3 it was hard to handle, and in GT4...well I have yet to get it.
 
scoobyonline200
What a difference though, in GT2 it was a very good handling car....no? Atleast if my memory serves me right. But in GT3 it was hard to handle, and in GT4...well I have yet to get it.
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GT2 it was magical but in GT3 and 4 it is just horrid. :nervous:
 
It's obnoxious to drive on any rally or road course. The turbo lag makes it undrivable.

From a rest, it crawls...

And then you wait and wait and you wait and you wait. And then you wait and wait and you wait and you wait. And then you wait and wait and you wait and you wait. And then you wait and wait and you wait and you wait...and then it speeds up Very Quickly.

But now there's a corner, so you have to repeat the process all over again.
 
The Escudo is a very specialist car and given the use it was put to in real life I very much doubt it was an easy car to drive.

To gain some insight into the workload that a car of this nature watch the 'Climb Dance' video of Ari Vatenan in a Pug 405 T16 at Pikes Peak. Even a driver of his amazing ability has to constanly work to keep the car on the road.

The key to the Escudo is very much like the TVR Speed 12, in that they require great throttle control. The turbo lag in the Escudo can be controlled in a similar manner to how you would in the real world, through left foot braking. Keep the throttle open to keep the turbo spooled up while you brake, this does require a great deal of control and is certainly easier with a DFP.

The Escudo and the Speed 12 have a lot in common in that they are not bad cars just because people find them difficult to drive, rather they are potentially great cars that simply demand a great deal from the driver.

After all, life would be very boring if every car was a doddle to drive.

Regards

Scaff
 
Scaff is right, with practise the Speed 12 and Escudo are very good cars.

In GT4 the Escudo still has very big spoilers but can be tuned to go very quickly
 
Scaff
The key to the Escudo is very much like the TVR Speed 12, in that they require great throttle control. The turbo lag in the Escudo can be controlled in a similar manner to how you would in the real world, through left foot braking. Keep the throttle open to keep the turbo spooled up while you brake, this does require a great deal of control and is certainly easier with a DFP.
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So, is it fun to drive with a DFP, or is it still worth criticising?
 
The Escudo was a top handler in GT2 on a paved road course. That thing could fly around any course you could name. GT3 and GT4 turned it into a wallowing pig. How could it have changed so much from one game to the next? I've never seen so much turbo lag on a Stage 4 turbo. It even wears tires out faster than it should seeing how light it is. In all fairness, I only tested it on a few courses. No ovals or Sarthe or Infineon. I might work somewhere. It was a slippery dog at Midfield and a tire-eating monster at Route 246.

I have to go and work on that car some more. Maybe I'm at fault due to not knowing how to set it up properly. I hope I'm just missing something.
 
It changed beause the physics became more realistic, GT2 was nothing like GT4 in terms of realistic physics, it's not a car designed for road racing.
 
Pupik
So, is it fun to drive with a DFP, or is it still worth criticising?
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I personally find it a challenging but fun car to drive


SirBerra
The Escudo was a top handler in GT2 on a paved road course. That thing could fly around any course you could name. GT3 and GT4 turned it into a wallowing pig. How could it have changed so much from one game to the next? I've never seen so much turbo lag on a Stage 4 turbo. It even wears tires out faster than it should seeing how light it is. In all fairness, I only tested it on a few courses. No ovals or Sarthe or Infineon. I might work somewhere. It was a slippery dog at Midfield and a tire-eating monster at Route 246.

I have to go and work on that car some more. Maybe I'm at fault due to not knowing how to set it up properly. I hope I'm just missing something.
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As L4S has just said, how a car handles in GT2 is hardly a great representation of realisim.

Don't get me wrong I'm a big fan of all the GT series (in fact as I write this I am in my hotel room waiting for GT2 to load up), but things have moved on massively. The levels of tyre grip offered in the earlier GT's was simply far to high and the handling model far to simplistic.

Have a read of the following thread I put together to see what I mean

Gran Turismo - A comparison across the series

Yes it does have huge lag in the turbo, but as I have already said its not a 'normal' car by any definition, it was designed to get up a mountain as quickly as possiable, drive the car corectly and the lag issues can be overcome.

As far as the tyre wear goes, weight plays second fiddle here to the sheer amount of torque the driven wheels have to handle if you go heavy with the throttle. Remember the torque delivered to the driven wheels of a car is not straight engine torque, you have to multiply this by the gear ratio and thene the final drive ratio, divide by the number of driven wheel and account for drivetrain losses. In the Escudo, in lower gears this figure is going to be huge, so a heavy throttle is going to fry the tyres.

You are very right in one point and that is the Escusdo is very sesitive to a good set-up, but then car set-up is far more critical in GT4 for most cars and tracks.

Regards

Scaff
 
Scaff
As L4S has just said, how a car handles in GT2 is hardly a great representation of realisim.
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From my expereinces with all of the GT series, with GT2 and GT4 being the ones I've played the most, I'd say a well-handling car in GT2 usually becomes an ill-handling one in GT4, and vice versa: Most Lotuses and a number of MR cars were evil-handling contraptions in terms of GT2 physics.

I'm not knocking the physics model of GT4, being that I've driven about 2-3% of the cars it has to offer, and maybe 1% of them in total at 8/10ths.
 
Hmm... maybe I should try this car then with a little patience and understanding I am guessing it can be an alright car. 💡
 
Pupik
From my expereinces with all of the GT series, with GT2 and GT4 being the ones I've played the most, I'd say a well-handling car in GT2 usually becomes an ill-handling one in GT4, and vice versa: Most Lotuses and a number of MR cars were evil-handling contraptions in terms of GT2 physics.

I'm not knocking the physics model of GT4, being that I've driven about 2-3% of the cars it has to offer, and maybe 1% of them in total at 8/10ths.
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Don't get me wrong GT4 is not the pinical of accuracy at all, but it is one hell of a lot further forward that GT2 in almost every way.

It was a very interesting exercise when I carried out the back to back tests across the GT series. I can remember being very impressed with all of them at the time of launch, but playing them one after the other realy does show how far PD have taken things.

Regards

Scaff
 
Ecxellent posts Scaff 👍. You have to remember that GT2 pushed the boundaries of what could be done on a Playstation, GT4 pushes them on the PS2 which is capable of a hell of a lot more than a PSX, but no clos to what can be done on a PS3, so expect GT5 and maybe GT6 to push the realism even further. I've often criticised GT4's physics but I've realised I was being overly harsh, no they arn't perfect, they arn't close, but just how much better ould they have been for a PS2 game? Not much, some aspects of the physics had to give. Like Scaff, I still boot up GT2 every now and then, it's a great pick up and play game compared to GT4 imo, but it's not near GT4 in terms of realism.
 
Best car by far in GT2. Still fast in rallies in GT4 but understeers horribly on the tarmac tracks. Out-accelerates a Polyphony FGT but there fly by you in the corners, presumably you haven't already thrown it of into the barriers. I haven't tryed it, but driving it with a steering wheel must be a nightmare.
 
no tcs needed
Best car by far in GT2. Still fast in rallies in GT4 but understeers horribly on the tarmac tracks. Out-accelerates a Polyphony FGT but there fly by you in the corners, presumably you haven't already thrown it of into the barriers. I haven't tryed it, but driving it with a steering wheel must be a nightmare.
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I actually find the Escudo far easier to drive with wheels and pedals, they make it far easier to control the throttle, also to left foot brake which makes a massive difference to the car.

Regards

Scaff
 
The Escudo is a beast that needs to be tamed. By itself it's near uncontrollable, and when I tuned it, I felt like I could hit the wall at any time.

That said, if you can control it, it has performance that bests most race cars in GT4.
 
The Escudo is phenomenal in a straight line but i do agree with others who say that understeer is a big problem.

On dirt tracks is where the Suzuki is at it's best. No tuning is needed to obliterate any other car on the rally satges, especially faster tracks like Swiss mountain.

With most of it's power coming in at high RPM's acceleration be sluggish in tight corners, but keep the engine in the upper power band and you will be flying.

When driven correctly the Escudo is a very capeable car, however lots of driver skill is needed when tackling road circuits:)
 
Du&#267
The Escudo is a beast that needs to be tamed. By itself it's near uncontrollable, and when I tuned it, I felt like I could hit the wall at any time.

That said, if you can control it, it has performance that bests most race cars in GT4.
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The big red beast is also named "The big red lawn mower"

And yes, when tunned correctly, it really is a bat out of hell
 
Scaff
I personally find it a challenging but fun car to drive

Have a read of the following thread I put together to see what I mean

Gran Turismo - A comparison across the series

Yes it does have huge lag in the turbo, but as I have already said its not a 'normal' car by any definition, it was designed to get up a mountain as quickly as possiable, drive the car corectly and the lag issues can be overcome.


Regards

Scaff
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Sure I know it's the Pike's Peak Escudo which was built to climb mountains in dirt, but since it was so fast in GT2 it was one of the cars that was always being used to beat everything else in the game. I just imagined that trait would carry to the newer games for some reason.

Still, the GT2 Escudo never had the type of turbo lag that the present one has. As far as the tire issue goes, I only used to use it with soft tires for attempting course record runs and probably never used it in road races so I don't know if the GT2 version Escudo did get good tire wear. Well I did use it in the final rally races for certain in GT2. I'm kind of lazy so I'm always looking for a magic car and this time it didn't meet up to my expectations. The Dodge RAM took the Escudo's place.

I never considered physics engine changes in simulators. I just figured they used some sort of formula and the game versions all ran about the same. It's just my lack of knowledge of game programming. Though when I think about it, it did seem in earlier versions (GT1 and GT2) the cars did seem to have better traction in general.
 
The main problem I have wit the Escudo is that it wont brake properly down past about 60kmh. Slowing from 180 to 60 is no problem, however slowing from 70 to 30 is a major pain in the butt whic includes more understeer than a half dozen 60s Muscle car.
 
Pupik
It's obnoxious to drive on any rally or road course. The turbo lag makes it undrivable.

From a rest, it crawls...

And then you wait and wait and you wait and you wait. And then you wait and wait and you wait and you wait. And then you wait and wait and you wait and you wait. And then you wait and wait and you wait and you wait...and then it speeds up Very Quickly.

But now there's a corner, so you have to repeat the process all over again.
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Can a car even be obnoxious?


On topic, I have no qualms with the Escudo other than the brakes.


Or lack of them.
 

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