NASCAR.....drafting and Safety Cars!!!!!

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lucag120

lucag120

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lucag120
So, we are about 6 months away from GT5.

And now a few interviews have been hitting the web about how Kaz describes the game, but all we've seen is a TGS demo that shows the exact same track from previous GT's and a few new cars with a damage model thats not going to be used.
Kaz constantly talks about GT5 and NASCAR and how NASCAR is going to be such a big hit.....
He's mentioned the improved AI for NASCAR BUT.......

i wonder....in GT5 prologue the drafting model makes for HORRIBLE racing on Daytona especially online..... and that the most strategic and important aspect of NASCAR racing is the Safety Cars and Yellow Flags. Yet there's been no mention from Kaz that these aspect of the game are being looked at. I'm worried that in GT5 NASCAR will be a disjointed part of the game as it wont be represented correctly.

Does anyone here think that NASCAR should only be in the game if PD can input these aspects into the game??
 
nascar will be for sure in the game even if they can't input drafting etc... however idon't care about Nascar.. i care about Wrc.
 
I wanna hear something big about WRC.
I think this will be the first time to play NASCAR for me..
 
Well NASCAR was one of the main reasons which called for a complete physics overhaul. Its not surprising because given the current GT5P physics it seemed as if he would start last, would end last.

But since they are completely making a new physics engine I'm in great hopes NASCAR (as well as the general racing) will be terrific, along with the dirty lines (which would be a vital tactic).
 
Nice that Nascar is in, so I can compare it to DTM, JGTC and the likes.
Fot the details; I couldn't be bothered.
I am not a Nascar fan, nor will be. So if it is in; fine. As long as we don't get all the cautions because of a 3d guy chooses to throw a leaf on the track
 
Safety cars would be good, especially now we have damage!

But I doubt PD would do it because there are so many variables (What happens to cars that are too damaged to move? [if indeed the damage model is that destructive] / Would the AI be able to decide if a Safety Car is needed?)
 
I am a Nascar fan, have been for 20 years, and I'm very excited about what may be now that Nascar is part of Gran Turismo.

I think its possible that yellow flags and pace cars could appear in the game. Remember in some of the GT4 license tests it was necessary to follow a pace car around. Even if they are starting fresh with GT5, I think this is some proof they've been playing with the idea of using pace cars. I think it would add another dynamic to the racing that would add to the realism, but I don't believe they are necessary for a decent Nascar experience.

I have to disagree about the drafting models effect on Daytona racing in GT5P. Instead I feel its the open nature of the rules we have been given. Keep in mind, Nascar is essentially a spec series. All the cars have to comply to a very strict set of rules that make all the cars equal both in body shape and under the hood. This is totally missing in GT5P. The PP system is a good concept, but it does very little to equal out the cars. A perfect example is the tuned Viper. At 800 pp it is consistently slower than the tuned Vette or Ford GT even though it has similar performance numbers. There are just too many variables that the PP system currently does not take into account.

I have recently run with several groups of people from other forums where we limited the HP, gear ratios and weight of the tuned Vette, Tuned Viper and Ford GT so that they will run almost identical lap times that were close to what a Nascar cup car would run around Daytona and the end result was a big, tight pack of cars running 2 and 3 wide and no one car was able to break away, much like a real Nascar Daytona race. If you are interested in trying it out let me know and I can post or PM to you the setups and rules we went by. I think you might be amazed in the difference of the quality and intensity of the racing.

Its obvious the drafting physics are currently simplified and possibly overstated, for instance no side drafting, but I firmly don't believe that it is responsible for the quality of the racing at Daytona.
 
lucag120
i wonder....in GT5 prologue the drafting model makes for HORRIBLE racing on Daytona especially online
Click to expand...

I haven't raced online in GT5p, only offline. I have found the drafting to be very good. What is wrong with it online?
 
Bogie 19th
I haven't raced online in GT5p, only offline. I have found the drafting to be very good. What is wrong with it online?
Click to expand...

Its way too strong on and offline.
You gain way too much extra speed from the slip-stream, pretty unrealistic.
 
G.T.Ace
Its way too strong on and offline.
You gain way too much extra speed from the slip-stream, pretty unrealistic.
Click to expand...

I guess I hadn't noticed that much. I don't actually spend enough time in drafts as I should though. Might help me conquer A class.
 
dlrws6
I am a Nascar fan, have been for 20 years, and I'm very excited about what may be now that Nascar is part of Gran Turismo.

I think its possible that yellow flags and pace cars could appear in the game. Remember in some of the GT4 license tests it was necessary to follow a pace car around. Even if they are starting fresh with GT5, I think this is some proof they've been playing with the idea of using pace cars. I think it would add another dynamic to the racing that would add to the realism, but I don't believe they are necessary for a decent Nascar experience.

I have to disagree about the drafting models effect on Daytona racing in GT5P. Instead I feel its the open nature of the rules we have been given. Keep in mind, Nascar is essentially a spec series. All the cars have to comply to a very strict set of rules that make all the cars equal both in body shape and under the hood. This is totally missing in GT5P. The PP system is a good concept, but it does very little to equal out the cars. A perfect example is the tuned Viper. At 800 pp it is consistently slower than the tuned Vette or Ford GT even though it has similar performance numbers. There are just too many variables that the PP system currently does not take into account.

I have recently run with several groups of people from other forums where we limited the HP, gear ratios and weight of the tuned Vette, Tuned Viper and Ford GT so that they will run almost identical lap times that were close to what a Nascar cup car would run around Daytona and the end result was a big, tight pack of cars running 2 and 3 wide and no one car was able to break away, much like a real Nascar Daytona race. If you are interested in trying it out let me know and I can post or PM to you the setups and rules we went by. I think you might be amazed in the difference of the quality and intensity of the racing.

Its obvious the drafting physics are currently simplified and possibly overstated, for instance no side drafting, but I firmly don't believe that it is responsible for the quality of the racing at Daytona.
Click to expand...


Quality post. 👍
 
I thought there was drafting in GT, especially GT4. If we're talking NASCAR and Daytona, you HAVE to mention tactics like bump drafting. The nature of Daytona and (if we get this course) Talladega is that you need to have a partner to go drafting with at full speed. I still remember doing those Slipstream Battles in GT4. Adding in ten more cars means that more cars will likely share the draft. I can already imagine three-wide and maybe four-wide on the backstretch. If PD can make the high-speed battles fun, this NASCAR experience will be a hit.

As for the pace/safety car, I'd like to see this being implemented in almost all circuit races, not just NASCAR. And I don't want to hear some cheap shots where someone says/types, "can't PD find a better pace/safety car than the GT-R? PD can't live without kissing Nissan's ass by having this GT-R Pace Car." I'd still like to see some utilization of the Pace/Safety Car in many more races. Only as long as the pace car driver doesn't drive like the pace car driver at the ALMS race at Laguna Seca that went off track after the Andretti Hairpin(?).
 
JohnBM01
I thought there was drafting in GT, especially GT4. If we're talking NASCAR and Daytona, you HAVE to mention tactics like bump drafting. The nature of Daytona and (if we get this course) Talladega is that you need to have a partner to go drafting with at full speed. I still remember doing those Slipstream Battles in GT4. Adding in ten more cars means that more cars will likely share the draft. I can already imagine three-wide and maybe four-wide on the backstretch. If PD can make the high-speed battles fun, this NASCAR experience will be a hit.
Click to expand...

I was thinking the same thing. I am hoping for races where you form teams or alliances with other cars and the Ai makes it so that the team work with you instead of against you.
 
JohnBM01
If we're talking NASCAR and Daytona, you HAVE to mention tactics like bump drafting. The nature of Daytona and (if we get this course) Talladega is that you need to have a partner to go drafting with at full speed.
Click to expand...

It's this kind of thing that makes me wonder how far PD is going to take the NASCAR experience, because NASCAR is very much a team sport in a lot of ways, will the computer controlled cars work with you as a team? Will your teammate bump draft with you, will it know to be ready when you bump him and vice versa? There are all kinds of facets in NASCAR that make it not just a bunch of car going fast around a track that I wonder if PD can pull off...
 
A lot goes into NASCAR that many people don't understand. I'm not a fan, but I understand how strategic the races are. Somehow I don't think PD will go far enough to give the series enough credit.
 
JMSpeed
A lot goes into NASCAR that many people don't understand. I'm not a fan, but I understand how strategic the races are. Somehow I don't think PD will go far enough to give the series enough credit.
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It's not like the bar is very high.
 
JMSpeed
A lot goes into NASCAR that many people don't understand. I'm not a fan, but I understand how strategic the races are. Somehow I don't think PD will go far enough to give the series enough credit.
Click to expand...

Honestly, I think PD wont half-ass NASCAR. PD already said that NASCAR will likely have the most realistic damage engine, great physics, full 500 mile races, close racing, good AI and even more than that.
 
Leadfoot53
Honestly, I think PD wont half-ass NASCAR. PD already said that NASCAR will likely have the most realistic damage engine, great physics, full 500 mile races, close racing, good AI and even more than that.
Click to expand...

Yeah, Kaz has made it clear that if NASCAR is going to be in GT5, it's going to be done right. He seems very...I don't know...emotionally moved by American racing and American cars as of late, so I don't think the fans will be dissapointed.

However, he hasn't said much about WRC. Which has me worried :nervous:
 
Leadfoot53
PD won't half-ass those things... That's Turn 10's job!
Click to expand...

Garbage remarks just add fuel to the fire. If you don't have anything constructive to post then please refrain from posting to this thread. Man the hate on T10 is just way beyond me.
 
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We have never seen yellow flags in GT series. If PD implement safety cars and yellow flags to GT5, it will be a big step as a race sim. However we stuck with the auto-pilot thing now, not sure how PD would put them together.

I remember when I was a kid playing Papyrus' Nascar on DOS, I destroyed all AIs during yellow flags, so I could be in first position on rolling start :lol:
 
TeamStig
However, he hasn't said much about WRC. Which has me worried :nervous:
Click to expand...

Judging by the tone of his interviews he is focusing mainly on NASCAR as it is a new type of racing to the GT series(it hasn't really been focused on in the past) where as Rally racing has been in the game since GT2.

I'm guessing we will hear more about WRC in the game as it gets closer(as well as the other goodies Kaz has for us).


franz
We have never seen yellow flags in GT series. If PD implement safety cars and yellow flags to GT5, it will be a big step as a race sim. However we stuck with the auto-pilot thing now, not sure how PD would put them together.

I remember when I was a kid playing Papyrus' Nascar on DOS, I destroyed all AIs during yellow flags, so I could be in first position on rolling start
Click to expand...

They could just let us control the car but limit the speed.
 
JohnBM01
Only as long as the pace car driver doesn't drive like the pace car driver at the ALMS race at Laguna Seca that went off track after the Andretti Hairpin(?).
Click to expand...

HA, thhe dumb ass ran right into the dirt...it was great.

But, hey, that's a tough corner....even at 35mph :rolleyes:
 
TeamStig
Yeah, Kaz has made it clear that if NASCAR is going to be in GT5, it's going to be done right. He seems very...I don't know...emotionally moved by American racing and American cars as of late, so I don't think the fans will be dissapointed.

However, he hasn't said much about WRC. Which has me worried :nervous:
Click to expand...
The lack of info. on WRC has me concerned too. NASCAR, fine, I've nothing against it, but it's not the most exciting race series to actually play. I'm sure it will all come good in the end though.
 
Bogie 19th
I haven't raced online in GT5p, only offline. I have found the drafting to be very good. What is wrong with it online?
Click to expand...
The drafting is too good in GT5P. Cars doesn't draft that well in real life, if they did I've would notice it on the highway.
 

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