Inside the AI-Powered Rendering Tech Polyphony Digital Is Building for Gran Turismo’s Future

[Mathaios_C]

I just find it hard to marry the desire for ultimate graphics fidelity, then completely unfaithful sport rules. To go back to my soccer analogy, do you play ANY sport games like soccer, basketball, American Football, baseball? Would you tolerate a sports game that completely broke the sport's rules but LOOKED great?

From what I see, most sports games adhere to the main rules. And quite honestly I'd hear the screams of disappointment from Madden fans or NBA2K16 if the game mechanics allowed completely illegal moves with no penalty. I wonder why motorsports has such a low bar?

No worries because the next Gt will be anyway cross gen ps5/ps6 so we will see what pd is really capable of with the ps5’s hardware ehehe

 

[Fossilized]

No worries because the next Gt will be anyway cross gen ps5/ps6 so we will see what pd is really capable of with the ps5’s hardware ehehe

Thing is, it seems that whatever extra horsepower is provided by next gen hardware is rapidly exhausted doing eye candy upgrades. I like how Sophy is coming along, but I'd really like the predictive capabilities of Sophy tasked towards penalty detection. Currently there doesn't appear to be ANY improvement in fault adjudication in divebombing and squeezing off track incidents (two cars going on a straight, one deliberately turns into the other to force them out).

Surely Sophy's abilities could be used to determine if a driver took a non-optimal line that caused a wreck or a pass with contact? If Sophy knows what IT can do legally, it could be used to judge if what WE do is legal?

I'm already at the 'Who CARES if it looks a tiny fraction better?' stage. If they're going to throw horsepower at a problem, make it a problem that MATTERS...

Better AI drivers + better stewarding = better racing!

 

[Lunard]

I just find it hard to marry the desire for ultimate graphics fidelity, then completely unfaithful sport rules. To go back to my soccer analogy, do you play ANY sport games like soccer, basketball, American Football, baseball? Would you tolerate a sports game that completely broke the sport's rules but LOOKED great?

From what I see, most sports games adhere to the main rules. And quite honestly I'd hear the screams of disappointment from Madden fans or NBA2K16 if the game mechanics allowed completely illegal moves with no penalty. I wonder why motorsports has such a low bar?

Calm down my friend.
I'm just giving my opinion.
Gran Turismo isn't not just about sport mode, at least on GT7.
As I said, Gran Turismo is a simcade racing game for both hardcore and casual players.
And there's no game that will replicate 100% accurate anything.
If you are looking for a game like that, you should change your hobby.
And casual players will not care too much about Sport mode.
And also, the news article has nothing to do with penalty systems.
And yes, it's about optimizing the game's rendering to have better FPS and less memory usage, which can make improvements possible in other areas, such as more cars in races and a better penalty system.
Read the comments from @RareHero and @ProjectWHaT written above to understand this better.
Because after all, players also want a well-optimized game.

Because it's also no use having a game with a great penalty system if it's running at less than 30 average FPS, as we've seen in other games of this type released lately.

 

[equalitus]

I just find it hard to marry the desire for ultimate graphics fidelity, then completely unfaithful sport rules. To go back to my soccer analogy, do you play ANY sport games like soccer, basketball, American Football, baseball? Would you tolerate a sports game that completely broke the sport's rules but LOOKED great?

From what I see, most sports games adhere to the main rules. And quite honestly I'd hear the screams of disappointment from Madden fans or NBA2K16 if the game mechanics allowed completely illegal moves with no penalty. I wonder why motorsports has such a low bar?

I guess it's because there are digital rights owners in the digital sphere; video games, movies, tv-shows that are digital. It should be legally free [to use all digital trade mark assets] for all in the digital sphere but it isn't. Meaning car corporations deny visible damage to their cars..!!

 

[Fossilized]

I'm pretty sure that there's a bunch of kids that don't really give a rats about the rules of basketball or soccer. But you don't see EA pandering to them. And there's a ton of CASUAL kiddy focused sports games for them. And there's a whole heap of racing games that are arcade racers. Perfect for gamers that couldn't care less about rules...

I think you are conflating stewarding with sport mode. If you care about the sport, you should care about being able to get away with bashing an AI opponent out of the way as much as you should care about an online opponent doing it to you...

The problem at the moment is that currently, there really isn't a good 'hardcore' console game, GT7 is the de facto console sim given that PMR is a hot mess still in beta, ACC is highly focused with few cars and few tracks, and PC2 is quite long in the tooth (and has the same or worse stewarding as GT7!).

So no... I don't agree that GT7 is a good compromise between sim and arcade. It's arcade. It just LOOKS like a sim.

 

[Lunard]

I'm pretty sure that there's a bunch of kids that don't really give a rats about the rules of basketball or soccer. But you don't see EA pandering to them. And there's a ton of CASUAL kiddy focused sports games for them. And there's a whole heap of racing games that are arcade racers. Perfect for gamers that couldn't care less about rules...

I think you are conflating stewarding with sport mode. If you care about the sport, you should care about being able to get away with bashing an AI opponent out of the way as much as you should care about an online opponent doing it to you...

The problem at the moment is that currently, there really isn't a good 'hardcore' console game, GT7 is the de facto console sim given that PMR is a hot mess still in beta, ACC is highly focused with few cars and few tracks, and PC2 is quite long in the tooth (and has the same or worse stewarding as GT7!).

So no... I don't agree that GT7 is a good compromise between sim and arcade. It's arcade. It just LOOKS like a sim.

Okay, if that's your opinion, that's fine. I'll respect it.
But speak for yourself, because for me it still maintains a good balance between arcade and simulator.
That's why the term simcade was created.
And please, be humble, because you don't have the right to call others kid just because they don't know how to play simulators or don't want to.

 

[Saargasm]

Dude - go play iRacing if you want that experience so bad. Your analogy doesn't work either

 

[Fossilized]

When it comes to console, I might give iRacing a go. It's very telling that there appear to be so few here (if ANY) that actually like real racing enough to want the rules included in something you all want DESPERATELY to 'look' like racing.

No other simulated sport gets this amount of hatred for the rules of the sport you want so desperately to look realistic.

I guess I might have the same degree of cause to tell you, if you DON'T like simulated racing, there are FAR more arcade racing games than there are good sims on console. How about you go play THEM? Forza sounds perfect...

How you can stand the time penalties beats me... sounds like it's just too much BOTHER to pull off a clean pass.

 

[Lomic]

When it comes to console, I might give iRacing a go. It's very telling that there appear to be so few here (if ANY) that actually like real racing enough to want the rules included in something you all want DESPERATELY to 'look' like racing.

No other simulated sport gets this amount of hatred for the rules of the sport you want so desperately to look realistic.

I guess I might have the same degree of cause to tell you, if you DON'T like simulated racing, there are FAR more arcade racing games than there are good sims on console. How about you go play THEM? Forza sounds perfect...

How you can stand the time penalties beats me... sounds like it's just too much BOTHER to pull off a clean pass.

 

[Saargasm]

When it comes to console, I might give iRacing a go. It's very telling that there appear to be so few here (if ANY) that actually like real racing enough to want the rules included in something you all want DESPERATELY to 'look' like racing.

No other simulated sport gets this amount of hatred for the rules of the sport you want so desperately to look realistic.

I guess I might have the same degree of cause to tell you, if you DON'T like simulated racing, there are FAR more arcade racing games than there are good sims on console. How about you go play THEM? Forza sounds perfect...

How you can stand the time penalties beats me... sounds like it's just too much BOTHER to pull off a clean pass.

Who said I didn't want clean racing and motorsport sim? When's the last time you did multiplayer that wasn't Gr3 & Gr4? What you're crying for is punishing ultra-realism and we're all telling you that this isn't that game. Not saying the penalty system doesn't need a big overhaul at all - it does.

However, the higher rated you are, the better the drivers you compete against. The better the driver the less chance of purposeful punting. Seeing that you're hardcore online driver, I'm assuming you're >A+?

 

[eran0004]

Surely Sophy's abilities could be used to determine if a driver took a non-optimal line that caused a wreck or a pass with contact? If Sophy knows what IT can do legally, it could be used to judge if what WE do is legal?

Sophy is trained to drive cars, not to determine who's at fault.

In principle, a neural network could probably do that task reasonably well, but the training would have to be done differently as it's not something that can be easily determined via hard rules. For comparison, teaching the AI to avoid collisions is easier, since you could just penalise it for any contacts.

 

[Fossilized]

The way I figure it, if Sophy can race clean, then it KNOWS the limits for where an inside move becomes a desperate dive bomb. It could be as simple as an invisible line where Sophy knows where you can (and CAN'T) make the apex.

If you brake later and then make contact, penalty. If you brake at or before the point and then contact occurs, it's the outside car cutting across you...

It's not perfect, but it's better than what we have. If Sophy knows the correct braking point, then the game does. But currently that knowledge doesn't get used in the penalty system.

Sophy races pretty clean. I'd love to see a Sophy steward system.

The rest of you kids terrified at the idea that you can't drive like an eight year old, there's nothing to say you can't turn it off as an option. Or restrict it to A+ splits. That ought to allow you to drive around like you're playing Need for Speed or whatever it is that you think racing's supposed to be, but make the game less arcadey for those who have grown up a bit...

Options...

 

[equalitus]

The way I figure it, if Sophy can race clean, then it KNOWS the limits for where an inside move becomes a desperate dive bomb. It could be as simple as an invisible line where Sophy knows where you can (and CAN'T) make the apex.

If you brake later and then make contact, penalty. If you brake at or before the point and then contact occurs, it's the outside car cutting across you...

It's not perfect, but it's better than what we have. If Sophy knows the correct braking point, then the game does. But currently that knowledge doesn't get used in the penalty system.

Sophy races pretty clean. I'd love to see a Sophy steward system.

The rest of you kids terrified at the idea that you can't drive like an eight year old, there's nothing to say you can't turn it off as an option. Or restrict it to A+ splits. That ought to allow you to drive around like you're playing Need for Speed or whatever it is that you think racing's supposed to be, but make the game less arcadey for those who have grown up a bit...

Options...

This could be a feature in the multiplayer Sport mode. There are usable heuristics already that could be coded which are similar to real world rules. But I guess the sport mode players would want options & not 100% same "strict" rules like in the real world for all races.

 

[Lomic]

The rest of you kids terrified at the idea that you can't drive like an eight year old, there's nothing to say you can't turn it off as an option. Or restrict it to A+ splits. That ought to allow you to drive around like you're playing Need for Speed or whatever it is that you think racing's supposed to be, but make the game less arcadey for those who have grown up a bit...

If you could refrain to point fingers, that would be great.

 

[Fossilized]

If you could refrain to point fingers, that would be great.

Read back a bit. Plenty of people here owning up to not wanting proper racing stewarding. Might cut into their 'fun'. Simply trying to point out that the option to have them on or not should keep EVERYONE happy.

Something wrong with that?

 

[Lomic]

Something wrong with that?

Yep... "the rest of you" is not "plenty of people" and I'd wish to know the full list of people here who don't want proper stewarding/penalty system, I bet it is a really small "plenty" if they even exist. And I don't appreciate the contemptuous tone used to point fingers at those (numerous) people.

Do as you please but if you want to engage in meaningful conversations, you should refrain from using derogative ways of addressing people.

 

[Lunard]

Read back a bit. Plenty of people here owning up to not wanting proper racing stewarding. Might cut into their 'fun'. Simply trying to point out that the option to have them on or not should keep EVERYONE happy.

Something wrong with that?

Wow, are you still in this discussion, arguing, trying to impose your point of view on others?
And then we're the ones who are the "kids" for not being so obsessed with realism in every detail of a racing and sports game.

 

[Fossilized]

If your viewpoint feels threatened by a contrary opinion, perhaps deep down you realize the validity of the point..?

For example, I don't feel you're trying to impose YOUR opinion on the forum. 🙄🤡

I'm not sure you quite get the point of an open forum. Maybe you should start a site where everyone agrees with you and thinks the same, dresses the same, and you can pretend there's only one way to think. Bon voyage... 🛳️

 

[Lunard]

If your viewpoint feels threatened by a contrary opinion, perhaps deep down you realize the validity of the point..?
For example, I don't feel you're trying to impose YOUR opinion on the forum. 🙄🤡
I'm not sure you quite get the point of an open forum. Maybe you should start a site where everyone agrees with you and thinks the same, dresses the same, and you can pretend there's only one way to think. Bon voyage... 🛳️

That's good that you think that about my opinion.
But, as for the rest, I'll say the same to you.
Have a good trip too.