Opinions from a Formula Car Driver.

Kamuifanboy

Kamuifanboy

4,022
United States
Cincinnati, OH
Hey GTP! How are you all today. Just going to give a little bit of opinions on what I think of the game so far (Will most likely add as I find more things out as well).

A little background on myself so you can get a good understanding of where I am making my comparisons. I have been racing 2 years of Formula Renault in Japan and have done a 2 day test session in a Formula 3 in Europe as well as a single day test session in an Auto GP WS machine in Europe. As far as street car knowledge. I don't really have much, did some testing for Toyota on the TRD version of the GT86 and driving my fathers E46 M3 on karting circuits.

Fun? Oh yes, I am really enjoying playing the game. The updated physics are a nice refresh to the stale ones that were in GT5.

Physics:
The physics are a massive step in the correct direction from GT5 to GT6. The body roll has been significantly improved. As well as the feeling of when the car/tires are transitioning from gripping to losing grip. This being said, I think my main gripe has to be something that was similarly incorrect in GT5. The amount of grip that you get under hard braking and during the corner is just too high. I don't' know if this is on all cars but, I started noticing it whilst driving the GT300 machines around Fuji Speedway. Though I have never driven a GT300 machine, I have driven on a track at the same time as them in a Formula Renault. Things I know about the GT300's were that they were running lap times around the 1 minute 43 mark. My Formula Renault on the other hand was running lap times around the 1 minute 41/42 mark while hitting top speeds of 240Km/h on the front straight. One thing that I noticed that was really annoying about the GT300's during the test was that it was difficult to overtake them because they had a good amount more top speed than my car. This means that they have to be exceeding the 240Km/h speed that my Formula Renault was able to do. When driving on GT6 with Racing Hard tires, I am able to hit lap times around the same 1 minute 43 second bracket. Only there is a big problem, I am only able to get 230Km/h out of the car on the long front straight. This was a bit alarming to me when I noticed the slow speed so, I decided to look where I am gaining the lap time. Turns out, it was in the braking and cornering. I started comparing my braking points and cornering speeds to that of my Formula Renault data/memory. The braking points were nearly identical in all corners, as well as apex speeds were around the same, give or take 5Km/h. Hopefully we will see an update that will significantly lessen the grip levels in GT6 at some time or another.

Sounds:
Sounds are still entirely wrong. I've read many threads on this in the forums so, I won't go into much detail. What I will say, is that the Red Bull X Junior car is a big upgrade to what we have on every other car in the game. And the HSV in car is a really close sound, listen to Onboards in real life and you will notice that the sound is pretty much dead on, the volume just needs to be turned up from 50% to 110%. Getting tired of muffled noises in car.

Feel free to add your opinions. I'll be adding more items in the future as I have more playing time in the game and as I get more experience with street cars in real life as well.

Cheers.

*EDIT*
Downforce Test
Kamuifanboy
After doing extensive tests with a BRZ, here are my conclusions.

Default Aero Settings:
- Top Speed 239Km/h
- Lap Time 1:43.3

50 clicks down in front with 75 clicks down in rear:
-Top Speed 241Km/h
-Lap Time 1:43.2

No loss of grip with significantly lower downforce levels with very little top speed difference.

Back to the drawing board.
Click to expand...
 
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From the videos i saw i also had the impression the cars were a bit "on rails" in general; on the one hand the weight balance is very well simulated from what i've been able to experience in the demo, but then on the other hand it seems like a lot of cars in GT6 shift around corners without much under/ oversteer in general (maybe they were all on racing softs? :)).

Just my visual impression here as i only played the GTA demo this summer, and i don't know if the full game has 100% the same physics...
 
Kamuifanboy
This being said, I think my main gripe has to be something that was similarly incorrect in GT5. The amount of grip that you get under hard braking and during the corner is just too high. I don't' know if this is on all cars but, I started noticing it whilst driving the GT300 machines around Fuji Speedway. Though I have never driven a GT300 machine, I have driven on a track at the same time as them in a Formula Renault. Things I know about the GT300's were that they were running lap times around the 1 minute 43 mark. My Formula Renault on the other hand was running lap times around the 1 minute 41/42 mark while hitting top speeds of 240Km/h on the front straight. One thing that I noticed that was really annoying about the GT300's during the test was that it was difficult to overtake them because they had a good amount more top speed than my car. This means that they have to be exceeding the 240Km/h speed that my Formula Renault was able to do. When driving on GT6 with Racing Hard tires, I am able to hit lap times around the same 1 minute 43 second bracket. Only there is a big problem, I am only able to get 230Km/h out of the car on the long front straight. This was a bit alarming to me when I noticed the slow speed so, I decided to look where I am gaining the lap time. Turns out, it was in the braking and cornering. I started comparing my braking points and cornering speeds to that of my Formula Renault data/memory. The braking points were nearly identical in all corners, as well as apex speeds were around the same, give or take 5Km/h. Hopefully we will see an update that will significantly lessen the grip levels in GT6 at some time or another.
Click to expand...
Try a one-two grade lesser than the default tyres and see how it compares.

For example from racing hard to sport soft or medium.

Traditionally the cars in GT come equiped with gripier tyres by default and some downgrade is necessary to achieve a more accurate grip. Tyre denominations can be misleading in the game (racing vs sport) so pay more attention to the handling/performance than to the tyre names in the game.
 
Zer0
Try a one-two grade lesser than the default tyres and see how it compares.

For example from racing hard to sport soft or medium.

Traditionally the cars in GT come equiped with gripier tyres by default and some downgrade is necessary to achieve a more accurate grip. Tyre denominations can be misleading in the game (racing vs sport) so pay more attention to the handling/performance than to the tyre names in the game.
Click to expand...

So then the problem lies in the tires in the game. I understand what you are saying but, it should not be this way. A GT300 car should not have to run sports medium tires to feel realistic. It is a race car, it should have racing tires to feel realistic. Even if the grip physics are more realistic with the lower grade tires, there is still a massive top speed problem with the GT300's. That will cause lap times to drop FAR slower than realistic times.

Still means that there is a problem with the game really.
 
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Mabey try messing around with the downforce settings until you get to the correct speed on the straight, then use racing hards and see what time you get?


Also, thanks for putting in the time to make the OP:)
 
Kamuifanboy
So then the problem lies in the tires in the game. I understand what you are saying but, it should not be this way. A GT300 car should not have to run sports medium tires to feel realistic. It is a race car, it should have racing tires to feel realistic. Even if the grip physics are more realistic with the lower grade tires, there is still a massive top speed problem with the GT300's. That will cause lap times to drop FAR slower than realistic times.

Still means that there is a problem with the game really.
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I don't know about that speed difference. Can not you modify the final gear ratio to achieve your top speed without altering the car? maybe at the time that PD recorded the car that was how it was tuned.

About the racing tyres in the game is just a name, see if you can match your experience with other tyres, even PD recommended that in the past for more realism. I guess that works that way to appeal to the casual mass, like the default driving aids in all cars or SRF in the license tests.

Ed. Also as is said above the downforce setting is something worth checking. 👍
 
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Zer0
I don't know about that speed difference. Can not you modify the final gear ratio to achieve your top speed without altering the car? maybe at the time that PD recorded the car that was how it was tuned.

About the racing tyres in the game is just a name, see if you can match your experience with other tyres, even PD recommended that in the past for more realism. I guess that works that way to appeal to the casual mass, like the default driving aids in all cars or SRF in the license tests.
Click to expand...

If PD did actually work with Yokohama this shouldn't be the case.
 
Ittybitty Stigy
Mabey try messing around with the downforce settings until you get to the correct speed on the straight, then use racing hards and see what time you get?


Also, thanks for putting in the time to make the OP:)
Click to expand...

I also I think downforce to be the issue here. In GT6 it makes a very large difference to car's handling and speed (on those cars with plenty of it to use, anyhow).
 
After doing extensive tests with a BRZ, here are my conclusions.

Default Aero Settings:
- Top Speed 239Km/h
- Lap Time 1:43.3

50 clicks down in front with 75 clicks down in rear:
-Top Speed 241Km/h
-Lap Time 1:43.2

No loss of grip with significantly lower downforce levels with very little top speed difference.

Back to the drawing board.
 
I've noticed excessive grip as well. Comparing an NSX-R lap done in real life at Tsukuba versus in GT6, the NSX-R in game clearly has too much lateral grip. I managed to do a 1:03 lap, which is about a second faster than its fastest time in real life.
 
Kamuifanboy
After doing extensive tests with a BRZ, here are my conclusions.

Default Aero Settings:
- Top Speed 239Km/h
- Lap Time 1:43.3

50 clicks down in front with 75 clicks down in rear:
-Top Speed 241Km/h
-Lap Time 1:43.2

No loss of grip with significantly lower downforce levels with very little top speed difference.

Back to the drawing board.
Click to expand...

In the current seasonal anniversary event, using the honda hsv-010. Setting aero sliders to lowest settings gives you an extra 10 kph over the start/finish line. As opposed to highest aero settings. Very similar lap times either way.
 
1241Penguin
I've noticed excessive grip as well. Comparing an NSX-R lap done in real life at Tsukuba versus in GT6, the NSX-R in game clearly has too much lateral grip. I managed to do a 1:03 lap, which is about a second faster than its fastest time in real life.
Click to expand...

PD's nasty habit of giving higher grip tire as default on most cars to cater for casual gamers. PD even fitted racing hard default tire on Renault Gordini ( 100HP car ) :eek:

To the OP : In your opinion, stock GT86 would have comfort hard or medium to get close to realistic grip of a real car ( factory tire ) ?
 
Ridox2JZGTE
To the OP : In your opinion, stock GT86 would have comfort hard or medium to get close to realistic grip of a real car ( factory tire ) ?
Click to expand...

As much as I wish I could give an answer to that, it is a bit difficult. The version of GT86 I drove was based off of the TRD version of the car which I believe has wider and stickier tires, as long as a lighter body weight. As well as the reason for driving the car was to test a few new parts from Gazoo Racing for their 86 N24 program. So, it was definitely far from stock, and what we have in GT6.

I have driven a GT86 stock before but, it was on a promotion event and we were driving on public roads. Couldn't really give it a proper thrashing to give it a proper review.
 
Kamuifanboy
As much as I wish I could give an answer to that, it is a bit difficult. The version of GT86 I drove was based off of the TRD version of the car which I believe has wider and stickier tires, as long as a lighter body weight. As well as the reason for driving the car was to test a few new parts from Gazoo Racing for their 86 N24 program. So, it was definitely far from stock, and what we have in GT6.

I have driven a GT86 stock before but, it was on a promotion event and we were driving on public roads. Couldn't really give it a proper thrashing to give it a proper review.
Click to expand...

The Gazoo N24 is there as well ;)
 
Kamuifanboy
As much as I wish I could give an answer to that, it is a bit difficult. The version of GT86 I drove was based off of the TRD version of the car which I believe has wider and stickier tires, as long as a lighter body weight. As well as the reason for driving the car was to test a few new parts from Gazoo Racing for their 86 N24 program. So, it was definitely far from stock, and what we have in GT6.

I have driven a GT86 stock before but, it was on a promotion event and we were driving on public roads. Couldn't really give it a proper thrashing to give it a proper review.
Click to expand...

Thank you for the answer :) Back in GT5, Asian GT Championship used GT86 ( stock ) with comfort hard. The Gazoo N24 would have at least sports medium or soft IMO :) If only PD uses Yokohama brand more extensively, like listing tire model and compound in game to choose from, instead generic types like now. Back in PSX days, I owned a Japanese game titled Advan Racing, it was great simulation racing with proper tire brand from Yokohama, able to change variety of tire model ( YH GP M7, Advan Neova etc ), variety of width and size with tire wear implemented :) even the shift button acts like a clutch when being held.
 
Hate to bring a wish into someone else's thread but there is a big pink elephant in the room staring at me. When will we be able to change the width of wheels and tyres?
 
Many are complaining about lack of grip and spins actually. Honestly I think people try to hard that is the reason.

I think it is perfectly realistic that people are much faster and have more grip on the game than on real life. That is pretty normal. You can learn the tracks and have some idea about reference braking points etc but not like real F1 simulator or something :)
 
You really have to experiment with tire compounds to get cars to handle and feel more realistic. Going down a tire grade or two is often the way to go for something more realistic in low to mid powered cars street cars.
 
gtracedriver1
Many are complaining about lack of grip and spins actually. Honestly I think people try to hard that is the reason.

I think it is perfectly realistic that people are much faster and have more grip on the game than on real life. That is pretty normal. You can learn the tracks and have some idea about reference braking points etc but not like real F1 simulator or something :)
Click to expand...

I don't think the people complaining about grip in spins really understand. The problem comes from over-correcting when trying to use a pad rather than grip of the tyres. The tyres definitely grip too much in every way, I have ABS off and don't even have to pump the brake, then, when trying to brake on turn in to push the rear of my Scirocco out and create a little oversteer the back just doesn't budge.

One thing I'd love to see is different wheel widths and different tyres "Racing Soft" and "Comfort Medium" means absoloutely nothing in the real world, why not have stuff like R888's, Goodyear Eagle F1 Assymetric 2's, Contisport Contact 5P, Michellin Pilot SuperSport etc. Real tyres with different characteristics to change the handling around a bit.
 
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Glad I'm not the only one who finds that there is way too much grip under braking. I kart race in real life, and I have done a few track days, and in no way can I stand on the brakes and turn at the same time like I can in the game. The car should definitely not respond as crisply to steering inputs while under full brake as PD has programmed it. I haven't had the time yet to mess around with different tire compounds but it seems silly to me to have to reduce the tire level to comfort or sport hard just to get a supercar or race car to stop realistically.
 
SciroccoRich
I don't think the people complaining about grip in spins really understand. The problem comes from over-correcting when trying to use a pad rather than grip of the tyres. The tyres definitely grip too much in every way, I have ABS off and don't even have to pump the brake, then, when trying to brake on turn in to push the rear of my Scirocco out and create a little oversteer the back just doesn't budge.

One thing I'd love to see is different wheel widths and different tyres "Racing Soft" and "Comfort Medium" means absoloutely nothing in the real world, why not have stuff like R888's, Goodyear Eagle F1 Assymetric 2's, Contisport Contact 5P, Michellin Pilot SuperSport etc. Real tyres with different characteristics to change the handling around a bit.
Click to expand...

Robot_House
Glad I'm not the only one who finds that there is way too much grip under braking. I kart race in real life, and I have done a few track days, and in no way can I stand on the brakes and turn at the same time like I can in the game. The car should definitely not respond as crisply to steering inputs while under full brake as PD has programmed it. I haven't had the time yet to mess around with different tire compounds but it seems silly to me to have to reduce the tire level to comfort or sport hard just to get a supercar or race car to stop realistically.
Click to expand...


Check this thread :

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/thre...creeching-comforts.295460/page-2#post-9152437
 
Ridox2JZGTE
Check this thread :

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/thre...creeching-comforts.295460/page-2#post-9152437
Click to expand...

What my point is, is that there are no tyres called "Comfort Medium" or "Racing Soft". There may be certain parallels and similiarities between the handling characteristics of say "sports medium" and R888's but they're not R888's and they won't handle like R888's handle. These are the kind of variables that a simulator should try to iron out. Even if they just chose one brand, for instance I know they did a fair amount of work with Yokohama, then named the tyres after their range then that would be better. It's just not quite as rounded as it should be.
 
SciroccoRich
What my point is, is that there are no tyres called "Comfort Medium" or "Racing Soft". There may be certain parallels and similiarities between the handling characteristics of say "sports medium" and R888's but they're not R888's and they won't handle like R888's handle. These are the kind of variables that a simulator should try to iron out. Even if they just chose one brand, for instance I know they did a fair amount of work with Yokohama, then named the tyres after their range then that would be better. It's just not quite as rounded as it should be.
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Yeah, that's what I always wanted since PS2 days, Advan/Yokohama had an official game back in PSX days : Advan Racing, I owned that magnificent game, there are branded tire in the game, able to choose rim size and tread width, this is in PSX, why can't we have it in PS3 ? Since PD is now in cooperation with Yokohama, I hope they will have some kind of branded tire in GT7 -with simulated grip and wear rate like in PSX's Advan Racing.
 
Kamuifanboy
And you would know my financial situation... how?
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I also race, so I know firsthand how expensive this **** can be. Formula Renault, Formula 3, travelling to Europe from Japan? Yeah, you're loaded.

If I'm wrong, tell me your secrets. I'm hurting for sponsor money right now.
 
RSnider
I also race, so I know firsthand how expensive this **** can be. Formula Renault, Formula 3, travelling to Europe from Japan? Yeah, you're loaded.

If I'm wrong, tell me your secrets. I'm hurting for sponsor money right now.
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Welcome to the family. Most of us are struggling for money. My family is only lower middle class at most. I can't tell you secrets for Sponsors as that is up to my manager, whom choose me mind you. Being contracted with Toyota as a Developmental Youth Driver doesn't hurt either.

I can tell you a few things though. To start, assuming that many drivers are in motorsports because they are "loaded" is not a good start to moving upwards. You are already doubting things before you've really made an attempt. I'd be willing to bet you didn't know that more than half of the drivers in series such as GP2 are driving for free to little or no money at all.

The second is, assuming you have mainly knowledge from America, is that America is the most expensive area to race. It's way less bang for the buck. Yes, the European budgets are much larger than that of America but, more often times than not, depending on your potential, you can get most teams to cut those budgets in half after some negotiations. From my time in America, I've learned that budget negotiations are near impossible to negotiate. Asia is another good place to look at racing as it is far cheaper than anywhere else in the world. Japanese Formula Renault runs half of the races as the Formula Renault Euro Cup Series for 1/3 of the budget.

The image of firing a, his family is loaded, claim to everyone on the internet is not going to help your image. People will think you are not a good person, and you won't get any connections period. Connections are still the most important thing in motorsports. You could have all the money in the world, and still not get a ride if you don't know the correct people.
 

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