Raikkonen return to F1?

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UN_OC
Your trying to argue that raikkonen isn't interested and that his talk with an investment firm are for a drive with a team that doesn't exist or even have a car for him to drive.
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No, I'm trying to argue that a handful of comments to the media does not prove Raikkonen will join Renault, which is what you seem to believe. You've seen Raikkonen approach Renault at Spa and taken it as confirmation that he will race for them. Typical Kimi fan, making something out of nothing.
 
Where to start.....

I just said in teh post before you

I am asuming that...
Raikkonen is interested - he made contact, people not interested don't make contact
Renault are interested - they want to speak to him, they have said no to 'other drivers' interested but want to meet Raikkonen
They are to meet soon - mentioned everywhere


No where have I said that Raikkonen will definately drive for renault. I said tehy are still holding tlaks and I believe that he should and probably will drive for renault f1 next year. But the talks are still to be held.

Where have I said that raikkonen will drive for renault next year? please read through and find any quote... just one. I have said he should, not that he will.



You, on the other hand aren't even clear what your arguing...
here you have simply saying that it's open to speculation, and there is no proof
No, I'm trying to argue that a handful of comments to the media does not prove Raikkonen will join Renault, which is what you seem to believe. You've seen Raikkonen approach Renault at Spa and taken it as confirmation that he will race for them. Typical Kimi fan, making something out of nothing.
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But here your saying that he isn't interested
And Raikkonen has also said on several occasions that he is not interested.
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And here your making **** up.. not even speculation.. just general not going to happen. Out of all kimi senarios this is definately not going to happen
Renault F1 was sold to Genii. Genii may be looking to enter WRC in the future under the Renault name. If so, Raikkonen would have to go to Renault F1 because Genii has no representation in Renault or Renault Sport.
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And here you missing the fact that kimi/hismanager has said the omst important bit.. 'we have contacted renault'
No, Raikkonen allegedly said to Boullier that "You have a fast car" and the press took it from there.
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And here your arguing the raikkonen is a team destroyer (irony that he was replaced by alonso..... whos never hurt a team.. except for mclaren... and renault...... and ferrari.....)
If Raikkonen joins Renault, I believe the team will suffer. I doubt he'll take well to the fuel rules and the new Pirellis, and the team environment - built around Kubica - is not one that he will take to well.
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And then that link posted alone as an argument seems to argue that raikkonen doesn't want it and wont have it despite the fact that the talks haven't taken place and raikkonen wants enough to atlast go this far.



Anyway, find some places, or atleast one where I have said that Raikkonen will definately be at renault next year - not just I think he should be
 
Well, technically speaking, he always has been. Renault don't want to go the lengths of hiring someone else, as Petrov brings cash and is somewhat important to them for the Russian market. However, like Boullier says, they are looking for results and championship-contending performance (not WDC but WCC, i.e. being a regular points scorer). Those words sound more ominous to me, more along the lines of "well, we might hire him next year, but he still needs to do better...". The pressure is still very real for Petrov, I fear his chances of retaining that seat are diminishing.

There are better options out there, Buemi, Glock and Sutil are the current names being thrown around, all quite worthy methinks.

I'm pretty sure we've been over this already, Petrov is not doing good enough for where Renault expect to be.
 
Ardius
I'm pretty sure we've been over this already, Petrov is not doing good enough for where Renault expect to be.
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Actually, Renault didn't expect to be where they are now until this time next year. The initial wind tunnel data on the R30 looked good, and they were quietly hopeful, but they never expected to be this far ahead. In some ways, Petrov's lack of testing experience has been a god thing because it's forced them to go a little slower and realy think about what they're doing.

Anyway, reading between the lines in the article a little, and I get the distinct impression that Renault are a little suspicious of Raikkonen's motives. I mean, this is the third or fourth major article about wanting to approach Raikkonen for preliminary talks, which is very odd behaviour. Most of the time it's just rumours and speculation with the team keeping mum until they're ready to tell the world - but not here. They've made a very public spectacle about talking to Raikkonen before they've even said a word to him. I have the suspicion that Renault are concerned that Raikkonen is only looking to join Renault the race-winning team and that they could be throwing good money after bad if he just phones it in when things don't go his way. Look at some of his 2009 performances - China, Singapore and Abu Dhabi all stand out as less than stellar showings; the last two in particular once Ferrari got their development back on track. You could also count Malaysia to a lesser extent, but it's questionable given that the pit wall was temporarily replaced by a group of monkeys who decided it would be a good idea to put him on extreme wets in the middle of a dry spell.
 
interludes
Look at some of his 2009 performances - China, Singapore and Abu Dhabi all stand out as less than stellar showings; the last two in particular once Ferrari got their development back on track.
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Nothing was back on track at that point. Ferrari gave up on the development of the F60 well before Singapore last year.
 
But by that point they had at least developed it. They didn't go an entire season without upgrading their car, like, say ... Hispania.
 
Still, Ferrari's development was far from "being back on track" as you mentioned. The F60 was never developed to the point of being anywhere near a Championship contending car last season. Throughout the season it was probably the 3rd or 4th best car overall, behind the Brawn, RB, and/or just even with the Mclaren, yet Kimi managed to finish in 6th position in the WDC, just 1 point behind Lewis. I don't see how you can (unless it conveniently suits your argument) point out the races where Kimi didn't exactly outperform the car (which could simply be down to the car not working on that circuit), and then ignore all of his extremely impressive performances where IMO he extracted the absolute most out of the car. IMO he clearly had more impressive drives than unimpressive drives considering the dog of a car he was in, particularly in the 2nd half the of season when Ferrari had completely halted development on the F60 (and inspiration must have been hard to come by).
 
timeattack07gt
Still, Ferrari's development was far from "being back on track" as you mentioned. The F60 was never developed to the point of being anywhere near a Championship contending car last season. Throughout the season it was probably the 3rd or 4th best car overall, behind the Brawn, RB, and/or just even with the Mclaren, yet Kimi managed to finish in 6th position in the WDC, just 1 point behind Lewis. I don't see how you can (unless it conveniently suits your argument) point out the races where Kimi didn't exactly outperform the car (which could simply be down to the car not working on that circuit), and then ignore all of his extremely impressive performances where IMO he extracted the absolute most out of the car. IMO he clearly had more impressive drives than unimpressive drives considering the dog of a car he was in, particularly in the 2nd half the of season when Ferrari had completely halted development on the F60 (and inspiration must have been hard to come by).
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...Which is why he would be the perfect benchmark for Kubica, who is accomplishing a similar feat this season in his Renault.
 
Translated article that appeared in Turun Sanomat overnight. It might not be the most reliable source, but it does contain direct quoes from Raikkonen:
Räikkönen puts a stop to Renault's milking

Turun Sanomat 6.10 2010 00:09:17

Kimi Räikkönen who is known for his silence got finally fed up when Renault continues week after week speculating through the media about the Finnish star's possible switch back to F1 in their team.

"I am very disappointed in the way they have used my name in order to promote their own marketing. I have not at any stage considered seriously driving for Renault and I can assure you that I'm 100% sure that I will not drive in Renault next year," Räikkönen declares in his straightforward way.

"My managers were weeks ago once in contact with Renault's team manager. That's all," Räikkönen said.

Even though they haven't had any negotiations, Renault's camp has constantly been feeding the F1-media with stories about how Räikkönen is interested in their team. According to team manager Eric Bouillier the only thing slowing down the negotiations has been the uncertainity of the Finnish driver's motivation.

Although the big audience doesn't necessarily notice it, it isn't any campaign for open negotiations, it's clearly a team- and finance-policy.

Renault is a racing team lead by tycoon Gerard Lopez. For Lopez F1 is business and therefore it looks like they are riding on WDC Räikkönen's name for as long as possible until filling the other seat.

Räikkönen and his managers are used to not speaking in public about any negotiations before the contracts are sealed. Therefore the policy Renault has taken to chow down one short contact for several weeks has been both disturbing and shocking to them.
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Sorry I don't have a link - I got it from another forum and there was no link supplied.

Anyway, it looks like that's it. Raikkonen had contct with renault, but it was only preliminary flirting. Renault played up the story for their own ends. It's getting pretty clear now that Raikkonen will not be racing in 2011. Where this leaves Vitaly Petrov and who would be on renault's short list in the event Petrov does not live up to expetctions is anyone's guess.
 
I've seen Raikkonen fans claim that this is a part of a wider scheme by Raikkonen, the idea being that Rneault use his name to milk the Russians, then he criticises them for doing it once they feel they've got as much as they can out of Petrov and his backers - only for the negotiations to go from public to highly private so that Renault can pull off a stunning coup, claiming that the team's organisation and preliminary wind tunnel data on the R32 chassis would be able to attract major sponsors, allowing Renault to back out of the deals with Lada, Bank SNORAS and Vyborg Shipyards that tie them to Petrov (except that SNORAS wanted to work with Renault because both their drivers are East European).

Kimi fans are a big like that.
 
Raikkonen's comments are interesting...

Maybe I shouldn't pay much attention to the media. After all, Renault haven't handled this badly, they've just been truthful, they didn't release this stuff in a press release, they answered the questions in interviews, so it's hardly milking the Raikkonen story for their own gain. It will be a shame not to see Raikkonen back... But at least there is still an open seat at Renault if Petrov doesn't stay on his current form.
 
Im a huge Kimi fan but that just sounds more like a conspiracy theory to me inter. You would have to convince Kimi to go along with something like that but what does Kimi get out of the deal for letting them throw his name around like that.

Either way the whole situation now seems odd. One half of me says this might be a good thing for Petrov seeing as Raikkonen was never a real consideration for the seat. But at the same time it could also be that they are trying to get other people interested in the seat by making it look like it will be a front runner next season.
 
Looks like Renault is trying to lure back Kimi with the acquisition of a Vodka sponsor (jk) :lol:

kubi_rena_suzu_2010-11.jpg
 
I think, that Petrov is probably more viable than any other rookie in commercial terms. H'es not half bad as a driver either. Whilst it would be better to get a skilled driver (Like Raikkonen - Although we know that isn't happening), a driver like Petrov fits the second slot quite nicely. Someone like Heidfeld would be a better driver, but in commercial terms he's worth next to nothing, as we have far too many German drivers already; Schumacher and Vettel attracted most of the German sponsors this season and it will be much the same next season.

While I did say Raikkonen is a better option than Petrov earlier in the thread, i'm hard pressed to think of another driver that can replace Petrov that can both better his performances and improve the commercial aspect for the team.
 
According to what Anthony Davidson was saying on the BBC commentary for P3 said from a driver insider prospective that Kimi wasn't really interested in F1 anymore.
 
NapoleonMikey
According to what Anthony Davidson was saying on the BBC commentary for P3 said from a driver insider prospective that Kimi wasn't really interested in F1 anymore.
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I suspected the talk of Raikkonen returning was largely down to his fans. I've found they tend to blow things way out of proportion; they get very critical of Petrov for crashing out of the Korean Grand Prix, but when Raikkonen wipes out of the Rally of Spain when he crashes on the shakedown stage, it's no big deal.
 
interludes... you. are. a. fool.


You are hampering on about how raikkonen fans apparently are all fanboys and they treat anything bad like the plague unless kimi does it which case they don't think its bad at all.

Would you, for once, stick to the topic, rather than attack people for having opinions. It isn't very sporting of you nor is it that polite.


And finally, no, these aparent raikkonen fanobys who have decided to ignore your post (presumably the raikkonen faboys are also interludes fanboys) do think that crashing out of a Rally before it has begun is a bad thing. That's people are saying that raikkonen should be back in F1.


It appears he doesn't want to be in F1, but it is hard to ignore the incredible results and ability Kimi Raikkonen has in a Formula 1 car and how he lacks the ability to keep the bloody thing on the road (several crashes this year) let alone win anything in the WRC.
 
UN_OC
It appears he doesn't want to be in F1, but it is hard to ignore the incredible results and ability Kimi Raikkonen has in a Formula 1 car and how he lacks the ability to keep the bloody thing on the road (several crashes this year) let alone win anything in the WRC.
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He can't win anything in WRC, hey big deal. People have managed to completely forget that he's driving his very first full year in rallying - not the first full year in WRC but the first full year in any kind of a rally car. On top of that the Red Bull and Citroën bosses seem to be very unimpressed with him, apparently they expected him to race head to head with guys who have driven WRC for several years and other rally classes for a good ten years before that. Having expectations is natural, having totally unrealistic expectations is just stupid. And as the bosses want more pace he ends up crashing because he doesn't have the necessary experience yet. Sure he's made some really stupid mistakes but so do all beginners, the difference being that nobody really cares in the lower classes. Now everyone points a finger at him and laughs how badly he drives.

Well, everyone but Malcolm Wilson, it seems.
 
UN_OC
It appears he doesn't want to be in F1, but it is hard to ignore the incredible results and ability Kimi Raikkonen has in a Formula 1 car and how he lacks the ability to keep the bloody thing on the road (several crashes this year) let alone win anything in the WRC.
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That's probably because rallying and Formula 1 are completely different disciplines of motorsport.

And your entire argument is negated by the fact that Raikkonen has said he doesn't want to come back.
 
I think he'll change his mind, if say Webber was to retire at the end of this year. And Red Bull were to offer up big money. either him, or Buemi.
 
Buemi is said to be on shaky territory with Toro Rosso management. He might have his eye on Webber's seat, but he's been underperforming. If Webber retires this year - and I doubt he will - then I suspect Red Bull might try and get Robert Kubica or even Nico Hulkenberg if his Brazil pace is genuine and not simply a fluke. He'd have to repeat his efforts in Abu Dhabi, though.
 
interludes
Buemi is said to be on shaky territory with Toro Rosso management. He might have his eye on Webber's seat, but he's been underperforming. If Webber retires this year - and I doubt he will - then I suspect Red Bull might try and get Robert Kubica or even Nico Hulkenberg if his Brazil pace is genuine and not simply a fluke. He'd have to repeat his efforts in Abu Dhabi, though.
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Oh ok, thanks for the insider information.
 
The Outlaw
Oh ok, thanks for the insider information.
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I wouldn't call it insider information; moreso extrapolation. The reason why I say Red Bull might be interested is because in this day and age, you need two quick drivers if you want to compete for WCC position, and neither Sebastien Buemi not Jaime Alguersuari has set the world ablaze. The Red Bull Young Driver Program has largely been a failure: too many drivers, and not enough seats - and those drivers that do make it haven't amounted to much. Sebastian Vettel is their only success; Liuzzi, Speed, Klien, Buemi, Alguersuari and Buemi have largely failed. Hartley and Ricciardo seem to be stuck in limbo (a lack of a GP2 team has hurt the Program), whilst Red Bull had to cut Mikhail Aleshin and Mirko Bortolotti loose. Even when the likes of Aleshin are getting results; Aleshin beat both Hartley and Ricciardo in the WSR. If Red Bull want a competitive driver, they're going to have to look outside their own stable - and Nico Hulkenberg might be a young, fast driver that they can get several years out of.

I certainly think Nico Hulkenberg got a lot of peoples' attention last night. However, if I were a team principal, I'd want to keep an eye on him for a little bit longer first. Just in case. If I were a team principal, I'd be asking "What, if anything, changed between Korea and Interlagos?" After all, his season hasn't exactly been flawless. The catch is that if they're going to bet on him being the future of their team, any team principal looking at him is going to have to make the call soon. Williams reportedly won't decide on their final line-up until Pastor Maldonado has tested at the Young Driver event after Abu Dhabi. That only gives Hulkenberg a little bit of time in which to impress, and a big part of his future is going to be decided tonight. If he has a bad race, he could be condemned to the midifeld for years unless Williams can (finally) get their next car right.
 

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