Real Guns

[Crash]

The full size does everything the Mk23 does, it's just a little smaller and I'm not a fan of target sights it has. The Mk23 I bought b/c of a price markdown and to complete my small collection. While it's a great gun, it's terribly impractical for anything other than being a collection piece.

I'm not sure I could CCW the compact .45 without some mild discomfort or bulges through my clothes. It's the same size as my old Sig 226, which is considered a full size gun.

Props for owning a Mk23. I don't ever hear about people owning that gun just because like you said, it's more of a museum piece and it's really expensive, even if though it shoots great. Do you CCW? Which one do you, or would you CCW?

The Sig 226 was an OK gun I guess. It felt great at the gun counter but the ergonomics went away after you fire a magazine or 2. My hand would quickly get tired and it just wasn't fun to shoot.

To compound things, it was a bitch to clean and there was some barrel wear. The HKs show no wear while you could feel the wear on the 226's barrel when you cleaned it. Not a bad gun, but not great either IMO. The .40 S&W caliber probably has the most to do with that though. I've shot a 229 in 9mm and it was night & day...but not good enough to buy one in place of an HK .45.

I shot the Sig 226 9mm at the range, and while it felt alright ergonomically, I didn't really like the trigger pull at all; I thought it was too long. You said that the 229 in 9mm caliber was night and day, how so?

At this point I'm considering purchasing a 9mm handgun in a few months. I want something that is reliable, easy to maintain, portable and fun to shoot. I was thinking of either a Glock or a HK USP; I've shot both and I really like them, but I worry that those are too big for CCW, but some people are saying that even the compact versions of those will print. I don't want it to be uncomfortable or to print when carrying.

 

[a6m5]

I've held the whatever the compact version of .45 Glock. It felt good in my hands, but it wasn't exactly tiny either.

 

[zedextreme8177]

Fired some sort of an air-powered rifle, though not BB.

Still pretty deadly, as missed projectiles had gone straight through the inch-thick metal sheet behind the target.

 

[Jay]

Oops double post

 

[Jay]

Fired some sort of an air-powered rifle, though not BB.

Still pretty deadly, as missed projectiles had gone straight through the inch-thick metal sheet behind the target.

Air powered rifle projectiles going through inch thick steel?? Huh?

What is it? Steel projectiles at 10000000 psi?

 

[BrutherSuperior]

Props for owning a Mk23. I don't ever hear about people owning that gun just because like you said, it's more of a museum piece and it's really expensive, even if though it shoots great. Do you CCW? Which one do you, or would you CCW?

They do not allow CCW in Illinois.

Out of the guns I do have, I think the PPK would make the most sense from a concealment point of view. The 45s are big and I'd probably buy a new gun for CCW in 9mm short/Kurtz/.380ACP/whateveritiscalledthisweek. The compact .45s I have are the same size as most full size guns. They're compact for being an HK, not a gun.

I shot the Sig 226 9mm at the range, and while it felt alright ergonomically, I didn't really like the trigger pull at all; I thought it was too long. You said that the 229 in 9mm caliber was night and day, how so?

Shooting those guns between .40S&W and 9mm is night and day. If you don't shoot often, but shoot a lot of rounds when you do like myself, you'll absolutely hate a .40

At this point I'm considering purchasing a 9mm handgun in a few months. I want something that is reliable, easy to maintain, portable and fun to shoot. I was thinking of either a Glock or a HK USP; I've shot both and I really like them, but I worry that those are too big for CCW, but some people are saying that even the compact versions of those will print. I don't want it to be uncomfortable or to print when carrying.

I can't really comment on the reliability of Glocks. For me, they shoot weird and I wouldn't buy one. In contrast, I love the USPs...but...they're pricey. Reliability? I've never had any issues and they're pretty easy going when you clean them.

If you're concerned about 'printing' - buy 2 guns. Get a small caliber weapon that fits in a pocket or hides nicely in a holster and buy a hand cannon for range use. Rent some different guns and in different calibers. The kick and noise between a .40S&W & .357SIG is very noticeable, just like the difference between the "pop" a 9mm makes and the "boom" from a 45. To me, 45s are the most fun to shoot - you may think otherwise but you'll never know until you try.

New gun owners or prospective owners usually have this alien idea in their head that they only need 1 gun and that's all they ever plan to buy. Heh. Plan on owning a bunch and don't make compromises. Have a CCW gun, or 3, and get some 'toys' for the range. You don't have to go broke and buy a half dozen at once, just know that when you buy your 1st gun it will most certainly be the 1st of many.

It's a fun hobby and if you're the enginerd-type, you'll be fascinated by how all the bits work from one gun to another, their histories, and their evolution. I've been eying vintage WWII weapons for a long time, just haven't had the money to invest in a few of them yet.

 

[Brett]

I shot the Sig 226 9mm at the range, and while it felt alright ergonomically, I didn't really like the trigger pull at all; I thought it was too long. You said that the 229 in 9mm caliber was night and day, how so?

A friend of mine has a SIG P226 and while I like the pistol quite a bit, the P226 is a bit large for my hand and slightly uncomfortable because of it. Yearly, the big gun range in Oklahoma City, H&H Gun Range, has a gun expo. I have been the last two years and tried out a dozen different handguns. One of the pistols I tried was the SIG P226 E2. The SIG P226 E2 is the same as the P226, but a P226 shaped in a more ergonomic manner; it is a night and day difference in how the P226 and P226 E2 feel in my hand. If it were not for the price tag that the SIG name commands, then I would probably own a P226 E2.

At this point I'm considering purchasing a 9mm handgun in a few months. I want something that is reliable, easy to maintain, portable and fun to shoot. I was thinking of either a Glock or a HK USP; I've shot both and I really like them, but I worry that those are too big for CCW, but some people are saying that even the compact versions of those will print. I don't want it to be uncomfortable or to print when carrying.

At my previous employer, one of my coworkers has a small collection of weapons and he brought out a few of his weapons out to the gun range for me to sample; that was an expensive trip, as I shot about 400 rounds worth of ammunition, majority of it bought by me. That day I shot a Walther PPK, Smith & Wesson 9mm (I do not remember the model number), Smith & Wesson M&P .45, and a Ruger revolver that shoots both .38 Special and .357 Magnum.

So, I have been in this boat since shooting for the first time two years ago. I have held many of H&Ks products and all of them feel great in my hand; shot a H&K at the gun expo two years ago, but only vaguely remember shooting it. The only thing keeping me from buying a H&K is the price tag; much like the German car manufacturer's, H&K is quite proud of their product and prices such. With that said, H&Ks are quality pieces and probably deserve the premium price.

I've held the whatever the compact version of .45 Glock. It felt good in my hands, but it wasn't exactly tiny either.

I have shot a Glock 21, the full size .45 ACP, and the trigger reach was a bit long for my hand.

New gun owners or prospective owners usually have this alien idea in their head that they only need 1 gun and that's all they ever plan to buy. Heh. Plan on owning a bunch and don't make compromises. Have a CCW gun, or 3, and get some 'toys' for the range. You don't have to go broke and buy a half dozen at once, just know that when you buy your 1st gun it will most certainly be the 1st of many.

This is exactly what I am afraid of.

It's a fun hobby and if you're the enginerd-type, you'll be fascinated by how all the bits work from one gun to another, their histories, and their evolution.

Yep.

 

[zedextreme8177]

Air powered rifle projectiles going through inch thick steel?? Huh?

What is it? Steel projectiles at 10000000 psi?

Inch-thick maybe an exaggeration, I shot this thing quite some time ago.

Yes, it uses very sharp steel projectiles, could probably hurt you pretty bad.

 

[Solid Lifters]

Inch-thick maybe an exaggeration, I shot this thing quite some time ago.

Yes, it uses very sharp steel projectiles, could probably hurt you pretty bad.

You think?

To your defense, there are some very high powered air rifles. Some can even hunt big game. See for yourself... http://www.americanairgunhunter.com/airgun_hunter.html

 

[zedextreme8177]

You think?

To your defense, there are some very high powered air rifles. Some can even hunt big game. See for yourself... http://www.americanairgunhunter.com/airgun_hunter.html

Yes, the one I fired is similar to those. There was also a similar high-powered air pistol there.

This was in a military show, so sound regulations probably applied.

 

[a6m5]

Would even a .45 go through an inch of steel? I'm sure my 9mm won't.

Bruther's comment about noob getting into guns thinking he's just going to buy one gun, that one is so true. Guy I work with who's been mentoring me, he told me the same thing, I'm like OK, whatever.... I had a .22 rifle, bought a 9mm Glock, I figured I should have at least 1 real long gun, so decided on a shotgun, 870 Tactical. But because it's a shotgun, I'm thinking I'm gonna have to buy a proper rifle, but wait, this thread makes me want to go get a .45, too.

And Brett, wasn't there a compact version of Sig? I remember reading about the JGSDF(Japanese military) using this slightly more compact version of Sig. If they were cheaper, I'd definitely have looked into Sigs.

 

[Time_Attack]

I don't think any handgun could shoot through an entire inch of steel...

 

[a6m5]

Talking about guns makes you want to go out and buy a gun. I know you are starting to get the itch....

 

[Time_Attack]

Its all about money right now. If I had steady employment I'd be making all sorts of bad purchases right now.

 

[a6m5]

Its all about money right now. If I had steady employment I'd be making all sorts of bad purchases right now.

Join the club, eh?

 

[Time_Attack]

Yeah, no **** eh. I hardly even buy beer anymore.

 

[BrutherSuperior]

Yeah, no **** eh. I hardly even buy beer anymore.

A quick way to find hidden wealth is to dump your g/f. It's worked for me every time and it's especially helpful around the holidays:idea:

Women are expensive, even if she's just a friend. While some guns are very expensive, between a girlfriend and a firearm (or car, or house, or pretty much anything under the sun), take a guess which will eventually get fat.

I'll give you 3 guesses.

 

[Time_Attack]

Heh I don't have that problem thats for sure. I do own a couple of old cars but thats it.

 

[Solid Lifters]

I don't think any handgun could shoot through an entire inch of steel...

Trust me, there are several pistols that can shoot through an inch of steel. But, they're not going to be handgun calibers, though.

 

[Time_Attack]

Well yeah I'll concede that much. I'm not sure anyone short of rambo would actually carry one though.

 

[Solid Lifters]

Well yeah I'll concede that much. I'm not sure anyone short of rambo would actually carry one though.

Actually, they aren't that bad to shoot. Remington XP is a very popular model.

 

[Time_Attack]

 

[BrutherSuperior]

Actually, they aren't that bad to shoot. Remington XP is a very popular model.

What kind of muzzle velocity would you see from a franken-rifle like that? I would think that would be the biggest factor in getting lead though steel and the shorter barrel would adversely affect that.

I could be wrong though... K=1/2m*v^2 is what I'm thinking of anyway

 

[Brett]

And Brett, wasn't there a compact version of Sig? I remember reading about the JGSDF(Japanese military) using this slightly more compact version of Sig. If they were cheaper, I'd definitely have looked into Sigs.

The compact version of the P226 is the P229.

I have been thinking about buying a SIG SP2022. Other than the controls being slightly different, the SP2022 is basically just a polymer framed P226 . . . a polymer framed P226 with half the cost.

Talking about guns makes you want to go out and buy a gun. I know you are starting to get the itch....

I have had the itch to buy one for a while. Spending a chunk of money is preventing me from doing so.

Yeah, no **** eh. I hardly even buy beer anymore.

It is never a good idea to skip buying beer.

 

[Solid Lifters]

What kind of muzzle velocity would you see from a franken-rifle like that? I would think that would be the biggest factor in getting lead though steel and the shorter barrel would adversely affect that.

I could be wrong though... K=1/2m*v^2 is what I'm thinking of anyway

It depends on what caliber it is. The XP comes in various calibers, just like the Model 700.

 

[a6m5]

Women aren't expensive.... They'd like to call me cheap though.

Looks like today must be Solid's birthday!

I have been thinking about buying a SIG SP2022. Other than the controls being slightly different, the SP2022 is basically just a polymer framed P226 . . . a polymer framed P226 with half the cost.

I like......

I have had the itch to buy one for a while. Spending a chunk of money is preventing me from doing so.

They'll deliver the bang for your buck. Maybe you can live off cup noodles for a month?

Edit: Brett, I read up on the SP2022. The guns small! And it holds 10 rounds? Unless it's going to be a conceal carry, I'd get something that would hold more than 10 rounds of 9mm....

 

[Crash]

Bruther's comment about noob getting into guns thinking he's just going to buy one gun, that one is so true.

New gun owners or prospective owners usually have this alien idea in their head that they only need 1 gun and that's all they ever plan to buy. Heh. Plan on owning a bunch and don't make compromises. Have a CCW gun, or 3, and get some 'toys' for the range. You don't have to go broke and buy a half dozen at once, just know that when you buy your 1st gun it will most certainly be the 1st of many.

Oh, I'm under no illusions what so ever that one gun will be sufficient. I know that I will eventually own multiple ones, but guns are relatively large purchases, so unfortunately at this point, as a poor college student, I can't afford purchasing several guns at once. For now, I want to get a good gun that I can use for defense and intermittent CCW; in the future when I have more funds, I'll buy additional guns.

It's a fun hobby and if you're the enginerd-type, you'll be fascinated by how all the bits work from one gun to another, their histories, and their evolution. I've been eying vintage WWII weapons for a long time, just haven't had the money to invest in a few of them yet.

Yup, most definitely.

Talking about guns makes you want to go out and buy a gun. I know you are starting to get the itch....

And yes, this thread definitely makes me want to buy a gun now. I spent 3 hours looking at guns instead of doing homework last night because of this thread

 

[a6m5]

And yes, this thread definitely makes me want to buy a gun now. I spent 3 hours looking at guns instead of doing homework last night because of this thread

Been there done that! I spent hours browsing around for the shotgun, several hours just on this beauty:



Remington 887 Tactical

I went with their 870 tactical instead, which is far less cooler. I was just couple of clicks away from purchasing the 887, then decided to do my homework(not the kind you got lol) literally the last second. Good thing, too. Turns out 887 had numerous issues when it came out couple years ago. Even this last year, reviews were somewhat mixed.

 

[Time_Attack]

It is never a good idea to skip buying beer.

For sure. I bought a six pack of goose island honkers ale last night. Very tasty.

 

[ledhed]

Money has stopped me from buying anything for a long while --the cost now to shoot just once a week is alone 80.00 ..

I like to expand my long gun collection but its not easy to find rifle ranges near Phila .
Hunting within an hour ddrive or so is all slug gun ( shotgun ) .

Sorry to say I think my days of going to Tioga county to use rifles to hunt are not being set up up anymore --all the old crew is slowly going different ways ...and its a rough time with strangers in a camp ...like guys who eat slim jims in a sleeping roll and wonder why bears think they are tootsie rolls.

Even black bear are not to be trifled with.