Menu and Presentation Considerations

  • Thread starter Thread starter JohnBM01
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Your competely right about the memory and time it would take, but if it was possible, thats how I would like it to be done, what you could do to overcome that problem of frustrating people trying to find a certain car or the time it would take to get to the car is have a option where you pres a button and a list of all the available cars comes up, choose the car on the list and you jump to the part of the showroom where that car is.
 
Pretty cool idea. Or even just a warp to a manifacturer even. But i think warping to the car itself might be a better idea. Quicker.
 
:tup:I like the idea of needing a licence of a certan level to buy certan cars. This would make things a little more challenging. You would still be able to see all the cars, as something to shoot for.
All of this would improve the game but, it would need it's own disc.
 
Well, I made the "License" deal so that a Class B racer doesn't Gameshark his/her way up to a high-powered GT car. To me, you learn to take advantage of faster cars in tougher tests. For example in GT2, you go from the Fiat Coupe's 0-1000m test, all the way up to clearing the Laguna Seca corkscrew in a Nissan R390 GT1. And then of course, you race all the way up to racing a Toyota GT-One around Apricot Hill.

Another example I wanted to give out was going to be a seperate thread (still not sure), but try this. How would you like to go through the showroom thing, find a road car, and get a special paintscheme for it? Now I have logic to this. When you played Gran Turismo 3, you got new cars with different paintschemes. And these paintschemes can not be had from the dealer. I mean, where can you get a Honda NSX with a chameleon paint in which green blends into blue? Where can you get an Audi TT for a a candy red or candy green color (technical names are Red Metallic and Green Metallic respectively)? So if you want to get special colors for a car, you may want to have a specialized color as an option. You can choose between the following: (1a) a color not available from the dealer (1b) a chameleon-style paint which you can customize to have two or three colors to blend (as long as they are stylish). You can also select "reflex spice" if you wish. (2) you can choose a two-tone or three-tone car style (3) with rally-modifiable cars, you can purchase a lightpod to get that authentic rally look in darkness.

Now, what would you consider? Let's say that you attended the Chevrolet Showroom and you were in the market for a Corvette. Would you want (a) all streetcar versions of the Corvette in one section including competition cars based on the streetcar being modified (b) all streetcar versions of the Corvette in one section, but compeitition and modifieds in a special/custom section, or (c) all streetcar versions of the Corvette in one section while you can link to customs and modifieds without leaving the Corvette section? An option I'd like include is that when selecting a car, you may see a small checkered flag by the car in the car list. If you see one of these checkered flags by the car, that means that you can buy the car, and if you wish, participate in a race series based on that car. So for example, if you wanted to enter Aston Martin's showroom, and you bought a DB7 to compete in a DB7 Cup race, you can access the manufacturer-sponsored events in two ways. The classic approach is being able to go into the showroom and enter the Special races (just like in Gran Turismo 2). The modified approach would be to access the special race from your home garage, the city, the tuning shop, the manufacturer's showroom, or the car section. So if you owned a Mazda 6 or 3, you can access a GT-style "Mazda Rev it Up," whereas you can race an autocross course and take some laps at Laguna Seca. If you wanted to race from your home garage, you can press the X button on "Special" and compete in the race of your choosing. To make things more interesting and simple, you can choose between manufacturer-sponsored event (like a Type R Cup or a Lancer Evo Meeting), or a GT-sanctioned race (FF Cup, FR Cup, Roadster and Spider Race, Stars and Stripes, Italian Avantgarde, that sort of thing). I think the showroom idea is pretty popular here, but we can also make looking for races to compete in more simpler. And I hope I struck gold doing that for you all. Remember, your ideas are as special as mine.
 
Special paints would be a nice touch.I think almost everyone would like to make thier car special. The special races would add also,but, the AL should match hp with hp. Thatway you couldn't mod up a car to the 9's and walk over everything in the race.

Just to add to the showroom angle. How about the tuner shop? Once you purchase a upgrade, they show mechanics installing the parts.(not gona happen). It would be something to look at, like eye candy, then they put it on a dyno to show improvements.(add another disc). Just me dreaming. Who knows, maybe by GT5 or GT6.

I also heard that they will be adding light wieght wheels.Read in a mag. I guess they would be a racing wheel, cost alot more but you gain some hp. (off the topic a bit) JohnBm1, have you heard if they will be adding any new wheel suppliers?
 
Originally posted by kart racer
I also heard that they will be adding light wieght wheels.Read in a mag. I guess they would be a racing wheel, cost alot more but you gain some hp.
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A lighter set of wheels wont make your car any more poweful, what they will do is decrease the cars weight and increase to effectivness that the power your car already has, and they will effect the cars handling.
 
I don't think mechanics installing the parts for you will possibly happen. But my overall view of the tuning shop would go like this:

Your car rotates in a 360 degree view (did you know the car view rotates 360 degrees in a counterclockwise (or as some people say, anticlockwise) direction?). I'm imagining either: (a) parts you can buy are displayed like menus in Gran Turismo 3, where everything is below the center of the screen. When you roll over an option, (a1) arrows will point to the part to be upgraded, or (a2) the part of the car to be upgraded will glow in red. Either that or (b) the tuning options available for the car will be shown on the left-hand side and be translucent while you see your car rotate. From here, the parts available for your car will be glowing in several different colors, and a description of the parts that can be upgraded will be displayed in a read-out.

To me, this should be the options for tuning. There may be some exclusions or inclusions, but here goes:
SUSPENSION
ENGINE
---ENGINE/NORMAL
---ENGINE/TURBO
---ENGINE PARTS AND UPGRADES
---ENGINE-BUILDING SHOP (must have any International License or higher)
TRANSMISSION
TIRES AND BRAKES
OTHERS
---WEIGHT REDUCTION
---RACING MODIFICATION
-----R.M./ENGINE SWAP
-----R.M./CARBON FIBER
---DRESS UP/OTHER PARTS (change headlight color, purchase lightpod (rally cars only), decal kits, body paint (includes chameleon colors), etc.)

Ahh, the power of imagination. Reply away, public.
 
Quick note... the "Engine" part means that if you have a car that can be tuned to have normal or turbo tuning (like the Honda Civic Type-R or PT Cruiser), you can choose which tuning you wish to upgrade for.
 
JohnBM01, you are so full of ideas. Where do draw them all from? You always have some great words of wisdom.

I really like the showroom idea, where you can cycle around the showroom, I feel that if it was first person it would be pretty cool. I remember in Need For Speed Porsche Something or rather You could pop open the doors, the hood and the bonnet, if that was implemented in Gran Turismo 4 it would be great. Even better if you could take the roof off and on, on a convertable, with a cool real fold-away animation, it would be impressive.
 
:cheers: Love your ideas, and the part about the having to be at a cert.. level before you can do some of the mods is great. And using a game shark to get to a level is for people who can't drive!!! ( I,m ready for the flack on that one.)
keep up the great threads.
:bowdown: JohnBM01 :bowdown:
 
You ccan say well done, or I like thoes ideas without treating John like a god. I'm sure John's flattered though but you make yourselves look bad as the previouse post proves.
 
Ass-kissing? Don't remind me of my Chat nights. I just provide an idea and people make their opinion. If this was butt-kissing, if I came up with the "Will GT44 have mechanical failure" topic, I'd be loved for my claims instead of being told "what the hell you been smoking before typing, John?" So, I given out my ideas and I thank you for your comments.

But, I have MORE ideas. This time around, I think the Home Garage needs better sorting. So if you sort by car value or manufacturer, it should STAY that way. If you see a car you want to tune rather than getting into it and then tuning, it is a good idea to have a "Tune Now" mode in the garage. From there, you can tune your car's parts and settings without hitting the track. This will be a good way to enter races when having a tuned car when a race requires Normal Cars. As long as no bodywork or permanent engine work has been done, you can freely change parts to get ready for the Normal Car race in question. Also when it comes to menus, I think you should be able to configure sound right away instead of "living with it" at raceday. In so many other games, I could decide on what music I want played, what sound settings I want, maybe restart the race (never going to happen for GT. Run what you brung)... but in GT, you don't get that. All you get is "Continue" and "Exit." I think the Pause mode should have a mini-options screen where you can control what you want to hear or modify. I mean, look at the EA Sports games. You can pause within the game and change several aspects of the game while in pause. You should also be able to access the options from the Home Garage, if not during a race.

Now, if you use a guest's garage, you should be able to use that garage in Arcade mode, not like in Gran Turismo 3 where you access someone else's garage and not use their stuff. If PD wanted to make things a bit better, check this out. If you have a second memory card with GT4 data, your garage will be expanded. So you can view the garage of one memory card or the other. And both can appear in the same "my garage" if you wish. Cars on Memory Card 1 will have a blue background, while cars on Memory Card 2 will have a red background. This is to aid in knowing which cars are from which memory card. But to me, I think there should be a catch. The catch is that if the other memory card has a 2,000,000 Cr balance with over 30,000,000 in cars, you can trade the cars from the other card into your garage. Now sure, your garage will be expanded, but if you're toting a new GT game on one memory card, you'll have to work to get enough money to keep those cars. For example, let's say I have 40 cars on my original memory card. But on my second card, I have 120 cars I downloaded from a magazine CD onto my original PS2 memory card. I can expand my garage by using cars from another memory card, but in order for me to keep the cars I am using from the other card is to Trade. Even if it means I lessen my garage from 40 to 30 to get the newer rides, so be it.

Okay, so the idea is a little flawed, but I'm trying to null the cheating possibilities. Maybe an alternative idea is that if you win the race with that car and win maybe 3 or 5 in a row or win an endurance with it, you can receive the car from the other memory card. The car in its original form as saved on the other card will stay, but the car you used to win with will be used up for you to own and take care of. The requirements may be tougher if you are trying to get more powerful cars. Anyhow, more ideas to come as well as potential commentary.
 
Or here is a nice way of putting it... the more you use the car from the other Memory Card and the more you win with it, the lower it will cost for you to trade it. A 50,000 Cr Corvette can sell for maybe 35,000 Cr by winning races and championships. But if you simply dominate with that car, you can trade it for free and add another car to your collection.
 
Originally posted by JohnBM01
if you simply dominate with that car, you can trade it for free and add another car to your collection.
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That's basically a licence to print money unless they've up'ed the ante about threefold. If one word describes the "racing" experience GT3 provides, it's complete and utter, invariably total domination.
 
You know, I've mentioned menus and presentations, but I'll make a small presentation consideration for racing. First, I think with "Tokyo Xtreme Racer 3" out, the headlights have a brighter glow, and I think the brake lights can shine a little brighter as well. I mean, when a car is far away, you know that you can barely see who's behind you. Now, I'm going to take this one from "Le Mans 24 Hours." No, I'm not talking about 24 drivers to a track (although that would be cool), but I'm talking about knowing who you can take for position. To me, when you trail someone, a graphic above the leading driver can be shown to know if you can improve position. In fact, here are two considerations:

(1) You have a little bit above the center of the screen, a specialized window that shows how much you trail another driver (or how much you are leading). So if you raced against a Nissan R390 Road Car (didn't want to be fancy this time), the window would say (as an example):

-----
(Driver Name) (new thread about this coming soon)
Nissan R390 GT1 Road Car = -1.556 sec., 1st Place
-----

or

(2) If a car is lapped, a window will be displayed talking about how many laps they are down. For example:

-----
(Driver's Name)
Ford Focus Rally Car = -2 laps, 5th Place
-----

Not only will you see that in the window, you will also get to see "2 Laps Down" above the driver's car, so it's easy to read if they are trailing. Also, you won't be hitting yourself for not gaining any position.


This would be an interesting idea, but it's optional. Do you remember the four styles of replay? One is normal, the other is a mode that switches views with the music, the third one is normal but with special views sometimes, and the last is a fairly wide view angle. What would make a nice consideration for style points is if you can have a special background around the screen, much like listening to an audio file with Windows Media Player. I myself, I like some of these special effects. My considerations would be starry, sparkly effects because I am fascinated by nighttime and I like it in my art. Then you may choose motion blurs, slow-mo replays which looks like you're watching a full-motion video (FMV) on Playstation 1, dramatic views like in Tokyo Xtreme Racer 3, fire and explosions, fireworks, Gran Turismo 4's logo jumping across the screen... so many options.

So, more ideas for the race, and the replay. You like? Reply. You dislike? Reply. Don't know what to say? Take your time to come up with words, then REPLY.
 
The little box above the car, I asume it would be for online races. Not a bad idea but with only 6 cars on the track at a time, it wouldn't be hard to figure out the position of the car ahead. The specail effects on replay only please,could be fun.
 
As I've said, I couldn't care less about online play, but you have to consider both online and offline. I mean, so what? You have to have interactivity in both online and offline play. I think the Need for Speed series did a great job of showing off where the rivals are and how far away they are. I say that when you have 6 racers, maybe if another racer is within 5 or 10 seconds, they will be shown. So someone 12 seconds behind won't be displayed. But if you trail by a huge margin, knowing how far away from the leader you are will give you something to work with. I mean, in any race, knowing where the leader is is imperative. I mean, look at "Mario Kart 64" or "Mario Kart Double Dash!". If you had a blue shell, you could blow the crap out of the leader. But this is a REAL racing game we're working with, so by learning how far away you are from the leader can give you a preference as to how hard you should be driving to catch up and make a run for the lead. Another bit of Menu talk would be to have a special "console" in the menu screen. The menu screen will be new if I created GT4. To me, the Continue and Exit options will be at the bottom as menus in GT3. The Continue/Exit bar can be customized with a few options. During a race, you can see the current running order. A bar below the running order will have information that will flash every 5 seconds. The varying information consists of the fastest laps from you and your rivals, track information, qualifying order, and such. When in a championship is in session, the varying bar of information becomes MORE useful than in a single race. The championship info bar features track information, qualifying order, fastest times by you and your rivals, the next three races of the championship, recommended pit window, track tips, point standings, estimated race length, and for some races, you'll get some tips based on the car you're racing. For endurance races, you can elect to have this information bar show you recommended race length, and if you read through it all, you may be able to quickly press Select to quickly save your game from your last pit stop. Or you may be able to choose how you want to save during endurances. Another nice feature would be to get an idea as to what cars you COULD win.

I'm not the only idea person around here. If you have something to contribute, go for it. Don't just wait on me to generate any ideas.
 
Some nice ideas are being put into the Prologue edition. I seen the GT4 gallery, and some of the menus look pretty nice. For example:

https://www.gtplanet.net/gallery/gt4p?&page=1

This is just one of the pages featuring nice menu pictures. They are even translated for you non-Japanese types. To be honest, one of the nicest features I seen was the screen for selecting options for your car. These include transmission select, assisted driving select, and tire select. What I would like to see is rally cars being drivable on road courses. Now, I know what you're thinking. "Why a rally car on a road course?" For that matter, "why a McLaren F1 at Citta di Aria?" I think rally cars are still race cars despite the difference in series. You raced against them in GT3, didn't you? GT World Championship's beginner class. So I know what I'm talking about. I even raced a Peugeot 206 Rally Car in the 4WD Pro League, and a Citroen Xsara Rally Car in the FF Pro League. So, and how about this? A top-speed test with an Escudo on the Test Course! Of course, this is just for starters. So, there are a lot more that can be done, and check out the above website to see more of Prologue's pictures. This can help in determining Menu and Presentation Considerations.
 
To help make this a hot topic with this thread, allow me to note that Page 11 of the Prologue callery has the menu pictures of mention. That is at:

https://www.gtplanet.net/gallery/gt4p?&page=11

If some of the items here any indication of menu design, I kind of like it. And looking at the GT Concept pictures, the menus to concept were colorful and enticing. I can imagine if GT4 were as much as eye candy even in a bunch of menus. Some seperate threads come up with some interesting ideas for GT4 presentation.

I think that for some people, jazzing up the menus with a techno-style theme with a blue background and some stylistic effects would be cool. You know, like when you have WinAmp and you can enable those special effects while you play a song. I don't know how Gran Turismo or Gran Turismo 4 or Polyphony Digital graphics would be shown with these showy effects, but it would be interesting to see how it would work out.

Again, any more menu or presentation ideas? Give this one a holler.
 
Can't say I give a crap about the menu, long as it's fast, easy to use, and doesn't cause a head ache, I'm happy
 
As something I thought of recently, I mentioned a showroom you can actually navigate. Some people don't like the idea because it takes up too much space. So here is a 2D solutiion:

Instead of a top-down view of the showroom, a generic showroom shows filled with all sorts of cars. Instead of the cars in their top-down view, the cars are replaced with the icons of them. So for example, Honda has maybe 10, 12 cars in GT3. So all the machines up for sale or for viewing will be displayed by their icons. And when you choose which car you want to look at, you will get the showroom view of it, as it were on display in New York, Detroit, Geneva, or whatever. I think that the cars displayed should get a nicer shine job. Like maybe you can have the big lights over the cars, but have maybe the cars surrounded by a starry background. To me, this will give the car a sparkly, shiny effect once viewed. Custom backgrounds and effects for each car, as I mentioned, will also be special. I think that a navigational showroom more than the list of cars will stay true to my "3D Showroom," but will not in any way slow down or frustrate shopping.

Another consideration I have is that if there is a seperate tuning division (for example, AMG for Mercedes-Benz, Spoon Sports for Honda, etc...), there should be a seperate "showroom" featuring those machines. This next one might be a good idea. If there is a car you unlocked by winning races or a championship, you have a chance to "unlock" that showroom. For example, if you get a Mini Cooper in GT3, my GT4 example will allow you to access Mini and maybe buy cars in the color you so choose. You can even get race cars and concepts, but as in an old post, you'll need maybe an International License depending on its power and capabilities, and a Special License for the concepts. Then if you sell a car that cannot be sold at a car dealer normally, you may be able to buy the car again since you've unlocked it. I think this will avoid the trouble of getting an earnable car and then selling it. Because when you sell that machine, it's gone. At least you can be able to buy new ones, pending you have gotten a car that cannot be bought. The only exception to the rule MIGHT be the Formula One cars. Those cars kind of look like real-world machines, but with generic paint. Then again, name me one car company where you can buy their F1 car right off the lot. The F1 Machines are a definite "must get an 'S' license to race."

This last one concerns used cars. First off, I think all companies in the game can use a used car lot except if the lineup of cars isn't very big (for example, the Lister Storm in GT2). But if you sell a car on one day, you may be able to buy the car again for a cheaper price before the car and its tuning is sold to another person. And of course, the more tuning to a car, the more you can get back in return. So if you have a 25,000 Cr machine and tuned it for over 200,000 Cr, the formula for the price will most likely be:

(car value/4) + (price of tuning/2) = new sale price

I'd also boost the sale price based on the car's mileage. So a car that raced a 150-mile endurance can sell for higher, but can be bought back for less. And with the selling option, you keep everything you've modified to the car. But if you seriously want to sell a car, when you sell, a dialog will read: "Do you wish to sell? NOTE: if you seriously want to sell this machine, you cannot buy it back in its form at all."

Well, three more ideas, and it looks like I'm a "Bronze Member" now... I'm shooting for gold, you know that.
 
Someone mentioned a little "R" logo in front of a car name. To me, this gives me an idea based on a rather confusing example.

This is the "letter system" which determines what kind of tuning is done:
(no symbol) = normal car
T = Tuned Car
R = Race Car, or car modified for racing

There is a special situation to address. What is the difference between a tuned car and a TUNED car? This will save you some trouble. If no permanent changes had been made to the car (i.e., Port and Polish, Displacement UP, Weight Reduction, and the like), the symbol for the Tuned car will be a normal letter "T." But if the car experienced weight reduction or engine modifications, the Tuned Car symbol will be a cursive capital "T." And if you take a car to a race and it has no permanent modifications, you can have a dialog say "This car has been tuned, so the entry of this machine in its current configuration will be denied. Do you wish to automatically downtune the vehicle's parts so that it can compete? [Yes] / [No] " This "Auto Tune" option will allow you to downtune your machine so you can meet regulations for normal car races. I hope I can save you all from having to downtune the car yourself. If you want to keep all the current settings and quickly reload the car's last configurations, you can load them from your Memory Card. The settings before Auto-Tune can be quickly reloaded without having to buy a new car altogether and modifying components.

So, what do you think? Another winner?
 
I've decided to update this topic per the request of my "Used Car Considerations" thread. This is the thread I have made some months ago to discuss how menus should look or want to look. Since I am a sugesstive person, I was wonderfully thanked for my efforts.

But the real update is that someone mentioned Project Gotham Racing 2. And in an episode of "X-Play," the game review of PGR2 featured an actual showroom you can walk through. For the one I seen in the review, it was a Ferrari showroom. It was first-person, so you could see the Enzo up close and personal. But the showroom idea I envisioned earlier in the thread goes back to R-Type Final's Museum mode. Along with that, were many different thoughts and opinions. If you haven't already, check out some of them. Anyhow, if you have any questions or further comentary, I'm here, all eyes and ears.
 
Good ideals abound in this topic. First I just want to say, I think getting as many cars, tracks, getting the a.i. improved, getting online racing ironed out, and making sure car phyisc's are great take top priority. The rest is icing on the cake. Good usefull menus and flawless user interface just make a good game better.
I would like to perhaps, while you are in main menu or from home garage be able to almost instanly be taken to dealerships, tune-up shop, the races, testing areas etc. This could be done by have one of the buttons activate a pop up menu. While testing a car ( and only while testing a car ) I would like to be able to get in another car from my garage if I so desired to. Also primarliy when testing a car, while in the pits, I should have full acess to my settings menu. Maybe you have option while in pits to restart the test with-out exiting the test track, a simple restart and you restart ( no replay, no other stuff just boom restart ) or you might have option to watch replay first etc. Heck maybe in game options you can turn off the replay, so that it does not automatically start after your test or race. Anyway back on menu dicussion, no matter how you lay-out the dealerships it will still take some time to go shopping for a car etc. Oh and if we could have a button on game pad activate the options while in main menu that would be usefull to turn off menu sounds or change menu sounds etc. Oh and before I forget please give the user the option to adjust sound volume, one for background sounds one for race sounds.
I really would like to see a search function put in for buying cars and comparing cars and maybe some of the search functions could be used on your home garage also. For instance lets say that I am just starting out and have maybe 30,000 credits, I could search for cars in that price range, and maybe I want it to be a mid engine drive drain, and maybe I want it to have at least 300 hp. Then it would also be nice to compare one car to the next or maybe even compare up to 4 cars at a time. I know I am a big dreamer, but hey dreams do come true and are builiding blocks for other things.
Lets not forget the 2 huge flaws in GT3, correct horsepower needs displayed on the cars while in arcade mode, and cars from your garage should be able to use just about anywhere especially while online.
Since GT4 is suposed to be a celebration of automobile history, of they have car info/history like on GT2 that would be nice. Another ideal I have is perhaps depending on how they do the races for simulation mode, they could have an option where you pick the race first then your car, that way only cars that are eligible would be displayed in your garage. I like GT2 race event method ( by horse power ) better then the way GT3 was done. Also series made up of ten races is a bit much for most players, I would prefer not more then 5 per series, but they could have alot more series and or more laps per race. Anyway I have a lot of ideals about online mode of GT4 and will try and post them in their perspective forum location.
 
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