Need help understanding suspension.

  • Thread starter yukicore
  • 14 comments
  • 2,181 views
68
Yukicore
Hi everyone! So I want someone to help me understand how exactly suspension works and how each tweak in GT5 affects car's handling.

So when I had just bought GT5 I was only about tuning engine to the max and putting turbos on and just maxing the **** out of it. But time, experience and interest of this great invention that made world it never could be without this invention.

So then I came to my mind and understood that car is not just power, wheels and big box on it. It's whole lot more and in order to make a car that works well you have to make it work together, work as one. Power is nothing without handling.

So I started small by tweaking my car in game, so I pretty much understand basically how it all works, But I want to know how to make it work together.



So what i want to know.

*Focus points (step by step) of making suspension work with the car based on power, weight and different terrains

*How dampers work, is the number level of resistance when Extension damper extends and Compression damper compresses. Or it's level of how strong and fast it tries to extend/compress

*Wheel Alignment setup, how does that change cars handling.

*Anti-Roll Bars - what are they, what do they do and in what situations I should use them.

I really, really would like and appreciate any help, but please don't comment if you are not sure, or know only partly, I want full answers and explanations, everything or nothing.
 
Step by step instructions would be way too lengthy to type up.
You can get all this info in the tuning forum.

Id recommend you should try out pre existing tunes for several cars from the tuning forums, and try to discover patterns and trends. Learning from a manual can be confusing, since there are so many variables. The best way to learn how to setup your car is through trial and error.

Basic info for what each tuning aspect does can be found ingame, or in the tuning forum.

Goodluck
 
You can also use this. Be warned however that some tuners have different concepts on how GT5's suspension works and relates to one another. But pretty much every one agrees on its theory.
 
I can tell you what the Anti-roll bars do...
This setting will make your car more stable in corners.
Example car: '69 Camaro RM This car is greatly improved by the race mod itself, but just with an adjustment to the anti-roll bars, you can improve it's high speed cornering stability. get one of these and drive it on the first 3 sections of Nurburgring... move the setting up by 1 or 2 on both sides and you will notice a bit of a stiffened feel to the way it handles. Combine this with all of the suspension settings and you will have a car that handles as good as, or better than most newer cars. it can even out handle some race cars. In a personal time comparison, I was able to pull consistently fast times that were comparible to my RX-7 touring car at the camaro's level (600 pp). I was pleasantly surprised by the way this car turned out.
Hope this helps.👍
 
Thanks for posting those links folks.
I too have recently figured out for myself, as well, that maxing out the cars isn't always the best thing to do with them... Lately I've been buying all new cars where I had already upgraded them with stage 3 whatever, so I can get them back to stock again. It only took me one and a half years to figure this out, heh.
 
I like to try a different car, and different tune, for every 2, 3 laps or so , on the Nurburgring, and a year after tinkering, it's only 'starting' to fall into place, but the learning curve is very steep for me, and I still experiment to this day, and I know there are dozens of better suspension tune settings I should use, but getting to them, is never crystal clear, and they vary from car to car, shape to shape, weight, ballistic location, LSD, track being used, transmission ratios, brake balance and Bias, braking point, AIDS being used, ABS @1 or 0, every PD patch update, who is hosting the game and from what kind of router settings, is he using peer blocking scripts to better his times, and your very pwn driving inputs at the wheel.

Its what makes this game so great afterall :)

Sometimes you know what you want your car to do, but programming the numbers in often skates around the end result. Thankfully, there are many many different tunes I can do, to get the car do what I'd like, and ultimately, win races online.

I still have no idea how to tune. But I can drive the car no matter what the settings, at least.
Kudos to the subtuning forum garages, they bring stock production cars alive. Whether or not you remain alive after driving them, well, that's not their responsibility.
 
Last edited:
This is so annoying, there are not the kind of info on those pages, there are info on how to tune them, but I want to know how they work so I can tune them myself with knowing what I am doing, not blindly follow tutorials. Please anyone who can answer my questing, please!!!
 
I found a good source that may explain this. The source (listed below) also has great explanations of how the transmission, differential, and brake balancing works as well.

Ride Height

Generally, you want as low a ride height as possible without bottoming out the suspension on rough roads and under heavy weight transfer. However, balancing the front and rear ride height can let you play with your vehicle's center of gravity. A higher ride height in the rear will shift the car's center of gravity forward, which may help front tire grip. The opposite is also true.

Ride Height: Lower<===>Higher

Spring Rate

Most vehicles come from the factory with fairly soft springs made to deal with rough public roads. On the track, however, the range of lumpy road surfaces is much narrower. The generally smoother track surfaces make suspension stiffening a very helpful adjustment in the corners. However, like all things in tuning, too much of anything will negatively impact your lap times.

Stiffer suspension will better control suspension travel and the always-changing nature of your wheel camber. By holding wheel camber more constant, you can effectively keep the tires flat against the pavement for improved grip. Too much suspension travel will cause the camber angle to change&#8212;since suspension does not travel straight upward, but rather in an arc&#8212;which will result in vastly different levels of grip depending on the weight balance of the vehicle at any given moment.

Though as we mentioned, too much suspension stiffness can be a bad thing. Too-stiff suspension will not have the travel necessary to properly deal with imperfections in the road surface. Slight bumps in the road will then cause the tires to skip and lose traction. As such, stiffening the front suspension too much can cause understeer, while stiffening the rear suspension too much can cause oversteer. Conversely, you can reduce understeer and oversteer by softening the front and rear suspension, respectively.

Spring Rate: Softer<===>Harder

Damping

While spring stiffness determines how much travel is in the suspension, dampers, also known as shocks, control the rate at which a vehicle's springs oscillate. Picture hitting a large bump at high speed in a standard road-going vehicle. After the bump, the car's suspension will continue to oscillate, bouncing up and down as the springs settle back down to their normal state. While this oscillation is good for driver comfort on public roads, it's not so desirable on the race track. The fluctuating weight balance during such oscillation can make tire grip unsteady, fluctuating with the suspension travel.

Stiffer shocks will control the oscillation of the suspension for a steadier weight balance. As well, stiffer springs will increase the speed of weight transfer, letting you more quickly and predictably redistribute the weight of the car with acceleration and braking. However, too-stiff shocks can overpower the springs, reducing their effectiveness at dealing with imperfections in the road and contributing to a loss of traction on uneven road surfaces, including bumps, dips and rumble strips.

Dampers (Extension): Softer<===>Harder
Dampers (Compression): Softer<===>Harder

Anti-Roll Bars

Anti-roll bars increase the vehicle's rigidity and stability under hard cornering by effectively tying together the left and right sides of the vehicle. Hard corners will cause the body of a car to roll away from the turn. You can adjust the stiffness of anti-roll bars to counter the body roll and tweak the cornering characteristics of your vehicle.

Generally, increasing front anti-roll bar stiffness will also increase the tendency to understeer. Conversely, increasing the stiffness of the rear anti-roll bars will increase the tendency to oversteer. It's a good idea to tweak the stiffness to an even level that suits the vehicle before adjusting for understeer or oversteer. When it comes time for the fine-tuning, it's often better to soften the anti-roll bars to correct understeer and oversteer rather than stiffen. If the anti-roll bars are too stiff, you'll get some instability on rough roads and hairiness in tight corners where the inside tires may lift off the ground.

Anti-Roll Bars: Looser<===>Stiffer

Camber Angle

Camber deals with the tilt of the wheels when viewed from the face of the car. Wheels with the tops tilted inward have negative camber, while wheels with the tops tilted outward have positive camber. There's generally no racing application for positive camber, though some degree of negative camber can help cornering. As the car hits hard into a corner, centrifugal force will naturally roll the weight of the vehicle outwards. Negative camber helps keep the tire flat on the asphalt during this weight transfer. However, too much negative camber will prevent the tires from sitting flat during straight acceleration and braking, reducing grip in those situations.

Camber Angle (-): Positive<===>Negative

Note: You cannot have a positive Camber Angle in GT5. Remember 0 is neutral and is neither positive nor negative.

Toe Angle

Toe is the tilted angle of the wheels when viewed from above the car. Positive toe moves the fronts of the wheels inward together, while negative toe has the fronts of the wheels pointed outward, away from each other. The effects of toe are limited, other than affecting tire wear, though a little positive toe can give the characteristic of understeer, while a little negative toe can give the characteristic of oversteer.

Toe Angle: Negative<===>Positive

___________________________________________________________________
Source: IGN
 
Last edited:
This is so annoying, there are not the kind of info on those pages, there are info on how to tune them, but I want to know how they work so I can tune them myself with knowing what I am doing, not blindly follow tutorials. Please anyone who can answer my questing, please!!!

Hate to burst your bubble, but I kinda doubt someone is going to give you what you are looking for.

In the real world, tuning suspension is one of the most complicated aspects of a car. There are books out there that are over 500 pages long on how to tune suspension. Many people in the automotive industry, or with knowledge of cars, especially those people involved with racing of any form, understand suspension tuning to be an art. Some people are masters of it, simply because they have a feel for it, almost a 6th sense, while others, even with a fundamental understanding of how each component works, couldn't tune a suspension to save their lives.

And yes, tuning in gt5 is no where as complex as it is in real life, but it still follows the same basic principles. The reason suspension is so tricky to tune is that it is not a series of individual adjustments, but rather a series of adjustments that all affect each other.

And since all the components affect each other, trying to type out an explanation of how suspension works gets extremely wordy. It's very difficult to explain in words how each adjustment affects the "feel" of the car.

As others have said, learning how to "feel" your way through a suspension tune tune can take a very long time...years, as some have expressed. Myself, I have been playing the GT series for over 10 years, and am still learning the finer points of suspension tuning (tuning dampers makes my head hurt lol).

Again, as others have said, trial and error are far and above the best way to learn. Also, there are dozens of very well written and informative topics in these forums, you just have to spend some time looking for them. No offense, but the fact that you posted this topic on the general board, and not in the tuning sub-forum indicates to me that you don't quite understand how these forums are organized, and also that you put next to zero effort into solving your own problem.

Also keep in mind that people who have spend countless hours mastering the craft of tuning will be less inclined to help someone who simply asks "can you teach me how to tune," as opposed to someone who indicates that they have put a considerable effort in on their own.

My suggestions to you:

-read all the description of tuning in the game.
-read all you can in the tuning sub-forum.
-pick a car that you know well, pick a track you know well, and just start turning laps. Start by adjusting one setting at a time, and try to get a feel for how each adjustment affects the performance of the car.
-search the tuning forum for a couple of tunes for the car you are using. Put one tune on the car, and do about 10-20 laps on your favorite track. Then put a different tune on the car. Make a mental note about the differences in the two tunes, then go out and do another 10-20 laps with the new tune. See if you can feel a difference in the performance of the car.

Fair warnin though, you won't become a master tuner overnight, or by simply reading some "tuning bible"...like we've said, it can take years.
 
Back