Slowest car for PD

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This topic came up while at NEGTP over the weekend. A discussion about what cars could win the PD cup.

I stated that I was currently running it in the ZZS on T4's. One person argued that racing tires were considered an advantage, and therefore should not be allowed in the race. He equated it to using an F1 in the MR races. Yes, it qualifies under the stated rules, but techinically, it was cheating considering the AI don't ahve access to these. I haven't loaded a replay into MK's yet, I'll have more info then.

While thinking about that train of thought, what cars out there might be able to win this "As is, from the dealer"?

Now, tire wear would figure heavily. My ZZS might not make one pit stop in 20 laps (yes, on T4's). Does anyone have a replay of a PD Cup race that they can load into mk's and verify what tires the AI use?

AO
 
I will tell you flat out there is no way that the AI cars are not using racing tires. In my run through the PD Cup, the Camaro SS was miles ahead - for the first 2 laps. He was definitely running Super Softs, because the Camaro SS I experimented with behaved exactly the same way when I put it on T8s. The AI behaviour very closely conforms to what you'd expect if they are running racing tires of varying degree. I don't see how that person could say that the AI are not running race rubber.

The RX-8 has great potential, but the stock gearing is just horrendous. I ran it, stock, in the Amateur European Championship and it was totally uncompetitive against the Opel Speedster. Handling is perfect, but there is zip zero nada for power below about 7,000 rpm, and the stock gear ratios make it impossible to keep the revs up there on most tracks. It revs so slowly that it will get owned in the PD Cup, at least with me driving.

All it needs is the racing transmission, but man, it needs that in a big way.
 
In mk's the tyres from the AI - regardless of the race - show up as a rather obscure code. You cannot tell what grade of tyre the AI uses from mk's at all.

I know that a Nissan R33 Nismo 400R will win on stock tyres, because I did it with that the first time out. I thought the same thing - stock means stock. Was BLOODY hard though. :D
 
Originally posted by ving
you done a writeup on it?
if not can you?
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No and maybe.

The easiest tracks by far are Apricot Hill and SSR5. I won by just over 30s on SSR5 ahead of the Nissan Z. Deep Forest is tricky, and bearing in mind just how much I hate Seattle II, it was a surprise I got 4th there. Trial Mountain is actually winnable, but you have to choose your opponents. The preference is that idiotic T8 Corvette, and no RX-7, Z Concept or Elise 190 (although you CAN catch the Elise 190 on Trial, it's just a bastard later on).

I'm actually currently doing some endurance races, but I'll drag the Teg out to finish my PD times at GT3T later on this month, I hope.
 
I think a good mark is to run at about 1'38.000 at Trial Mountain in the first race - that should put you just ahead of the Nissan Z in that event (assuming it runs) based on a one-stop strategy.
 
I agree - there's no way a Mustang Cobra could get 6 laps at race pace on stock tyres at Trial Mountain. I suspect they run medium racing tyres.
 
Originally posted by RVDNuT374
Or they run the tires down to the bare rims.:p
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That would explain the bizarre behaviour just before they pit!

I was drafting one of the Lancers on that flat right hander onto Pit Straight at Trial Mountain - I turned in, he went straight on with severe body roll to the left and plenty of tyre smoke, before smacking the wall and going into the pit.

I was also pretty close to the 350Z just before his last stop and he had a major wobble coming into the right hander out of the tunnel on the backstraight - they certainly do run them to the end alright.
 
i'd say that run em till they are red then.
but they start off too well to be on stock tires and they are rather harsh on them...
 
Originally posted by ving
i'd say that run em till they are red then.
but they start off too well to be on stock tires and they are rather harsh on them...
Click to expand...

You're not wrong - there was some pretty impressive sliding across the apex of that last corner. I had a completely different, tidier, much faster line through there, just running over the kerbing on the right - they were slewing across the face of the corner right into the rubbish on the right hand side - particularly the Lancers. Very harsh on tyres.
 
Originally posted by Famine
In mk's the tyres from the AI - regardless of the race - show up as a rather obscure code. You cannot tell what grade of tyre the AI uses from mk's at all.

I know that a Nissan R33 Nismo 400R will win on stock tyres, because I did it with that the first time out. I thought the same thing - stock means stock. Was BLOODY hard though. :D
Click to expand...

I thought the Nismo 400R did not qualify for the PD Cup ?
 
Well - it would appear the V6 Clio has a major advantage - it's very kind to its tyres.

I just ran the Midfield II race (#2 in the series) without stopping (on superhards), beat the Z by 42 seconds. I was able to run mid '24s through the second half of the race (including 6 laps within 5 hundredths of 24.5, which I was happy with).

So - we need something less than a Clio, it would seem.
 
I wrapped up the 5th, 6th and 7th races in the ZZS last night. This one as well is easy on tires.

Thanks for the info on the tires. I had figured the AI were running some sort of racing tires.

On my runs last night, I fell victim to my Seattle Curse again. Landing 3rd place with a nearly criminal act on the Supra to steal the lead 3 corners from the finish line. So my record is 6 golds, and one bronze. I think that I can finish the series out and win the championship.

I'd be interested to see what the next car is that I can run.

AO
 
Originally posted by gumpy
I thought the Nismo 400R did not qualify for the PD Cup ?
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Why would you think that?

The AI's tyres in PD Cup are always the equivalents of T2s, T5s or T7s. Anyone who thinks that Corvette that pits every 2 laps is running road tyres needs their head feeling.

However, mk's programme displays them as "Rain?, free 10", "Rain?, free 11", "Rain?, free 23" and "Rain?, free 24".
 
I've found mk's program, as wonderful as it is, to be of very limited usefulness in deciphering the AI setups. It just seems to have generic information, and the "tweaking" is done directly to the AI's preformance numbers, not via special settings.

This was brought home to me during the rally races, because I was trying to run the exact same car as the AI. In particular, my prize Corolla RC handled and accelerated nothing like either the AI Corolla or the Arcade Corolla. Yet when I used mk to analyze the replay, both the computer car and mine had the generic "all 7s" suspension setup, and showed stock horsepower.

AO, don't feel bad about Seattle. That last-lap lunge seems to be programmed into the dominant AI car no matter what it is. The exact same thing happened to me with the 350Z at Seattle. My tires went form light orange to red in the last half lap, and the 350Z magically made up about 7 seconds in that same half lap... plus he suddenly decided to brutalize me in the bargain. I just happened to be driving a heavier car than you are, so while he got me once, the second time he came out on the short end.
 
Originally posted by vat_man
Well - it would appear the V6 Clio has a major advantage - it's very kind to its tyres.

I just ran the Midfield II race (#2 in the series) without stopping (on superhards), beat the Z by 42 seconds. I was able to run mid '24s through the second half of the race (including 6 laps within 5 hundredths of 24.5, which I was happy with).

So - we need something less than a Clio, it would seem.
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I think you'll find its a MR thing. they are very balanced... needs to be run in a FR or FF i think to get a good run...
 
i think actually there are lots of cars that can do 20 laps on t2 tires tho. try that clio with stock tires dood :)
 
Originally posted by ving
i think actually there are lots of cars that can do 20 laps on t2 tires tho. try that clio with stock tires dood :)
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Yeah - but I kinda feel guilty hobbling the car. I want to have to extract the maximum out of the car I choose to get the win.

I'll finish this series and have a trawl through the car lists. Running in the ZZS sounds interesting.
 
Ha ha...

Looking through the list, I thought:
- one of the MR2s, say the G-Limited or GT-S
- naturally aspirated Supra
- Honda S2000 Type V
- one of the Nissan Sylvia/180SX
- Toms Chaser

Yes, I downloaded the Ultimate Car List in Excel format.
 
I think the Chaser might win easily...doesn't it have about 300-400bhp stock? It's got REALLY good handling too. :)
 
Can the Chaser enter?

I'd love to have PD dump Seattle one and two off the list of tracks for GT4. Unfortuantely, I'm not in the majority.

I think it was Cam over at GTF that has done it in the MR2. I'm up against a the Supra RZ in my running at the moment. The S2000 sounds like a nice contender. That is worth looing into.

AO
 
Originally posted by DODGE the VIPER
I think the Chaser might win easily...doesn't it have about 300-400bhp stock? It's got REALLY good handling too. :)
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Yeah but it's pretty heavy - I have a feeling it would be very hard on tyres.

I might go back and try the Legacy B4 again - I'll have to do some serious testing.
 
mr2 sounds fun....
atm i am saving up money by winning series' and selling cars. I want to buy the tickford falcon but i am still 500k out.
after that i will do more serious racing, if i have time
 
Wouldn't it be easier and quicker just to run the Speedway Enduro? You'll get the prize money, and even if you don't win the Falcon you'll get some nice cars to sell if you want to buy it.
 
Heck, yeah, ving! It's dull but fast money. Or, if you have the Scud Missle you can just rubberband it while you blissfully snooze. I needed the Tickford recently, so I went to bed with the Scud banging it's way around the wall. Got up to pee in the middle of the night, received the F090, saved, restarted the race, got up at dawn, got a spare C5R, sold it, saved, restarted the race, took a shower, had breakfast, and lo and behold, there was the Falcon! Plus I'd added more than half a megacredit to the war chest besides.
 

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