Save the Manuals!

Screw the manual transmission, in fact screw multi-speed transmissions all together. I'm old school, I like my 1 speed tranny, a lever for a brake, no suspension, a crank for steering and only 3 wheels.

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Cars have come a long way and while it may be sad to see some of the old technology go by the wayside, it usually helps in the long run. Granted I think that Benz is awesome and historic, there is no way I would want to drive it every day.

Zenith013
This whole "auto is making people lazy and stupid" argument is idiotic. Stick+clutch is becoming a niche product like RWD. It's outperformed by DSG's in nearly every way, so the only reason to drive one is for some traditionalist fun. Get off the high horse.
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Have to agree 100%, having an auto doesn't instantly make the entire car automatic, you still have to drive the damn thing.
 
A torque-converter automatic that doesn't let you choose gears in any way (and even one with PRND32(1) isn't anywhere near as fun to take through twisties. My first car was an automatic with PRND321 selections, and I made every attempt to try having fun with those options. It wasn't. Trying to force a downshift that way was painful and probably not doing the trans any favors.

We also had a Mitsubishi Endeavor as a rental car this summer, and it had the +/- notch on the shifter. That was awful as well, just messing around going straight.

Good sequentials or DSGs are probably the only good substitutes for a manual.
 
There arent many great autos that can outperform and more importantly offer more control up and down than manuals.
Maybe some BMW's, Jaguars, AMG Mercedes and some cars equipped with the ZF box but not all autos.
And what I mean by auto is not double clutch but a conventional automatic gearbox.

In general they do make people lazier, but mostly in normal commuter cars.
However the main point of this is not that it makes people lazier but the fact that those of us who want one for fun don't want to see it go.
See if you guys can take a moment to understand that instead of assuming it's us trying to be elitist or whatever.

And yes I do want to be a part of this.I will probably get a Toyota Vios soon with a 5 speed when I am allowed to get my license.
If Im really lucky I would LOVE a FG Ford Falcon XR6 or a Toyota GT 86.
That said having a go (on rural roads) in a 5 speed Toyota Hiace was actually quite amusing and so much nicer than the auto.

And I think the 458, etc should offer a 6 speed manual to at least humor the purists.Like Corvette and R8.
I understand though the problem is with these cars is the gains with a double clutch are just so great that a manual SEEMS pointless.
Ideally Manuals are suited to cars with less than 500hp IMO but regardless they should never die.The fun factor and feel are just great.

Besides its not the huge burden some desribe it to be.Just takes some getting used to.👍
 
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I'm pretty sure I would pick a paddle shift trans in a supercar over a manual. Especially if the car would see some sort of track duty, being able to keep both hands on the wheel all the time is a big plus in a car with that much power. Not as big of a deal in a Corvette or something else with a really fat powerband and tall gears if you don't have to shift a lot though.
 
Shifting is just something that you do. I learned to shift on a tractor. Sitting on a incline/delcline in traffic in New York City (where I was born) or North Carolina (where I learned to race) is not a bother. It simply second nature. So much so that I reach for my shifter even when driving my truck (Nissan Titan) it just reflex.
 
Eric.
I'm pretty sure I would pick a paddle shift trans in a supercar over a manual. Especially if the car would see some sort of track duty, being able to keep both hands on the wheel all the time is a big plus in a car with that much power. Not as big of a deal in a Corvette or something else with a really fat powerband and tall gears if you don't have to shift a lot though.
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I have to agree with you here. Love banging gears but when it obvious paddles would be quicker and more consistent. It's a no brainier when winning is on the line.
 
As long as we get some sort of "manual that shifts for you" that not only downshifts quickly, but revmatches too, then that is acceptable. I love manuals, but it's been proven that a twin clutch system is faster than a manual, so be it.

The automatic trans with the gear selectors can suck it though. They all suck.
 
Perfect Balance
The automatic trans with the gear selectors can suck it though. They all suck.
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From what I've heard about some of the modern ones, many are actually equally as good as dual-clutch setups. Much of the industry is split now, as torque converter autos are now becoming much more efficient (more so than manuals, nowadays) and responsive too. The 'box in the new 3-Series is an 8-speed torque converter auto and early reviews seem to suggest it's as good as any DSG.
 
I appear to have been overlooked :(, as I'd invited you to take a look at my Miscellaneousness album which contains pictures of my 3 manual vehicles in my previous post here.
Anyway, this time I'll just post a pic here that shows all 3 in 1 shot:
picture.php

Does this count or do I actually have to shoot the clutch pedals and gear knobs before I get counted as a triple-crusader? ;)

More Porsche pics here.
More Miata pics here.
 
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Let them die.

Manuals are antiquated technology built to, somewhat poorly, solve a problem that no longer exists. Manuals will go the way of the record. There will always be people who swear that the music sounds better on a record, but the rest of us will be enjoying digital music steaming from the internet to our smartphones. There is only one car I'd really consider buying in a manual transmission, and that's only because it's 20 years old.
 
Perfect Balance
As long as we get some sort of "manual that shifts for you" that not only downshifts quickly, but revmatches too, then that is acceptable. I love manuals, but it's been proven that a twin clutch system is faster than a manual, so be it.

The automatic trans with the gear selectors can suck it though. They all suck.
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Go drive the new Mazda3.

Best damn torque converter auto ever.

Actually, Mazda's "manual" mode has traditionally let you do whatever you want aside from lugging at low speed/heavy throttle or overdownshifting it. My 6 has an oldschool auto so 1-2 and 2-1 shifts are a bit delayed in manual mode (4-5 won't happen until it completely engages 4th as well) but otherwise listens to what you tell it to do.

Danoff
Let them die.

Manuals are antiquated technology built to, somewhat poorly, solve a problem that no longer exists. Manuals will go the way of the record. There will always be people who swear that the music sounds better on a record, but the rest of us will be enjoying digital music steaming from the internet to our smartphones. There is only one car I'd really consider buying in a manual transmission, and that's only because it's 20 years old.
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That's pretty apt actually.

Convenience vs experience. Sure, downloaded music on a smartphone is easily accessed at any time but it truly doesn't sound as good as on vinyl... Or even a CD that wasn't made from a rip off the internet.

There are only a few vehicles I'd think about going for anything other than a manual in, and they all involve being cruisers or daily transport rather than toys. Long distance highway use or being in traffic I don't really care to be involved with the transmission (highway doesn't entirely matter, traffic is just mind numbing either way)...
 
Rotary Junkie
Go drive the new Mazda3.

Best damn torque converter auto ever.
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I haven't had experience with a truly bad dual clutch setup. They generally work well.

100% of autos I've driven has been crap for anything other than driving around. And they kinda suck for that too. One possible exception isn't enough to say autos work well. They still suck.

EDIT: Also how new are we talking? I drove a Mazda 3 from the gen before the current, and it was a very nice car to drive, felt very solid, but the auto wasn't anything special.

Also, it's not that they don't do what you tell them to, it's that their the response sucks and they don't revmatch. Driving at the limit is nearly impossible because the downshifts upset the car during braking at the limit.
 
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Rotary Junkie
That's pretty apt actually.

Convenience vs experience. Sure, downloaded music on a smartphone is easily accessed at any time but it truly doesn't sound as good as on vinyl... Or even a CD that wasn't made from a rip off the internet.

There are only a few vehicles I'd think about going for anything other than a manual in, and they all involve being cruisers or daily transport rather than toys. Long distance highway use or being in traffic I don't really care to be involved with the transmission (highway doesn't entirely matter, traffic is just mind numbing either way)...
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That's pretty apt actually.

Lossless audio will sound better than vinyl. What you are appreciating with older analog systems is the loss of quality it uniquely generates for that media. And lossless audio can easily be downloaded these days and stored on a mobile device. What you said would've been true 4 or 5 years ago, but is hardly the case now. Get with the times.

And what you personally want is hardly what the rest of the market wants. And guess what dictates technology? The market.

Manuals are an outdated technology at this point. Dual Clutch systems are more efficient in every way, while being easier and more convenient.
 
I still believe you can be mroe efficient than any auto transmission in a manual, especially in a place with hills and such. For me conventional manuals are more fun and involving. I get that thing get simpler and simpler but it may just be too simple after that for some, and I half include myself there. The automated manuals are great fun, and probably will eventually replace conventional manuals for a number of reasons, but for me at least it's more fun to drive a fuly manual car while at the same time not something that is a hassle or annoying. I fully support manual transmissions but right now on most supercars for example they just would not work as well as some sort os sequential or automated manual. Another advantage for the manual is that it's old tech so it's sure to last, but times will change and automatics and automated manuals will improve, maybe to a point of it being satisfactory to most (if not all) enthusiasts. The way I see it, manual transmissions are great, but we should appreciate all sorts of different transmissions for what they are and their different uses.
 
Smallhorses
I appear to have been overlooked :(, as I'd invited you to take a look at my Miscellaneousness album which contains pictures of my 3 manual vehicles in my previous post here.
Anyway, this time I'll just post a pic here that shows all 3 in 1 shot:
picture.php

Does this count or do I actually have to shoot the clutch pedals and gear knobs before I get counted as a triple-crusader? ;)

More Porsche pics here.
More Miata pics here.
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If that 911 has an auto, you are a sick man, so I'll take your word for it:sly:
Nice cars, by the way.
 
I would like to join this cause. I always wanted a manual in every car I owned since I learned how to drive 10 years ago. First car was an automatic 04 cavalier that I hated driving. My current car, though, has a 5-speed and I LOVE IT. Probably the most fun car I have ever driven to this point. Heres prove. 2011 Mazda 3i Sport 4dr.

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You lucky man. A WRB Impreza. Looks like a 06-07. I almost got a used one when I was looking around before I got my Mazda3. Loved test driving both.
 
Manuals need to be saved! I learnt to drive in a manual a year ago. And I will only drive manuals (Unless it's paddle on a supercar, even though I want manual). And I certainly will NOT buy an Auto! ever! It's useless.
 
I will definitely join the cause. Im only 14 and can drive a manual no problem. Its 750000x more fun than an auto.
 
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I think a qualifier for this should also be a list of how many Auto cars you've driven, because if you haven't driven any, your opinion is pretty much worthless. You learn how to perfect auto driving, just as you learn how to perfect manual shifting.

I've driven plenty of manuals with horrible gear stick 'action' and horrible clutches, that simply ruin the car overall.. in these cases, a good auto is way better. Just as a good manual is better than a bad automatic.

Personally, having owned 6 manuals to 3 autos, I wouldn't call it either way, they both have advantages and disadvantages - it's all about personal preference, just as drive train, body style, suspension set-up etc.... but.. with regard to the OP... manufacturers are only giving people what they want.. and the majority of people want better acceleration numbers, and better economy. Taking the gear changes away from the least consistent or reliable part of the car (the Driver), helps them achieve this... and therefore sell more cars... you should be petitioning *new* car buyers, not car manufacturers, or second hand-buyers, and you should be petitioning them to look at the experience, not the numbers... otherwise you're just making a "look at us, we all think we're purists" list.
 

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