Montoya Disqualified??

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katana87

katana87

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Having missed out on the race that was held yesterday, I got on the internet wanting to find the winner of the race(Kimi Raikkonen), and realized that only 11 drivers had crossed the finish line. As I looked in the list I see Montoya being DSQ I wondered why and what I found out was when the safety car came out because of the crash that Jenson Button had(Really surprised me in the Qualifyings) He went into the pits but didn't re-fuel(as he shloud have) on the next lap he came in and skipped the Red light which that was what brought the FIA to DSQ him. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Generaly I think that they were too harsh on him and should have just penalized him 20 or more seconds.


Great finish for Ferrari! :)
 
I think the penalty was just.

He knows the rules, he should have known better, if he'd have stopped he'd have had a good points finish and would have helped his championship, it was his own fault.

The FIA were just abiding by what the rules state as illegal, and therfore were right to disqualify him.
 
yeah, specially as he had already had a warning from monte carlo so it was even more just for him to be DQ'd,
 
What stupid move, seriously why the hell did he do it? I guess he was just that desperate for a win.
 
When the Safety Car enters the main straight, the pit lane is CLOSED for the safety of the Safety Car and the snake. At the end of the pit lane is a large, two signal traffic light. One signal is green, one is red. Each signal is the size of a hideously deformed elephant's face. They are kind of hard to miss. How JPM did escapes me - then again, how he tanked it coming out of the pits the previous time was quite baffling too.
 
I've never seen anything like this in F1, Champ car or IRL (Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong) or anywhere else, this rule is just absurd, there was absolutely no safety issue there. DQ him for that really was the icing on the cake... :dunce:
 
It's a long-standing rule.

If you're in the pits when the safety car is on the main straight you MUST stay there until it and all of the cars following it in the snake have passed.

A BIG FAT RED LIGHT at the end of the pit lane serves to reinforce the fact that the pit lane exit is CLOSED.

He ran the light and got a DQ. What's the problem?
 
Safety cars were introduced in 1992 (don't know when the actual FIA rule #149i was created though ) and have been rarely used since. That is the first time I ever see this rule applied (followed or not), same with our tv commentators.

Yes, he should have seen the "big fat red light", but the rule is dumb, and the punishment way too harsh.
 
It's all rather silly, since JPM's dealt with Champ Cars before; he should have waited.

Oh, and try to avoid posting race "spoilers" in the thread title, katana87. It's bad form (see the Read This: threads first).
 
jpmontoya
Safety cars were introduced in 1992 (don't know when the actual FIA rule #149i was created though ) and have been rarely used since. That is the first time I ever see this rule applied (followed or not), same with our tv commentators.

Yes, he should have seen the "big fat red light", but the rule is dumb, and the punishment way too harsh.
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If you leave the pit lane at ANY point during the weekend when the exit is closed you will be disqualified from the race.
 
the punishment is as Famine just stated is what the rules state the punishment should be DQ for exiting on red light. By this simple definition it is just. As simple as that. Wether the rule is stupid or not or wether the rule nullifies a safety issue is not the point, the rules are the rules.
 
Hi guys,

I am a former fan of JPM when he was a Champ Car ace. I though that guy was going to destroy Ralf pace but even if he was quicker, he did never manage to outperform him (something Fisico did several times).

Personally, I think JPM does deserve driving for Mclaren based on his speed but he is just not professsional enough. He just loses his brains sometimes. What he did to DC at Monaco was just scandalous. Really scary and irresponsible in fact.

Anyway, it's always easy to judge out of the car and really those guys are damn good.

Enjoy 2005 thrilling season and FORZA FERRARI.
 
pupik
It's all rather silly, since JPM's dealt with Champ Cars before; he should have waited.

Oh, and try to avoid posting race "spoilers" in the thread title, katana87. It's bad form (see the Read This: threads first).
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i am sorry for my stupidity :guilty:
 
henry_wattel
Hi guys,

I am a former fan of JPM when he was a Champ Car ace. I though that guy was going to destroy Ralf pace but even if he was quicker, he did never manage to outperform him (something Fisico did several times). .
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Unlike you, I was not suprised to see Ralf beeing faster the first year. Driving a F1 or an indy car is not the same, especially on the technical field. Montoya is very talented, but so is Ralf. When he leads, he's very difficult to beat, I saw him dominating the whole French GP 2003, that was amazing.
On the other side, I think it's not fair to compare Fisico-Ralf and Montoya-Ralf. Fisco and Ralf were rookies, both did some great races, and some mistakes, Giancarlo was just slightly more regular. The battle between Ralf and JPM was totally different, with experienced drivers and with a car that could win some races, resulting as more pressure. (especially in the williams team, very efficient at making its own drivers hating themselves - remember Jones-Reutemann 1981, Piquet-Mansell 1987)



henry_wattel
Personally, I think JPM does deserve driving for Mclaren based on his speed but he is just not professsional enough. He just loses his brains sometimes. What he did to DC at Monaco was just scandalous. Really scary and irresponsible in fact.
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I agree with you. It's not a problem of talent and quickness , like you said. The problem is that JPM makes too many mistakes, and has this abilty to lose his selfcontrol easily. I think he hasn't made a clean race in this season so far.

Nevertheless, it's not easy to be quick and regular instantly when you discover a new team. Look at Ralf, he's also struggling at the moment, being beaten by Jarno, but I think this will change. Ralf had issues because the car was not stable while braking (ralf is known to brake very late and hard, brutalizing the car, while Trulli's style is very fluent). Like ralf in the toyota team, JPM has to adapt himself to the car, and adapt the car to himself by setting it up. This can take some time.
Moreover, JPM has to face kimi, one of the 3 best drivers of the moment, including also Michael and Alonso.


About the topic, I think what helped the stewards to disqualify JPM was that he seemed to see the red light (I guess it was impossible for him to miss it), but chose not to consider it. (JPM quite admited himself).
 
pupik
It's all rather silly, since JPM's dealt with Champ Cars before; he should have waited.
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There is no such rule in Champ Car

6.22.10. Blend Lines. The entrance and exit of the pit lane shall each be marked with a blend line to identify the area that will be considered the pit lane. During a full course yellow condition, once a pack up has been established, the following blend line rules will be in effect:

6.22.10A. Blend In. Any competitor entering the pit lane may not pass the pace car or any other race car(s) until they are past the pit entrance blend line.

6.22.10B. Blend Out. Competitors leaving the pit lane may not pass the pace car or any race car(s) that are in the pack up after passing the pit exit blend line. The competitor leaving the pit lane must enter the race track behind the race car(s) that were on the racing surface past or adjacent to the pit exit blend line as the competitor exiting the pit crosses the pit exit blend line. A competitor leaving the pit lane will be placed by the Officials into the pack up in the order where he crossed the pit exit blend line.

6.22.10C. Right of Way. Race cars exiting the pit lane during a full course yellow condition before a pack up had been established must give way to faster race cars on the race track.
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How so?

The rule is there. It's been there a LONG time. Do this and that happens. Montoya did the offence and the punishment was meted out.

Snypa
About the topic, I think what helped the stewards to disqualify JPM was that he seemed to see the red light (I guess it was impossible for him to miss it), but chose not to consider it. (JPM quite admited himself).
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Try telling that to a cop next time you're pulled for running a red light... :D
 
Famine

Try telling that to a cop next time you're pulled for running a red light... :D
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well I've never crossed a red light and I've been driving for over 10 years. :)
About JPM incident, I just wanted to say that he seemed to have done more than forgetting to check the light. He seemed to have thought "well, I don't care, I take the risk".
Anyway, he broke the rules, and the rules were clear, and apply for everyone.
 
katana87
Having missed out on the race that was held yesterday, I got on the internet wanting to find the winner of the race(Kimi Raikkonen), and realized that only 11 drivers had crossed the finish line. As I looked in the list I see Montoya being DSQ I wondered why and what I found out was when the safety car came out because of the crash that Jenson Button had(Really surprised me in the Qualifyings) He went into the pits but didn't re-fuel(as he shloud have) on the next lap he came in and skipped the Red light which that was what brought the FIA to DSQ him. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Generaly I think that they were too harsh on him and should have just penalized him 20 or more seconds.


Great finish for Ferrari! :)
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He broke a rule in the rule book simple as punishment is Disqualification and rightly so. It is for safety reasons. How Montoya went off at the end of the pit lane first time round shows how poor a driver he is. Amazing when on fire but how often is that?
 
JPmontoya
6.22.10B. Blend Out. Competitors leaving the pit lane may not pass the pace car or any race car(s) that are in the pack up after passing the pit exit blend line. The competitor leaving the pit lane must enter the race track behind the race car(s) that were on the racing surface past or adjacent to the pit exit blend line as the competitor exiting the pit crosses the pit exit blend line. A competitor leaving the pit lane will be placed by the Officials into the pack up in the order where he crossed the pit exit blend line.
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Are these Champ car or F1 rules you quoted?

If they are Champ car rules just because there is no red light doesn't mean you can just strole back into the pack. You have to wait for the pack to pass.
 
ExigeExcel
Are these Champ car or F1 rules you quoted?

If they are Champ car rules just because there is no red light doesn't mean you can just strole back into the pack. You have to wait for the pack to pass.
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Yes, they're from Champ Car rules, but it effectively means that you can get in the pack. You're just not allowed to pass after what they call the pit exit blend line.

I never seen anyone having to stop at the end of the pit lane to wait for all cars following the safety car to pass, neither in F1, nor in Champ Car. Our local commentators who have followed every single GP well before they introduced the safety car in 1992, had to actually search in the rules because they didn't understood why the red light was on, they thought Montoya would be punished for coming back in front of Coulthard. So what we call here a long standing rule is pretty close to never being used prior to this weekend.

Does anyone here recall a similar situation, seeing a driver stopped at the end of the pit lane waiting for everyone to pass?
 
You dont see it becuase the teams make sure to try and avoid it as it either puts you a lap down or lose you alot of time and track position. It happened this time becuase Their was a radio malfunction and Montoya came in a lap after he should have, just bad luck for him, he made it worse on himself by ignoreing the light, and lets face it he knew it was red, no way he didnt, and disregarded it.
 
I wonder if Letterman is going to ask him about this incident on the show tonight. Yep, Dave announced on last nights show that JPM will be on tonight's show. Can't wait to watch!
 
At the risk of offending any JPM fans I think JPM was a bit too eager in the Canadian race to try to win or place 2nd that he over did coming out of the pits for the 1st pit stop and was blind to the lights having stayed behind the saftey car for one lap befor pitting. One would think that being in F1 for a couple of years he would have learned that patience is indeed a virtue. Reubens started last and ended up 3rd.
 
Explaining the next problem, going through the red light at the pit lane exit, he added: “They had to make me stop, normal thing coming out of the pits. As I approached, the blue light came on and I radioed, said, ‘Do we have to stop or not?’ I didn’t think they heard me, and the blue light came on, I thought maybe I read it as a mistake because it shouldn’t have came on. I decided to go through it. My mistake in a way but, you know, I thought they’re going to give me a drive-through penalty or something or ask me to go to the back of the line. But then after that the official decided to get me out of the race. I think it’s very harsh to be honest, unfair. But that’s what it is. I’m over it. It’s been a tough season for me, very unlucky. The things with the FIA haven’t helped.”
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There you go :dopey:

Blake
 
I'm surprised there have been no follow up punishments. I know the black flag was punishment enough but the FIA told him to keep his nose clean and well, he didn't.
 
I saw the David Letterman interview of Montoya. I don't think this guy has a clue what he's doing behind the wheel. This guy needs to be baby-sitted. He can't be relied to race on his own.

Basically he said he asked permission from the team to leave the pit when he saw the SC drive by. He asked the team what to do. They didn't respond, so he exited the pit lane anyway. He said he was going to be in last position in the field if he waited. So, he left the pits thinking if he did get a penalty, it didn't matter because he was going to be in last position anyway. He thought no big loss. He didn't count on getting disqualified or he would have never left the pit exit on a red light.

He was asked about the accident in Monaco. He said that Ralphie almost put him into the wall. He moved over to get out of the way, and it was more RS's fault the accident occured. He said the vidoe tape of the proof that he caused the accident showed that GV and RS were on their own when they crashed and he said he had nothing to do with it. He was 100 yards away at the time, therefore he wasn't the cause of the accident.

When asked about the shoulder injury, he said it was true when he said he broke it while playing tennis. He said he's lazy and let too many tennis balls on the court. He ran on the court and slipped on one of the balls, fell, and broke his shoulder. Personally, I still felt he was lying.

When asked about NASCAR, he said the difference between a NASCAR race car and a F1 car are like a pickup truck and Ferrari. That got a laugh, along with slipping on a tennis ball.

It was not a bad interview. He seems like an OK guy, but he sees things a lot differently than you and I.
 

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