NASCAR Thread.
- Thread starter WallRunner
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A good friend sent me this:
Heck Yeah! I'm proud that they've got the balls to follow in the fine NASCAR traditions of Smoky Yunick, Cotton Owens, Junior Johnson and others who bend that rule book and make a mockery of mandated "Parity". (If they actually were) Hell this is racing after all isn't it? It would be more unsportsmanlike if they weren't actually trying to find an advantage. Jimmy Spencer was whining that the penalties handed out weren't stiff enough. I'll take your queue and guess that the whole thing might have been staged by NASCAR. (that's National Association for SPEC Car Auto Racing)
I'll bet David Pearson has a knee slapping cackle every time Tony Stewart gets sent to "Anger Management" class.
And my next rant is Tony George. (Who I truly believe is owned by the France Family) I saw an ad for Honda touting them as the "Exclusive Engine Supplier to the IRL" Nooooooo!!! SPEC ENGINES for the INDY 500?!? Half of what made the Indy 500 great was somebody was always trying a car or powerplant with some different thinking! Arrrrrgh! No wonder nobody wants to watch open-wheel racing in the US!
Heck Yeah! I'm proud that they've got the balls to follow in the fine NASCAR traditions of Smoky Yunick, Cotton Owens, Junior Johnson and others who bend that rule book and make a mockery of mandated "Parity". (If they actually were) Hell this is racing after all isn't it? It would be more unsportsmanlike if they weren't actually trying to find an advantage. Jimmy Spencer was whining that the penalties handed out weren't stiff enough. I'll take your queue and guess that the whole thing might have been staged by NASCAR. (that's National Association for SPEC Car Auto Racing)
I'll bet David Pearson has a knee slapping cackle every time Tony Stewart gets sent to "Anger Management" class.
And my next rant is Tony George. (Who I truly believe is owned by the France Family) I saw an ad for Honda touting them as the "Exclusive Engine Supplier to the IRL" Nooooooo!!! SPEC ENGINES for the INDY 500?!? Half of what made the Indy 500 great was somebody was always trying a car or powerplant with some different thinking! Arrrrrgh! No wonder nobody wants to watch open-wheel racing in the US!
- 7,984
- GTP_Royalton
Mark Martin was robbed. The caution should have came out when he was leading.
Someone care to tell me why NASCAR failed to throw the caution or turn on the caution lights when there is a 20 car wreck with cars flipping everywhere?
NASCAR throws cautions for fantom debris or sometimes pieces of spring rubber in the infield grass but they can't throw a caution for a 20 car pileup?
No wonder they kept wrecking all the way into turn 1. The wreck happened in turn 4 and positions were still up for grab. With no caution people still gunned it for the finish line causing maximum carnage.
This is the biggest blunder I've ever seen NASCAR make
Mark Martin deserved to win that but NASCAR blew it
Someone care to tell me why NASCAR failed to throw the caution or turn on the caution lights when there is a 20 car wreck with cars flipping everywhere?
NASCAR throws cautions for fantom debris or sometimes pieces of spring rubber in the infield grass but they can't throw a caution for a 20 car pileup?
No wonder they kept wrecking all the way into turn 1. The wreck happened in turn 4 and positions were still up for grab. With no caution people still gunned it for the finish line causing maximum carnage.
This is the biggest blunder I've ever seen NASCAR make
Mark Martin deserved to win that but NASCAR blew it
ND4SPD
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- JeffZ28
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Ha, thats what I was thinking too. I feel bad for Mark Martin. This year's Daytona 500 was unusually unexciting for me, until the last 15 or so laps. I was suprised to see how mediocre Jeff Gordon was doing when compared to his duel race. I guess being almost an inch too low really benefitted that car?..... That was one of the most spectacular finishes though, second to Friday's truck race finish. Hopefully Nascar's COT will create races as exciting as the truck series.
- 19,423
- HSV
It wasn't Toyota's fault, Waltrip's team did it. Waltrip pretty much says so.
I'm not a fan of throwing the red flag with three laps to go; cold tires + break in concentration + 25 people running for checkered flag = inevitable accident. I know it's a 4-year-old rule, but it's a dangerous tactic NASCAR uses to spice up the show. Boo hoo, some races end under caution, that's life.
- 9,089
- Scotland
the yellow flag did come out,after they crossed the line,havent seen nascar for a couple of years since i moved out from my mums(i dont have cable) but from the games you are still "racing" till you get to the line.the race was fair and well deserved for harvick who made an awesome run to the end,if he hadnt got loose in ether turn 3/4 he would have won but he did and thats what cost him.
- 26,245
- Houston, Texas, USA
- JMarine25
I'll just make it quick.
* I don't think Mark Martin was robbed. Kevin Harvick basically stole the show. It was kind of like last year's Indy 500 battle between Marco Andretti and Sam Hornish Jr. The difference is that there wasn't a multi-car crash on the final lap of last year's Indy 500. This is what I would consider a quality loss for Mark Martin. Nobody stole anything. I think that last lap pileup probably wasn't going to suspend a great race in progress up front. Also, nobody up front could really mount such a challenge. So it goes both ways.
* Juan Pablo Montoya did pretty well in his first go-round. I think he's going to win a race this year, maybe even two or more. The native of Bogota, Columbia ended up 19th. I have great respect for Montoya. He does have a great resumé whether you like him or not. He won a handful of races in his 1999 (then) CART campaign (a terrible season later), he won the Indy 500, he even did the toughest short-term goal- win an F1 race. Now he's in NASCAR trying to make a name for himself in the States... again. As long as Chip Ganassi is around, Montoya is going to make him proud as best as possible. But anyways, a top 20 finish is always great for a first-timer in Cup. Now unless you're Jamie McMurray(?) or someone, who won his first race in his second try (Charlotte), then it's still great to finish this high.
I'll key in on Toyota in Cup in a future post if I decide to come back.
* I don't think Mark Martin was robbed. Kevin Harvick basically stole the show. It was kind of like last year's Indy 500 battle between Marco Andretti and Sam Hornish Jr. The difference is that there wasn't a multi-car crash on the final lap of last year's Indy 500. This is what I would consider a quality loss for Mark Martin. Nobody stole anything. I think that last lap pileup probably wasn't going to suspend a great race in progress up front. Also, nobody up front could really mount such a challenge. So it goes both ways.
* Juan Pablo Montoya did pretty well in his first go-round. I think he's going to win a race this year, maybe even two or more. The native of Bogota, Columbia ended up 19th. I have great respect for Montoya. He does have a great resumé whether you like him or not. He won a handful of races in his 1999 (then) CART campaign (a terrible season later), he won the Indy 500, he even did the toughest short-term goal- win an F1 race. Now he's in NASCAR trying to make a name for himself in the States... again. As long as Chip Ganassi is around, Montoya is going to make him proud as best as possible. But anyways, a top 20 finish is always great for a first-timer in Cup. Now unless you're Jamie McMurray(?) or someone, who won his first race in his second try (Charlotte), then it's still great to finish this high.
I'll key in on Toyota in Cup in a future post if I decide to come back.
- 2,886
Damn fine finish.
Mike Joy said it best on windtunnel, 'If NASCAR threw the caution, would it stop them from wrecking? No it wouldn't.' By the time NASCAR had thrown the flag and turned on the caution lights, Harvick would have still won and the majority of the wreck would have cleared.
There's always next year.
That has since changed, as soon as the caution comes out, the field is frozen in the positions that they are in and they slow down.
I disagree, the main reason why Martin lost was because his drafting partner, Kyle Busch had moved to the outside trying to block Harvick who had a great run going into turn 3. Kyle either had to block him or help Martin, he tried blocking but didn't work, Harvick just had too big of a run. Even though he got loose he actually managed to get back in front of Harvick, but not where it counted.
Mike Joy said it best on windtunnel, 'If NASCAR threw the caution, would it stop them from wrecking? No it wouldn't.' By the time NASCAR had thrown the flag and turned on the caution lights, Harvick would have still won and the majority of the wreck would have cleared.
There's always next year.
That has since changed, as soon as the caution comes out, the field is frozen in the positions that they are in and they slow down.
I disagree, the main reason why Martin lost was because his drafting partner, Kyle Busch had moved to the outside trying to block Harvick who had a great run going into turn 3. Kyle either had to block him or help Martin, he tried blocking but didn't work, Harvick just had too big of a run. Even though he got loose he actually managed to get back in front of Harvick, but not where it counted.
- 7,984
- GTP_Royalton
Villeneuve coming to NASCAR sooner rather then later?
From what I've read he wants to be the first winner of the Daytona 500, Indy 500, 24 hrs of LeMans, F1 championship, NASCAR championship, and CART Championship.
It's good to see guys like this who love racing. Not stuck up arrogant drivers like Michael Schumacher who say "I've won F1 which is the top of the racing world. Anything else is not a challenge and a waste of time."
From what I've read he wants to be the first winner of the Daytona 500, Indy 500, 24 hrs of LeMans, F1 championship, NASCAR championship, and CART Championship.
It's good to see guys like this who love racing. Not stuck up arrogant drivers like Michael Schumacher who say "I've won F1 which is the top of the racing world. Anything else is not a challenge and a waste of time."
- 7,984
- GTP_Royalton
Juan Montoya gets his first NASCAR win in his what, 8th NASCAR race?
Any surprise?
Not here
Too bad he won the way he did though, I hate for controversy to cloud his win.
As for the accident, I saw it live and here is my thoughts.
Juan Montoya was more then aware that cautions were happening every lap and he was eager to get around Scott Pruet, the earlier the better.
With that said I think he got too excited. He had much fresher tires then Pruett and he tried to get him as soon as possible. Pruett thought it was impossible to close that fast into turn1 and didn't pay attention to him.
Pruett is understandably mad, his comments show that, but I think he and Montoya will get over that, considering it was really just a, as Denny Hamlin called it, 'overzealous' move.
This race was great for Montoya and NASCAR. Is it possible for Montoya to go from 21st to the lead in 20 laps in Formula 1 when he has the fastest car? No. And if he had made contact like that in Formula 1 his race would have been finished, but in NASCAR he was fine.
This will be great for Montoya's confidence and momentum. He has had 2 subpar showings in NEXTEL cup this year but this win should get him on the right track.
But, in the end, that is Montoya. He will always be the most agressive driver on the track. That is his biggest strength and at times his biggest weakness. Try and take his agression away and you will take away his biggest strength.
Let Montoya be Montoya.
Any surprise?
Not here
Too bad he won the way he did though, I hate for controversy to cloud his win.
As for the accident, I saw it live and here is my thoughts.
Juan Montoya was more then aware that cautions were happening every lap and he was eager to get around Scott Pruet, the earlier the better.
With that said I think he got too excited. He had much fresher tires then Pruett and he tried to get him as soon as possible. Pruett thought it was impossible to close that fast into turn1 and didn't pay attention to him.
Pruett is understandably mad, his comments show that, but I think he and Montoya will get over that, considering it was really just a, as Denny Hamlin called it, 'overzealous' move.
This race was great for Montoya and NASCAR. Is it possible for Montoya to go from 21st to the lead in 20 laps in Formula 1 when he has the fastest car? No. And if he had made contact like that in Formula 1 his race would have been finished, but in NASCAR he was fine.
This will be great for Montoya's confidence and momentum. He has had 2 subpar showings in NEXTEL cup this year but this win should get him on the right track.
But, in the end, that is Montoya. He will always be the most agressive driver on the track. That is his biggest strength and at times his biggest weakness. Try and take his agression away and you will take away his biggest strength.
Let Montoya be Montoya.
ND4SPD
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- JeffZ28
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Wait, I just missed the Busch series race this weekend? Weren't they at Mexico? The one busch race I wanted to see and I missed it. Oh well, I'm happy for Montoya but I heard there was a bit of controversy. I guess I'll wait for a rerun to pop up on Speed channel sometime this week to catch it then.
I was just watching the coverage on the testing of the COT and I just noticed that the Dodge COT isn't a Charger, but an Avenger! I know Chevy is using the Impala as the COT and we now know Dodge is using the Avenger as the COT, but is Ford sticking with the Fusion as the COT? I didn't notice what name was on the Ford COT. If they were to use a different car, I'd guess it'd be the new Taurus.
**EDIT
Oddly enough TSN has just put on a re run of the Busch race at 11:30pm......I thought I was gonna go to bed early so I wouldn't be too sleepy at school, but it looks like my plans have changed.
I also just noticed that they removed the chicane from the front straight. I wonder why, I actually liked those chicanes.
I was just watching the coverage on the testing of the COT and I just noticed that the Dodge COT isn't a Charger, but an Avenger! I know Chevy is using the Impala as the COT and we now know Dodge is using the Avenger as the COT, but is Ford sticking with the Fusion as the COT? I didn't notice what name was on the Ford COT. If they were to use a different car, I'd guess it'd be the new Taurus.
**EDIT
Oddly enough TSN has just put on a re run of the Busch race at 11:30pm......I thought I was gonna go to bed early so I wouldn't be too sleepy at school, but it looks like my plans have changed.
I also just noticed that they removed the chicane from the front straight. I wonder why, I actually liked those chicanes.
- 1,006
A little extreme on the pessimism but point well made and taken on my part Sting.
m.piedgros
m.piedgros
- 10,620
- gtp_jimprower
Oh, come on, Dale Sr., Rusty, D.W., they was all doin' that spinout stuff in the '80s.
- 451
- Jonerz99
What he was saying was if Montoya had spun Jr. there would have been hell to pay. Because it was a non-NASCAR regular in Scott Pruett NASCAR knew they didn't have to take action. I imagine if it had been Jr. who was spun Montoya would have been sent back to Europe before you could say "over-anxious move."
Cheers,
Cheers,
- 25
i am happy for montoya. the incident with scott pruett looks to me to be accidental. it looks like JPM had the line going into turn one. pruett didnt see him down there and they touched. oh well. **** happens.
- 36,517
- Scotland
- GTP_daan
JPM was never close enough to have the line. It was Pruett's corner all the way. JPM just braked way too late and tagged the back of Pruett.
And don't try to circumvent the swear filter. Its there for a reason.
- 21,286
- GR-MI-USA
- YSSMAN
- YSSMAN
Not to put a damper on JPM's parade, but Mexico is only a side-show even in the NASCAR world. Was I rooting for him? Yes, although I am a Said-Head, so I was rooting for him as well...
My Point: Just because he has gotten a win on a track like Mexico City really doesn't reflect well on the entire season of NASCAR thus far. Considering that we are technically only two races in when we're talking about the "Big Show," and given that JPM's performance on the ovals has been somewhat "average," I'm not about to go out and wave the Texaco/Havoline flags just yet.
Does that make him a bad driver? Certainly not. I currently foresee a future for JPM that makes him a "road course specialist," with a few ovals (and the like) that he does well on. Think Robby Gordon or Boris Said, and you'll get a pretty decent idea. JPM has a long, long, long season ahead of him, and an early race in the Bush Series is by no means a guarantee for a win later in the NEXTEL Cup.
...I'd say he has a good chance at places like Infineon and Watkins Glenn, and maybe Pocono and Indianapolis, but some of the other tracks may be a bit more difficult. I'm looking forward to Vegas this weekend, it is usually a pretty good track that can demonstrate what a driver and a team can do.
My Point: Just because he has gotten a win on a track like Mexico City really doesn't reflect well on the entire season of NASCAR thus far. Considering that we are technically only two races in when we're talking about the "Big Show," and given that JPM's performance on the ovals has been somewhat "average," I'm not about to go out and wave the Texaco/Havoline flags just yet.
Does that make him a bad driver? Certainly not. I currently foresee a future for JPM that makes him a "road course specialist," with a few ovals (and the like) that he does well on. Think Robby Gordon or Boris Said, and you'll get a pretty decent idea. JPM has a long, long, long season ahead of him, and an early race in the Bush Series is by no means a guarantee for a win later in the NEXTEL Cup.
...I'd say he has a good chance at places like Infineon and Watkins Glenn, and maybe Pocono and Indianapolis, but some of the other tracks may be a bit more difficult. I'm looking forward to Vegas this weekend, it is usually a pretty good track that can demonstrate what a driver and a team can do.
- 26,245
- Houston, Texas, USA
- JMarine25
I respect Juan Pablo Montoya. This move against Scott Pruett wasn't like when Paul Tracy and Alex Tagliani tangled in San Jose last year or so. I'd be ticked off if my own teammate spun me out (just ask my "ToCA Race Driver 3" experiences). However, I didn't think he intentionally spun him out. I hate for people to put that cloud of guilt over Montoya like this. Should he have done what he did to try to the win? Not at all. I thought this was incidental contact. The thing I hated most about this was how Todd Parott(?) was saying "I'm sorry we wrecked Pruett." Just gets me riled up because MONTOYA DID NOT WRECK PRUETT! That's what NASCAR's been turning into- wrecking. The #42 simply tagged Pruett on the rear while still on the race track. He didn't put Pruett into the wall, he didn't knock him off the track to be hit by other cars... he did NOT wreck Pruett. He just simply tapped him and spun him out unintentionally. Part of the reason why I don't watch NASCAR religiously is because of stuff like that. And maybe it's the internationally-cultured person in me, but I felt pretty disappointed at foreign words being mispronounced during the broadcast.
All in all, it was a great event, and NASCAR Busch is supposed to go there next year to race again in Mexico City. Then later this year, NASCAR goes to Montreal. So NASCAR currently races at three tracks that have either hosted or currently host Formula One grands prix. NASCAR finds some great road courses. Most of the ovals get cookie-cutter, but their road course selection is great in my view.
And so I sounded off. I'm done. Take care.
All in all, it was a great event, and NASCAR Busch is supposed to go there next year to race again in Mexico City. Then later this year, NASCAR goes to Montreal. So NASCAR currently races at three tracks that have either hosted or currently host Formula One grands prix. NASCAR finds some great road courses. Most of the ovals get cookie-cutter, but their road course selection is great in my view.
And so I sounded off. I'm done. Take care.
- 1,006
The word wreck came out of NASCAR and has been adapted to other North American motorsports. A wreck is what we would normally call a shunt. That was a shunt. However, in NASCAR "wreck" keeps being redefined. I've already complained about the NASCAR road course rules and because Montoya came together with Pruett spun him, resulting in lost positions for Pruett and a full course yellow that is pretty much a wreck. Even though a car didn't go flipping into the infield sliding on its roof, on fire, collecting pounds of sod and flipping back onto its roof, with another what... thirteen cars smashing in the tri-oval, the Montoya incident was still a wreck. I think by the nature of road course racing it would be extraordinary hard to replicate the Daytona crash, or many others like it from around oval racing.
m.piedgros
m.piedgros
- 1,759
Wow I wouldn't count that as much of a win. Take your own team mate out to win. That took no skill to win it that way. Maybe if he actually passed him clean. But I don't have much respect for that win.
- 3,195
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- mwoodski
- mwoodski
Meh, I think Pruett chopped down on Montoya, but still JPM would have gotten it anyways I think. However, what everyone fails to mention, is Said's awesome piece of Off-Road driving after Pruett got nudged. That crazy guy went flying through the grass at Kamikaze speeds, lol.
- 1,006
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I have no comment as of yet.
m.piedgros
- 7,984
- GTP_Royalton
NASCAR's caution fest,
yes the last dozen laps of the race was annoying due to all the cautions but there are some things you should remember,
- This is the feeder series to NASCAR, and alot of the drivers racing have little to no experience on roadcourses. They have no experience in looking for local yellows etc and just throwing local yellows for cars spun in the middle of the road could have been deadly.
-NASCAR's top NEXTEL cup series uses local yellows ALOT during their road course races imo due to the experience of the drivers.
- NASCAR is commercialized. thats why they didnt throw the caution at Daytona, so you cant really compare daytona and Mexico. NASCAR's commercialism is great that it gave us green/white/checkered finishes + redflaged races that are near the end but bad that it makes them not throw the caution at Daytona to make a great finish. I think it is more good then bad that they are looking to put on a good show
Montoya&Pruett the next Tracy&Franchitti?
yes the last dozen laps of the race was annoying due to all the cautions but there are some things you should remember,
- This is the feeder series to NASCAR, and alot of the drivers racing have little to no experience on roadcourses. They have no experience in looking for local yellows etc and just throwing local yellows for cars spun in the middle of the road could have been deadly.
-NASCAR's top NEXTEL cup series uses local yellows ALOT during their road course races imo due to the experience of the drivers.
- NASCAR is commercialized. thats why they didnt throw the caution at Daytona, so you cant really compare daytona and Mexico. NASCAR's commercialism is great that it gave us green/white/checkered finishes + redflaged races that are near the end but bad that it makes them not throw the caution at Daytona to make a great finish. I think it is more good then bad that they are looking to put on a good show
Montoya&Pruett the next Tracy&Franchitti?
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