MS vs. Apple: The epiphany
- Thread starter SuperShouden
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boiltheocean
Premium
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Well they have Apple Downloads page which I guess they are just glorifying and calling it the App Store, presumably for more money off of developers.
I quite like the name Lion.
All I want is Lion to be even faster than Snow Leopard.
Start your own Apple is great thread.
What are you on about? We are just discussing the Keynote.
- 7,956
- BradleyH131
This. After this Keynote I have very little doubt that OSX will be the last of a 'traditional' operating systems by Apple. OS11 will be a desktop version of iOS. Apple has worked out a model whereby they can have complete control and get paid for people selling programs which they have nothing to do with. Steve Jobs has said that the Desktop OS is only needed for very specific needs now, and I'd bet the demographic that Apple is targeting won't need the perks of a full desktop style OS. It's really the next big gamble in computing.
The iPad I believe was a test the waters type device, to see if people were happy doing workflow on a mobile OS. Now that the iPad is outselling the MacBook line, it's pretty obvious which direction Apple is going from here.
- 1,096
- Wattsterplus
- XML Binging Language?
This is looking like thread highjack. Start your own Apple is great thread.
Edit: If you buy the new Airbook/netbook you have more money than you need. Give it to the red cross where it will do some good and not line Steve jobs pockets.
This is the kind of crap Fanboy reaction that is embarassing. Ok so you have your PC specs listed in all your posts, great 👍.
You saw the word Apple and you have the problem.
In the same vein as your edit, why not build a lower spec 'gaming rig' next time, and hand the difference to save the children.
On top of that, plenty of people swear by Apple for good reason. If you don't understand what a premium product is, or understand that people have options, go back to gaming on your rig and stop trolling.
Robin
Premium
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I wonder if the spec of machine required will stay roughly the same as Snow Leopard. The problem with Apps on a desktop is that software which was previously free or freeware might become chargeable just for the hell of it!
I agree, if you already look at companies like HP, Lenovo, Sony etc they are already implementing their own quick launch (mobile OS esque) user interfaces on top of Windows. I bet even Chrome OS will just look like a full screen version of Android. I could see Lion being the game changer for the general public provided it isn't a massive flop. For professionals there will always be a market for the traditional OS though.
As you stated selling software as 'apps' allows Apple to take a cut from something which they would have otherwise got no profit from (you going into a store and buy it). Also people are more willing to put down a few bucks here and there rather than fork out hundreds for something. This is what the successful iPhone model is based on, one click micro transactions.
Robin.
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boiltheocean
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I wouldn't worry about that. Take the existing appstore as an example. For every paid app, there are at least several dozens of free alternatives. I've also seen several iPhone developers up their prices for the same piece of software on iPad....only to have their competitors lower theirs to 0,79 euro.
And there's more: developers are quite happy to share 30% of their turnover to outsource the distribution and marketing of their software to Apple. Also, Apple has literally created a huge army of developers over the past three years, as the iOS and OSX API's share the same common ground. It's extremely easy to port your app from iOS to OSX and vice versa. The things combined are going to be the most important ingredients to create a succesful store with quality content.
The way I see it is that iOS devices are like consoles in a box: they're all closed/limited in some way, but the available content is generally of high quality, software distribution is limited to one or only a few channels and there's no malware/viruses/spyware.
OSX devices on the other hand are just regular desktop computers: they're not limited in any way, there's tons more content than on closed devices, but the downside is there's also plenty of crap and gazillions of distribution methods.
I suspect that some of the concepts of iOS will make it into OSX, but I doubt Apple will piss off their professional clientele by closing it off.
- 6,584
- Kent, UK
- GTP_Jondot
I don't actually mind the App Store, provided it's not then turned into the only way of getting applications onto your computer (a la iPhone). My mother would love it, for example - no install processes, no searching a variety of different websites for what she wants, no panicking about whether it'll have a virus or not. For the casual technophobe it'll actually be very handy.
The other benefit, of course, is that applications that normally wouldn't get any sort of recognition should (in theory) pop up alongside the big-bucks developed stuff when you search. Say I develop a new word processor for OS X, on Google there's pretty much no chance of it being spotted by anyone, whereas if it was accepted into the App Store then it should pop up next to Pages, Word and Open Office when someone searches for 'word processor'.
Provided Apple don't start phasing out the traditional-install stuff to create a walled garden, I think it'll be quite useful. Although I still think they should have called it Fluffy.
The other benefit, of course, is that applications that normally wouldn't get any sort of recognition should (in theory) pop up alongside the big-bucks developed stuff when you search. Say I develop a new word processor for OS X, on Google there's pretty much no chance of it being spotted by anyone, whereas if it was accepted into the App Store then it should pop up next to Pages, Word and Open Office when someone searches for 'word processor'.
Provided Apple don't start phasing out the traditional-install stuff to create a walled garden, I think it'll be quite useful. Although I still think they should have called it Fluffy.
- 4,797
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Oranges are better than apples but Apples are better than Microsoft
- 10,849
- Belgium
- bramturismo
lolwut?
Gaming rigs are still a hell lot cheaper than Apple products. Why not buy a PC next time, and hand the difference to save the children.
- 6,110
- Finland
Apparently you've never come across the idea that Apple products might be better than their competitors and people buy them for that very reason. I've had two iPods this far and I bought them both because they were much easier to use and sounded significantly better than any Creative available at the time. Sony didn't offer large enough storage space. And I didn't feel like buying something that sounded bad or only held half of the music I wanted it to.
I agree that many people buy an iPod, in white of course, and then wear the ungodly miserable plastic earbuds everywhere because then everyone can see they have an iPod. On the contrary both of mine have been black and always playing through a variety of Koss headphones.
And before someone comes up with the old Apple fanboy card I'll say it right away - I'd never buy an iPhone or an iPad. Just because every trendy person either has one or wants one despite there being better alternatives they simply ignore as there's no Apple logo on them.
Joel
Premium
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- Halifax, NS
- Noob616
I got an iPod touch as a Christmas gift, and I'm very happy with it, but I'm not sure if I would get one had I had to spend my own money on it. When you first get one, it's a lot of fun and the apps are addicting. But it pretty quickly just becomes a mobile internet browser and .mp3 player, which shouldn't carry a 300$ price tag.
- 2,376
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i think the humour is meant to be in the portrayal of the PC user, with the weird excuses and unrelated explainations...
nah i dont get it either
kids dont really think macs are like this do they? 
- 2,796
- São Paulo
- Dravonic
i think the humour is meant to be in the portrayal of the PC user, with the weird excuses and unrelated explainations...
nah i dont get it either
Well the whole picture do have valid points.
Macs are indeed quite tame when compared to PCs. A lot easier to deal with. No need to worry or be extra careful to keep it running smoothly. On the other hand though, while PCs are quite bothersome and require far more care, they do allow you to achieve better performance. Notice that gamers have PCs, while office workers have Macs.
The picture does make a lot of sense if you give it some thought.
- 692
- Dracwolley
The idea behind the picture almost makes sense, but with all the stuff they put into it makes it totally awful.
Also, this is my dream machine: iMac 27" i7. This has a 27" LED backlit screen at 2560x1440 resolution, 8GB of 1600 RAM, an i7 940 and an ATI Radeon HD 5870. And most importantly, Windows 7 installed via Boot Camp. Try getting that in a PC for 2.2K 👍 it can be done, but with nowhere near the build quality, lifetime, and overall awesomeness that the iMac can give. And it comes with OSX.
That, my friends, is a rocket-powered Ducati that also has training wheels... but they're removable. 👍
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ROAD_DOGG33J
Premium
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- holyc0w1
- holyc0w
I would like to see that happen with an iMac first.
- 692
- Dracwolley
I'll edit that to 2.2K, but beyond that, just check Apple's store.
ROAD_DOGG33J
Premium
- 14,487
- IL, USA
- holyc0w1
- holyc0w
I did. $2298 with a 5750, so I don't know if you can get a 5870. If you could that would be at least another $175 and another $100 for Windows 7.
- 692
- Dracwolley
for some reason I thought it was a 5870, I guess it is just a 5750. I stand corrected.And also, I just checked, it used to come with 8GB of RAM standard but now it's just 4 since the processor upgrade. ...oh well. Doesn't take away from it still being a great machine. My school owns 2, one with windows 7 on it, and it runs Crysis 2 (yes... we installed that on it) with higher settings than my friend's $2500 gaming PC he made last year. Plus, he's running it in 1080P, but we're in native 2560x1440.
Ya, I'm a bit of a fanboy, but it wouldn't be my dream machine without windows 7.
But, back OT:
EDIT: lolwut, thread merged and my on-topic-making picture just became the most off-topic thing in the world. pretty funny actually 👍
But to actually get on topic this time: I own a MacBook pro and an iPod touch, and received their premium headphones as a gift (they're actualy very, very nice). Wouldn't buy: iPad, iPhone, apple display, MacBook air, Mac pro, Mac mini, any other iPod becuase every other iPod sucks, etc.
But, my only experiences with Apple products have been good ones. Headphones working and sounding fantastic after two years which happens to be exactly 24 times longer than my equally priced Skullcandy headphones lasted MacBook pro just as great as it was brand new, tearing apart everything I throw at it, iPod never had a problem and is fantastic to use, and I know someone who has used an eMac nearly every day for seven years now I believe and he has never had an issue. I really must admire apple for this.
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^ You mean crysis warhead?
I have an ATI based PC here which I bought the beginning of this year and I payed the equivalent of $1400. It's capable of running crysis warhead with enthusiast settings all around at 1080p and about 30fps but with no AA unfortunately. If your friend can't max it out with a $2500 machine, then he got ripped off. Or bought an intel + nvidia
I have an ATI based PC here which I bought the beginning of this year and I payed the equivalent of $1400. It's capable of running crysis warhead with enthusiast settings all around at 1080p and about 30fps but with no AA unfortunately. If your friend can't max it out with a $2500 machine, then he got ripped off. Or bought an intel + nvidia
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- 692
- Dracwolley
^ You mean crysis warhead?
I have an ATI based PC here which I bought the beginning of this year and I payed the equivalent of $1400. It's capable of running crysis warhead with enthusiast settings all around at 1080p and about 30fps but with no AA unfortunately. If your friend can't max it out with a $2500 machine, then he got ripped off. Or bought an intel + nvidia
Did I say crysis 2? Wow, I'm tired.
[removed because of false information]
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There's no way that IMac with a 5750 will get close to 60fps running Crysis Warhead. Not even 30fps. Where's the BS thread?👎
http://www.overclockersclub.com/reviews/xfx5750/7.htm
10fps and thats with a 20% OC on the video card.
Edit:
http://www.overclockersclub.com/reviews/xfx5750/7.htm
10fps and thats with a 20% OC on the video card.
Edit:
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- Dracwolley
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- Dreamweaverx
The Mac vs PC debate is something that people seem to love to exaggerate. The picture that started this thread is an excellent example of this concept, and a lot of the discussion afterwards furthers it.
I am a mac person. My parents had owned macs there entire life and had made the decision to only own macs in the household. Therefore its what i grew up on and the system that I knew the best. As I went through my teen years I used windows on and off, and was more turned off by windows because it was a system I was unfamiliar with. I feel that this was the case for many people in the early half of the 2000's when confronted with the shiny new osx. Then I went to college and I had to use windows more frequently because of the "windows only" applications in the engineering department. This changed the way I thought about the mac/windows comparison. From my personal experience, along with the experiences that i have collected from my peers I think I can create a more accurate comparison.
Windows is a supercar, but not just any supercar. It can go the absolute fastest compared to any other car. Its panels can be replaced and reformed into an almost infinite amount of shapes, depending on the taste of the driver. However fairly frequently you will have to take it to the shop in order to fix something that, if not fixed, will prevent your car from running. If you are a talented mechanic, you could fix your car yourself but after numerous breakdowns you become frustrated with its poor reliability. In the end the vast majority of drivers will give up and buy another car.
The mac is a luxury vehicle. It goes fast, but not ridiculously fast. It easily overtakes the "econoboxes" on the highway, but can't keep up with the supercars. You can customize your vehicle, but only with certain options that are deemed fit for your model by the manufacturer. It only rarely needs to be taken into the shop in order to fix a catastrophic problem. It runs reliably and drivers are pleased with their experience.
The bottom line is that they are both cars, and they are both good cars. Windows is at times woefully unreliable. I can not tell you how many times I have had friends come to me with their 400 dollar dell laptop and say that they have done x process a dozen times, then took it to a store and got it "fixed", and yet it still is broken. They end up simply buying another 400 dollar laptop and pray to have a better experience. Not including the devices my family has owned, I have owned 2 apple products in my life. One 17" first gen MacBook Pro and the 27" i7 iMac I'm typing on now. If my memory serves me my MBP is 4 years and change old. I would consistently run it 24/7 under moderate load for various creative projects that I have pursued over the years. The only problem I have ever had with it was my battery died and needed to be replaced (for free from the apple store). My iMac which I bought right when the i7's were announced has just celebrated its first birthday and came with a defective speaker out of the box. After that was fixed I have yet to have an issue with it. It just cannot be argued that Macs are generally more reliable then PC's.
However Apple hasn't rode into town on a shining horse, ready to slay PC users left and right. The restraints on OSX as a whole are sometimes very frustrating. Things as simple as mouse acceleration are very difficult to turn off. Their designs are beautiful, but are limited. It would be like Richard Hammond's Porsche dealership. "Here is your 911, which color would you like?". Software support is sometimes nonexistent. Apple does a tremendous job supporting their own programs, including the iLife suite among others, but lags far behind on supporting any type of third party devices. I can't tell you how long I've been waiting for driver updates to help optimize starcraft 2. Believe me, I remember the 90's with OS8 and the only option for games being the oregon trail; it wasn't pretty.
I hope this can better explain the differences, and the advantages of the two OS's.
I am a mac person. My parents had owned macs there entire life and had made the decision to only own macs in the household. Therefore its what i grew up on and the system that I knew the best. As I went through my teen years I used windows on and off, and was more turned off by windows because it was a system I was unfamiliar with. I feel that this was the case for many people in the early half of the 2000's when confronted with the shiny new osx. Then I went to college and I had to use windows more frequently because of the "windows only" applications in the engineering department. This changed the way I thought about the mac/windows comparison. From my personal experience, along with the experiences that i have collected from my peers I think I can create a more accurate comparison.
Windows is a supercar, but not just any supercar. It can go the absolute fastest compared to any other car. Its panels can be replaced and reformed into an almost infinite amount of shapes, depending on the taste of the driver. However fairly frequently you will have to take it to the shop in order to fix something that, if not fixed, will prevent your car from running. If you are a talented mechanic, you could fix your car yourself but after numerous breakdowns you become frustrated with its poor reliability. In the end the vast majority of drivers will give up and buy another car.
The mac is a luxury vehicle. It goes fast, but not ridiculously fast. It easily overtakes the "econoboxes" on the highway, but can't keep up with the supercars. You can customize your vehicle, but only with certain options that are deemed fit for your model by the manufacturer. It only rarely needs to be taken into the shop in order to fix a catastrophic problem. It runs reliably and drivers are pleased with their experience.
The bottom line is that they are both cars, and they are both good cars. Windows is at times woefully unreliable. I can not tell you how many times I have had friends come to me with their 400 dollar dell laptop and say that they have done x process a dozen times, then took it to a store and got it "fixed", and yet it still is broken. They end up simply buying another 400 dollar laptop and pray to have a better experience. Not including the devices my family has owned, I have owned 2 apple products in my life. One 17" first gen MacBook Pro and the 27" i7 iMac I'm typing on now. If my memory serves me my MBP is 4 years and change old. I would consistently run it 24/7 under moderate load for various creative projects that I have pursued over the years. The only problem I have ever had with it was my battery died and needed to be replaced (for free from the apple store). My iMac which I bought right when the i7's were announced has just celebrated its first birthday and came with a defective speaker out of the box. After that was fixed I have yet to have an issue with it. It just cannot be argued that Macs are generally more reliable then PC's.
However Apple hasn't rode into town on a shining horse, ready to slay PC users left and right. The restraints on OSX as a whole are sometimes very frustrating. Things as simple as mouse acceleration are very difficult to turn off. Their designs are beautiful, but are limited. It would be like Richard Hammond's Porsche dealership. "Here is your 911, which color would you like?". Software support is sometimes nonexistent. Apple does a tremendous job supporting their own programs, including the iLife suite among others, but lags far behind on supporting any type of third party devices. I can't tell you how long I've been waiting for driver updates to help optimize starcraft 2. Believe me, I remember the 90's with OS8 and the only option for games being the oregon trail; it wasn't pretty.
I hope this can better explain the differences, and the advantages of the two OS's.
