Racing Brake kit = no difference!

  • Thread starter Thread starter NurburgRay
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NurburgRay

NurburgRay

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NurburgRay
I had the idea since the first time i had installed the race brakes that my cars didnt brake any better than with the standard brakes...
Now i tested it on the RouteX with a couple cars ( alfa brera, E46 M3, Nissan GTR 09, and a Toyota gt86)
All cars where standard, nothing tuned what so ever, only the racing brake kit installed..

I run the cars up to 200km/h or 120mph and hit the brakes as hard as possible at the 1000meter marker after the tunnel.
With or without the racing brake kit installed.. they all stopped at the excact same spot.

So unless i'm doing something very wrong, the racing brake kits are just a waste of money.
 
I believe you can edit the brakes on the racing kit than normal.

Like have more front brake then rear or vice versa.
 
JadeRaven
Yeah I guess it's just for the adjustability.

Also real world big brake kits don't typically make a car stop any faster, they just prevent brake fade.
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The brake kits on my track car are definatly make the car stop faster than their Original brakes...
brake fading can only be prevented if you installed steel brake *dont know the correct english word..* hoses?
You get fading becouse your brake fluid is boiling, so the standard brake "hoses" are expanding =air =fading..
No matter what brakes you install, if you dont replace the brake "hoses" they will Always fade
 
GT6 still seems not to simulate brake temperature.

And if brakes don't get hot and don't fade what advantage should racing brakes have ?
 
stb155
GT6 still seems not to simulate brake temperature.

And if brakes don't get hot and don't fade what advantage should racing brakes have ?
Click to expand...

Shorter brake distance... for example.. bigger brake discs = more friction = quicker stop = later braking :)
 
NurburgRay
Can someone post an example of how thy look like compared to the Original brakes? i dont see any difference :(
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:lol: I thought it was just me not seeing the difference. 👍
Really must pay more attention whilst out on the next drive, try and see how noticeable they are. :)
 
A lot of people in the drifting community are ditching the big brake kit in favor of standard brakes. We find that braking on corner entry (while sideways, on CH tires) is much more smooth and predictable using standard brakes compared to the big brakes. The big brake kit also tends to make the car behave oddly when using left foot braking mid corner.

Perhaps it's because we're simply more used to the standard brakes from GT5, but until someone can show me a distinct advantage that the big brakes provide, I will continue to use standard brakes on all my drift cars.
 
PsuPepperoni
Most modern cars could lock up their wheels with the stock brakes if they didn't have ABS. I'm not sure how you can have more friction than that.
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in wet conditions that is true.. in good conditions not every car can lock its brakes up ;)
 
NurburgRay
Now i tested it on the RouteX with a couple cars ( alfa brera, E46 M3, Nissan GTR 09, and a Toyota gt86)
Click to expand...

Hm, those cars probably have pretty good brakes to begin with. Try something a bit older and see if there's any difference. Like the VW Beetle. On racing softs.
 
NurburgRay
Shorter brake distance... for example.. bigger brake discs = more friction = quicker stop = later braking :)
Click to expand...

I think that's incorrect. As JadeRaven said, more powerful brakes shouldn't matter if it ends up locking the tires anyway. As the OP mentioned, installing the race brakes doesn't reduce stopping distance, so brake friction isn't a variable in GT6 either.

The ONLY two factors that affect stopping distance here are tire grip and downforce (the latter of which increases tire grip).

There's an interesting GT5 thread that discusses the importance of tire grip in regards to braking and other performance factors which can be found here:

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/braking-differences-in-gt5-are-non-existent.155936/
 
NurburgRay
The brake kits on my track car are definatly make the car stop faster than their Original brakes...
brake fading can only be prevented if you installed steel brake *dont know the correct english word..* hoses?
You get fading becouse your brake fluid is boiling, so the standard brake "hoses" are expanding =air =fading..
No matter what brakes you install, if you dont replace the brake "hoses" they will Always fade
Click to expand...
Wrong. Carbon ceramic brakes get rid of brake fade
 
NurburgRay
The brake kits on my track car are definatly make the car stop faster than their Original brakes...
brake fading can only be prevented if you installed steel brake *dont know the correct english word..* hoses?
You get fading becouse your brake fluid is boiling, so the standard brake "hoses" are expanding =air =fading..
No matter what brakes you install, if you dont replace the brake "hoses" they will Always fade
Click to expand...

Brake fade does not come from brake lines. It occours when the metals in the brake componets expand and create more space between the drums/discs and pads. Steel brake lines mainly help with a more firm feel in the brake pedal, it is a false sense of better braking.

Also, in this game the racing brakes do install bigger rotors on the cars, so at least there's the cosmetic upgrade.
 
NurburgRay
Shorter brake distance... for example.. bigger brake discs = more friction = quicker stop = later braking :)
Click to expand...

No. Bigger brake discs doesn't equal more friction. Bigger/softer brake pads yes, but not bigger discs, if the area covered by pad is the same. In this way the only improvement would be less fade, cause they would heat up slower.
 
On one of the cars I didn't like the brakes so I got the racing brakes and the car stopped much better. I don't remember which car.
 
Every car I bought stop better with racing brakes. But there is a bug that make them way to effective. 300 kph in a 1000 kg car and you hard lock the brakes with more then 60 % brake applied whereas it´s impossible to lock with standard brakes at the same speed. So yes racing brakes are more effective but on some cars it totally destroys them if you don´t cheat and use ABS or totally readapt your braking.

To some extent you can adjust this in the setup but there is cars I am not happy at 0-0 on racing brakes but can´t use standards because they simply can´t stop the car as fast.
 
Some misinformation about brake fade in here. the feel of brake fade comes from a couple of places.

Yes, rubber lines expand and braided lines can help give a firmer feel all around. That's not fade though.

Overheating fluid can cause brake fade in a way. When the fluid boils, it takes more pedal travel to get the same braking performance because you compress the air in the lines easier than fluid. Fluid boils due to heat.

True brake fade is due to overheating of the friction material itself, not the fluid. Different materials have different heat tolerances. Street pads can easily glaze over and lose friction with extended track use, causing fade. Race pads and race parts like carbon ceramic rotors deal with heat a lot better, so that's what you see on Le Mans cars and such.

Heat is where large calipers/pads/rotors come in. With more surface available for braking, and the more area available for cooling, the better the brakes dissipate heat. Calipers get bigger to hold bigger pads that spread heat out. Larger rotors also spread out heat and give more surface for heat dissipation.

A BBK can increase braking performance, but only as far as your tires will let it. Running all-season touring tires (comforts in GT) with a BBK is useless as you will overcome the friction of the tires before the full braking performance is reached. However, with sticky tires it starts to make a difference, especially over time. Heat sill builds up in the brakes and fade happens, no matter the tires or full braking performance available. So, while a car may be able to lock up tires at the track on lap 3, on lap 20 it may be a different story as the braking capacity changes due to heat.

How this plays in the GT6 ... I don't know. But that's what a real BBK does.
 
Brakes are part of the big picture, these include tires, hoses, disk size, car weight, rim size, disc material etc. They all affect different aspects of braking which includes stopping distances and brake fade. You can't just say, hoses will do the trick, or stickier tires will do it etc.

My IRL autoX/Track car has metal braided hoses, better pads, better rotors, lighter rims etc. And yes, my stock brakes fade in an autoX session.

I do remember my brakes fading when i was driving the old school Pontiac Firebird with stock brakes in a race in GT6.
 
TouringBubble
Some misinformation about brake fade in here. the feel of brake fade comes from a couple of places.

Yes, rubber lines expand and braided lines can help give a firmer feel all around. That's not fade though.

Overheating fluid can cause brake fade in a way. When the fluid boils, it takes more pedal travel to get the same braking performance because you compress the air in the lines easier than fluid. Fluid boils due to heat.

True brake fade is due to overheating of the friction material itself, not the fluid. Different materials have different heat tolerances. Street pads can easily glaze over and lose friction with extended track use, causing fade. Race pads and race parts like carbon ceramic rotors deal with heat a lot better, so that's what you see on Le Mans cars and such.

Heat is where large calipers/pads/rotors come in. With more surface available for braking, and the more area available for cooling, the better the brakes dissipate heat. Calipers get bigger to hold bigger pads that spread heat out. Larger rotors also spread out heat and give more surface for heat dissipation.

A BBK can increase braking performance, but only as far as your tires will let it. Running all-season touring tires (comforts in GT) with a BBK is useless as you will overcome the friction of the tires before the full braking performance is reached. However, with sticky tires it starts to make a difference, especially over time. Heat sill builds up in the brakes and fade happens, no matter the tires or full braking performance available. So, while a car may be able to lock up tires at the track on lap 3, on lap 20 it may be a different story as the braking capacity changes due to heat.

How this plays in the GT6 ... I don't know. But that's what a real BBK does.
Click to expand...

Yes all true...
So what's the point of the racing brakes in GT6 then? that was actualy my point/question for starting this thread :p
 
There is a noticeable difference when using the Club Sport pedals, I have to press the pedal harder to get full braking with standard brakes vs race brakes. Either will lock the wheels so the stopping distance will not change as that is determined by tires, weight, speed and road conditions. It doesn't take much brake to lock a SH or lower tire. RS on the other hand require quite a bit and stop quite a bit quicker
 

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