nurburbring online worry

[profi]

If 6 well rendered cars can run on the Nurb in GT4, on the puny PS2 hardware, there would be no problem with 16 even better rendered cars on the processing powerhouse that is the PS3.

I share your worries RedOak.

And its not because of the dataflow in online mode, thats not the problem here. Its simply as RedOak says: the huge amount of data of the track itself PLUS the 16 cars.

So my worries apply to both: online AND offline number of cars.

Arent there already tracks in GT5 where the max. number of cars is limited ?
(Eiger Nordwand / max 8 ? ..correct me if im wrong)

And this is for one reason only: its too much for the PS3
If it were not they could simply put in.. say 30 cars (That was my wish a year ago and is still for GT10 on PS10 )

And the bad thing if our worries are correct is that exactly this Nordschleife would be most fun to drive in a full field.

If i recall right, there was a limit already in TouristTrophy for the Nordschleife: You couldnt do a full field (max. 4 bikes) on that one..

Think about it

 

[Omologato]

Do you mean the unused Sudchlieffe course and the F1 Nurburgring. They might as well include the 24hr full course as well, which is the F1 course plus the Nordschlieffe, mmmm i drool at the prospects.

I would love to see Südschleife(Southern loop in case anyone was curious) included in the final version of GT5! To my knowledge, no video game has included it yet. http://sudschleife.8200rpm.com/ is a good site with lots of information on it.


As for the original topic: I don't think it will be an issue. The 360 gets on just fine with 8 cars, so I don't see 16 being an issue in the end for the PS3. Passing 15 cars on the other hand...

 

[frestkd]

Ummm from my viewpoint there should have no problem for the PS3 being it's twice as fast as the 360, and FM2 works well with 8 players on the Ring, and on XBL. The 360 also has to load the custom paint, and tunes during online play so I have a feeling PD, and Sony should no problems doing the same.

 

[Spec M]

Also may I state that when theres lag in Forza its the individual cars/players that physically lag, they appear on your screen to be teleporting or crashing over and over again. Worst case scenario you may sit in the loading screen for four minutes and then your xb will crash causing you to restart the system. Doesnt happen to often but it happens. I myself believe the ring itself will have nothing to do with it. The smaller tracks (Tskuba ex.) seems to be the most problematic, all eight cars trying to get through one turn slows the frame rates and even appears to skip a few sometimes.

 

[steve30x]

I would love to race the Green Hell online. I would also love to see it in GT5.

 

[Kryz11]

Also may I state that when theres lag in Forza its the individual cars/players that physically lag, they appear on your screen to be teleporting or crashing over and over again. Worst case scenario you may sit in the loading screen for four minutes and then your xb will crash causing you to restart the system. Doesnt happen to often but it happens. I myself believe the ring itself will have nothing to do with it. The smaller tracks (Tskuba ex.) seems to be the most problematic, all eight cars trying to get through one turn slows the frame rates and even appears to skip a few sometimes.

I agree, the smaller the Track the more lag. I play PC race sims, and with 20-30 people there was almost NO lag with Bigger locations, but smaller ones everyone in one bunch was a lag problem.

 

[Studentdriver]

I share your worries RedOak.

And its not because of the dataflow in online mode, thats not the problem here. Its simply as RedOak says: the huge amount of data of the track itself PLUS the 16 cars.

So my worries apply to both: online AND offline number of cars.

Arent there already tracks in GT5 where the max. number of cars is limited ?
(Eiger Nordwand / max 8 ? ..correct me if im wrong)

And this is for one reason only: its too much for the PS3
If it were not they could simply put in.. say 30 cars (That was my wish a year ago and is still for GT10 on PS10 )

And the bad thing if our worries are correct is that exactly this Nordschleife would be most fun to drive in a full field.

If i recall right, there was a limit already in TouristTrophy for the Nordschleife: You couldnt do a full field (max. 4 bikes) on that one..

Think about it

Wow, you've got it completely wrong...there are limits on Eiger because of the style of the track. Short and narrow; in fact I think the max at London should be 12 unless a championship format dictates otherwise.

 

[phil_2001]

the servers are a problem, I hope they are not laggy. It should be more than enough a 5mbit dl/1 mbit up DSL connection and with that speed I didn't always get smooth sailing in Race'07 game when I used to play it.

 

[RedOak]

speaking of servers... any word concerning dedicated servers? hosting races without actually playing and dedicating all cpu cycles to the server?

 

[Gatz83]

If game developers can have 30+ players in a server all shooting at eachother, blowing **** up, driving vehicles, dieing, chatting, gernades etc...

There should be no problems with 16 players in cars on a race track...

 

[Jay]

Well, PD have not always put every track from a previous game into the next. So nothing is guaranteed. But I realy do hope that Nurburgring will be back, cause it is my favorite.

Considering when KY was asked his favorite track, his choice was Nurburgring (no suprise), I think it is pretty safe to assume it will make it.

I remember pre-GT4 days people were wishing for Nurburgring and almost everyone had no hope due to the size of the track, well we all got a awesome suprise.

 

[amar212]

I think that we even haven't seen a 50% of what we'll get with the full GT5 game.

16 people on Nurburging is nothing to be worried about, as lang as there are private lobbies or clean-drivers lists.

 

[Hereward]

Just a puick one on the servers, many people includeing me are praying for private servers......as long as you can invite friends in I'll be happy! like with the COD4 ranked matches. Can you imagine Nurburgring with the inclusion of 6 pre pubesants.......just sit on the start line for a miniute then take your time driveing round the anarchy LOL either that or really get a flying start and take that first corner by the pits extreemly slowly on the inside LOL

 

[Denur]

Considering when KY was asked his favorite track, his choice was Nurburgring (no suprise), I think it is pretty safe to assume it will make it.

I remember pre-GT4 days people were wishing for Nurburgring and almost everyone had no hope due to the size of the track, well we all got a awesome suprise.

Yeah, I guess we can quite safely assume that the Nordsleiffe will make into the final game. By that time I'll certainly have a full HD tv (instead of the HD ready I have now) and will spend first some time on sightseeing.

 

[GT4Ever]

thats not a worry mate,nurnburg will make it 100%...
and i dont think it will be a big problem at all...sure it recuires more memory etc etc,but he..the ps3 is very very capable of doing this and for the maybe online problems wich will occur,sure pd will sort everything out...

If 6 well rendered cars can run on the Nurb in GT4, on the puny PS2 hardware, there would be no problem with 16 even better rendered cars on the processing powerhouse that is the PS3.

I think that we even haven't seen a 50% of what we'll get with the full GT5 game.

16 people on Nurburging is nothing to be worried about, as lang as there are private lobbies or clean-drivers lists.

I notice that most of the GTPlanet members have extremely high expertations about the power of the PS3. Dont get me wrong the PS3 is a powerfull console, but don't forget that GT5 is already showing frame rate problems on certain points. I doubt if the full version of GT5 will be much more than the Prologue version with more cars and a few more tracks and gameoptions.

The PS3 has only 256mb system memory, and a track as big as the Nurburgring with high-res textures and 16 cars on track can be a real big problem even for the PS3. It won't be a problem for the processor, disc-space or the online servers, but the system memory of the PS3 can be a real problem. The best way to load a track (and the way its being done now) is to load the entire track in the system memory. But a track like the Nurburgring with HD textures could easily get bigger than 512 mb.
All we can do is just wait and see, but it won't be surprised if the ring wont be in GT5 at all.

 

[phil_2001]

So what if PS3 has 256 of system memory? actually it has 512 as they said because they can use the whole memory fully. There is a old nurb. track with bigger textures on PC and it has few Mbytes- 30Mb, or so if I'm not mistaken. Even on PS2 with its 32+4Mbyte memory the old nurburgring track loads fully which means the track has less than 32Mb and it looks great graphically, plus there are the cars.
If you'd like to experiment get a race event happen on Nordschleife with 6 cars and then open the console tray and you will see you still can drive around the track.

 

[amar212]

I notice that most of the GTPlanet members have extremely high expertations about the power of the PS3...
The PS3 has only 256mb system memory, and a track as big as the Nurburgring with high-res textures and 16 cars on track can be a real big problem even for the PS3.
But a track like the Nurburgring with HD textures could easily get bigger than 512 mb. All we can do is just wait and see, but it won't be surprised if the ring wont be in GT5 at all.

Since I always skip this type of debates - because none of has has NO GODAMNED IDEA what are we talking about besides quoting some numbers and similar - just two lines:

- Nobody knows how many SPE's of Cell is used by GT5, but there are some hints that game is using just 3 SPE's (4 still left unused),

- PS2 could handle Nurburgring with 6 cars and only 32MB of RAM.

Conclusion: Be serious End expect tracks even longer that Nurb.

 

[BreakerOhio]

I was hoping this track would have made it on GT5 Prologue. Even if it's not enhanced from GT4, it would be a fun track to test drive all the cars available in Prologue around in.

 

[spyrrari]

I was hoping this track would have made it on GT5 Prologue. Even if it's not enhanced from GT4, it would be a fun track to test drive all the cars available in Prologue around in.

exactly..i would allready be happy with nurnberg and one more track...

 

[GT4Ever]

Since I always skip this type of debates - because none of has has NO GODAMNED IDEA what are we talking about besides quoting some numbers and similar - just two lines:

- Nobody knows how many SPE's of Cell is used by GT5, but there are some hints that game is using just 3 SPE's (4 still left unused),

- PS2 could handle Nurburgring with 6 cars and only 32MB of RAM.

Conclusion: Be serious End expect tracks even longer that Nurb.

I hope your right, but it would be plain stupid to just use 3 of the 7 SPE's while your games has frame rate drops.
And yeah the PS2 can do it with just 32mb ram, but some of the textures in GT4 look like crap. That is acceptable for a PS2 game with SD output. But blurry textures on a full-hd tv would be a shame. And the PS2 doesn't have to run a OS on the background.
I've got the feeling that the Nurb should have been in GT5 Prologue, but that it didn't make it due to technical problems. This is just a pure guess, but the commercial with the Nissan GTR in it was taken in at the road besides the ring. And they have tested on the Nurburgring some months before the GT5 Prologue release. So there are indications that they where planning to get the Ring in the game.
But well i hope your right, just wait and see

So what if PS3 has 256 of system memory? actually it has 512 as they said because they can use the whole memory fully.

Offtopic now:
The PS3 has 256mb of system memory and 256mb of Vram from the graphics chip. Both memory modules are separate so they cant use the vram for other tasks than rendering and they cant use the system ram for rendering. The big advantage of this is that the vram can be made much faster than the system memory. The disadvantage is that you cant use any of the other memory when one of both runs out.
This is one of the big differences between the 360 and the PS3. The 360 has 512mb aswell but fully shared between the GPU and the CPU. This way the 360 can use more than 256mb for rendering or for system tasks. And therefore the graphical randering on a 360 is slower than on a PS3 because the shared memory is slower (360 uses system ram (DDR2) speed memory for the graphics). But it can use more memory for rendering than the PS3 when it needs to.

 

[missile]

I guess, the Green Hell is now already included into the GT series by
definition. It is KY favorite track, of course! To separate the Ring out of
GT5 is *really* ridiculous. The Ring defines racing to its bare bone,
leaving it out would imply a deep painfull threat to each racer's heart!

Quite the contrary will be the case, the Ring in GT5 will be the flagship
of all the courses included. And it will rise the bar for every other racing
game rivaling GT.

I guess, the entire GT5 will be build/balanced in such a way that
everything run perfect on the Ring. Whether it is the poly count, the
rendering techniques used, online data transfer, etc., it will all be
balanced to reach the best possible experience on the Ring. For sure!

 

[djfourmoney]

Agreed

I get the feeling that people are looking for problems that don't / won't exist.

That's just IT right there, why worry?

My goodness, PD will make a another tour-de-force game and people will still complain, just ignore them, they feel whatever concern or gripe they have is more important that the other 90% of game players that are perfectly happy with the game.

If GT5 has damage for example, I didn't call for it. Its about keeping the car on the black stuff not how "cool" it looks with the hood all bent, crushed fenders and broken suspension parts.

I don't understand how the 'Ring would be a concern with up to 16 online drivers, then I guess you doubt the power of the PS3, which has barely been scratched...

 

[Gaz Vonhammer]

- Nobody knows how many SPE's of Cell is used by GT5, but there are some hints that game is using just 3 SPE's (4 still left unused),

that's very true, Imagine when they finally use the whole CPU, you could dedicate 1 full spe just on physics. why not two, one for the tracks and weather, the other on cars, and because they can share there own memory ( not the 512 system memory ) the little buggers would be working as one to create the ultimate physics engine, then use another to process the damage data, and PD would have the rest spare for everything else.