Most efficent way to increase power

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priesty_lfc

priesty_lfc

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priesty_lfc
Basically as the title says,

Is there a more efficient way to increase power?, I have every upgrade on my car, I then have to reduce power to meet specific regs for a series I'm in, fine I do that but I end up using the power limited and reduce it by around 30%. That didn't bother me until I recently read that using the limiter by anything over 10%ish is actually pretty bad as it reduces over overall power band so your actually getting less power.

I've now decided to change parts to get to the same figures I need which has given me a better power band but overall the cars feels a lot slower and the handling has changed although I'm using th same set up?

Is this normal?, are there certain parts I should look to fit instead of others? Which is better engine upgrade or big turbo?

Any help would be much appreciated

Thanks!
 
Dont do the engine stage upgrades. Just use bolt on stuff set you power to 100% add stuff until you go just over the PP an the back it down a little. If you have done the engine stage upgrades that cant be undone then your out of luck. Repurchase the car and start over.. Thats whay a lot of guys dont run anything that cant be undone especialy if you are PP racing in room online.
 
Use ballast along side the power limiter, you'll keep more power and you can move the weight to change the balance of the setup.
 
Ok so which of these to is best?


A)

306BHP/6600rpm
41kgfm/4600rpm
3.85kg/BHP

B)

306BHP/5100rpm
46kgfm/4800rpm
3.85kg/BHP

C)

306BHP/6600rpm
40kgfm/4800rpm
3.85kg/BHP
 
priesty_lfc
Ok so which of these to is best?


A)

306BHP/6600rpm
41kgfm/4600rpm
3.85kg/BHP

B)

306BHP/5100rpm
46kgfm/4800rpm
3.85kg/BHP

C)

306BHP/6600rpm
40kgfm/4800rpm
3.85kg/BHP
Click to expand...
B was achieved by using powerlimiter? And the peak of the powerband is therefore flat from 5100 to about 7000 or higher? If yes, then B is the best.

But it wouldn't really make sense then, because this whole topic is about how to get max possible power at a certain pp level and not about how to restrict the car the best way to a certain power.
 
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dr_slump
B was achieved by using powerlimiter? And the peak of the powerband is therefore flat from 5100 to about 7000 or higher? If yes, then B is the best.

But it wouldn't really make sense then, because this whole topic is about how to get max possible power at a certain pp level and not about how to restrict the car the best way to a certain power.
Click to expand...

I don't know which is the best that's why I asked, yes B is limited but the orange graph drops off significantly compared to the other 2.which graph is more important? The green BHP graph or the orange torque graph?

A was a stock engine with bolt on parts but stock turbo

B was everything and restricted to 70%

C was stage 3 engine and racing exhaust only.

All are the same BHP but there orange graphs is what is different on them,.
 
priesty_lfc
Ok so which of these to is best?


A)

306BHP/6600rpm
41kgfm/4600rpm
3.85kg/BHP

B)

306BHP/5100rpm
46kgfm/4800rpm
3.85kg/BHP

C)

306BHP/6600rpm
40kgfm/4800rpm
3.85kg/BHP
Click to expand...

Impossible to pick between then without an image of the powerband.

EDIT

When you detune, are you detuning for hp limited races or PP limited?

For the former, always use power limiter. For the latter, take off parts.
 
Yes, B is best.

The reasoning behind why going below 90% or so with the power is bad only applies to PP races. If you are entering a race where the only limits are hp and weight, the best tune is to max out your car and then limit the power.
 
Try 10 laps around said track, with each setup , A, B, and C. (you even have three tuning sheets to save to) , then, compare laptimes.

rinse and repeat to a different track, preferably one you know well. compare laptimes again.

You may also want to practice this online against human AI for overtaking scenarios.

I don't know the conclusion to this, but I would hope that a certain Setting, works for some tracks, and situations, better than other tracks, for the best laptime.
 
I would go with Tune B. It's easily going to outperform the other two setups. The only reason the handling seems to change is the increase in power over a wider rpm range.
 
Tune A is the best as torque stays higher than B after the middle rpms. This means that you can keep the same gear and have better acceleration for more time before switching to next (slower acceleration) gear. The range of rpms in which tune B has higher torque almost never is used in a track. Who leaves the rpms constantly in the range 2-5k? Everyone's target is to drive hard. This means >5k rpms.
 
Rotorist
Everyone's target is to drive hard. This means >5k rpms.
Click to expand...

Nope, tyre wear can play a huge part in endurance racing or where the races are deliberately made so race distance means tyre wear has to be taken into consideration for either setup or driving style.

Drivers wil deliberately hold back for part of the race to ensure they have either tyres left or better tyres than their opponents so can push more at end of race.

----------------

OP - power delivery.

What's best is subjective to the car and regulations it's being driven under...

Cars with 5sp gearboxs can feel alot better with less power more torque, same with high power / low grip FWDs.

Whereas 7 sp cars can be more suited to higher peak power delivery - it all depends on what you're driving and on what track.

Some cars just feel better with MID rpm turbo's and smoother power / torque curve, like RX8's at around 520-540 bhp with sports tyres.

Most of my FWD's will run mid turbo's too because they feel alot better to drive and don't wear out tyres as much or understeer when peak power suddenly kicks in.

Shorter tracs with lower top speed and closer gearing means you can get away with a peaky delivery, high speed ciruits where gears are more spaced out, a smoother power delivery can more advantageous.

Use setup sheets A, B & C so you're prepared for all situatons.

There's such small differences in power between the choices you've shown, chances are setup and driving style will have just as much impact on race time, if not more so, than which 'power' option you choose.
 
Rotorist
Tune A is the best as torque stays higher than B after the middle rpms. This means that you can keep the same gear and have better acceleration for more time before switching to next (slower acceleration) gear. The range of rpms in which tune B has higher torque almost never is used in a track. Who leaves the rpms constantly in the range 2-5k? Everyone's target is to drive hard. This means >5k rpms.
Click to expand...
No

Imagine all 3 power courves over eachother in the same graph, and then start to rethink your theory.
 
Imho:

Under a PP or bhp limit, first you want to make sure to get peak power all the time. This means your powerband (bhp, ignore torque) should be flat for all the rpms you actually use.

1. Set your gears so each gear covers the same range of rpms, like from 5500 to 7000 in every gear. Now look how big that range has to be to get both a good 1st gear and your desired topspeed.
2. Put in enough tuning parts so with help from the limiter your powerband is flat for all of this range (plus a few 100 rpms so you don't need to shift perfectly precise).

If you put in too much tuning parts (and have to use more limiter to make it under the PP limit), you'll lose peak power (bhp). And the loss is not only at the peak, but at all the rpms you use. So you want to hit a certain spot.

There are little differences between the parts you use for tuning. Some increase redline, others don't. It may depend on the car, but I've seen lately you can get more flatline without losing peak power with those increasing redline (exhaust, catalytic converter, chip, some stages of engine tuning?). But this is not super important, we are talking about differences of 1-2 bhp here.

Under a bhp limit overtuning probably doesn't matter. More flatline means less precise shifting needed, so go for it.

A car with all the used powerband flat feels a little different than a realistic powerband. I think it's easier to handle throttle control, but one could also say it feels cheesy. Anyway, it's quicker.

In your example B is best. And it should have quite a few PP more? If you go for same PP, you might get a better B with less tuning parts, the flatline seems too much.
 
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Z1-AV69
2. Put in enough tuning parts so with help from the limiter your powerband is flat for all of this range (plus a few 100 rpms so you don't need to shift perfectly precise).
Click to expand...

Power limiter shouldn't be relied upon. What's ging to happen when you have to race 100% limiter and 0 ballast..

Quite a few websites and oragnised series use 100% power limiter, 0kgs ballast. It's getting more & more popular..

Far better to get used to 100% limiter and 0 ballast, makes it easier to convert to using limiter and ballast than the other way round. Becoming dependant on limiter and ballast, then you try 100% limiter and 0gs ballast racing, big difference.

Ballast isn't necessary for tuning, but great for handicaps or equalising cars performance. Power limiter is just a total pain for race organisors, so many will "try it on" with illegal cars in organised series.

So many times we find people using power limiter when they shouldn't, it's a total nightmare. So many times they say "...well my limiter was at 95% blah blah blah" and they think this is OK, when rules say 100%..??

Limiter = great for random lobbys, nightmare for organisors..

Wish PD would get rid of it..
 
Z1-AV69
There are little differences between the parts you use for tuning. Some increase redline, others don't. It may depend on the car, but I've seen lately you can get more flatline without losing peak power with those increasing redline (exhaust, catalytic converter, chip, some stages of engine tuning?). But this is not super important, we are talking about differences of 1-2 bhp here.
Click to expand...

I have found that the parts you choose to use do make a large difference, if you could as much as a second or more depending on the track as a "large difference", given the same PP limit. Specifically the ECU, Racing Exhaust and Cat Converter are the three upgrades I try to put on every single tune and each one has the same thing in common, they increase the redline of the car.

There is a trade off of course, since using the power limiter too severely begins to rob you of more and more HP the lower you go with it. So for example, if you have a car out of the box that's 550 PP and then by doing a weight reduction and adding the three parts above, it might go to say 580-600 PP. If this is the case I'd use it as a 600 PP car, because reducing it to 550 PP will likely result in losing 15-20 or more HP relative to cars in the 550PP group. For some that's a reasonable enough trade off to drive a car they really like in a lower PP group, but it's not a trade off I'd be willing to make, most of the time.

As a result, most of my 550 PP cars for example, start out at 525-530pp or less, so that with some weight reduction and the parts listed added to the tune, it might get to 555-560 PP, and then a small amount of power limiter will flatten out the power curve enough in the usable range to get even power delivery. I've found in most cases this is the best way to go. If I'm tuning a car for a specific PP range, normally I won't use more than 5% engine limiter, but will find up to 10% acceptable. If I have to use more than that with weight reduction (as necessary) and the three tuning parts added, normally I'll bump up the PP category for that car.
 
Highlandor
Limiter = great for random lobbys, nightmare for organisors..

Wish PD would get rid of it..
Click to expand...

It's equally good for everyone, and PD had better not even consider removing it. It is never good to make the problem worse, try fixing it instead. Allow the host to control use of the power limiter.

Although if you use PP, the limiter doesn't really matter anyway.

Anyway, replying to the post above saying A is best, it's not. Ignore the torque. All three have the same hp, but B has that hp spread over a wide range of RPM. If you want to know how fast the car is going to be, you need to find the area under the power curve between the RPM of each gear. B will clearly maximize this in all cases.
 

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