MINI Countryman; Paceman in 2012, WRC Edition

[exigeracer]

Why would they do that?

To sell cars. Half the people would have bought the Mini if it were called the BMW 0.5 series.

Will the car sell without an image?

Nope.

Why Do they think that the people will buy a Mini just because it is a Mini when Mini doesn't mean anything anymore?

Yep.

 

[Joey D]

As someone who has actually bought a Mini I can say I got it for three reasons.

1. It's sporty enough to be fun
2. The fuel mileage is awesome
3. It's a poor mans BMW

 

[Philly]

To sell cars. Half the people would have bought the Mini if it were called the BMW 0.5 series.

Right. They can sell the car as a Mini and have it appeal to the public because it is a Mini and the word "Mini" means a lot in the car business. If the word "Mini" meant as much as BMW .5 series, they wouldn't sell too well, either as a Mini or .5 series.

As someone who has actually bought a Mini I can say I got it for three reasons.

1. It's sporty enough to be fun
2. The fuel mileage is awesome
3. It's a poor mans BMW

GTI, Rabbit, Astra, Fit Sport. There are others that have class, sportiness and fuel mileage. The Mini isn't the only competitor in the class, and it will only get more competitive.

 

[YSSMAN]

(GTI FTW!)

...I do wonder how MINI plans to put this up against the Tiguan, which I hear is much more capable than a crossover should be on the MKV chassis...

 

[exigeracer]

Right. They can sell the car as a Mini and have it appeal to the public because it is a Mini and the word "Mini" means a lot in the car business.

Correct.

If the word "Mini" meant as much as BMW .5 series, they wouldn't sell too well, either as a Mini or .5 series.

Mini means far more to the general public than BMW 0.5 series. That is why they sold so well.

GTI, Rabbit, Astra, Fit Sport. There are others that have class, sportiness and fuel mileage.

Sorry, but the Astra and Fit Sport have zero class. People still laugh at chumps who drive Opels (regardless how good or not they are today), and Japanese econoboxes are still perceived as the antithesis of class.

To you and me, class means a lot different than to someone several years older than you who doesn't know the industry. Car manufacturers bank in on that as a tool to sell cars. This is exactly why the Golf is called the Rabbit in the NA market.

 

[Joey D]

GTI, Rabbit, Astra, Fit Sport. There are others that have class, sportiness and fuel mileage. The Mini isn't the only competitor in the class, and it will only get more competitive.

The only problem with those cars is that they do not have a company like BMW backing them. People relate BMW with a drivers car, therefore they should relate Mini with them as well. While yes I do agree with you that this market segment will continue to grow and grow, I still think people who can afford it will still take the small car marketed by BMW over one marketed by General Motors. It's not that GM builds a bad car by any means, it's just the perception by a large majority of car buyers and automotive enthusist that BMW is the pinnacle of the automotive world.

Also people who buy Minis want to be seen as someone who enjoys motoring. If I can quote someone else from another thread...

Owning the Mini says to people 'i like cars'. Owning a Honda Jazz [Fit] says 'i want to get from A to B without having to use public transport' and 'Oh, i've got grey hair as well'

I think that sums it up perfectly. Yes the Cooper isn't a fast car nor is it especially good looking to many people, but it has that "fun to drive" factor many other cars of the small econo-box class do not have. I haven't driven a Fit so I'm not 100% sure how they are. Actually the only other tiny car I've driven was a Yaris over in England and that wasn't exactly "fun".

...I do wonder how MINI plans to put this up against the Tiguan, which I hear is much more capable than a crossover should be on the MKV chassis...

I would expect to see an AWD and slightly higher off the ground Mini Clubman in the next couple years. I highly doubt BMW will make an SUV out of a Cooper but I can see them going for the Clubman. It would be awesome to see one on X3 underpinnings though. This concept probably won't be produced looking anything like that, BMW isn't that stupid...errr wait these are the same guys that think tail lights need to look odd all the time.

 

[Philly]

I would agree that currently, the Cooper is an awesome car. I agree 100% with what you said about the Mini Cooper.

The only problem with those cars is that they do not have a company like BMW backing them. People relate BMW with a drivers car, therefore they should relate Mini with them as well. While yes I do agree with you that this market segment will continue to grow and grow, I still think people who can afford it will still take the small car marketed by BMW over one marketed by General Motors. It's not that GM builds a bad car by any means, it's just the perception by a large majority of car buyers and automotive enthusist that BMW is the pinnacle of the automotive world.

However, if BMW keeps throwing ideas at this brand, it might not be seen as a company that builds small, quick and fun to drive cars. The Cooper will probably remain as a highly desirable car for quite some time, only the other cars in the segment can change that. Other cars in the Mini lineup might lose that distinction.

 

[Joey D]

Very true, BMW might get over zealous with the brand and more or less ruin its image for enthusiast. My point was that the reason BMW is throwing money and all these ideas into Mini is because the brand is selling quite well right now and they want to milk it for all it's worth.

 

[exigeracer]

Very true, BMW might get over zealous with the brand and more or less ruin its image for enthusiast.

They don't make money off enthusiasts. Take a look at companies that try to cater to enthusiasts. They're barely afloat.

 

[YSSMAN]

Very true, BMW might get over zealous with the brand and more or less ruin its image for enthusiast. My point was that the reason BMW is throwing money and all these ideas into Mini is because the brand is selling quite well right now and they want to milk it for all it's worth.

...Someone should remind them to develop the Triumph brand...

 

[Kent]

Well...
Looks like the child of a Hummer and a Mini.
Unfortunately, in the process of making this baby the Mini was killed.

 

[Blackbird.]

Fiat Multipla

Oh god, it's not that bad. I'm somewhat attracted to it.

 

[Joey D]

MINI’s Monte SUV waits in wings
As our pictures show, the car – to be called Monte – has a raised ride height and wider track. Although the standard front-wheel-drive layout is retained, toughened suspension components mean that light off-roading will be possible.

Also evident is the stretched wheelbase, which ensures greater stability and more room for passengers in the rear. However, they are still likely to access the back seat through the reverse-opening Club*door. Under the bonnet will be a range of 1.6-litre petrol and diesel engines. There is also the possibility of a new 1.4-litre entry-level oil-burner. These powerplants will be mated to either manual or automatic gearboxes, both with six ratios.

Bosses at MINI will be keen to stress this is an environmentally-friendly SUV. As with other vehicles from parent firm BMW, it will benefit from Efficient Dynamics technology. This means a stop-start system to reduce emissions and fuel use, regenerative braking and energy efficient engine components.

Prices for the Monte are expected to be around £2,000 higher than for the equivalent Clubman version, and the first examples should arrive in showrooms here in 2009.

The Monte? Come on like the Monte Carlo? Or better yet the Full Monty .

 

[Philly]

Monty Python?

This car definitely isn't helping my building dislike of the MINI brand.

 

[Joey D]

Well I understood the Clubman because it's a reincarnation of the older Cooper, but I really don't understand this. But I guess if you want to make money you have to cater to what people are buying.

Here:

 

[exigeracer]

Minis were big competitors at the Monte Carlo Rally, so that's where I'm guessing the name came from.

 

[JCE]

Man, if BMW doesn't stop messing with MINI, the whole brand would be tarnished. They shouldn't call it a MINI anymore......

Quoted for truth.

While I love the way this BIGI looks (I refuse to call it a MINI) it isn't a god damned MINI. BMW needs to stop ruining what was quite possibly the coolest all around car on the face of the planet. The MINI name and badge are an institution, and they are slowly killing it. They managed to pull off one of the greatest automotive comebacks ever by bringing the MINI back--and now I fear they are ruining it. I hate the new not-so-MINI, it isn't a MINI...its freaking BIGGER for christ sakes. Here's a tip BMW--MAKE THE MINI SMALLER! I'll have my Fiat 500 for less money thank you.

[/rant]

 

[YSSMAN]

I can't say I'm upset. This being said, if it doesn't have AWD I'd be very disappointed. But, if they can get it done cheaply and sell them at a reasonable price, and people buy into it... Well, my guess is that we will start seeing a lot more small AWD vehicles coming to the United States. Living in Michigan, you'd have to appreciate it...

 

[JCE]

YSS, come on i thought you would be in our camp on this. Its BMW selling out--and they are going to piss off more people than they will appeal to by doing this.

*edit*
This just might piss off the entire British empire...errr I mean country.

 

[YSSMAN]

Well, yes on priciple I do disagree with BMW's decision overall, but I can't fault them for attempting to find a niche and making a profit. I don't know... Maybe its because I find it so unlikely for me to ever be in the market for a MINI, but even if I were, I'd only be considering the S. My assumption is that the market would in fact do much the same, and should the vehicle not sell, BMW would likely kill it.

Maybe I place too much trust in the hands of consumers, but I think they can make the proper decision...

 

[m7ammed]

Yeah but back when the original Mini existed, SUVs weren't all that, the world has changed since then...... I wonder if they will keep the clubman look or thats just for testing

 

[exigeracer]

Its BMW selling out--and they are going to piss off more people than they will appeal to by doing this.

*edit*
This just might piss off the entire British empire...errr I mean country.

We've already been through this. Read the discussion from page one.

 

[Joey D]

I hate the new not-so-MINI, it isn't a MINI...its freaking BIGGER for christ sakes. Here's a tip BMW--MAKE THE MINI SMALLER! I'll have my Fiat 500 for less money thank you.

They can't make it smaller due to increased safety regulations. It's still one of the smallest vehicles you can buy on in the US right now.

Also think about it this way, some dumb chick, driving a Excurison or some other stupidly large vehicle, talking on her mobile phone, putting on her make-up, and yelling at Johnny and Suzy in the back doesn't see your old school Mini and plows into you. You're dead and she doesn't even realise it. Look I love the original Mini, but it's just not safe to have those kinds of cars on the road anymore, at least in America.

I think the new R56 Cooper is a great size, still small enough to get good fuel mileage, be reasonably quick, and be easy to park, but be big enough to ensure I don't die, put some stuff in the boot (it's a British car I can call it that ), and at least have two other smaller people in the back.

I don't expect everyone to like the car, so don't think I'm saying you are wrong for disliking it, everyone is entitled to their opinions...even if they are wrong....just kidding .

 

[JCE]

The Fiat 500 is pretty small and I'm sure it will pass US safety regs...so what's the excuse for BMW? I mean the Aveo passes and its got to be the smallest car in the US. I'm just disgusted that BMW seems to be ruining a good thing.

 

[Joey D]

The new Mini is really a great car. I must have drove 20 other cars from a Lincoln LS to a Mazda 3 to a BMW 3-series and when all was said and done I got the Mini.

I don't believe we are getting the Fiat 500 in America and I do not believe the Aveo has a great crash test rating. The Mini actually holds it own quite well in a collision, the safety, addition of HVAC units, and the turbo charged engine are all things BMW cites for the increased size in the Cooper.

But hey they sell like hot cakes so someone much like them, they are also one of the best cars from hold their value as well.

 

[JCE]

Which MINI did you get, the first run 2003-2006 style or the revised 2007 style? I'm not "hip" to what models are designated what. Don't make me out to be a MINI hater. I love them, that is why I'm disgusted at what BMW is doing to them.

 

[Joey D]

2007 R56 version, so the slightly larger newer one...it's still much smaller then anything I have driven before and one of the smallest cars on American roads.

Blazer's length 177"
Cooper's length 145"

 

[Joey D]

It's got an official name...which I don't really care for. Monte was cooler but I'm guessing Chevy threw a fit or something.

The MINI has been on a growth spurt since the introduction of the second-generation model. With the 3½-door Clubman wagon on its way to dealerships, the new convertible set to follow, and even a sports-coupe derivative rumored to be in the works, the BMW division is focusing on the development of a crossover based on the MINI.

No big news there, we've been watching the spy shots roll in for months now. The surprise, however, is that it won't be called the Colorado as previously thought. No, that was just a working title, an internal codename. It won't be called the Monte, either, as previous reports suggested. According to a recent interview in German publication Auto Motor und Sport, MINI's CEO Kay Segler said the retro soft-roader will likely be called "Crossman".

Magna-Steyr is expected to build 80,000 Crossmans (Crossmen?) at its factory in Austria each year, starting in 2010. The name, of course, combines Crossover with Clubman, the wagon variant on which it's based. Think it'll entice more buyers than "Colorado" or "Monte"?

And I guess this confirms Mini will be opening up another plant to handle the high demand of their vehicles. Maybe now it won't take 6-8 weeks to get one in the states, although it's been said by Mini they don't really make a ton of money in the US.

 

[Jim Prower]

Crossman? That's a Bow manufacturer, I could swear it is...

 

[Philly]

It is crossmen. Plural. Maybe they want to stress that it is bigger than the original and can fit more than one man?

Maybe we'll see a MINIman and a coupeman or something to fit a naming scheme.