is there any possible way to use an auto tranny to beat friends who use manual tranny?

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RZQSPEED

RZQSPEED

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razaqafazran1103
any guys suggest the way to beat the guys who use manual tranny while using an automatic tranny for controller users?

As in the Alpine VGT seasonal for example, the time trial is like me in a Lancer Evolution 3 vs guys on 700+ HP GT-Rs with stage 10 weight reduction (or stage 4 weight reduction with tons of downforce) in a 3 way Touge! Those guys were @KazaMR2 and @RCKakashi14
 
Yeah There's only one way I know, Keep practicing and try to use different driving lines, and it helps if you download a replay from the top 10 and follow there lines.
 
Gadge
Yeah There's only one way I know, Keep practicing and try to use different driving lines, and it helps if you download a replay from the top 10 and follow there lines.
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I will try then in free practice with the VGTs i got in respective tracks. Thanks!
 
Gadge
Yeah There's only one way I know, Keep practicing and try to use different driving lines, and it helps if you download a replay from the top 10 and follow there lines.
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Sound advice, but I would think that if he continues to use an automatic transmission, sooner or later there's an invisible 'wall' that he will hit and cannot break through without having full control over gear choices. Save for ABS, the more control you have over your car inputs in GT6, the faster you can potentially go.
 
JayOTT
Sound advice, but I would think that if he continues to use an automatic transmission, sooner or later there's an invisible 'wall' that he will hit and cannot break through without having full control over gear choices. Save for ABS, the more control you have over your car inputs in GT6, the faster you can potentially go.
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I use automatic transmission just with abs-1 and most off the time, I am about 3 seconds off the leader on the TT events in most off them
 
Unless you are one of the few, the answer is no. Automatic transmissions are (Edit: generally) designed for comfort, not for performance.

I'd recommend that you start trying to use the manual, even on the controller. it's not that tough once you get the controller configured correctly. The default settings aren't even close to optimal and encourage avoidance of manual mode.
 
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Yeah but I prefer using the AT for some reason, it's just better for me at the moment as I can't drive IRL.
 
I never used MT until I got a wheel, always felt totally un-natural with a DS3, whereas with a wheel it was second nature. The main thing I noticed though, was how dependent on the sound I was, these days I always wear headphones when playing the game so I can crank the volume, and I never listen to music whilst I'm playing. I've messed up plenty of laps though, from double shifts, or missed shifts... anyhow..

... back in the PS2 GT days, one of the shoulder buttons acted like a gear-hold, so you could wring it out a little more, or stop it from downshifting if you wanted. I knew, for instance, that certain sections of the 'ring, once the car was in 4th, to hold the gear-hold button and it wouldn't move to 3rd or 5th, shaved off some big tenths in each section. No idea if this still works, but pretty sure it used to be the shift up button (R1?).
 
Gadge
Yeah but I prefer using the AT for some reason, it's just better for me at the moment as I can't drive IRL.
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No offense intended. I realize some are more comfortable with AT. I was for the first ~6 months or so, but I couldn't keep up, so I spent a little while figuring out how to make the controller work for me in manual mode. My lap times improved significantly and my control and enjoyment as well. To be honest, now that have been using a wheel for ~2 years or so, I can't even use AT mode with the controller any more and do a lap without issues. (yes, I've tried, and it was pure misery)

Drive as you wish. It's not my intention to play commissar, just offering my advise. :)
 
In cars with peak power near the top of the power band, in GT5 at least, there's no difference between auto and manual transmission in the hands of a skilled pilot. One of the fastest guys I ever faced online used auto and chase cam in every car. The key is the power band, so something like a Zonda C12 that peaks early and drops dramatically at the redline will not be as fast with auto.
 
Preface: Almost all my GT6 driving involves racing in untuned cars.

I use MT in basically all lower power cars. Say below 450pp, I'm going to be using MT.

But in faster cars, I often use AT, and only use MT if there's some significant benefit to MT that overrides my clumsiness in shifting in faster cars. (It's a cost/benefit analysis for me in faster cars, because I'm not fantastic with shifting in faster cars.)

So... It really heavily depends on the car.

The Alpine VGT stock transmission hugely favours ability for manual shifting, for example.
No clue about tuning it because I haven't done that.

Some cars are just like this.
Because of the powerband that's described in a previous post here.

Also, most unmodified low power car on a track with long straights or hills is going to significantly favour manual shifting.
Many unmodified low power cars on any track will favour manual shifting, particularly in crowded in racing conditions.

Some of this can be mitigated if transmission tuning is allowed, but it can't always be tuned out completely. Particularly if the car will be "maxed out" racing against others with the car maxed out.

Notable examples of where you will REALLY lose out racing AT, and particularly in 'tuning prohibited':

Mini Coopers, Autozam, Copen, Cappucino
These cars really favour shifting up very early, well before it's in the red.

Also a couple of Toyota Supras & at least a couple MR2s.
I believe that's why the MR2s have kind of a steep learning curve to get the most out of them. They are not easy handling cars, and not very forgiving, then you add in needing to shift well, and it really takes more than average attention to do well in them.

There are also several vintage cars that favour MT shifting too.
In some cases it's better to shift them early, and in some cases it's better to run them up into the red zone.

All that said... There are quite a few car/track combinations that will allow AT shifting to be fairly competitive, given otherwise equal drivers.

There's nothing that's going to be more useful than actually knowing the good lines on a track, as far as lap times.

Knowing the track, and being able to drive a good racing line is really the #1 way to reduce lap times, regardless of the car or your shifting ability or even using AT.
 
In order to answer your question, if you are going to insist on using AT, the best thing to do (other than improve your driving) would be to use the custom transmission settings to get your car to shift exactly when you want, although that would be rather tedious. I used to be an AT guy for years, when I finally switched to MT it was a bit rough at first. Whether on controller, or wheel, it eventually becomes second nature. When all these people recommend switching to MT, it's not because they're saying it's better because they prefer it, (like someone who will try to convince you one console is better than another) they're actually trying to give sound advice. Switching to MT really isn't as hard as one might think.
 
Peelster1
use the custom transmission settings to get your car to shift exactly when you want
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The AT will still shift @ 7500 rpm while peak power is rated @ 5500 rpm.

The Alpine's gearbox is quite closely stacked so I did a quick test with the AT:

2nd-3rd gear, upshift @ 7500 rpm: Revs drop to ~5800 rpm.
3rd-4th gear, upshift @ 7500 rpm: Revs drop to ~6000 rpm.
4th-5th gear, upshift @ 7500 rpm: Revs drop to ~6200 rpm.
5th-6th gear, upshift @ 7500 rpm: Revs drop to ~6300 rpm.
6th-7th gear, upshift @ 7500 rpm: Revs drop to ~6400 rpm.

So, using AT will actually prevent you from ever using the full power of the engine.

Let's look at the power curve for the car:
DSC_0003_zpsdpqtlkfz.jpg


So, the power slowly decreases from 443 bhp @ 5500 rpm to ~410 bhp @ 7100 rpm, followed by a steep descent past the AT shifting point ~390 bhp @ 7500rpm, all the way to the rev limiter ~360 bhp @ 8000 rpm.

Shifting @ 7500 rpm, like the AT, will cost you a significant amount of time.

RZQSPEED
any guys suggest the way to beat the guys who use manual tranny while using an automatic tranny for controller users?
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As you can see, AT will lose a lot of time in acceleration. Making up for it in the corners will be hard work.
I suggest you try MT a few times and shift in the 6500-7000 rpm range.
 
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AT is always worse, in any situation.

Just because you have a controller doesn't mean you should be stuck with AT, man the 🤬 up.

I and everybody else I know that's on controller uses MT.

People usually suggest the buttons for upshift/downshift but I've found it's much more natural to use the back triggers for gear changes. It almost feels like paddle shifting.

Whenever I ask people why they use AT a LOT answer with "I'm on controller".

Like seriously that's no excuse at all, I mean I've been there, I used AT practically from GT1-GT4, but MT only takes half an hour to an hour to learn... you'll never look back.

I mean damn, it's easier to use MT on DS3 than it is on a wheel. For a start you have no clutch to worry about.

Conclusion;

USE MANUAL.
 
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I have tried and am trying to learn to use MT with the controller, as I can see the benefit in this, just do not have the dexterity to do it justice.
I did try a friends wheel set up and took to it immediately, and was quite a bit quicker, even doing heel and toe.
So I'll keep trying and crashing, just wish I had room for a rig set up.
 
SJC ALPHA
I have tried and am trying to learn to use MT with the controller, as I can see the benefit in this, just do not have the dexterity to do it justice.
I did try a friends wheel set up and took to it immediately, and was quite a bit quicker, even doing heel and toe.
So I'll keep trying and crashing, just wish I had room for a rig set up.
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Patience friend. It takes time to transition. Don't listen to the bullies. Use it if you want, and don't if you don't. No one but the self-appointed commissars will care.

I'd recommend NOT racing at first, instead just focus on getting around a circuit without crashing. I transitioned by starting with speeds on the order of 55(mph) and under, sticking to the "correct" lane, on non race course GT roadways like Nurburgring, etc. (the two laners). Once I made it around without crashing, sliding off etc a few times, I increased the speed....and again...and again. Give it a try
 
Streeto
AT is always worse, in any situation.

Just because you have a controller doesn't mean you should be stuck with AT, man the 🤬 up.

I and everybody else I know that's on controller uses MT.

People usually suggest the buttons for upshift/downshift but I've found it's much more natural to use the back triggers for gear changes. It almost feels like paddle shifting.

Whenever I ask people why they use AT a LOT answer with "I'm on controller".

Like seriously that's no excuse at all, I mean I've been there, I used AT practically from GT1-GT4, but MT only takes half an hour to an hour to learn... you'll never look back.

I mean damn, it's easier to use MT on DS3 than it is on a wheel. For a start you have no clutch to worry about.

Conclusion;

USE MANUAL.
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No, it's not. In any car with peak power up near the redline, a good driver will have almost no difference in lap times because the AT will shift at the same point you would shift manually anyway. Most cars in the game have peak power up near the redline or can be tuned that way. For those that peak much earlier and quickly drop off, yes, they will be slower with AT.
 
Yeah, in a lot of cars - AT doesn't cause as big a problem.
But the other time that AT can cause a problem is in low power cars on hills.

If using a controller ... you need to experiment with where to map your shifting.
Figure out where it makes sense for YOU.
I shift on the stick I steer with.
 
xiando
I'd recommend NOT racing at first, instead just focus on getting around a circuit without crashing. I transitioned by starting with speeds on the order of 55(mph) and under, sticking to the "correct" lane, on non race course GT roadways like Nurburgring, etc. (the two laners). Once I made it around without crashing, sliding off etc a few times, I increased the speed....and again...and again. Give it a try
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Thank you, I have tried the going slow technique, goes against the grain as I'm a bit of a speed freak, but I'll keep going.
 
Johnnypenso
No, it's not. In any car with peak power up near the redline, a good driver will have almost no difference in lap times because the AT will shift at the same point you would shift manually anyway.
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I agree with your point, but there are instances where short shifting can be beneficial.
There are also a few cars that benefit from going past the AT shift point.
 
SJC ALPHA
Thank you, I have tried the going slow technique, goes against the grain as I'm a bit of a speed freak, but I'll keep going.
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It's always best to start slow.
This is true when learning anything.
 
Hmm. I've got a disability that prevents me from being able to even reach the paddle shifters on my wheel. So I have to use AT, it's not a choice.

I used to race with the same group of friends for years in GT5. After a lots of seat time, I became one of the fastest guys in the group. Nearly always in the top 3 in qualifying. Another guy used a pad and was equally quick with AT as well.

Another instance: Last year at Virginia International Raceway, Nissan had a display with several rigs set up with GT6 running and a TT contest. Using a Nissan GTR on Trial Mountain. After a few tries I had not only the fastest time set that weekend but the fastest time ever set the entire Tudor Series season.

I don't use any driver aids and no ABS either with AT. Certainly not a popular combination! It has made me really concentrate on cornering speeds. The down side of course is some cars will really through off the balance by downshifting mid corner. I have a tough time with some Lamborghinis.

I'm not trying to brag, just giving you an example. I'm certainly no alien, not even close but I could run with some fast friends with no problem.
 
@NCRthree For most cars the AT shifts close to the optimal rpm. For other cars AT can be a big disadvantage.

This is an extreme example that very clearly demonstrates the latter:
Purchase a Suzuki Cappucchino '95 an take it to Daytona Speedway in free run.

Lap 1 - AT, shifting @ 8500 rpm: Lap time: 1:27.656 / top speed 170 km/h (never makes it to 5th gear).
Lap 2 - MT, shifting @ 7500 rpm: Lap time: 1:22.478 / top speed 185 km/h.

This is for lap 1, accelerating from 2nd gear. On a flying lap the gap would be even bigger.
 
Vegard
@NCRthree For most cars the AT shifts close to the optimal rpm. For other cars AT can be a big disadvantage.

This is an extreme example that very clearly demonstrates the latter:
Purchase a Suzuki Cappucchino '95 an take it to Daytona Speedway in free run.

Lap 1 - AT, shifting @ 8500 rpm: Lap time: 1:27.656 / top speed 170 km/h (never makes it to 5th gear).
Lap 2 - MT, shifting @ 7500 rpm: Lap time: 1:22.478 / top speed 185 km/h.

This is for lap 1, accelerating from 2nd gear. On a flying lap the gap would be even bigger.
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Oh for sure! A lot of times in spec races I had to make up time in corners. Noticed that in a BRZ/FRS stock series. Worse is the 71 Cuda.
 
AT is not always the best, as said before depending on the power curve.
My only problem with it is unlike a real AT, you can't get it to down shift when you want it to.
 
@WhoosierGirl uses an auto (but with a wheel) and she's seriously quick.

It all depends on who you've got on your friends list though. I use auto. A Sunday driver too but I'm always in the top 1 or 2 of my friends list where manual gearboxes are in the majority. If you've got the top 200 drivers in your friends list though, time to switch to manual. You'll need the added control.
 
xiando
I'd recommend NOT racing at first, instead just focus on getting around a circuit without crashing. Give it a try
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I took your advice with a VW Bora around the High speed ring, I set a time using AT then tried to match it using MT.
I beat it on my second flying lap by .3 of a second, I need more practice (lots actually) as there is more time to be had.
Manual is definitely faster and especially enjoyed holding 4th gear round the last turn. Will try again after NASCAR.
Don't have a friends list so I'll be faster either way :)
 
SJC ALPHA
I took your advice with a VW Bora around the High speed ring, I set a time using AT then tried to match it using MT.
I beat it on my second flying lap by .3 of a second, I need more practice (lots actually) as there is more time to be had.
Manual is definitely faster and especially enjoyed holding 4th gear round the last turn. Will try again after NASCAR.
Don't have a friends list so I'll be faster either way :)
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It's already been acknowledged that cars that peak early and fall off near the redline don't work as well with AT, and the VW would certainly fit that case as would many 4wd and other vehicles.
 
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