LSD and ESP

[phil bell]

What are the effects of a aftermarket LSD on a car that uses ESP(ESP can't be turned off) or brake intervention to prevent the inside wheel spinning? (Mclaren MP4,Dodge challenger,Mercedes SL55,etc).

 

[AMG_FTW]

Do you mean the irl cars, in which you cant turn esp off?

 

[freedomweasel]

I don't think the cars you mentioned use similar systems, but I could be wrong. The system on the McLaren isn't what is usually referred to as ESP. It's more like (a much more advanced version) of the XDS "differential" on the MkVI VW GTI.

In the game however, I'm not sure if their systems are actually carried over at all. So an LSD would be just like adding an LSD to any other car. The McLaren for example doesn't have anti-sway bars in real life but putting adjustable suspension on the car in GT adds the bars.

 

[phil bell]

I don't think the cars you mentioned use similar systems, but I could be wrong. The system on the McLaren isn't what is usually referred to as ESP. It's more like (a much more advanced version) of the XDS "differential" on the MkVI VW GTI.

In the game however, I'm not sure if their systems are actually carried over at all. So an LSD would be just like adding an LSD to any other car. The McLaren for example doesn't have anti-sway bars in real life but putting adjustable suspension on the car in GT adds the bars.

XDS is using the brake application to prevent wheelspin,it turns kinetic energy to heat and dosent really distribute it to the other wheel as efficiently.So it's not a true LSD.

Yup,that is exactly what im asking.Cos on the challenger at least I think they are carried over.

 

[phil bell]

Do you mean the irl cars, in which you cant turn esp off?

Sorry what is irl?

 

[freedomweasel]

XDS is using the brake application to prevent wheelspin,it turns kinetic energy to heat and dosent really distribute it to the other wheel as efficiently.So it's not a true LSD.

Yup,that is exactly what im asking.Cos on the challenger at least I think they are carried over.

As I understand the McLaren system, it's similar to XDS in that it just uses the brakes to reduce wheel spin. They did this in order to save weight over an actual LSD. I will say that it doesn't seem to drive like the reviews claim it does.

I know the AYC in the Evo is in the game because you can adjust it in the tuning menu. A lot of other real features, like adjustable aero on the Viper ACR, however aren't in the game. There might be a way to watch the data logger and see if the McLaren is doing anything fancy.

edit: I believe "irl" generally means "in real life". Though it's also the abbreviation for Indy Racing League and the country code for Ireland.

 

[phil bell]

As I understand the McLaren system, it's similar to XDS in that it just uses the brakes to reduce wheel spin. They did this in order to save weight over an actual LSD. I will say that it doesn't seem to drive like the reviews claim it does.

I know the AYC in the Evo is in the game because you can adjust it in the tuning menu. A lot of other real features, like adjustable aero on the Viper ACR, however aren't in the game. There might be a way to watch the data logger and see if the McLaren is doing anything fancy.

edit: I believe "irl" generally means "in real life". Though it's also the abbreviation for Indy Racing League and the country code for Ireland.

It feels like it has an LSD (doesnt spin inside wheel,does powerslides,etc) But It seems to me as lacking traction.The press also say it has an open differential.So what's your take on cars like this?

 

[freedomweasel]

It feels like it has an LSD (doesnt spin inside wheel,does powerslides,etc) But It seems to me as lacking traction.The press also say it has an open differential.So what's your take on cars like this?

This is the point where I have little to no real experience to add to the discussion. I've never driven anything like the MP4-12C so I can't comment on how it compares in the game. I also have little to no actual experience with cars with similar suspension/tricky e-differential/electronics. According to the press releases I believe the system is called "brake steering" and is used in their Formula 1 cars as well.

I can only say the way I understand how it works is that the electronics use the brakes to limit wheel spin. Also, driving the car in the game is incredibly difficult to me compared to cars like the 458, 430, etc whereas all the reviews say it's basically the new greatest thing and easy to control.

 

[phil bell]

I can only say the way I understand how it works is that the electronics use the brakes to limit wheel spin. Also, driving the car in the game is incredibly difficult to me compared to cars like the 458, 430, etc whereas all the reviews say it's basically the new greatest thing and easy to control.

Agreed,You gotta have a really delicate right foot and precise entry speed.The challenger however,that's easy and fun despite what I believe to be ESP.

Anyway,thanks for the input.👍

 

[onerichf]

Many agencies around the world have tested LSD to see if maybe it gave you any ESP. I still don't know how that helps in the corners though...​

 

[scca_ziptie]

"The MP4-12C uses a "yaw control" system that is turned on "all the time" with a higher threshold in Track Mode, but they McLaren are rumored to instruct owners how to turn it off for track days."

Quote was taken from Road & Track April 2011 issue(which has a GREAT article on the MP412-C & the F1 road car). I'd give this issue two thumbs up !!!

What I find truly amazing it the car generates peak horsepower @ 7000rpm; but the peak torque is rated from 3000-7000rpm..... Max HP & Torque acheived at the same RPM, that sounds like a helluva power delivery.

They did not "go into detail" on how the yaw control system works, but it would certainly seem to use the "conventional" method of operating individual brake calipers depending on what the computer deems.

 

[freedomweasel]

"The MP4-12C uses a "yaw control" system that is turned on "all the time" with a higher threshold in Track Mode, but they McLaren are rumored to instruct owners how to turn it off for track days."

Quote was taken from Road & Track April 2011 issue(which has a GREAT article on the MP412-C & the F1 road car). I'd give this issue two thumbs up !!!

What I find truly amazing it the car generates peak horsepower @ 7000rpm; but the peak torque is rated from 3000-7000rpm..... Max HP & Torque acheived at the same RPM, that sounds like a helluva power delivery.

They did not "go into detail" on how the yaw control system works, but it would certainly seem to use the "conventional" method of operating individual brake calipers depending on what the computer deems.

"The car will make use of Formula 1-sourced technologies such as "brake steer[1] ", where the inside rear wheel is braked during fast cornering to reduce understeer. " from wiki.

This technology was first seen in their MP4-12 Formula 1 car. (Not to be confused with the MP4-12C)

 

[phil bell]

"The MP4-12C uses a "yaw control" system that is turned on "all the time" with a higher threshold in Track Mode, but they McLaren are rumored to instruct owners how to turn it off for track days."

Quote was taken from Road & Track April 2011 issue(which has a GREAT article on the MP412-C & the F1 road car). I'd give this issue two thumbs up !!!

What I find truly amazing it the car generates peak horsepower @ 7000rpm; but the peak torque is rated from 3000-7000rpm..... Max HP & Torque acheived at the same RPM, that sounds like a helluva power delivery.

They did not "go into detail" on how the yaw control system works, but it would certainly seem to use the "conventional" method of operating individual brake calipers depending on what the computer deems.

With a well developed twin turbo engine these ridiculous figures are possible
I believe the yaw control is really brake control though:tup:

 

[AMG_FTW]

many agencies around the world have tested lsd to see if maybe it gave you any esp. I still don't know how that helps in the corners though...​

roflmaoew