Problems with drifting!

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Deejay

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So, I picked up GT5 on the release day and played it for some days and got so frustrated over how bad this game really was so I stopped. Note that I played with both a DS3 and a G27!

Before any of you start by saying "Go back to your forza" or anything like that, I'd like to point out that YES I am a player (actually VERY good) and a lover of Forza, BUT i still prefer GT5's realism over Forza's freaking assists. I have tried every "simulator" that exists for commercial use that is pointed towards realism along with iRacing, LFS, Rfactor, GTR-games, STCC... you get it.

Yesterday I "came back" to GT5 after thinking "It has now been a full year and more since release, have PD improved where they needed to?"

I sat down in my custom built rig with my G27 (just to clarify that I'm a serious racer with the positioning and all) and started with adjusting the wheel and all. After i got it down I took a car that I was familiar with, the z33. 350+ horse and full suspension, with the DS3 I was keeping up with the fellow CH drifters and I thought that I'd might try it out with the wheel, after some struggle and looked up a setup for the wheel and took TwinturboCH's tune for a S13. I started on Indy Road Course since it's a flat track and I didn't want elevations to get the best of me before I got the hang of GT5's physics again.

This is the point where I am going to post some critique, keep in mind: I can throw a car around in real life and I've compared this with a unreleased mod on Rfactor and I'd say its pretty damn close. I can throw a AE86 on rfactor (which generally is a car that easily spins if you are not careful) around like crazy and still put the car on all the zones with some precision, I'm not DRIFTGOD, but I wont be the slowest.

The overall grip is very strange, on CH you have no grip at all, you just spin around like crazy only by looking at the accelerator, but mid-corner in a drift I can grip up with almost 400 horses on the back wheel and a car that weighs less than 1100kg. My example is Tsukuba's last corner, I throw the car sideways and randomly mid-drift the car grips up and I have to steer into the corner (I don't get tank slappers, I know VERY well how to work the wheel and my throttle) and this happens with every car, no upgrades, full upgrades, no tune, forum tune, it's all the same. As I've stated, I am familiar with slip angles, overall grip and how to notice what the car is doing mid-drift and I just think GT5 is so messed up for the drifting community that it isn't even enjoyable, don't get me wrong I LOVE to drift something that's really difficult, but this is just stupid. And for you who thinks I am "just used to rfactor" you are terribly wrong, I play alot of different games everyday, each one with different physics engine, I just have experience with how most developers code tyres and I can slide a car in any game you like, EXCEPT this game.

Another point is the throttle sensitivity, is there a way to change it? Only by putting my toe on the gas the indicator moves like 30% of the bar and after 60% of it, the resolution is MUCH higher. This is probably the reason why I think drifting on this game feels like you have about 25 degrees of steering lock, I'm on full lock half the time, with about 45 degrees of correction on the wheel and that is in EVERY drift, not just in high angle ones. This MIGHT be because of my habit of having some throttle and GT5 registers a higher value of what I'm used to compared to rfactor and it is a matter of me adjusting to it, but it doesn't change the grip critique I have, it actually amplifies it, why do my car grip up when I'm on more throttle than I even wanted to?

I would like to discuss this with someone who is familiar with other racing games and could tell me what I need to do in order to enjoy this, just send me a PM with your PSN-ID or skype if you wanna talk or feel free to post here. Please refrain from using foul language here, I'm not a flamer and I don't want to be treated like one. I am asking GTP for assistance. Please tell me if any of you recognize anything that I've written and you got over it.

I'd gladly show the drifting mod for Rfactor to anyone interested and I'll show you the best drifting you could get today, I'm always looking for people since the mod isn't out yet and I wanna tandem with some good people!

Let's see if we can get some answers!
 
OK so if I read it right your having trouble extending drift through long corners & there is to much wheel work compared to what your used to?

to extend drifts first try not changing up so quickly and let the gears ring out a little more.

If its no help try:

LSD: 37, 34, 34 (top to bottom)
Set your top speed to a low speed (via transmission)

this'll get those wheels spinning easier and keep them spinning longer.

also try with rear camber on 0.

With the wheel turning problem just try cranking the sensitivity up to+7, that way you shouldn't need to lock the wheel for every drift.
 
Ditch that LSD setup. If you are going to give people advice, please don't put them on the wrong track Klevrah.

If you want a good differential setup, look at TTCH's diferential setup thread. I always use 5 60 60 (top down) or 60 60 60. Which match real life differentials as well.
 
I ran 60/60/60 on the s13, I will try the fully locked one too 5/60/60, but it wont help as much, I also found out that my G27 loses calibration after like a minute of drifting and I am going to return it for a new one, it's only 2 months old and I have been using it for only ONE month barely. Keep the advice coming, more about technique, as I said: I took a setup from the depot :O
 
I got a DFGT a couple of weeks ago but can now drift with very few problems at all! I had the exact same trouble on Tsukuba, how the car would regain grip, often sending me far into the sand. I have been using TT's S13 tune and it's nice, but suspension tunes make very little difference unless you do something stupid with the toe and camber. My tuning tip is to choose your car, Remove the stock Toe, and tune the diff at something like 20,60,30.

The trick with GT5 900 degree drifting, is for long corners, not to start with high angle unless you know exactly what you're doing. You have to keep a consistent drift, to stop the front wheels regaining grip. Throw the car right, pump the throttle and be damns quick on the counter steer. Slowly rotate the wheel further as the back steps out, then when you decide, turn the wheel that extra little bit further to stop the angle increasing. You should now, with small wheel adjustments and smart throttle control be able to make the rest of that turn.

And remember, don't slow out of this turn to regain grip, power out and catch it slowly.
 
GODfreyGT5
The trick with GT5 900 degree drifting, is for long corners, not to start with high angle unless you know exactly what you're doing. You have to keep a consistent drift, to stop the front wheels regaining grip.
Click to expand...

irl you want the front to have grip, front end grip in GT5 is really weird tho and you seem to lose front end grip a lot when there is no reason for it

pretty much if i drift like i do in real life and Live For Speed in GT5 i have a lot of issues, there are some pretty big flaws in the physics (like the cars snapping back and understeering when they shouldn't) that stop you from driving the same way you would irl

once you learn where the flaws in the physics are going to come out and bit you in the ass you learn to avoid it pretty good
 
driftnick13
irl you want the front to have grip, front end grip in GT5 is really weird tho and you seem to lose front end grip a lot when there is no reason for it

pretty much if i drift like i do in real life and Live For Speed in GT5 i have a lot of issues, there are some pretty big flaws in the physics (like the cars snapping back and understeering when they shouldn't) that stop you from driving the same way you would irl

once you learn where the flaws in the physics are going to come out and bit you in the ass you learn to avoid it pretty good
Click to expand...

This is the kind of response I was looking for, I will not be coming back to this game until they changed this, which probably means that I will not ever come back. I was waiting for a response that confirmed that I was right and not just naïve.

Thank you.
 
Gonales
Ditch that LSD setup. If you are going to give people advice, please don't put them on the wrong track Klevrah.

If you want a good differential setup, look at TTCH's diferential setup thread. I always use 5 60 60 (top down) or 60 60 60. Which match real life differentials as well.
Click to expand...

well I saw he was having allot of difficulty already, I don't know about you but I help people drift all the time. my setting is more calm but yet still has enough to stretch long corners, Ideal for what he wanted right?
 
Deejay
This is the kind of response I was looking for, I will not be coming back to this game until they changed this, which probably means that I will not ever come back. I was waiting for a response that confirmed that I was right and not just naïve.

Thank you.
Click to expand...

To make you feel even better I'm gonna confirm what Nick just said.
When it comes to drift GT5 physics are straight ******** and for that reason any person that play LFS or any of the other pc sims with good drift mods (Rfactor) and/or drift IRL should stay away from GT5.
Sure when you know how to work around the flaws of the game you can be a good drifter, but tbh those flaws are what brought me away of GT5, especially the front grip issue.
 
I would play LFS and Rfactor, infact I have both full games. But my PC will only run LFS at around 20-25fps and imagine how much worse Rfactor is. All I can do is use my PS3.
 
Warren4649
To make you feel even better I'm gonna confirm what Nick just said.
When it comes to drift GT5 physics are straight ******** and for that reason any person that play LFS or any of the other pc sims with good drift mods (Rfactor) and/or drift IRL should stay away from GT5.
Sure when you know how to work around the flaws of the game you can be a good drifter, but tbh those flaws are what brought me away of GT5, especially the front grip issue.
Click to expand...

Yep have to agree with this, drifting is so much more pure on PC sims. I do it with a few mods on Rfactor and it feels a lot better compared to GT5.
 
Deejay
So, I picked up GT5 on the release day and played it for some days and got so frustrated over how bad this game really was so I stopped. Note that I played with both a DS3 and a G27!

Before any of you start by saying "Go back to your forza" or anything like that, I'd like to point out that YES I am a player (actually VERY good) and a lover of Forza, BUT i still prefer GT5's realism over Forza's freaking assists. I have tried every "simulator" that exists for commercial use that is pointed towards realism along with iRacing, LFS, Rfactor, GTR-games, STCC... you get it.

Yesterday I "came back" to GT5 after thinking "It has now been a full year and more since release, have PD improved where they needed to?"

I sat down in my custom built rig with my G27 (just to clarify that I'm a serious racer with the positioning and all) and started with adjusting the wheel and all. After i got it down I took a car that I was familiar with, the z33. 350+ horse and full suspension, with the DS3 I was keeping up with the fellow CH drifters and I thought that I'd might try it out with the wheel, after some struggle and looked up a setup for the wheel and took TwinturboCH's tune for a S13. I started on Indy Road Course since it's a flat track and I didn't want elevations to get the best of me before I got the hang of GT5's physics again.

This is the point where I am going to post some critique, keep in mind: I can throw a car around in real life and I've compared this with a unreleased mod on Rfactor and I'd say its pretty damn close. I can throw a AE86 on rfactor (which generally is a car that easily spins if you are not careful) around like crazy and still put the car on all the zones with some precision, I'm not DRIFTGOD, but I wont be the slowest.

The overall grip is very strange, on CH you have no grip at all, you just spin around like crazy only by looking at the accelerator, but mid-corner in a drift I can grip up with almost 400 horses on the back wheel and a car that weighs less than 1100kg. My example is Tsukuba's last corner, I throw the car sideways and randomly mid-drift the car grips up and I have to steer into the corner (I don't get tank slappers, I know VERY well how to work the wheel and my throttle) and this happens with every car, no upgrades, full upgrades, no tune, forum tune, it's all the same. As I've stated, I am familiar with slip angles, overall grip and how to notice what the car is doing mid-drift and I just think GT5 is so messed up for the drifting community that it isn't even enjoyable, don't get me wrong I LOVE to drift something that's really difficult, but this is just stupid. And for you who thinks I am "just used to rfactor" you are terribly wrong, I play alot of different games everyday, each one with different physics engine, I just have experience with how most developers code tyres and I can slide a car in any game you like, EXCEPT this game.

Another point is the throttle sensitivity, is there a way to change it? Only by putting my toe on the gas the indicator moves like 30% of the bar and after 60% of it, the resolution is MUCH higher. This is probably the reason why I think drifting on this game feels like you have about 25 degrees of steering lock, I'm on full lock half the time, with about 45 degrees of correction on the wheel and that is in EVERY drift, not just in high angle ones. This MIGHT be because of my habit of having some throttle and GT5 registers a higher value of what I'm used to compared to rfactor and it is a matter of me adjusting to it, but it doesn't change the grip critique I have, it actually amplifies it, why do my car grip up when I'm on more throttle than I even wanted to?

I would like to discuss this with someone who is familiar with other racing games and could tell me what I need to do in order to enjoy this, just send me a PM with your PSN-ID or skype if you wanna talk or feel free to post here. Please refrain from using foul language here, I'm not a flamer and I don't want to be treated like one. I am asking GTP for assistance. Please tell me if any of you recognize anything that I've written and you got over it.

I'd gladly show the drifting mod for Rfactor to anyone interested and I'll show you the best drifting you could get today, I'm always looking for people since the mod isn't out yet and I wanna tandem with some good people!

Let's see if we can get some answers!
Click to expand...

With what I changed above in red it's hard to believe what I highlighted in RED below

Deejay
I ran 60/60/60 on the s13, I will try the fully locked one too 5/60/60, but it wont help as much, I also found out that my G27 loses calibration after like a minute of drifting and I am going to return it for a new one, it's only 2 months old and I have been using it for only ONE month barely. Keep the advice coming, more about technique, as I said: I took a setup from the depot :O
Click to expand...

Deejay
This is the kind of response I was looking for, I will not be coming back to this game until they changed this, which probably means that I will not ever come back. I was waiting for a response that confirmed that I was right and not just naïve.

Thank you.
Click to expand...

This tells me you were looking for a person to tell you it's wrong

Deejay
Thanks guys!

Just let me know if you want to play some Rfactor, the mod is REALLY good, I'm always up!
Click to expand...

So you can persuade some people to play Rfactor with this mod you are talking about....


Sorry if it seems as though I'm on a witch hunt but it looks as if you never wanted to figure out some good settings for gt5 but instead wanted to talk about how bad it is and how good this rfactor mod is..........while at the same time saying that your month,2 month, 1 year old wheel has problems and needs to be replaced:idea:

this is a post from the op from jan 31st 2011

Deejay New Member
I didn't read the whole thread, just your post so I might be a little bit off here, but I think I can contribute something of value here.

NOTE: I'm swedish so mind my grammar.


Everyone who started driving games when GT5 released had the dream of becoming Dorikin aka Drift king, and I can see why: The smoke is awesome and it's not standard racing etc. Personally I like drifting and have not been much for the racing scene until I really got the hang of drifting full laps on Forza and GT5. You have no idea how much racing experience it takes do make a full corner drift, all of you who have the experience will agree, you who have not will call me a dumbass and frankly I don't give a damn 'bout your 12 year old asses.


My point here is; there is not a single man in the world who succeeded drifting without racing, because if you look closely on every competitor, they all have a record of grip racing before they started drifting.

TOO LONG DIDN'T READ: You gotta learn how to handle a car with traction in order to handle it without. Put on comforts on a stock typical JDM car and break the 1 minute mark on Tsukuba, after a month or so practicing you should have gained ALOT of experience in drifting without even doing it.

Give me a reply which will make no sense at all so I can laugh at ignorant people who does not know what they are talking about. Happy drifting and I love y'all.



and then another from him yesterday

I'd say I like both situations, chasing is most exciting of course because you can see the car in front and try to high-five
But leading makes you sharpen your skills in order to pull away, this is of course only if the following car is good enough to give you a good chase! I love the feeling of seeing a car close in my mirrors, I know they can keep up with my speed and it's gonna be a good battle!







After all of this is it hard to take anything he is saying seriously.
 
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Ok, so the OP is used to RF and LFS, but in other hand he can suit himself on more arcadish games like Forza. So blame and punish a game just because it have a diferent physics set, compared of what you already tried is a waste of time, cose every freaking game will have a diferent set of physics. Take it or leave it.

I didn´t understood completly if his touble is only related to G27 or even using a DS3. Lets say that he intent to use his G27 for drift in GT5. The good new is that after 2.0 a lot of improvements came up for this wheel. The bad side is that without the right wheel config and a decent car setup, he will rage a lot.

From what i readed, sounds more a springs x dampers issue than gearbox / LSD issue, but its just a guess. Also, sounds like the OP is not very patient with his games. When or if you have only one racing game to master, less is more. If drifting on GT5 was a completly fail like you are pointing, there wouldnt be so many people grinding their cars everyday.

Like i said many times, the coolest game that i drifted in my life is not RF or LFS, no. Its was (R.I.P) Project Torque, and nobody is forced to agree or even know this game.
 
mikeonthebike
With what I changed above in red it's hard to believe what I highlighted in RED below





This tells me you were looking for a person to tell you it's wrong



So you can persuade some people to play Rfactor with this mod you are talking about....


Sorry if it seems as though I'm on a witch hunt but it looks as if you never wanted to figure out some good settings for gt5 but instead wanted to talk about how bad it is and how good this rfactor mod is..........while at the same time saying that your month,2 month, 1 year old wheel has problems and needs to be replaced:idea:

this is a post from the op from jan 31st 2011

Deejay New Member
I didn't read the whole thread, just your post so I might be a little bit off here, but I think I can contribute something of value here.

NOTE: I'm swedish so mind my grammar.


Everyone who started driving games when GT5 released had the dream of becoming Dorikin aka Drift king, and I can see why: The smoke is awesome and it's not standard racing etc. Personally I like drifting and have not been much for the racing scene until I really got the hang of drifting full laps on Forza and GT5. You have no idea how much racing experience it takes do make a full corner drift, all of you who have the experience will agree, you who have not will call me a dumbass and frankly I don't give a damn 'bout your 12 year old asses.


My point here is; there is not a single man in the world who succeeded drifting without racing, because if you look closely on every competitor, they all have a record of grip racing before they started drifting.

TOO LONG DIDN'T READ: You gotta learn how to handle a car with traction in order to handle it without. Put on comforts on a stock typical JDM car and break the 1 minute mark on Tsukuba, after a month or so practicing you should have gained ALOT of experience in drifting without even doing it.

Give me a reply which will make no sense at all so I can laugh at ignorant people who does not know what they are talking about. Happy drifting and I love y'all.



and then another from him yesterday

I'd say I like both situations, chasing is most exciting of course because you can see the car in front and try to high-five
But leading makes you sharpen your skills in order to pull away, this is of course only if the following car is good enough to give you a good chase! I love the feeling of seeing a car close in my mirrors, I know they can keep up with my speed and it's gonna be a good battle!







After all of this is it hard to take anything he is saying seriously.
Click to expand...

haha, this is always the interesting part about the internet, no matter how you try and explain that you are not hating on the game, but instead criticise it, someone is always going to hate you for it.

@mikeonthebike

For the part with the G27, on the release day I played with my friends wheel, I got my own wheel two months back. I suggest you stop accusing me of lying based on assumptions.

Deejay View Post
This is the kind of response I was looking for, I will not be coming back to this game until they changed this, which probably means that I will not ever come back. I was waiting for a response that confirmed that I was right and not just naïve.

Thank you.


This tells me you were looking for a person to tell you it's wrong

No, this tells you that I wanted to hear from someone who actually has some experience with other racing games and can give an opinion that doesn't say me "GT5 is the most realistic racing game ever"


@Lazy Liquid


I am not punishing the game because of the "different" physics set, I am criticising it because pretty much all of the big companies that are involved with racing games pointing towards realism have the same basic idea about slip angles and tire grip. GT5 is just REALLY different, I don't care if a game is not compareable with real life, but GT5 makes drifting so difficult because of the slip angles that it only becomes stupid. I have tried various setups from the forum, for better and for worse, and nothing changes the weird slip angles.


@ everyone who reads

I thought this was a bad idea and I was right. I managed to get some solid answers, but in the end, most of you are just so narrowminded that you will be stuck with this game and you will never change. I do not despise you, but i feel sorry for you, you are missing alot of fun and alot of real world references (for you who are serious), I don't want to come here and tell you that Rfactor is the best drifting game in the world, but just try Project D 2.0 for 10 minutes and tell me which one is better AND more realistic.
 
i have found the drifting physics in this game very weird compared to other games as well as real life, especially when handbraking or regular braking during a drift giving a completely unrealistic reaction. also when drifting on a sloped surface the car acts very wrong compared to real life

another factor to be considered is the apparent lack of caster effects on the steering which has a major effect on how a car will steer mid drift
 
I was being sarcastic on my last 2 posts...

I can understand the OP´s frustration. Also, if i try to convince my old Project Torque friends (that moved to LFS, RF and now ACR Beta) to buy a PS3 and a GT5, probably most of them will refuse or laugh of myself.

The most annoying racing game with the drift feature that i ever played was NFS Shift 1, and even hating i could drift and win the challenges... even on Ebisu. Its normal to bring your old habits from older games to newer games, but a good e-drifter knows how to adapt himself and improve. I can even drift using a gamepad on R-Factor with Oversters Mod (witch everyone says be a lot harder than Project-D).

So if you like GT5, the strong online community, the large number of cars... keep trying. If it doesn´t counts, you still have another options (good and bad ones).
 
lazy liquid you sound like a massive douche. im not saying drifting in this game is hard, its actually quite easy once you are used to it, im just saying in some cases it doesnt feel right or act correctly.

"a good e-drifter knows how to adapt" haha get over yourself nerd
 
jay s13
lazy liquid you sound like a massive douche. im not saying drifting in this game is hard, its actually quite easy once you are used to it, im just saying in some cases it doesnt feel right or act correctly.

"a good e-drifter knows how to adapt" haha get over yourself nerd
Click to expand...

I am a massive douche, get used to.
By the way i noticed, just looking to this forum, a lot of people came back from the cript after the 2.02. Some people are just happy using more their standard cars, and some other are facing again their own old ghosts and crying a river.

Oh, before i forget... jay s13 (2 posts):
Before you get into a forum bashing someone, learn the basics of writing first. Thank you.
 
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Lazy Liquid
I am a massive douche, nice to meet you.
By the way i noticed, just looking to this forum, a lot of people came back from the cript after the 2.02. Some people are just happy using more their standard cars, and some other are facing again their own old ghosts and crying a river.
Click to expand...

Hahaha
 
i know how to write quite well mate but this is a forum not an essay, plus i felt i needed to dumb it down a touch as you are obviously not able to comprehend the fact you are a tard
 

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