[Mod] Gran Turismo 2 plus (bug fixes, restored content and new content) - beta 7 released

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Alex Carriel
The GT-R V-Spec N1's side mirrors are in the car's color (white) while in GT4 and in real life they are black (i think they are made from carbon fiber).
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Nice spot - I went from GT-R Registry's guide on the differences, but looking again all their brochure pics have black mirrors, and most of the real car photos do too. I'll see if they can be changed - GT2 limits particular areas of the car to only 16 colour shades so the mirrors may be sharing their colour with the doors or A-pillars, but if the car has any spare space in any of its palettes I can probably switch the mirrors over to that palette.

Alex Carriel
View attachment 786965 Guys, is this supposed to happen? Lol
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As mentioned, it's been reported - it's one of the blockers currently for the next alpha release. I trust my tooling, so it may be something not properly researched yet, or maybe I've accidentally deleted some of the TRD Supra's data.
 
Well, you could copy and paste the Mine's GT-R V-Spec N1 (R34)'s side mirror into the normal N1 version you added, since the original Mine's R34 side mirrors are black.
 
It's not a matter of copy-pasting. Changing the color of the mirrors is easy as using the pencil tool in photoshop, the problem is that as pez said, the mirrors can share colors with other parts of the body. Each car model has 16 palettes of 16 colors used to color every part of the body texture. And for example, say the mirrors are sharing with the car's side, which probably uses 15 colors + alpha, then in order to break the sharing you either reprogram the 3D faces so they use an other palette, or you remove some color shades (affecting the quality of the shading a little) and replace the removed colors with the ones you need, in this case a black (and maybe a grey for highlight) It's one of the many limitations the PS1 format has.
 
submaniac93
It's not a matter of copy-pasting. Changing the color of the mirrors is easy as using the pencil tool in photoshop, the problem is that as pez said, the mirrors can share colors with other parts of the body. Each car model has 16 palettes of 16 colors used to color every part of the body texture. And for example, say the mirrors are sharing with the car's side, which probably uses 15 colors + alpha, then in order to break the sharing you either reprogram the 3D faces so they use an other palette, or you remove some color shades (affecting the quality of the shading a little) and replace the removed colors with the ones you need, in this case a black (and maybe a grey for highlight) It's one of the many limitations the PS1 format has.
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Oh, I didn't know, man. My bad.
 
No problem ^^ Don't worry though, i'm sure Pez will figure something out. A lot of the time, there's something that uses a whole palette to itself and only like 5 or 6 colors in it, leaving plenty of room to color something with it :P
 
Coming in a future version:

acuradealer.png


mercedesspecial.png


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If possible - that's significantly harder as there is no menu that features both Vauxhall and Opel, whereas for Acura I can just tell the game to load the US version of South City.
 
pez2k
If possible - that's significantly harder as there is no menu that features both Vauxhall and Opel, whereas for Acura I can just tell the game to load the US version of South City.
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And will possible to add the restored cars to dealerships? As seen in the image of the CLK is possibile
EDIT: Will be also new Special Colors cars?
 
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Technically not. When you get to "99" you have to reset back to 00, so if you were to add car newer than that you'll have to use '0x
 
I've been watching this thread for a while now and I gotta say that this is some cool stuff that you are all doing.

I have a question, is it possible for you guys to integrate the Simulation Mode and Arcade Mode together and replace the actual start menu with the menu from the demo version?
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I really like that menu a lot.
 
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GT714
I've been watching this thread for a while now and I gotta say that this is some cool stuff that you are all doing.

I have a question, is it possible for you guys to integrate the Simulation Mode and Arcade Mode together and replace the actual start menu with the menu from the demo version?
latest

I really like that menu a lot.
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If if possibile will great, but I don't think that is possible in terms of disc space... Too things are present in the Simulation Mode disc and at 99% there isn't quite space for adding also the Arcade Disc
 
GT714
I have a question, is it possible for you guys to integrate the Simulation Mode and Arcade Mode together and replace the actual start menu with the menu from the demo version?
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No. Other than the disc space required as mentioned above, it would take extensive rewriting of the game's code. Everything I've modified so far involves just changing game files, not disassembling and rewriting code.

I've heard talk that there may have been a pirated unofficial translation 15+ years ago that cut out all of the music and movies and included a custom launcher to get both discs on one CD-R, however I would expect that it would just be booting the two separate main menus rather than using the demo menu. Either way, even if it existed that would be the only time I've ever heard it being considered possible, never mind done.
 
No. As far as I know, Pez's goal is to fix what needs to be fixed, unify all the regions so that everyone will be able to access the same content, and restore/add hidden/beta/missing content and a few bonus things. No major specs changes unless absolutely required/very wrong.

I will also add that nerfing the Escudo would potentially break the Pike's Peak event, as the opponents in those races are pre-recorded inputs much like a replay. Altering it or the Cultus will definitely break the AI ad make the events worthless.
 
Oh ok, even though the Escudo should be nerfed but some people enjoy having game breaking things in videogames. The game was meant to be a simulator(GT always has been far from attaining that though) Yet it makes a hill climb car the best machine for all races on all road surfaces. I highly doubt it would keep up with the GT One on a circuit in real life but it outstrips it in every way in the game. So to make GT2 more balanced and enjoyable fixing clear cut misrepresentations and performance specs in a supposed sim racing game should be desired. Not trying to be mean but this hack lacks any appeal what-so-ever to me because it doesn't fix what needs to be fixed.
 
First post here in this forum, but I've stumbled upon this thread and could not believe what I was seeing, so I felt I should leave my thanks. This mod is a dream come true and the modders are to be commended. That NSX in particular is very tantalising.

Also, I must admit the above statement made my blood boil a bit: "The game was meant to be a simulator(GT always has been far from attaining that though)".

Ricardo Divila, the Brazilian racing engineer who worked for Nissan in SGT from the late 90's onwards, told in the 2016 March number of magazine RaceCar engineering the following story:
"By the time I was racing in Japan in 1996 in Super GT, now known as GT500, the state of the art [in professional computer simulations] was improving rapidly, and at Nismo we had visits from Polyphony's coders to collect data from the real cars and validate the game’s physics engine – which, by the way, ended up being better than our own vehicle dynamics programs. We also had the drivers try out the handling and response. We learnt back then that they can simulate better than us, but we can design better than them. But I don’t know for how long."

This, mind you was about Gran Turismo 1 so one can imagine the amount of data they collected for GT2 was much higher, as well as the quality of the sim code. It's precisely because they were meant to be simulators that these games are still highly playable after all these years.
 
@Tina Branford I'm sorry that the Escudo ruins the game for you, but let me just say that the car is required only for Pike's Peak (and even then, you can beat it with the Cultus, which is just as broken, and if you're extremely skilled and playing on the NTSC-USA version -PAL's times are harder-, with a FTO LM Edition, even though the Escudo AI is slower than the Cultus's). You could play the whole game without it and still have the full experience.

I would also like to point out that a 990hp, 900kg machine with massive wing to provide as much downforce as possible at low to medium speed would 100% be able to follow if not beat a 650hp, 900kg Le Mans machine irl (and in later GT games), provided the dirt car is setup correctly, and the track is not just a straight line (although the real life Escudo would wreck any Group C/GT1 car in a 1/4 mile i'm sure). The only problem with the Escudo in GT2 is that it has no turbo spool lag (and who actually knows if it really has the type of lag it has in later games? I'd say they nerfed it way too much to the point of being horrible to drive in later games) and not enough air resistance.
Those 2 things are changeable in GT2, but as I said, considering we would not be able to alter the AI opponent along with it, and combined with the fact that this mod is meant to keep the original game as intact as possible, while fixing most glitches and issues, as well as some quality of life improvements, Pez (correct me if i'm wrong) has no plans to modify any car's handling unless it's required (example: the Golf V6 that wasn't 4WD and didn't have a 6-speed transmission).

The goal isn't to bring GT2 to today's standards (that's plain impossible) but to make a "what if it had been finished" GT2 with some added bonuses.

Of course we're talking about this particular mod. When Pez releases his tools to the public, anybody will be able to make the changes they want to the game.
 
Tina Branford
Not trying to be mean but this hack lacks any appeal what-so-ever to me because it doesn't fix what needs to be fixed.
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You've already had a nice long off-topic rant about exactly the same thing in this very thread. To be quite honest I'm not bothered whether you want to use the mod or not, so there's not much point in going on about it again.

If you're that upset about it, just don't use the car. It's not as if it's even needed for any event in the game.
 
submaniac93
@Tina Branford I'm sorry that the Escudo ruins the game for you, but let me just say that the car is required only for Pike's Peak (and even then, you can beat it with the Cultus, which is just as broken, and if you're extremely skilled and playing on the NTSC-USA version -PAL's times are harder-, with a FTO LM Edition, even though the Escudo AI is slower than the Cultus's). You could play the whole game without it and still have the full experience.

I would also like to point out that a 990hp, 900kg machine with massive wing to provide as much downforce as possible at low to medium speed would 100% be able to follow if not beat a 650hp, 900kg Le Mans machine irl (and in later GT games), provided the dirt car is setup correctly, and the track is not just a straight line (although the real life Escudo would wreck any Group C/GT1 car in a 1/4 mile i'm sure). The only problem with the Escudo in GT2 is that it has no turbo spool lag (and who actually knows if it really has the type of lag it has in later games? I'd say they nerfed it way too much to the point of being horrible to drive in later games) and not enough air resistance.
Those 2 things are changeable in GT2, but as I said, considering we would not be able to alter the AI opponent along with it, and combined with the fact that this mod is meant to keep the original game as intact as possible, while fixing most glitches and issues, as well as some quality of life improvements, Pez (correct me if i'm wrong) has no plans to modify any car's handling unless it's required (example: the Golf V6 that wasn't 4WD and didn't have a 6-speed transmission).

The goal isn't to bring GT2 to today's standards (that's plain impossible) but to make a "what if it had been finished" GT2 with some added bonuses.

Of course we're talking about this particular mod. When Pez releases his tools to the public, anybody will be able to make the changes they want to the game.
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I highly doubt that the Escudo could out perform Group C or LMP class cars IRL on a proper circuit. If it's design was really that superior engineers and the FIA among other racing organizations would have changed the design and classification standards for racing machines in those groups to accommodate having vehicles using that design. It would have become a standard to design machines like that for circuit racing a long time ago. The only cars that possess downforce of that level and even greater are F1 machines and the Escudo would not keep up. The engineering used in F1 is optimal for circuit in reality and no Escudo or LMP1 car can match them. Hence the reason the F1 cars are the fastest circuit machines and engineers use that design for that very purpose. Also, the Escudo is not as reliable I heard it's engine(s) has a really short life span and needs to be rebuilt after only a few events and it is not meant for endurance racing it's a sprint hill climb machine. So the GT-One, Audi R10, Mazda 787B, etc all being endurance capable would kill it in a proper length racing event easily. To note in GT3 and GT4 you can't set up the Escudo to be faster than the LMP1&2 or Class C cars on a circuit. If you go to GT Vault and other GT tuning based sites you'll never see the Escudo producing faster lap times than the Sauber C9, Mazda 787B, Minolta 88C-V on a circuit with anyone's set up. So Polyphony Digital at least got that correct.

By the way I don't play GT2 anymore because of this very thing it's unjustifiable no matter what angle you look at it from.

Also pez considering my rant is about GT2, the cars in GT2, and the fact that I mentioned your particular hack in my post clearly means it's not "off-topic". Now if I were to talk about Chrono Trigger and how unbalanced that game is in regards to Marle&Glenn's end game viability in this topic that would indeed be off-topic.
 
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Tina Branford
Also pez considering my rant is about GT2, the cars in GT2, and the fact that I mentioned your particular hack in my post clearly means it's not "off-topic".
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The thread is about this mod. This mod does not and will not alter the Escudo's physics in any way. Any further discussion of the car is not relevant to this thread. If you wish to make your own Escudo mod, please create your own thread to discuss it, or use the general modding thread.
 
I didn't say the engineering behind it was better than anything else, nor did I say it would beat LMP cars on a 24 hour race. You have to think hypothetical for that. On a single lap or 3 lap race, i'm sure the Escudo would do a very good job keeping up with those.

Also BTCC, F2, F3 cars in hillclimbs are a thing and yet those weren't designed for it. So saying just because a car is specifically designed to run on X or Y doesn't mean they can run on the other is not always true. While a LMP can't run on dirt, a rally car can perfectly run on asphalt.

Also, in this case, then why is the Suzuki SX4 Pike's Peak so closely resembling the Escudo when it's made for an Asphalt Pike's Peak? Doesn't that mean that the design provides enough downforce and grip for an asphalt track? In which case, what's stopping it from going against race cars on a flat, low-altitude track? Heck, they'd be breathing compared to what they're used to.

Anyways I don't have the perfect counter to your arguments, but at least understand what this mod is about and how insignificant your problem is considering the fact that the car is, like mentioned previously totally optional and never used by an AI in more than a single race.
No one is forcing to use it apart from Pike's Peak. And no one will use it against you because there isn't any online play. The fact that this car is an unjustifiable problem to you, however minor it actually is, is preventing you from playing the game is in my opinion something you should be concerned about.
 

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