Online Racing Unfair?

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No Surrender

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Every time i enter an online race my car is totally outmatched. For example, i enter a max 500pp race, tune my Sirocco up to the limit using the best tune available which i got from this forum and sure enough, i am left for dust in the first few moments of the race. My question is are people cheating the pp limit somehow? My Sirocco tuned to 500pp shouldn't be getting absolutely destroyed by a very similar car in a Focus St. They should at least be close enough in speed and acceleration to make it a fair and fun race. This happens to me every lobby i enter. All i want is a fair race which is why i enter pp limit races but it doesn't seem to help. Am i doing something wrong?
 
No Surrender
Every time i enter an online race my car is totally outmatched. For example, i enter a max 500pp race, tune my Sirocco up to the limit using the best tune available which i got from this forum and sure enough, i am left for dust in the first few moments of the race. My question is are people cheating the pp limit somehow? My Sirocco tuned to 500pp shouldn't be getting absolutely destroyed by a very similar car in a Focus St. They should at least be close enough in speed and acceleration to make it a fair and fun race. This happens to me every lobby i enter. All i want is a fair race which is why i enter pp limit races but it doesn't seem to help. Am i doing something wrong?
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Just because a car is 500pp does not mean it will be competitive. Some cars are at 500pp due to their light weight but they have low power (like the Red Bull Junior). Others have high power but are extremely heavy. People are not cheating the pp limit in online races, they are just using cars that have a well rounded weight, hp, downforce, etc. Just find a good car that others are using in those rooms and tune it well. Good luck!
 
Are they drafting? Setting gears closer to each other for faster acceleration along with LSD settings? Any of these could factor in.

ukfan758
Just because a car is 500pp does not mean it will be competitive. Some cars are at 500pp due to their light weight but they have low power (like the Red Bull Junior). Others have high power but are extremely heavy. People are not cheating the pp limit in online races, they are just using cars that have a well rounded weight, hp, downforce, etc. Just find a good car that others are using in those rooms and tune it well. Good luck!
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Light weight affects PP dramatically the lower you go. For example cutting 100kg from a car that weighs 1500kg will raise PP by maybe 4-5, but dropping 20kg or even 10kg from a car as light as the Rocket will raise PP by 3-4.

The RedBull jr has an insane amount of PP if i recall. 600+ I think.
 
And it depends on the track. If it's a very technical track you need to be using up the PP points on handling upgrades. A faster track maybe more PP toward HP.
 
Hah, I'm wearing the same shoes. I figure it's tuning and setup tricks, which I really don't care for figuring out. It's not like it's every race, but it can be pretty hopeless.

If I'm totally tuned out of the main competition, I just hope that there are a few guys that are near me in competitiveness that I can have a fun race with.

PD needs to make servers searchable by "shuffle race" type for gods sake. I mean, that is the 🤬 right there. Eliminates tuning and tricks from the equation all together, and makes for some very interesting races...
 
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ukfan758
Just because a car is 500pp does not mean it will be competitive. Some cars are at 500pp due to their light weight but they have low power (like the Red Bull Junior). Others have high power but are extremely heavy. People are not cheating the pp limit in online races, they are just using cars that have a well rounded weight, hp, downforce, etc. Just find a good car that others are using in those rooms and tune it well. Good luck!
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Appreciate your quick response and totally understand what your saying. Problem is in this particular race we were all using very similar cars, Focus ST, RS, and my Sirocco with all similar weight and hp and obvioulsy the max 500pp setting so just dont understand how they are so much faster to the point were i cant even compete at all. This was me using the recommended tuning setup from this forum so was expecting to at least be competitive. Think i might just have to stick to one make races and non tuning lobby's to get a fair race.
 
No Surrender
Appreciate your quick response and totally understand what your saying. Problem is in this particular race we were all using very similar cars, Focus ST, RS, and my Sirocco with all similar weight and hp and obvioulsy the max 500pp setting so just dont understand how they are so much faster to the point were i cant even compete at all. This was me using the recommended tuning setup from this forum so was expecting to at least be competitive. Think i might just have to stick to one make races and non tuning lobby's to get a fair race.
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Do you use a DS3 controller?
 
Fredzy
Hah, I'm wearing the same shoes. I figure it's tuning and setup tricks, which I really don't care for figuring out. It's not like it's every race, but it can be pretty hopeless.

If I'm totally tuned out of the main competition, I just hope that there are a few guys that are near me in competitiveness that I can have a fun race with.

PD needs to make servers searchable by "shuffle race" type for gods sake. I mean, that is the s**t right there. Eliminates tuning and tricks from the equation all together, and makes for some very interesting races...
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Totally agree. Ive been trying out online races for the past 2 days using tunes from the forums and i still dont have a hope in hell it seems. Now i dont consider myself the best driver in the world nor the worst i was just hoping for some good races but i just cant seem to get that online. Whats shuffle racing may i ask?
 
Also were there any restrictions on aids? Some people that are already pretty good use SRF to get a huge advantage.

At this time there is no shuffle racing but in GT5 it would randomly assign similar cars to everyone in the lobby to use for the race.
 
grashopper
Also were there any restrictions on aids? Some people that are already pretty good use SRF to get a huge advantage.

At this time there is no shuffle racing but in GT5 it would randomly assign similar cars to everyone in the lobby to use for the race.
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Yeah i always search for races with SRF off. Shuffle racing sounds good hope they bring that back. Just fed up entering races were in the first few moments you realize you have no chance in competing.
 
@No Surrender, you have to focus on your driving. I can make most cars fast online - I just choose not to. That's why I've chosen to run in league racing, instead. If everyone's driving in cars that are matched by a series host to be perfectly even, it really comes down to the driver. If we go to a rally course, (rallying is my specialty) I'm normally one of the fastest drivers in the lobby, if not the fastest, but I don't always win because so much of lobby racing comes down to cars.



There are faster drivers than I, but there are also faster cars than mine. That's a fact of life. Someone will always bring an Integra Type R or NSX... Those two cars are rather fast compared to their PP rating.
 
Don't use the flat bottom for 500pp cars either, that pp difference could be used for more power of less weight.
 
No Surrender
Yes mate. I considered that could be one of the problems but in most races it doesnt seem like it would make much difference what i was using cos the cars in front were just clearly so much quicker.
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I've been having problems with my DS3 (which works perfectly fine with all other PS3 games) acting very odd when my G27 wheel is plugged in. It totally bugs out and goes full throttle, other buttons don't work until I turn it off. I figured it was the controller being messed up until I went back and used it in GT5 with no problems.

Other people are having inexplicable problems with their cars not responding properly that sound like it could be potentially related...

RE: shuffle racing, I didn't even realize it wasn't part of GT6. If they don't bring it back, I'll croak. It is, as it sounds, great. There's nothing like going into a tough race and being dealt the Yellow Bird as your car for the race :boggled::D
 
No offense OP but it looks like you just aren't very fast. Practice is the key. Once you've eliminated car setups as an issue by using the tunes provided by respected garages, it all comes down to your skill level. Practice, practice, practice, ask a lot of questions, watch a lot of replays. Study racing, because the basic principles are the same here.
 
No offense, but most of the time, the weakest link in a car's set up is the squishy bit in the middle. I'm in a weekly online series, and usually log 6-10 hours of playtime a week. It takes a long time to get really good. I always assume that everyone I'm racing against is putting in just as much effort, and that drives me to practice more to improve. If you have the setups down, it's just a matter of improving yourself.
 
Practice. I've Been taking out a lot of Nsx-Es in my golf 1 gti which is 505 pp. on a 500-550 race, it's all doable it just depends who you race with , your overall skill of the track and you knowing the limit of the car.

I remember doing the super license tests . It's quite the same thing, the longer you sit there doing the races the better you get on the track and faster lap times occur. Just pay close attention to how you drive. Also try to do free runs in your garage with your car on the track you want to explore, every single lap will give you an updated ghost which you should save if you want to go and race again later to better your time and experience on the track :D
 
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Good tuning and knowing how to drive is are good start. Just remember there are some really good drivers out there. You aint always going to cross that line first....
 
@No Surrender - Are you tuning your car up to 500pp, or are you tuning it way higher then using the Power Limiter to bring it back down to 500pp? If you are doing the former & everyone else is doing the latter, they're gonna be that much faster than you. That's one of the reasons I'll never race with PP restrictions, because the Power Limiter can't be banned in online lobbies. Another stupid oversight by PD.
 
VBR
@No Surrender - Are you tuning your car up to 500pp, or are you tuning it way higher then using the Power Limiter to bring it back down to 500pp? If you are doing the former & everyone else is doing the latter, they're gonna be that much faster than you. That's one of the reasons I'll never race with PP restrictions, because the Power Limiter can't be banned in online lobbies. Another stupid oversight by PD.
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This is exactly what I was thinking this morning. If everyone else is tuning to the max then limiting power they will have way more low end torque than you and will just walk away. You can get marginally better power to weight ratios by using the power limiter as well. (At least in the cars I played around with. I have only used it in seasonals but have found it can make a difference.)
 
No Surrender
Every time i enter an online race my car is totally outmatched. For example, i enter a max 500pp race, tune my Sirocco up to the limit using the best tune available which i got from this forum and sure enough, i am left for dust in the first few moments of the race. My question is are people cheating the pp limit somehow? My Sirocco tuned to 500pp shouldn't be getting absolutely destroyed by a very similar car in a Focus St. They should at least be close enough in speed and acceleration to make it a fair and fun race. This happens to me every lobby i enter. All i want is a fair race which is why i enter pp limit races but it doesn't seem to help. Am i doing something wrong?
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Just look at the cars that came in first to third and buy those.
 
Lordmarshal
Just look at the cars that came in first to third and buy those.
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Most of the time a stock car can be made quite a bit faster with the right tune.
This would be very effective against the A.I. in Offline career though...
 
Most of the time, it's the transmission ratios if they're walking away on straights/off the line. Good ratios make a big difference. A lot of people use RS tires on <550PP cars online for some reason, so if you're getting dusted in the corners, check your tires.

Some cars, like the Focus, box outside of their weight class. They're faster than most other cars at that PP level. Some cars are just plain slower (like a 500pp truck...)

Maxing out tuning and power limiting back down can give an advantage (but IMO, it kills the spirit and character of a car, it truly makes them all the same, especially once the suspension is tuned to take out any quirks the car may have.)

Other than that, it's skill. Even my friends that can do consistent clean laps struggle to get within 3-5 seconds of my times using the same cars with the same settings, just because of the little bits of speed you learn to keep by taking the right lines and hitting the right brake/acceleration points.
 
Lordmarshal
Just look at the cars that came in first to third and buy those.
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This.

No way you will win a race in a Siroco. Not many if any FF cars can compete in 500pp races. I saw a guy doing ok in an Integra but it must have been hell to drive. His breaking points were all different and he was making the race into the avoid the Integra challenge.
 
raytard
Most of the time, it's the transmission ratios if they're walking away on straights/off the line. Good ratios make a big difference. A lot of people use RS tires on <550PP cars online for some reason, so if you're getting dusted in the corners, check your tires.

Some cars, like the Focus, box outside of their weight class. They're faster than most other cars at that PP level. Some cars are just plain slower (like a 500pp truck...)

Maxing out tuning and power limiting back down can give an advantage (but IMO, it kills the spirit and character of a car, it truly makes them all the same, especially once the suspension is tuned to take out any quirks the car may have.)

Other than that, it's skill. Even my friends that can do consistent clean laps struggle to get within 3-5 seconds of my times using the same cars with the same settings, just because of the little bits of speed you learn to keep by taking the right lines and hitting the right brake/acceleration points.
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It's all about research, certain cars are faster than others at a certain pp but the track also makes a difference. I know in online racing that vw doesn't stand a chance in the rooms I run in. Like I said whatever car wins at whatever pp.... Buy them and See how you do.
 
The PP system allows to achieve a similar rating with very different approaches - a powerful but not-so-nimble car may have less PP than an agile, but underpowered racer.

Tuning matters, too. I remember entering a X2014J lobby @Norschleife and being given thirty seconds per lap by the leader; found his tune on Youtube and in practice I managed at the first attempt to reduce that gap to five or six seconds that I'd blame on my inferior skills or unfamiliarity with the setup.
 
phil_75
What's that got to do with it?

Doesn't stop me winning online!
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See my other post above, I was figuring along the lines of some sort of problem with the controller and game. Certainly in a straight line there are no advantages to using a wheel. PD made sure of that by making the H-pattern shifter useless haha
 
Wow appreciate all the responses guys its really helping me out a lot. Even the ones saying i'm a slow driver :P Trust me, i don't mind admitting when i'm the weaker driver in a certain lobby and i'm simply being outmatched by pure skill but the majority of the races I've entered i honestly don't think the best GT player in the world would stand a chance simply due to the fact of the clear performance difference from the cars!

I think VBR's observation has just confirmed my worst fear - Ive been tuning my cars up to the PP limit instead of maxing them out and using the power limiter. I honestly think this has been the main problem!

Im going to test that theory right now by using the power limiter and see if i notice any difference!
 

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