I may have found the 'trick' to drifting.

[XCNuse]

..until your tires are flat.. then it will lol

 

[Evo7GTA]

? Now are you saying that tyre pressure does have an effect?

 

[Swift]

XNcuse. My challenge with what you're saying is not that it's "wrong" but if your settings are not good for drifting in GT4, then why try to keep saying that they are correct?

That's all I'm saying.

 

[vinsion]

Vinsion said:

(for example, harder brakes in the front [than the rear] meaning the tail slides out...just another form of that wonderful thing called oversteer ).

I didnt quite get what you meant by this vinsion. Why, and what was the benefit of using the 'technique' we're talking about when you have harder brakes in the front? Doesnt the cars tail slide out more when the rear brakes are stronger?

Here I'm talking about the brake controller. What I mean is when you have the brakes set to a higher level in the front, the tail end will tend to come around and cause oversteer but only when you offset the center of gravity by turning, otherwise, you'll just stop faster. This style is not to be confused with brake entry drifting, in brake entry, you hve a higher level brake setting in the rear so the tires nearly lock up, allowing you to slide it out manually, rather than having the tail end come out on it's own.

Vinsion said:

The trick works well in GT4 when a good feint is applied, but I've found that every time I use this trick, the drift itself becomes all about throttle control, otherwise its all about the wall . TIP: remember to reduce countersteer as soon as you grab the wheel again, because of the the extreme whippage you've been hearing about (or rather, realistic quality).

Sorry to ask you to clarify again vinsion, but what exactly do you mean by this? At what point should you grab the wheel again and reduce the amount of countersteer? Also. What is it exactly which you do differently instead of this 'technique' which you said is all about throttle control or else you go into the wall?

I'll start from the beginning here...
Ok, when you feint, the purpose is to let the suspension bounce you into losing grip in the rear, or rather, the iniation of a drift. So as soon as I am bounced into the drift, I let the wheel go from my hands and wait for the moment when the wheels are turned to exact amount of countersteer I need for the drift (depending on speed/turn angle/suspension tuning/current RPM/your own ego/etc.). At this point I grab the wheel again and wiat the point in the turn that I decide to reduce countersteer. Normally you want to reduce it about 50-60 feet before the end of the apex. But don't do this rapidly, or you'll be back to square one with the whole whipping out of it thing. Reduce CS slowly, gradually, and instinctually; over time you'll come to get the feel for what you need to do to make sure you don't 1: Spin out, 2: Whip out of the drift.

Hope that clarifies my oh so devious words for ya . If it doesn't, just PM me or talk to me on either AIM, or MSN

AIM: vinsionsan
MSN: vinred00@hotmail.com

Drift on/peace out/be cool/whatever,

</Vin>

 

[XCNuse]

@ evo... take the tire pressure out of any setup and you will ruin the way the car handles period lol

@ swift; i never said anyone was wrong? im just saying those settings are a good starting point for making a drift setup from scratch.. shoot.. i use those settings all the time lol i may change a few values but not many..

 

[foshoazn]

For some reason, it feels that drifting in gt4 is easier than drifting in gt3. The countersteer has to be more delicate, so that the you won't go out of control. The awesome thing is that the weight transfer does the work for you when linking drifts. I think the best technique is the feint drift 👍 . Works like a charm.

 

[KurtG]

Thanks for the explanations vinsion. Im not entirely clear on the brake bias thing but ill read up on some other posts that talk about that directly.

fosho- If the countersteering has to be more delicate to keep from going out of control in gt4, doesnt that mean that gt3 drifting was easier?..

 

[foshoazn]

KurtG - I mean it is harder to countersteer the right amount, but the linking of drifts is easier cause of the weight transfer, you don't have to force the car back into the drift, and you can get even larger drift angles on cars. It kinda feels like you can do more wild drifts in gt4. Well I use the AMUSE S2000, stock, and it is awesome the way it is. Oh and i use the dual shock controller.

 

[nate0rz]

It's kinda cool that it counter steers a little bit...

And yeah, this game could use caster...but then they might as well add thrust. How funny would it be to play with the thrust angle?

 

[Boundary Layer]

It's kinda cool that it counter steers a little bit...

And yeah, this game could use caster...but then they might as well add thrust. How funny would it be to play with the thrust angle?

lol,

i think incorporating thrust alignment settings is a bit overboard and too complex for most gamers. Unless you have a vehicle in the game capable of four wheel steering, or the ability to set the rear toe angle independently on each side, i dont see what possible benefit it would offer (aside from making cars with hillarious handling characteristics). Due to the thrust angles heavy dependence on toe, i think rear toe adjustment is enough.
(ya, i realize you were probably just kidding around with that thought)

But i agree with most of you that caster would be beneficial in trimming the cars responsiveness into and out of corners.

btw, thanks for the few tips offered here on controlling a drift with the DFP Kurt, Vinsion, Thio, others.
I got mine just a few days ago and came to most of these conclusions on my own, but its good reassurance that I'm not just imagining things while i'm driving.

 

[ForcedInduction]

That's very not bad.

If there is a trick to drifting, it's practice. That's what makes it all come together.

AMEN

 

[Homer_SS]

Ive noticed that with the EVO when you set the AYC to its maximum the car is VERY i REPEAT VERY TOSSABLE. It is possible and most times Necessary to use complete oppisite lock countersteer otherwise YOU WILL Spin out. It makes for some VERY interesting drifting. Try it out

Oh and setting Torque lock to 10/90 F/R helps aswell

 

[194GVan]

thats interesting Homer SS, however I should point out that many people feel that driving with the aids turned on is not a good way to learn car control and drifting. Its basically like relying on a computer to help you control your car, and in the end if you continue drifting with aids you wont be drifting to your full potential because the aids will be limiting you. Its a bad habit to rely on them.

ok NEVERMIND me, you are talking about Active Yaw Control (AYC), not Active Spin Control (ASC). Im not too familiar with that in AWD drifting, to be honest Im hesitant to begin practicing with AWD

 

[Homer_SS]

thats interesting Homer SS, however I should point out that many people feel that driving with the aids turned on is not a good way to learn car control and drifting. Its basically like relying on a computer to help you control your car, and in the end if you continue drifting with aids you wont be drifting to your full potential because the aids will be limiting you. Its a bad habit to rely on them.

ok NEVERMIND me, you are talking about Active Yaw Control (AYC), not Active Spin Control (ASC). Im not too familiar with that in AWD drifting, to be honest Im hesitant to begin practicing with AWD

Ya AYC is not a Driving Aid. The First thing i do (regardless of drift or grip cars) is turn off all aids! You should try drifting with AWD id say its alot easier than RWD drifting, once you overcome Understeer. Thats where AYC comes in! It really is an amazing experience.

Damn i feel like playing GT4! Im off to go do some DORIFTOOOOO!!!

 

[194GVan]

Ya AYC is not a Driving Aid. The First thing i do (regardless of drift or grip cars) is turn off all aids! You should try drifting with AWD id say its alot easier than RWD drifting, once you overcome Understeer. Thats where AYC comes in! It really is an amazing experience.

Damn i feel like playing GT4! Im off to go do some DORIFTOOOOO!!!

Ill probably try it this weekend, maybe with a recently purchased R32 N1 VspecII. I noticed that FF drifting is somewhat similar to AWD with the understeer problems so Ill try to apply what I learned from that to AWD

 

[Swift]

Homer: while there is certainly nothing wrong with adjusting the AYC, putting it to 10/90 defeats the purpose of AWD drifting. With that setting, you're just drift FR style with a little bit of pull. But it at around 30/70 at least. that'll give you a completly different experience, not to mention the ability to do a no-countersteer AWD drift!

 

[Gen.]

AYC adjusts the torque to front and rear? I thought the VCD (Variable Control Dif?) did that.

The AYC (Active Yaw Control) regulates the torque from left to right.

 

[Swift]

AYC adjusts the torque to front and rear? I thought the VCD (Variable Control Dif?) did that.

The AYC (Active Yaw Control) regulates the torque from left to right.

Yes you're absolutely right! I always get those confused!

 

[Homer_SS]

Homer: while there is certainly nothing wrong with adjusting the AYC, putting it to 10/90 defeats the purpose of AWD drifting. With that setting, you're just drift FR style with a little bit of pull. But it at around 30/70 at least. that'll give you a completly different experience, not to mention the ability to do a no-countersteer AWD drift!

Although you can get Zero Counter Drift with something like 30/70. But ive found that with anything like 10/90 or even 20/90 you can keep your foot planted on the gas while youre drifting and it carries you furthur (longer drift). Also i think its alot more exciting to see countersteering than zero counter drifts. (Well thats my opinion anyways.) Yes AYC controls torque Distr. from L/R and VCD controls it from F/R. I think you guys got confused when we started talking about 10/90 torque lock etc. Oh and with RW bias its alot easier to POWER OVER after a feint type of motion. I love getting the car sideways before the actual turn and carrying it through!

 

[Swift]

Although you can get Zero Counter Drift with something like 30/70. But ive found that with anything like 10/90 or even 20/90 you can keep your foot planted on the gas while youre drifting and it carries you furthur (longer drift). Also i think its alot more exciting to see countersteering than zero counter drifts. (Well thats my opinion anyways.) Yes AYC controls torque Distr. from L/R and VCD controls it from F/R. I think you guys got confused when we started talking about 10/90 torque lock etc. Oh and with RW bias its alot easier to POWER OVER after a feint type of motion. I love getting the car sideways before the actual turn and carrying it through!

That's fine if you want to do that. But you're not really doing AWD drifting. You're taking an easy way out. Yeah, sure you can just mash the cash and have some mild adjustments while countersteering, but well, that sounds incredibly boring to me. If you don't like to do zero countersteer drifts that's cool. But using an AWD vehicle with the Front torque percentage at 10% is quite pointless. You might as well go get a FR.

My point is that when a car is setup as you've described, it takes less skill to drift and will eventually be unrewarding.

 

[Homer_SS]

That's fine if you want to do that. But you're not really doing AWD drifting. You're taking an easy way out. Yeah, sure you can just mash the cash and have some mild adjustments while countersteering, but well, that sounds incredibly boring to me. If you don't like to do zero countersteer drifts that's cool. But using an AWD vehicle with the Front torque percentage at 10% is quite pointless. You might as well go get a FR.

My point is that when a car is setup as you've described, it takes less skill to drift and will eventually be unrewarding.

Pointless how? Last time i checked the Skyline STI and many other AWD cars are set up to be RWD biased most of the time. Now because the game does not alternate for you and mimic real life (waiting for that to be implented in later GT's) i decided to take matters into my hands. Hell you can even do that in a real STI (set torque split). By youre standards adding a sports suspension to make the car easier to drive fast around a car will be alot less rewarding than driving it stock. Like all other things im just tweaking the car to do a certain thing. This thing is Drifting.

Although it may be easier it certainly is not unrewarding. The replays are amazing and real fun to watch. The car being tossed side to side, completely perpendicular to the track is great. Dont get me wrong i love RWD drifting, this Lancer and a Skyline was my first venture into the world of AWD drifting. It was all Silvias and RWD cars before.
I never thought that Zero counter drifting was all that fun to look at. But when i did it was exciting but wasn't as rewarding as oppisite lock countersteering.

IMHO the game physics are still way off to real life. In real life you can carry drifts with out having to worry about it snapping back and ending up into the wall. i think that front tires get grip and loose it at the worst times.

 

[Swift]

Pointless how? Last time i checked the Skyline STI and many other AWD cars are set up to be RWD biased most of the time. Now because the game does not alternate for you and mimic real life (waiting for that to be implented in later GT's) i decided to take matters into my hands. Hell you can even do that in a real STI (set torque split). By youre standards adding a sports suspension to make the car easier to drive fast around a car will be alot less rewarding than driving it stock. Like all other things im just tweaking the car to do a certain thing. This thing is Drifting.

Although it may be easier it certainly is not unrewarding. The replays are amazing and real fun to watch. The car being tossed side to side, completely perpendicular to the track is great. Dont get me wrong i love RWD drifting, this Lancer and a Skyline was my first venture into the world of AWD drifting. It was all Silvias and RWD cars before.
I never thought that Zero counter drifting was all that fun to look at. But when i did it was exciting but wasn't as rewarding as oppisite lock countersteering.

I'm not talking about the Skyline. I know that some AWD cars simply won't drift or drift much better with the VCD at 10%.

Do me this favor, check out Countersteer Zero It's GT3, but it shows off the potential of AWD drifting with 30% or more torque to the front wheels.

Hey, it's all you bud. If you want to drift FR with a bit of pull, that's fine. But don't call it AWD drifting when you take an EVO and set it up like a Silvia.

As far as the realism thing, do you drift AWD IRL?

 

[G-T-4-Fan]

Pointless how? Last time i checked the Skyline STI and many other AWD cars are set up to be RWD biased most of the time. Now because the game does not alternate for you and mimic real life (waiting for that to be implented in later GT's) i decided to take matters into my hands. Hell you can even do that in a real STI (set torque split). By youre standards adding a sports suspension to make the car easier to drive fast around a car will be alot less rewarding than driving it stock. Like all other things im just tweaking the car to do a certain thing. This thing is Drifting.

Although it may be easier it certainly is not unrewarding. The replays are amazing and real fun to watch. The car being tossed side to side, completely perpendicular to the track is great. Dont get me wrong i love RWD drifting, this Lancer and a Skyline was my first venture into the world of AWD drifting. It was all Silvias and RWD cars before.
I never thought that Zero counter drifting was all that fun to look at. But when i did it was exciting but wasn't as rewarding as oppisite lock countersteering.

IMHO the game physics are still way off to real life. In real life you can carry drifts with out having to worry about it snapping back and ending up into the wall. i think that front tires get grip and loose it at the worst times.

Now I've had settings TOO that were easy to drift in Swifts opinion, and he only said that because he just wanted to help, and he's good at it (helping) so it's probably worth a shot with different settings.
I would say, keep AAALLLL the fun cars you have and just practice a bit with one car you can constantly adjust:tup:.
I did the same thing: my subaru is pretty easy, while my Mazda 6 touring car is much harder, and I use the last one just for learning.

Now I told Swift some days ago, that the drifting in AWD felt too easy, and I discovered later that other cars like the mazda are still hard to drift. It was so easy that I began comparing it with cycling, and that's isn't very fun is it, it's just boring? Believe me, once you learned a tiny bit, it becomes a LOT more fun, also in a non-realistic game (if that's your IMO)

Sorry if I mess my opinion too much with this "argue" but I think you should know how you can aproach someones comment while still being able to have loads of fun👍

 

[Homer_SS]

I'm not talking about the Skyline. I know that some AWD cars simply won't drift or drift much better with the VCD at 10%.

Do me this favor, check out Countersteer Zero It's GT3, but it shows off the potential of AWD drifting with 30% or more torque to the front wheels.

Hey, it's all you bud. If you want to drift FR with a bit of pull, that's fine. But don't call it AWD drifting when you take an EVO and set it up like a Silvia.

As far as the realism thing, do you drift AWD IRL?

Nice video 👍
No matter what you do the AWD is AWD.... Meaning even with the 10/90 lock theres is plenty understeer. Ive drifted the with 30/70 and alot more with 50/50. I just prefer drifting with 10/90 its just more fun because of the countersteer. AWD drifting is when *gasp* a car, with ALL 4 WHEELS powered, slides *gasp* so i think ill continue to call it AWD drifting.
Once again this just a difference of opinions.

I should have been clearer with the Realism thing..... i meant it as a general statement with alot of the RWD cars not AWD.

I am open to all coments and actually i just bought a AUDI RS6 and have been fidiling with that. I have set this car up with a more even torque split (40/60) and it is really fun. But in the end i guess i love the EVO with its tossability and nimbleness. These characteristics show through even with the AYC disabled and a more even torque distrbution.

I am trying to approach these comments with fun but stuff like this

Hey, it's all you bud. If you want to drift FR with a bit of pull, that's fine. But don't call it AWD drifting when you take an EVO and set it up like a Silvia.

Doesn't help.
Especially coming from a Mod.
I never intended to start an arguement..........just a friendly talk between enthusiasts.

 

[Swift]

Nice video 👍
No matter what you do the AWD is AWD.... Meaning even with the 10/90 lock theres is plenty understeer. Ive drifted the with 30/70 and alot more with 50/50. I just prefer drifting with 10/90 its just more fun because of the countersteer. AWD drifting is when *gasp* a car, with ALL 4 WHEELS powered, slides *gasp* so i think ill continue to call it AWD drifting.
Once again this just a difference of opinions.

I should have been clearer with the Realism thing..... i meant it as a general statement with alot of the RWD cars not AWD.

I am open to all coments and actually i just bought a AUDI RS6 and have been fidiling with that. I have set this car up with a more even torque split (40/60) and it is really fun. But in the end i guess i love the EVO with its tossability and nimbleness. These characteristics show through even with the AYC disabled and a more even torque distrbution.

I am trying to approach these comments with fun but stuff like this

Doesn't help.
Especially coming from a Mod.
I never intended to start an arguement..........just a friendly talk between enthusiasts.

Hmmm....
Who said we were arguing. The thing that makes AWD drifting unique is the fact that you can drift without countersteering. You can get some more angle in AWD the FR, but the main thing is no countersteering and slightly longer drift potential.

When I say "It's all you" I mean just that. I'm not arguing or telling you what to do. But an Evo with 10/90 VCD is defeating the purpose of AWD drifting. BTW, when you drift, all four tires are sliding no matter what drivetrain you're using. Just a slighty different rate for the front wheels without power.

 

[vinsion]

Hmmm....
Who said we were arguing. The thing that makes AWD drifting unique is the fact that you can drift without countersteering. You can get some more angle in AWD the FR, but the main thing is no countersteering and slightly longer drift potential.

When I say "It's all you" I mean just that. I'm not arguing or telling you what to do. But an Evo with 10/90 VCD is defeating the purpose of AWD drifting. BTW, when you drift, all four tires are sliding no matter what drivetrain you're using. Just a slighty different rate for the front wheels without power.

I absolutly love drifting AWD, and I'll tell you why.

Try the Vinsion® FR-AWD Transition Test©...

Spend a whole day drifting FR (or a considerable time, as you can see I have no life ) then for the last hour or so switch to an AWD car.

*Thrown for a loop*

It's a big transition normally. It feels really weird to be comlpetely sideways, your front tires riding on the rumble strip...

With no countersteer.

One car that's a real test of skills is the Falken GT-R, its so damn good for racing grip that when you try to get it sideways, it's do or die, it takes some serious feinting. I spent about an hour drifting it a got sideways a few times...

Through a whole 60 Meter staight.

Only then to pull it into the next corner at about 60 MPH.

I love how you can simply adjust your countersteer a little bit and either the car will iniate a true drift by actually cornering, or continue a powerslide in a striaght line.

Ok, I think I've hit the Enter key one to many times,

</Vin>

 

[Homer_SS]

Hmmm....
Who said we were arguing. The thing that makes AWD drifting unique is the fact that you can drift without countersteering. You can get some more angle in AWD the FR, but the main thing is no countersteering and slightly longer drift potential.

When I say "It's all you" I mean just that. I'm not arguing or telling you what to do. But an Evo with 10/90 VCD is defeating the purpose of AWD drifting. BTW, when you drift, all four tires are sliding no matter what drivetrain you're using. Just a slighty different rate for the front wheels without power.

:tup:No problem, youre comments were slightly aggressive thats why.
Although the zero countersteer thing is unique to AWD its not the only way to drift in awd. 10/90 does not defeat the purpose of drifting. Incase you havn't tried it, it only slightly helps the understeer problem. It will NEVER feel like a RWD car... not even close to it. Youre constantly reminded that youre in a AWD car. You can sense the front wheels clammering to get some grip and Understeers still. All it does is when you mash the pedal it helps the rear to step out abit more as opposed to a more balanced torque split. It no where near defeats the purpose.
I was expirementing today and noticed you can do zero counterdrifts with the torque split at 10/90. Although slightly harder.
Once again its just a difference of oppinions and tastes.👍

 

[Primera]

sorry guys bad english!!! what is countersteering???

 

[G-T-4-Fan]

sorry guys bad english!!! what is countersteering???

It's that when you drift sideways and lose grip, you'll have to countersteer: it means steering against the direction you were going thrue a corner: you drift in a left side corner, then loose traction and begin steering to the right again for preventing a spin

Other members, don't start flaming on the guy for asking such a basic question please

 

[Swift]

It's that when you drift sideways and lose grip, you'll have to countersteer: it means steering against the direction you were going thrue a corner: you drift in a left side corner, then loose traction and begin steering to the right again for preventing a spin

Other members, don't start flaming on the guy for asking such a basic question please

Yep, it's not like he started a new thread asking "What it countersteering?" So let's all be nice, as you have been doing, and welcome this new guy to the boards.