Lance Armstrong Possible PED Confession - (Oprah interview Jan 17)

Discussion in 'Sports' started by Earth, Aug 24, 2012.

  1. Earth

    Earth

    Messages:
    7,809
    Funny how there are murder suspects who don't seem to get dogged this much.

    What happened to Double Jeopardy? Why is this still going on? How is the USADA allowed to drag this on for so long?

    How can one man compete in 9 Tour de France events and not test positive once? Lets say he was on steroids. IMO it looks worse on whoever is testing these athletes then it does on Armstrong.

    Once baseball started testing for steroids one positive test after another is continually popping up. Armstrong is tested for a decade and no smoking gun?

    What bothers me about this case, whether Armstrong is guilty or not, is how it appears the USADA wanted to make an example out of Armstrong to either prove what they are doing is working or discourage further steroid use.

    Sad either way.
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2013
  2. Dean

    Dean

    Messages:
    6,255
    Location:
    Denmark
    Maybe the US wanted him to win? If so it's a bit like the Danish Tour de France winner of '96, Bjarne Riis. He confessed after, I think, 10 or 11 years. So it's not only Armstrong who cheated. They all did, well most of them atleast, and some does today too. I believe that's how this sport works, sadly.
     
  3. Mac K

    Mac K

    Messages:
    7,594
    Location:
    Canada
    Sad indeed, thats terrible..
     
  4. gogatrs

    gogatrs

    Messages:
    7,424
    Location:
    United States
    I really think that they should just make a second "class" so to speak for those that use steroids and those that don't.
    If you want to be competitive in that sport, isn't it somewhat required to do the 'roids?
     
  5. jjsahagun

    jjsahagun Premium

    Messages:
    79
    I always though of him as:
    Great athlete, with a greater doctor and with an even greater lawyer.
     
  6. McLaren

    McLaren Premium

    Messages:
    38,496
    Location:
    United States
    That's assuming Armstrong even cheated to begin with.

    I honestly can't believe they're still pursuing this. Didn't he retire in 2010 for good after finishing 3rd?
     
  7. Dean

    Dean

    Messages:
    6,255
    Location:
    Denmark
    I know, it's impossible to say if he cheated, but I believe he did.

    I'm not sure, about when he stopped.

    According to the Danish news; the American Doping agency is seeing this as a confession, and they'll try to ban him for life, and try to take his seven victories from him.
     
  8. Schwartz

    Schwartz Premium

    Messages:
    4,314
    Location:
    United States
  9. hawkeye122

    hawkeye122

    Messages:
    3,915
    Location:
    United States
    Did he do performance enhancing steroids? My opinion is still out on that.



    The USADA is making these accusations based on "Testimonies" give by 2 Riders who have been banned from cycling for drug use; Tyler Hamilton and Floyd Landis.

    He didn't test positive for years. In cycling, you are tested in season very VERY often, and even in the offseason you are required to give a place where you can be reached on certain dates for offseason testing.
    If he didn't fail a test, the USADA has no concrete proof, and thus, no case.

    The US Anti-Doping Agency doesn't have FULL say in who wins what.

    The UCI (Like the FIA, for cycling) has backed Lance Armstrong all the way. Apparently they are going to speak soon. I expect them to say something along the lines of
    "Yeah, but we gave him the trophy. It's ours to give and take, not yours."

    He's currently guilty as a result of him not entertaining the charges, which have arisen for the 4th time in as many years. He isn't "Admitting guilt", simply saying "I'm sick of the BS. This is an unfair trial"





    This is like(Hypothetical) SCCA investigating/going to dock wins from Corvette for running too big of a restrictor at Le Mans. However, Corvette passed ALL ACO inspections during the race weekend. SCCA has no proof, other than what a former team member (who had been kicked out of the sport for a Renault/Nelson Piquet Jr.-type incident) is claiming.
    SCCA can run up and down all day saying that Corvette "Didn't win". But the truth of it is- It's the ACO's event. They decide who wins or looses. And if Corvette passed all ACO inspections, then the ACO is fine with Corvette getting credited the win.
     
  10. lbsf1

    lbsf1

    Messages:
    3,679
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    I just heard about this on the bbc news. It is ridiculous, he has never tested positive to any drugs, his teammates may have at some point but that doesn't mean he did. From the bbc report it sounded like Lance has just had enough of the allegations so has stopped argueing against them, however still is adamant that he hasn't taken drugs.

    Just because this isn't a criminal case do the USADA think they are above Double jeopardy and innocent until proven guilty. If you can't prove he didn't do drugs then don't punish him, and as in this case there isn't even any solid evidence that he may have taken drugs.

    Feel so sorry for him.
     
  11. Dean

    Dean

    Messages:
    6,255
    Location:
    Denmark
    I believe it should be said, that it's possible to hide the use of doping or steroids, but, I can't tell how they hide it.

    Edit: Of course, I think he shouldn't be banned, as long as no doping or steroids have been found “in him”. As said above this; “innocent until proven guilty”.
     
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2012
  12. That90sGuy

    That90sGuy

    Messages:
    638
    Location:
    Australia
    The title of this thread is a bit misleading. Lance Armstrong has not been stripped of his titles yet. Unfortunately too many news sources have jumped to this conclusion, but I guess the USADA will take this action anyway (but isn't the UCI the only organisation who strips titles?).

    If this does happen however, there will be two groups of people who will view Lance throughout history. One side will be that he won those titles fair and square and the other side will scream "drug cheat". Me, I'm on the fair and square side.

    And, one of the cyclists looking to testify against him, Floyd Landis, isn't really the most reliable witness considering that he was an obviously on drugs when he won it back in 2005 (I think?)
     
  13. hawkeye122

    hawkeye122

    Messages:
    3,915
    Location:
    United States
    He did drugs in '06, came back several years later and did drugs AGAIN to with the Amgen Tour of California, a higher-level UCI event.
     
  14. That90sGuy

    That90sGuy

    Messages:
    638
    Location:
    Australia
    :nervous: Now I really don't trust the guy.
     
  15. Touring Mars

    Touring Mars Moderator

    Messages:
    22,638
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    I've temporarily editted the thread title because it is incorrect. The OP can change it to whatever they want, so long as it is factually accurate.

    I think the reason that Armstrong has been pursued to doggedly is because of the seriousness of the allegations against him - which not only include using drugs to further his own glorious career, but also that he was involved in a more serious way with doping of others.
     
  16. Bram Turismo

    Bram Turismo Premium

    Messages:
    10,686
    Location:
    Belgium
    10 years ago perhaps, but today there is no possible way to hide any form of doping. Especially not with riders being forced to tell the team of their whereabouts. Just look what happened to Rasmussen; He was never tested positively, and never accused of doping directly after a stage. But because he refused to tell the team about his whereabouts they threw him out of the Tour because he probably was taking doping. (Which he probably was)

    I'm not even bothered commenting on Lance's case. This is a man who has been found innocent in the past of taking doping, who has gone through a cancer, and many years of more hard work than any of his accusers will ever have hoped to put into their sport.
     
  17. Dean

    Dean

    Messages:
    6,255
    Location:
    Denmark
    Yes. I remember “the chicken” (That's what he's called in Denmark), a big shame, both for him and for Danes.

    I remember someone, I think it was Contadore, who had 0.000000001‰ of doping in his blood, I think after eating a steak or something.

    So, I think you're right. They would have seen if he had been using doping.
     
  18. Bram Turismo

    Bram Turismo Premium

    Messages:
    10,686
    Location:
    Belgium
    Clenbuterol.

    That is not a drug. They just hunted Contador down because he had something in his blood that they didn't like. Even though it is no performance enhancer.

    Seriously, you ban a rider because he had 5.0e10^-9 clembuterol in his blood? There is no possible way to take in an amount that little. And even if that amount someone managed to get into him, there is no existing way such a small amount actually affects performance or the body in general.

    I never bought the Contador allegations. In my view they just wanted to see him hunted down because everyone likes when the guy that kept beating your guy gets removed out of the equation.

    And then they said that Contador was an idiot to say that he ingested that amount of clenbuterol through his meat. Actually, there are a lot of athletes who have been infected with clenbuterol in the past, because clenbuterol used to be fed to animals.

     
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2012
  19. Dean

    Dean

    Messages:
    6,255
    Location:
    Denmark
    Yeah. I couldn't remember what it was, but it was something he apparently shouldn't have said he had eaten. I believe it's a good thing I'm not a sportsman.
     
  20. Bram Turismo

    Bram Turismo Premium

    Messages:
    10,686
    Location:
    Belgium
    The thing with Contador's statement, though, is that from over the 83,000 samples they tested from animals none contained clenbuterol.

    Still, I am convinced there was no performance gain to be found from such a small amount. Besides, why would a rider who knows he is the best in his sport and has won the Tour 2 or 3 times, do drugs?
     
  21. Dean

    Dean

    Messages:
    6,255
    Location:
    Denmark
    Good question. Sadly I can't answer it.
     
  22. PzR Slim

    PzR Slim Premium

    Messages:
    6,489
    Location:
    England
    So much misinformation in this thread and great to see the Armstrong PR Hype Machine in full swing. Honestly, read up on the subject a little more it might just enlighten you.

    Ask yourself one question. If he is innocent why wasn't he prepared to let the evidence USADA had against him be heard? He and he alone chose not to have the evidence heard.
     
  23. Dennisch

    Dennisch Premium

    Messages:
    26,949
    Location:
    Netherlands
    He is the most tested cyclist in the history of the sport. Nothing was ever found. Except the statements of people who did get caught.

    How long has he been fighting against this? Far too long it seems. The UCI should take a stand and defend Armstrong until the case is done. And won by Armstrong.
     
  24. PzR Slim

    PzR Slim Premium

    Messages:
    6,489
    Location:
    England
    What about his ex team mates who were prepared to testify in the arbitration process who have never been caught but were prepared to implicate themselves in the doping?
     
  25. Dennisch

    Dennisch Premium

    Messages:
    26,949
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Still doesn't make it a positive test.
     
  26. PzR Slim

    PzR Slim Premium

    Messages:
    6,489
    Location:
    England
    Did David Millar ever test positive? What about Voughters?
     
  27. Dennisch

    Dennisch Premium

    Messages:
    26,949
    Location:
    Netherlands
    I have no idea about those two.
     
  28. PzR Slim

    PzR Slim Premium

    Messages:
    6,489
    Location:
    England
    They didn't, yet Millar served a ban for doping and Voughters has recently admitted to doping. There are lots of cases of athletes from many sports who never failed a test yet subsequently admitted to or were banned for doping offences. And Lance did test positive but got a back dated TUE for saddle sore cream. Also the French doping agency re-tested some of Armstrong's samples from the 1999 tour and found EPO. The friendly UCI paid for a report that effectively said that the tests could not be relied upon because the samples were old and could have been degraded. They didn't however explain what chemical process could cause clean urine to produce EPO however.
     
  29. mattythedog

    mattythedog Premium

    Messages:
    7,551
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Big words from the USADA when they have no powers to strip Armstrong of his titles. Only the UCI can do that, so we have to wait and see what they do.
     
  30. GregTheStig

    GregTheStig

    Messages:
    2,436
    Location:
    United States
    With all the reports going around I really don't know what to believe. But this crap has been going on for so long I'm kinda not surprised he just gave up. It seemed like the USADA was going to "find" him guilty from the beginning.

    For the time being I still think he's innocent and I feel really bad that his amazing accomplishments are (probably) going to be stripped.