-kg or +HP, which is more valuable?

[VetteDawg]

So what gives you more bang for your PP buck?

Is your car quicker if you bring the weight all the way down and therefore have less Horse Power?

Or quicker with more Horse Power and carry the max for weight?

 

[Blitz187]

So what gives you more bang for your PP buck?

Is your car quicker if you bring the weight all the way down and therefore have less Horse Power?

Or quicker with more Horse Power and carry the max for weight?

In my experience.... this ENTIRELY depends on what car/track combo you are going to use... On some tracks more power is better and others less weight is better....

 

[Duke of Pendle]

I would say that in every case, weight is the enemy.
Weight cancells out power, when considering accelleration. Therefore, less weight makes the best use of what power you have.

The benefit continues with braking. Less weight = less momentum to dissipate when braking. Therefore braking distances are lower with less weight.

When cornering, the roll centre can be higher with less weight, and tyres need to generate less centripetal force. Therefore cornering speeds are higher with less weight.

This was the creed that the late, great Colin Chapman lived by.

 

[Diego440]

Reducing weight is usually better, in the short term. But you're usually able to put much more hp than you're able to reduce weight.

 

[Chadwicksracing]

Reducing weight is usually better, in the short term. But you're usually able to put much more hp than you're able to reduce weight.

👍 I always use less weight than HP. Straight line speed is important, but if you can't exit the corners with any speed whats the point.

 

[orimarc]

How to say this directly...I know. Let's see Top Gear Power Board:

1001 hp, 2000 KG Bugatti Veyron - 1.18:3
263 hp, 506 kg Caterham Seven R500 - 1:17.9

"More HP makes you faster on the straights. Less weight makes you faster everywhere."

 

[Exorcet]

In GT5P, going for min power + min weight per PP regulation yields a better power to weight ratio whenever I bothered to check. However, lowering horsepower automatically lowers top speed regardless of weight. On top of that, you have to consider your power curve. Some cars loose all of their top end when detuned, which can be bad. Generally though, I go for weight.

 

[VetteDawg]

1001 hp, 2000 KG Bugatti Veyron - 1.18:3
263 hp, 506 kg Caterham Seven R500 - 1:17.9

Would you know the formula for deriving the ratio?

 

[humpus]

I disagree. If you're a clean racer, capable of handling different racing lines and anticipating other racers, you can move up through the field with more weight.
I just love passing those stupid clio's on 550 Suzuka. Sure, they'll stick on you through the first sector, but just keep the door shut and make up time on the straights. You'll slipstream right past them.

Ps: in general, people use too sticky tires, which doesn't allow them to max out the use of weight or power.

 

[Stevisiov]

There is no definite answer to this, it purely depends on the situation, however I would argue in most scenario's saving weight gives greater performance than increasing bhp.

 

[Nicksfix]

This is a flip of the coin call.As others have said,it depends upon the car and the track.Currently I am using added weight in the Tuned Lotus Elise 111R for 650pp expert HSR.The Lotus does not weigh that much to begin with,so by adding weight it brings it up to the level of other cars,therefore I can add more H.P. to it.

 

[Diego440]

Would you know the formula for deriving the ratio?

The Stig?

I disagree. If you're a clean racer, capable of handling different racing lines and anticipating other racers, you can move up through the field with more weight.

But most of the time, more weight = more power, required in order to move that weight. So while the Clio weighs 1100 Kgs and has 200 hp, a Merc SLR weighs 1800 kgs and thus, needs 600hp to be agile enough.

 

[PaganiC12]

I would rather ditch weight then add power.

Taking away extra pounds makes you faster in a straight line, helps you stop quicker, makes the car easier and faster in the corners, and predicting the car is so much easier. For example, drifting a very heavy car is difficult because you have grip then when all the weight transfers the car is gone. (This is very true if your suspension is soft and your tires are not R-compound.) If you have a light car you can chuck it and hold the car. Additionally, adding horsepower only helps you on the back-straight of Fuji, while ditching weight helps you in Fuji, Suzuka, and Dayota. I've learned that taking off weight in the Dayota Oval makes you do faster laps than adding power, since you corner faster.

Basically, it depends on the track and your driving style. Personally, I would take a Lotus Elise over a SL55 AMG every single day.

 

[Scaff]

The Stig?



But most of the time, more weight = more power, required in order to move that weight. So while the Clio weighs 1100 Kgs and has 200 hp, a Merc SLR weighs 1800 kgs and thus, needs 600hp to be agile enough.

The laws of physics will however dictate that an 1800 kilo car will be more difficulty to start turning and more difficulty to stop turning that an 1100 kilo car.

Weight always blunt ability when it comes to a cars ability to turn.

And for anyone that wants the physics....

http://phors.locost7.info/phors13.htm


Regards

Scaff

 

[Magneto]

If you divide a cars original weight with it's original power, you get the original kilogram per horsepower. In every single car on GT5P that I've done the math on, you get less KG per HP when taking as much weight as possible off and lowering power output accordingly. I've used this to good effect on many cars.

 

[mPWRD]

I agree with some of the others: it's about the combination of car, track, and pp limit. For example, with the M3, you can maximize hp and minimize weight and still not reach 800 pp (i think). If you're driving a track with a lot of short straights and hard corners, such as Fuji or Eiger, you want low weight and a little less power. For a track like Daytona Road, which is more high-speed with a few sharp turns, you want more power, and a little bit more weight is ok. If you're driving on Suzuka, which has a combination, you want a good balance. It's always good to start with a balanced tune and then tailor it from there.

Thanks for the link, Scaff. Could really help me with my physics class...

 

[Scaff]

Thanks for the link, Scaff. Could really help me with my physics class...

No problem, here's the whole series.

http://phors.locost7.info/contents.htm

Regards

Scaff

 

[niky]

It depends entirely on the track. For tracks which are short with lots of corners, you go for lowest weight and lowest power. For tracks with really long straights, sacrificing lightness for top-end is necessary to keep up with traffic.

 

[snowgt]

In most cases...less weight.

The reason is, that in most cases the chassis is set up for a certain amount of hp and weight. Take away weight, and it will be easier to handle and quicker on straights and through corners. By simply increasing power, you can only gain on straights, but might even suffer in exits of tight corners as the chassis might not be able to put down that power on the tarmac appropriately.

Of course, you can try to fiddle with the setup to remedy that fact...but that's not always possible.

 

[MetalheadA7X]

I don't see why on twisty tracks less power is good.

I prefer using a light yet powerful car with short gear ratios so acelleration is quick. This applies to tracks such as Eiger rather than Suzuka of course.

 

[Ardius]

I don't see why on twisty tracks less power is good.

I prefer using a light yet powerful car with short gear ratios so acelleration is quick. This applies to tracks such as Eiger rather than Suzuka of course.

Less power and less weight is good on a twisty track compared to more weight and more power - which is the whole point of this thread, its a choice between the two.

 

[Lotrzyna]

How to say this directly...I know. Let's see Top Gear Power Board:

1001 hp, 2000 KG Bugatti Veyron - 1.18:3
263 hp, 506 kg Caterham Seven R500 - 1:17.9

"More HP makes you faster on the straights. Less weight makes you faster everywhere."

Would you know the formula for deriving the ratio?

I had some fun with numbers

Veyron mass/power - 1,99800200
Catheram mass/power - 1,92395437

so 1HP of Veyron would move 1kg of veron around TGTrack in 39,18915000s
so 1HP of Catheram would move 1kg of Catheram around TGTrack in 40,48952569s

hence Veyron has better engine...? but gaining weight didn't bring anything good for V.

but on the other hand

veyron/catheram mass 3,95256917
veyron/catheram hp 3,80608365

so veron gained more mass than it gained hp
for veron to have almost the same ratio of gained mass to gained hp Veyron would have to weight 1925,878 kg or have 1039,525 hp

and than the test could give us an answer, but C (air resistance ?) is also different for these cars, I assume, so the best is always test everything with 1 car

BDW all above is probably wrong so just don't bother yourself with it - I just considered it interesting and worth "wangling"? ;-)

BDW#2 in game I mostly try to go with less HP and less mass ...

 

[VetteDawg]

BDW#2 in game I mostly try to go with less HP and less mass ...

That part I understood.

 

[Stevisiov]

I didn't check in GT4 but does tuning your car affect the weight? I don't recall it does.

GT5P doesn't deal with parts, but if it did, the weight of parts would all have to be a consideration, racing chips, port polish they are all free horsepower (in terms of weight) so there is no real disadvantage to performance in doing them really, even on really tight stages.

I hope future GT games show the weight gain of particular parts (along with a torque power curve), it would make that choice over supercharger and turbochargers a little more interesting.

But that's all getting a little off topic. Fuji is the main HP track in GT5P, the lack of HP for the tuned Lotus really starts to show after 130mph, especially with that huge rear spoiler, loads of time is lost against a mines/blitz powerhouse, the elise will quickly make the time back on the rest of the track pretty much, so even at fuji power isn't everything.

 

[Stavingo]

It counts on the car, the track and the PP.

 

[zed300]

It's not as simple as it first seems. Sure, what most of you are saying is probably close enough, to use it regularly, but an engine is more than a just a number.Torque and where in the curve it is produced and for how long, coupled with the gear ratios is what produces the acceratoin.
So, just dropping the weight and Hp figure is not a necessity for all types of vehicle, to get the best out of them.
I find the higher the hp the less you have to drop the weight to improve the performance. The lower hp car will advantage more from a higher weight loss. This is more relivant, when the gear ratios cannot be changed to provide the max acceleration-top speed,for the selected circuit.

 

[arora]

Short tech track, loose the weight for sure. Long highspeed tracks, add the hp.

Simple

 

[niky]

Power can only get you so much... when you have too much weight, it dulls the responses of the car, you can't recover from turns as early, get on the power, etcetera...

The trick is really finding how little power you can get away with and still be competitive. Simply, a very fast, poor handling car can have the same lap time as a very slow, great handling car over one lap, but will be trickier to keep at that level over a whole race.

 

[Earth]

I always go low weight, low HP, even at Daytona SuperSpeedway

Horsepower only helps you once you are going straight

Less weight helps you accelerate, brake, and turn better.

Horsepower only helps you go straight faster.

 

[MeAgainstYou]

depends on the combo... but in the most times i use it balanced 👍