mclaren f1 performance

[pedrocor]

Take a look at this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McLaren_F1

As you can read, the real top speed is reached in 6th gear at the rev limiter.

 

[Highlandor]

Around a tight track the Mclaren is not great, especially if its on sports tyres,

You have absoluetly hit the nail right on the head with that my friend.

All of my road cars have road (sports) tyres on them, slicks are for racing cars period. This is the way it is in real life, always has been, always will be. 👍

This thread is about the Maclaren performance and the issue with the top speed has been the main issue, however, I can't believe no one has mentioned the OTHER issue...

Standard gearbox:

1st gear = 75(?) mph
2nd gear + 120 mph

This is an absolute nightmare, using first coming out of a tight corner or chicane then the wheels spin, use second and the car bogs down and doesn't pull away cleanly.

Has anyone tried the Maclaren f1 '94 with the custom gearbox option and sport tyres (no weight reduction and no engine tuning - all standard)??

The car has zero grip...nothing...zilch, the rear whels spin as if you have mistakenly put comfort tyres on.

This is representative of real life, when Clarkson tested the F1 he hated it for this very same reason, you simply cannot use the power the car has got, in the lower gears.

When I saw the f1 in the game I was so happy, couldn't wait to drive it, but the reality is it's gearbox and it's power is it's downfall as a road car, just as in real life.

Which is a huge shame.

My Enzo has sports tyres and 700bhp - traction, no problem. My SLS AMG has 650bhp - traction, no problem. 458 Italia / 430 Scuderia - 600bhp - traction no problem.

I really hate to say it, but the f1 is just a huge dissappointment. Unless you are driving along a very long and very straight road.

There are so many tracks on this game, but there are only maybe 3 / 4 tracks where the f1 can really unleash it's potentional.

I had wet dreams of driving the f1 car around the 'ring, but that's just been shot to pieces, my ZZII in standard, unmodified form leaves it for dead and the ZZII costs 59,000 whereas the f1 costs 1,000,000.

Top speed is not the issue with the maclaren f1 because it can be easily fixed (with a custom gearbox), whereas the traction issues can't be fixed, period.

Unless you want to use soft slicks or driving aids, but what's the point of that, all cars feel the same, might as well be playing need for speed....

 

[Bigbazz]

Don't get me wrong though, you put racing hards on the Mclaren F1 and it is a different beast, it has buckets of traction and it litterally is a transformation. On the high speed tracks the F1 is very good. Tsukuba is my best real life comparison of a tight track (where the F1 isnt so good) because the cars record at that track is 1.04, where as the Japanese in their tuned Skylines and other cars (at a similar 600Bhp, the mines R34 for example) will do the track in 59 seconds.

Should be mentioned that the SLS AMG in game is probably too good to be realistic, based on watching the top gear america episode from the 21st dec. They explain how the car is not a "Track" car, and you could see by the way clarksons backend was all over the place, it is not a great race car in the real world, a lot worse than a Mclaren F1 by any standards.


The Mclaren F1 was designed to be usable in everyday life, and also to be comfortable and its looks were more important than its performance, they did not want to make a big wide long car that would spoil the looks, they wanted a supercar that was a real road car, this is why the car was quite a handful to drive and it took a lot of skill to get the most out of it, it would dominate at a high speed circuit but on tight tracks it would (and did) suffer. The GTR version however fixed a lot of these problems, obviously with reduced weight and harder racing suspension but also with the longtail design which greatly increased the stability of the car and improved the airflow. The longtail GTR version of the car went on to win Lemans.

In a straight line the game has it really good, the car accelerates at the right speed and almost hits the listed top speed (231mph). This car is my favourite car in the game by quite some margin, i have a lot of fun driving it and with racing tyres on it is one of the best stock road cars in the game, with road tyres it does suffer a little.

My biggest gripe is that you cannot adjust the gear ratios with the racing gearbox installed, so 1st and 2nd gear are hopelessly short which causes massive issues trying to drive it properly on tight tracks (and this is the games fault for locking gear ratios).

 

[TwinturboCH]

To the above,. Top gear raced a Mclaren F1 and Bugatti and though the Veyron obviously won the race it was close, there is no chance the Veyron would do 0-200 faster than the F1 can do 100-200.

What you are forgetting is that in that particular test, the F1 was driven by 'the stig' who would clearly be able to get the car off the line at close to the optimum, whereas the Bugatti was driven by Hammond who clearly got a crap start. Their test was obviously rigged (via driver skill) to make good t.v.

Im not one hundred percent sure but wasn't it the f1 GTR (race spec version) that got the record not the run of the mill f1??.

Nope, it was achieved with the normal road version F1. The GTR race car is actually significantly slower top end due to reduced gearing (so it hits max RPM in top on a circuit), more drag due to the additional aero parts, and less power as it has to run intake restrictors to comply with GT regs.

This thread is about the Maclaren performance and the issue with the top speed has been the main issue, however, I can't believe no one has mentioned the OTHER issue...

Standard gearbox:

1st gear = 75(?) mph
2nd gear + 120 mph

This is an absolute nightmare, using first coming out of a tight corner or chicane then the wheels spin, use second and the car bogs down and doesn't pull away cleanly.

You do realise that is the same as the real ratios right?

 

[JuiceMcGoose]

I have both the regular McLaren F1 and the Stealth version. Love the Stealth. Been using it as my grinder lately at Euro Champ. Rome. 99K Cr. for 5 1/4 minutes. Indy puts me to sleep. You lap the AI, which means trouble, but with 500 Cr. to rebuild the chassis or engine no big deal if you crash. Run about 2.3 rear camber and it's a lot of fun to drive. It's about 2 seconds a lap faster than the regular F1 at Suzuka but I haven't tested it's top end.

I tuned my Veyron to about 1250 hp, turned off all assists and ran 271 MPH at Sarthe with no draft. Important that you turn off ABS. And be ready with the pause button.

 

[JJ72]

My F1 with sport hards on has no major problem with traction, at least no major problem given it is a 600bhp beast with very little weight on it, it is no worse than a Zonda R and is a blast around Nurburgring. (7:10 bitches!!)

Even on Tsubuka I don't find it too much of a handful. It is very predictable on throttle and on the brakes.

About the long ratio, it's the same story with the F40, you just have to accept it as a design feature.

 

[transam1998]

I've mentioned this twice already but...what on earth is with the mclaren f1's straight line speed? It's so slow for an f1. I decided to drag against a veyron in 2player thinking here we go....it wasn't even close, I mean the veyron hit 243mph and the f1 hit 217mph.

There's two major issues really. 1). it only does 219mph, not 240 and 2). If you hit the rev limiter in 5th (or just before) and you shift up to 6th, bye bye speed. Your speed drops, from 219mph to 212mph.

Minor? Very just a little rant that I had to get on with. T'was bugging me GT5 is amazing nevertheless.

A lot of good points in this thread, check your horsepower, I don't remember exactly what mine was, bit It seemed to be about 30hp less than advertised when I purchased mine. Haven't broken it in fully, so don't know if it will climb to where it is supposed to.

Also, as mentioned, 6th gear is a fuel economy gear, you will get more top end if you leave it in fifth.

 

[daan]

You do realise that is the same as the real ratios right?

No, it is not. The GT5 F1 can do 80mph in first. The real one can only do 65mph in first.

The GT5 F1 is geared way too high.

Also, as mentioned, 6th gear is a fuel economy gear, you will get more top end if you leave it in fifth.

Again, the real one will hit it's top speed in 6th, as 5th will "only" take you to 180mph.

 

[transam1998]

My F1 with sport hards on has no major problem with traction, at least no major problem given it is a 600bhp beast with very little weight on it, it is no worse than a Zonda R and is a blast around Nurburgring. (7:10 bitches!!)

Even on Tsubuka I don't find it too much of a handful. It is very predictable on throttle and on the brakes.

About the long ratio, it's the same story with the F40, you just have to accept it as a design feature.

Lol, the first time I drove the F40, I was thinking, WTF!!?

I then looked up the specs for production F40s and found the gearing to be correct. Not sure if they tried to help fuel economy, cruise noise or just keep from blistering street tires. :-)

 

[JuiceMcGoose]

Lol, the first time I drove the F40, I was thinking, WTF!!?

I then looked up the specs for production F40s and found the gearing to be correct. Not sure if they tried to help fuel economy, cruise noise or just keep from blistering street tires. :-)

When Road and Track tested the F40 they said it was the loudest car they had ever tested. Over 100 dB in first gear.

 

[transam1998]

Hammond didn't use the launch control on the veyron to make it a closer race. Also they were in the desert and the higher the heat the less the turbos on the veyron would work.

Everytime they launch that car, they get several seconds of obvious turbo lag :-/ You can see the car take on a whole new life once the turbos are up. Not sure if they do that intentionally to keep it close, or they just don't want to risk hurting the transmission or what?

 

[JJ72]

Lol, the first time I drove the F40, I was thinking, WTF!!?

I then looked up the specs for production F40s and found the gearing to be correct. Not sure if they tried to help fuel economy, cruise noise or just keep from blistering street tires. :-)

It's designed so you stall everytime you ease off the light and people get a better look of the car.

lol no seriously it's classic italian car tradition, long gears and a gradually unwinding engine over actual practicality, the F40 still has that influence in it.

 

[Bigbazz]

The F40 is a marvel, it does 200mph with 481bhp. Back in those days that was a lot of power for a road car and the F40 was the king for a short while. Cars that do 200mph today generally have a lot more power on tap and so will accelerate harder through those gears.

 

[Highlandor]

You do realise that is the same as the real ratios right?

And............???

Didn't stop Clarkson from hating it due to lack of traction in those gears...

Plus try driving it on a tight and twisting track with those gear ratio's, I went 2 seconds faster around Deep Forest on custom gearbox with rear wheels spinning constantly..???

75 in first and 120 in second is just ridiculous..

Maybe, in real life when you're just driving around in normal traffic, with normal speed limits and you have an accelerator pedal with which to control the power and torque, it isn't so bad. But I don't have that luxury, and I don't have an accelerator pedal....

 

[appplezz101]

well by a fully custimizable transmission. thats what i did with my aston db9 that had a top speed of 273? and put to 191 so you could get the transmissiaon and make it like 240 or 245

 

[Yaycandy69]

I have a Stealth F1 and it is faster than the veyron.

 

[TwinturboCH]

Didn't stop Clarkson from hating it due to lack of traction in those gears...

Clarkson is a poor example as he's, frankly, a terrible driver. Yes the F1 is twitchy and moves around underneath you, but in real life, a lot of race drivers like it like that

 

[JJ72]

But I don't have that luxury, and I don't have an accelerator pedal....

That's your entire problem.

 

[finnracer]

Strange as it is NFS Shift actually got the gearing pretty much perfect for the Mclaren F1(even though it way way too short on most of the other cars) and it is a shame that it is too long in GT5 Oh well the Sealth model has much better gearing

 

[skywolf23]

Clarkson is a poor example as he's, frankly, a terrible driver. Yes the F1 is twitchy and moves around underneath you, but in real life, a lot of race drivers like it like that

I think clarkson hams it up a great deal for the camera and his heavy tail wagging foot. I mean look at him in the few shows where he is actually racing in a series and he does handle cars pretty well under race conditions, well other that passing under yellow flag thing.....but i think he can do it just clean race driving is not that exciting on test track with cameras rolling.

F1 tho in real life does take a bunch of getting to know the car, it is a pure drivers car there are no driving aids, no nice smooth clutch and gearbox, not much of anything other than i think it has abs, but it is as about as pure a race car for the road you can get. With the only other contender in that vein back then being the F40.

 

[alucard0712]

I do whole Like the Wind with tuned F1, and it's no engine upgrades at all.It's a beast.But it has lower grip than RM'ed Corvette.

 

[Highlandor]

That's your entire problem.

Really...Oh wow..thanks ...that's my life's problem's sorted .. 👍

Gee..

I mean, the fact that I have already mentioned that I have other cars on similiar power to weight ratio's and the same tyres, that DON'T have traction issues has got nothing to do with it then..??

The fact that I have 270 cars, all my road cars are on sports soft tyres and the only one that I have a problem with is the F1..??

Plus, one of the top car reviewers in the country had the same problem as me in real life..??

All of this is irrelevant because I'm not using pedals...??

Of course...my bad......I'm sorry........it's just me, absolutely nothing to do with the car....

 

[transam1998]

No, it is not. The GT5 F1 can do 80mph in first. The real one can only do 65mph in first.

The GT5 F1 is geared way too high.


Again, the real one will hit it's top speed in 6th, as 5th will "only" take you to 180mph.

Doing some your research,


taken from the Mclaren Wiki

Both the standard edition and the 'McLaren F1 LM' have the following gear ratios: 3.23:1, 2.19:1, 1.71:1, 1.39:1, 1.16:1, 0.93:1, with a final drive of 2.37:1

The McLaren F1 uses 235/45ZR17 front tires and 315/45ZR17 rear tires (using only the rear tire daimeter for this.)

The engine has a redline rev limiter set at 7500 rpm


Plugged into a gear vs speed calculator

rpm 1 2 3 4 5 6
7500 82 121 155 191 229 285 mph

Sounds pretty close to me.

 

[transam1998]

It's designed so you stall everytime you ease off the light and people get a better look of the car.

lol no seriously it's classic italian car tradition, long gears and a gradually unwinding engine over actual practicality, the F40 still has that influence in it.

Lol @ light comment, nice :-)

 

[JJ72]

First off, Tiff Needel liked the car and has no problem with it, he is a much more capable driver and I think we can lay that point to rest, how the real car does isn't directly relevant to how the car in game does anyway.

Then, what other cars with similiar power to weight ratio are we talking about? The one you listed only the Enzo came close, and that is a car with two more decades of chassis and suspension development. Compare to its then competitions such as the F40, the F1 is pretty superb in traction, and don't forget the F1 only had 315 rear tires, a Lambo murcielago have 325 in the front and 355 at the rear, modern cars are heavily tyred.

I have the zonda R, Enzo, and SLS all together, the F1 is only slower than the Zonda R and on sport hard is very controllable, you only need to be careful with the throttle and control the torque surge at mid range - and that's why I say the problem is your control input, if you have a real pedal it will be alot easier.

 

[transam1998]

Really...Oh wow..thanks ...that's my life's problem's sorted .. 👍

Gee..

I mean, the fact that I have already mentioned that I have other cars on similiar power to weight ratio's and the same tyres, that DON'T have traction issues has got nothing to do with it then..??

The fact that I have 270 cars, all my road cars are on sports soft tyres and the only one that I have a problem with is the F1..??

Plus, one of the top car reviewers in the country had the same problem as me in real life..??

All of this is irrelevant because I'm not using pedals...??

Of course...my bad......I'm sorry........it's just me, absolutely nothing to do with the car....

And exactly how do you not have traction issues with a 2600 lb car with 630hp and street tires?

Even my 3500 lb firebird with only 500 hp spins my drag radials quite easly, when I had the Goodyear Eagles on it, it was almost undriveable.

 

[alucard0712]

GT5 itself has a problem with L1 and R2...and I loose some races just because of this...and yes - on McLaren F1...

 

[daan]

Doing some your research,
....
Plugged into a gear vs speed calculator

rpm 1 2 3 4 5 6
7500 82 121 155 191 229 285 mph

Sounds pretty close to me.

Autocar's test say 65, 95, 125, 150, 180, ~230. McLaren raised the limit on the car that did 240.2mph, so all of them would naturally go up a touch.

Question. If it was really geared to 285 in 6th, why did it achieve 231 standard, and 240.2 with the rev limit raised? If it could do 280ish in 6th it wouldn't have needed that.

Lets quote Andy Wallace after he did a 384km/h (238mph) run at Nardo, Ehra Lessien

We're very close to the rev limiter now

So, he was in 6th, doing 238mph, very close to the limiter. If 6th went up to 285mph, he wouldn't have been anywhere near it (and way way over it if he was in 5th.)

 

[transam1998]

The F40 is a marvel, it does 200mph with 481bhp. Back in those days that was a lot of power for a road car and the F40 was the king for a short while. Cars that do 200mph today generally have a lot more power on tap and so will accelerate harder through those gears.

I've noticed that as well. The Jaguar XJ220 was another. Seems like modern cars need well over 500 to 600 to get the same mph out of them.

 

[transam1998]

Autocar's test say 65, 95, 125, 150, 180, ~230. McLaren raised the limit on the car that did 240.2mph, so all of them would naturally go up a touch.

Question. If it was really geared to 285 in 6th, why did it achieve 231 standard, and 240.2 with the rev limit raised? If it could do 280ish in 6th it wouldn't have needed that.

Lets quote Andy Wallace after he did a 384km/h (238mph) run at Nardo, Ehra Lessien


So, he was in 6th, doing 238mph, very close to the limiter. If 6th went up to 285mph, he wouldn't have been anywhere near it (and way way over it if he was in 5th.)

Yep, their graph does show that. and their gearing and tire sizes are the same as wiki, and when I plug them into a gearing calculator, You get what I put above. I can poke around more, this stuff always interests me.