Instead of making a new thread every time....Formerly tell me about the new Fiat 500

[Boz Mon]

Well, winter is coming, and I havent found a worthy Prelude replacement yet. Still vaguely looking for S2000's and miatas, but then I noticed that in 2 years the U.S. will be getting the FIat 500 Abarth. This may be the perfect Prelude replacement. I like the Prelude because it is a really well rounded car. It's pretty quick, gets good mileage, fun to drive, reliable, practical, it's unique, etc. The 500 may be the car I'm looking for, granted its not as quick, but I think I can sacrifice that. I know someone on this board in the UK or somewhere else has one of these cars....So please tell me about it, anything, pros, cons, etc.


EDIT BELOW:
Instead of making a new thread, I decided to just keep updating this one as I get new ideas for Prelude replacements. I'm not sure if I should only update the 1st post, or make a whole new reply so this time, I am going to do both.

I have been doing a bit of research on S2000's and such when I came up with the idea of a newer (NC?) MX-5 aka a Miata. This seems like it may be the best of all good ideas. From what I understand, the NC is more car, but it weighs the same as an NB ie no weight gain but more power.

I do like the Mazdaspeed Miata, but I put a lot of miles on my cars and I am worried about the turbo holding up. I like the looks of the NC, so does anyone have one? Or does anyone have any useful info about it? Pros, Cons, quirks, etc?

 

[Northstar]

PM Moglet, he has one.

Edit: Also, check out this thread, you will have to do some digging but there is some good info on what models will be coming here.

 

[Joey D]

I think one of the things you are going to have to look out for is the price. While the Fiat 500 maybe be affordable in Europe, it easily could face the same problem the MINI has and have a grossly inflated price due to desirability. You also have to hope Chrysler doesn't attempt to Americanise the vehicle and have it end up to softer then the European model. It'd be a shame if we got the car and it turned out to be dumbed down for the US.

 

[Philly]

The thing will probably be fairly slow, I'd bet. Sure, it's quick for a European car, but it's 100 hp 1.4 just won't stack up well against everything else on the road. With the light weight, maybe the 130 hp Abarth will be reasonably quick, But you're still looking at Fit/Yaris/Versa acceleration if we get the base 1.4 here. But I also don't know what output of engine we'll be getting here. And I'm sure that the chassis will make for a pretty decent car.

 

[homeforsummer]

The thing will probably be fairly slow, I'd bet. Sure, it's quick for a European car, but it's 100 hp 1.4 just won't stack up well against everything else on the road. With the light weight, maybe the 130 hp Abarth will be reasonably quick, But you're still looking at Fit/Yaris/Versa acceleration if we get the base 1.4 here. But I also don't know what output of engine we'll be getting here. And I'm sure that the chassis will make for a pretty decent car.

Going by the average figures of anything else in that range a 100bhp 1.4 that weighs roughly a tonne will do 60 in 10 seconds roughly and top out on the far side of 110mph (in fact I've just checked - 10.2 seconds and 113mph - good guess, then). It weighs 930kg. 930. Is there any new car on the US market thats that light, save for the odd Elise? That's easily enough to keep pace with traffic and little Fiats with revvy engines encourage you to bomb about more than Fits or Yaris do any day.

People forget that although Europe generally has a different idea of performance than the States, that doesn't mean that we don't get any quick cars. Our roads and motorways are full of people in big BMWs, Mercs, Audis, Range Rovers, Porsches etc and I've never felt dangerously underpowered or intimidated in the 6.5 years I was driving a 60bhp, 930kg car, on narrower, rougher roads than you get out there and still cruising along at 80mph on motorways.

Maybes you just all need to man-up a little

Anyway, Boz Mon - if you're looking for something like your Prelude, why not just get a second-hand one of these?

Seems like the perfect replacement, surely?

 

[Tornado]

I'd buy another Prelude before I got an RSX.

@ Boz Mon:
All you need to know is what the guage cluster looks like:

 

[Philly]

Maybes you just all need to man-up a little

I only brought it up because he was talking about a sports car and how he liked it because it was pretty quick. Handling and being fun to drive is something I'm sure the 500 excels at with that low weight. But it just won't be sports car quick in a straight line by any means.

There's nothing wrong with having a 0-60 time of 10 seconds in normal driving. I never use all of the throttle in the GTI unless I'm trying to have fun or something. If minivans and delivery trucks never have problems getting up to speed, I'm sure the 500 never will.

 

[Boz Mon]

I'd buy another Prelude before I got an RSX.

@ Boz Mon:
All you need to know is what the guage cluster looks like:

I'm digging that cluster. I have read that the Abarth 500 is a bit quicker to 60 somewhere in the 7 second range, which I am ok with. And as far as the RSX, I'm with Toronado, I'd buy another Prelude before an RSX

 

[Jondot]

Don't pin your hopes on an Abarth, though. Even if Fiat do bring it over for sale immediately (which seems unlikely to me, to be honest) you'll have a hell of a job getting one in the first year.

 

[YSSMAN]

Generally speaking, you're going to have a hell of a job getting a standard 500 in the first year or two. My guess is that they will take off just as quick as the New Beetle and MINI did back in the day, and the Abarth version will only make things worse. Beyond that, I do not know if all the Chrysler dealers will be given the go-ahead to sell the cars. It will be a limited release at first, likely in the largest markets initially.

In general, I've only heard positives of the car. The quality appears to be a bit ish-ish, but its supposed to be a pleasure to drive. Usually. Chrysler hasn't given any calls as to how much the car will cost once it shows up in the US, but I'd anticipate it to start somewhere around $15K for the basic model, fully-loaded versions going into the mid-20K range without any problem.


But the biggest problem?

That. Which will be here shortly. Probably easier to get, probably a little cheaper, probably built better as well.

 

[Moglet]

I'd buy another Prelude before I got an RSX.

@ Boz Mon:
All you need to know is what the guage cluster looks like:

Wow, that's one awesome cluster, I wonder who's car that's in?!
You should see it at night;

I'm digging that cluster. I have read that the Abarth 500 is a bit quicker to 60 somewhere in the 7 second range, which I am ok with. And as far as the RSX, I'm with Toronado, I'd buy another Prelude before an RSX

The Abarth 500 is quick enough in standard form (trust me) and drives like a go kart (it's amazingly fun), but it won't do 0-60 in 7 seconds. That's the Abarth EsseEsse 0-60, which is £2000 on top of the standard model in the UK. For that you also get uprated suspension and brakes though.

I'd definitely recommend one, I'm still loving mine and it still gets admiring glances on the street even after well over a year of being on the road.

I took mine out for a spin last night as the sun was setting and the roads were quiet and it's still not boring. With the setting sun streaming in through the glass roof, the engine roaring away (and it does, despite being a 1.2) and the car flying through corners while the needles on the cluster chased each other around the dial, I had a huge smile on my face. I've never driven a small car in this class (not counting the Mini due to the price difference) where you can feel so connected to the road. It seems like you can feel every tyre breaking traction at exactly the right moment through the steering, even though there is a bit more of a dead zone than there should be.

It also makes a fairly nice noise as standard;


and has a very decent standard stereo too, which can be upgraded;


And here is a generally good video; http://www.vimeo.com/4119920

If you need to know anything else then I'll be checking back here often just incase. The only thing I'm not too clued up on is the new MultiAir turbo engines.

 

[Boz Mon]

Apparently updating the 1st post doesnt bump the thread so...

I have been doing a bit of research on S2000's and such when I came up with the idea of a newer (NC?) MX-5 aka a Miata. This seems like it may be the best of all good ideas. From what I understand, the NC is more car, but it weighs the same as an NB ie no weight gain but more power.

I do like the Mazdaspeed Miata, but I put a lot of miles on my cars and I am worried about the turbo holding up. I like the looks of the NC, so does anyone have one? Or does anyone have any useful info about it? Pros, Cons, quirks, etc?

 

[YSSMAN]

I'm a big fan of the NC, which is blasphemy according to the hardcore MX-5 enthusiasts. As a vehicle you can use everyday, it is an excellent car that still drives quite well, and it still available at a very reasonable price. I know of nothing significantly wrong with the vehicles in terms of reliability, as it is otherwise off-the-shelf pieces from other Mazda vehicles... Particularly the Mazda3.

 

[homeforsummer]

I'm a big fan of the NC, which is blasphemy according to the hardcore MX-5 enthusiasts. As a vehicle you can use everyday, it is an excellent car that still drives quite well, and it still available at a very reasonable price. I know of nothing significantly wrong with the vehicles in terms of reliability, as it is otherwise off-the-shelf pieces from other Mazda vehicles... Particularly the Mazda3.

I'm a fan of the NC too, though I now think that I'd never want it instead of an NA, and the troube with that is that I'd then have two MX-5s, which is silly.

But yeah, I like the NC. Mine would be the 1.8 which has smaller wheels and the benefits they bring, and it'd have the hardtop because if you're going to have a softer MX-5 it may as well keep you warm too and be less easy to break into. And while we're going down that road I'd probably also have the automatic transmission (if you can get such a thing on the 1.8), because if it's going to be used daily then I'd want it to be relaxing. But because of all of that, that's why I'd still want an NA with as little technology as possible.

As for the NC compared to the others, I'd personally say it's lacking a little character and it's perhaps not as "raw", but probably easier to live with day to day. It's heavy for an MX-5 but light for a modern car, and though again it's not as "sharp" as earlier MX-5s it'll still feel a lot better than a lot of normal cars. Seems to feel quite solid too.

I daresay a MazdaSpeed NB would be more fun and a fair bit faster (and they look great IMO), but as a daily, all-weather proposition I expect an NC is quite a nice car.

 

[niky]

The biggest problem with the NC is the steering.

The extra comfort, you can live with.

The soft-ish suspension... sublime...

The extra body stiffness... yes please.

The extra power? Heck yeah.

The steering? Errh... mind you... it's very, very good... but that's in comparison to other cars with electric steering. Compared to the near-telepathic hydraulic racks of mid-90's Miatas (and Mazdas in general)... not so. Thus the charge of "no soul" from older Miata owners.

Came to that conclusion after driving one for a little bit... my bud, who's a Miata newbie... didn't believe me... after fifteen minutes of driving, he was ecstatic.

After an hour... he finally got it... he reached the point where he felt: "is that all there is?" So he bought an NA. With just 37k kms on the clock. Damn his eyes.

But... if you have never owned another Miata... you'll never know the difference... and I can't think of another modern roadster more worth the money than this.

The Mazdaspeed NB should be fairly reliable... it's a low-pressure turbo, so it's not going to cook itself to death if it's been looked after properly... and if you don't care about looking after it properly, you can make it much faster. Probably the most exciting stock Miata there is... at least until the NC Mazdaspeed comes out.

 

[Boz Mon]

Im not looking to upgrade the car I buy. I have driven 2 NB's and loved them. I read somewhere that the NC is actually the same weight at the NB's. I'm gonna have to drive one and see about the steering. I really enjoy how I can feel the road through the Prelude's steering wheel, this is one of the biggest things I think would bother me, not being able to feel the road.

 

[homeforsummer]

Incidentally, why are you selling the Prelude? Just fancy a change? You seem to like it a lot so it seems a little strange to part with it.

 

[niky]

You'll get feedback, yes. Probably on the same level as the Prelude. But not with the same amount of detail and organic fluidity as with the NA or NB.

Like I said... if you've never owned an older Miata... you'll never know what you're missing.

 

[Boz Mon]

Incidentally, why are you selling the Prelude? Just fancy a change? You seem to like it a lot so it seems a little strange to part with it.

Hmm, where to start on this one. Its 12 years old, has 140+K miles on it, the clearcoat on the door is peeling, the drives side quarter panel clearcoat is spiderwebbng. Theres rust on the hood, trunk, and drivers side quarter. Salvage title, I think that pretty much covers the issues.

 

[Boz Mon]

hmmm, Sorry for the double post but I have somewhat of an update. The local honda dealer has an 06 MX-5 with 16,0000 miles. They want around 16k for it. It seems like I can get an almost new MX-5 for the same price as an older S2000. Once spring gets here, the MX-5 search will be in full swing