Stick Shifts Make Up Less Than 4% of New Car Purchases, Can You #SaveTheManual?

[Beeblebrox237]

Oh, we're saving the manuals? I was preaching that before it was cool . I agree, though, that manuals are doomed, and the people who do want them tend to buy used cars more than new ones.

 

[Epic B]

Oh, we're saving the manuals? I was preaching that before it was cool . I agree, though, that manuals are doomed, and the people who do want them tend to buy used cars more than new ones.

At some point I think "Save the Manuals" will be less about saving the manual transmissions and more about saving human operated vehicles in general as automation takes over. As for manual transmissions at this point, they're definitely a niche market, especially in high performance sports cars and supercars, many of which don't even offer a manual.

But then again I don't even drive.

 

[Tornado]

I recognize that not everyone has driven a car with a big thumping whack of torque where downshifting is fairly optional when paired with a stick, but even as it pertains to something truly gutless like a BreezeFrees, how often do you really think people downshift to the extent where it will supposedly dramatically cut down on distracted driving?

Diesels?

 

[McLaren]

What?

If there's anything that would make a change, It's probably more likely that it'll be those people you're bashing, those buying lower end vehicles. Rather than those higher-end cars, as like you said, those purchases would likely be significantly fewer in general.

There is some truth to his post. I remember reading folks bash on the exotic market for dropping manual gearboxes & realizing 90% of those folks are not even in the demographic to buy those cars. That market was met with not only dropping a gearbox that wasn't worth developing on new models, but replacing it with something far more efficient for those cars' performance.

If you read the replies in this thread you would think you could walk into any car dealer and pick out any car and if you wanted it manual they would make it for you. The people posting that they don’t have a choice are right, and manufacturers decided when manuals were still a third of the market to stop offering them on a lot of models to save cost.

That's because the market decided it wasn't cost-effective to keep building them. This has been said repeatedly in the thread.

There have even been noted instances where a manufacturer did offer a manual for 1-2 extra years because people clamored online for them, and not enough of these people actually did anything.

 

[Robin]

Even in the manual haven which is the UK it is noticeable how many new affordable cars are now being offered as auto or at least semi automatic (with paddle shift). It's almost like that technology is getting cheaper than making a gearbox mechanically operated.

Even though it looks like the requirement of learning and passing your full licence with a manual car is set to stay I can see them massively falling out of favour over the next few years. The roads are getting more congested leading to more stop start situations which gets seriously tiring. Seems like you can't drive to anywhere anymore without stopping regularly.

 

[homeforsummer]

I recognize that not everyone has driven a car with a big thumping whack of torque where downshifting is fairly optional when paired with a stick, but even as it pertains to something truly gutless like a BreezeFrees, how often do you really think people downshift to the extent where it will supposedly dramatically cut down on distracted driving?

Diesels?

That's an interesting point. I often think that many people are so poor at driving with a manual transmission that they'd be less distracted with an automatic, since it'd free up some brain space to actually navigate rather than attempting to operate something mechanical. Given the way some people drive automatics would certainly save a lot of fuel from poor gear choices.

I'd also echo those who are no more or less engaged driving a manual than not doing so. I enjoy driving manuals, but it doesn't make me drive any "better" or be any more attentive. Suggesting all drivers mentally switch off when driving automatics simply isn't the case. I believe in the psychology world they call that "projecting".

 

[TenEightyOne]

Even though it looks like the requirement of learning and passing your full licence with a manual car is set to stay

I don't think there is such a requirement - isn't it the case that you can take your driving test in an auto and just be limited to that type on your licence?

 

[MatskiMonk]

I don't think there is such a requirement - isn't it the case that you can take your driving test in an auto and just be limited to that type on your licence?

This is the case. Last time I looked up the stats only 2% of licenses were Automatic only.

Always makes me scratch my head why Americans think "driving stick" is such a big deal... to me it's just "driving".

 

[ImaRobot]

There is some truth to his post. I remember reading folks bash on the exotic market for dropping manual gearboxes & realizing 90% of those folks are not even in the demographic to buy those cars. That market was met with not only dropping a gearbox that wasn't worth developing on new models, but replacing it with something far more efficient for those cars' performance

That may be true, but what he said is that those that bash on Autos are buying low end vehicles that don’t come in manual like a Yaris(which does)and not a real sports car. He didn’t mention anything about bashing manual exotics.

 

[Robin]

I don't think there is such a requirement - isn't it the case that you can take your driving test in an auto and just be limited to that type on your licence?

I should have phrased it better. I meant learning to get your full licence to drive anything that a full licence allows requires that you learn in a manual. Yes there is auto only learning and you get a 'full' licence but your limited to autos obviously.

I'm suprised only 2% of people have an auto only licence, judging by how terribly people drive and how many times people can repeatedly fail their manual test I thought it would be higher!

 

[Moby45]

"Stick shifts and safety belts
Bucket seats have all got to go
When we're driving in the car
It makes my baby seem so far"

Yay for Cake quotes! lol They are who I mostly listen to on long road trips. All of their songs feel like pretty good driving songs.

 

[SiriusR]

Oh. This topic again.

I'm pretty sure I've already said something like this in a similar thread here, but I'll say this again: I'm yet to see someone who's not enthusiastic about cars (and people like that are the vast majority of people actually buying cars) who'd prefer stick shifts. They either prefer autos or just don't give a damn. Unless these people start to prefer manual transmissions for one reason or another, the whole #savethemanual deal is just car enthusiasts being a vocal minority.

No, seriously. Find someone who has a car but isn't enthusiastic about cars and driving and try to explain them how fun and engaging rowing your own is. They either will shrug it off or see you as some annoying Jehovah witness-like guy going all like "EXCUSE ME, DO YOU HAVE A MINUTE TO TALK ABOUT OUR LORD AND SAVIOR, MANUAL TRANSMISSION?".

tl;dr: stick shifts are becoming more and more niche, hence why they're dying, and it makes perfect sense; it's fine if there will be niche market for them, but it will be a niche market for car enthusiasts like us, not something an average person would buy.

 

[CarreraGT]

I recognize that not everyone has driven a car with a big thumping whack of torque where downshifting is fairly optional when paired with a stick, but even as it pertains to something truly gutless like a BreezeFrees, how often do you really think people downshift to the extent where it will supposedly dramatically cut down on distracted driving?

Diesels?

What on earth does that mean?

 

[Tornado]

What on earth does that mean?

If I'm driving a car on the highway or on a backroad or on an interstate, what difference does it make how the car got in the top gear to keep me from getting distracted?

 

[kikie]

Is it still so that modern automatics (double clutch, conventional automatics) have a higher economy than manuals?

 

[Epic B]

Is it still so that modern automatics (double clutch, conventional automatics) have a higher economy than manuals?

Might depend on the vehicle. In higher end sports cars and their ilk it's not uncommon for the automatic to have better acceleration though, especially if it's a twin clutch box.

 

[Beeblebrox237]

Oh. This topic again.

I'm pretty sure I've already said something like this in a similar thread here, but I'll say this again: I'm yet to see someone who's not enthusiastic about cars (and people like that are the vast majority of people actually buying cars) who'd prefer stick shifts. They either prefer autos or just don't give a damn. Unless these people start to prefer manual transmissions for one reason or another, the whole #savethemanual deal is just car enthusiasts being a vocal minority.

No, seriously. Find someone who has a car but isn't enthusiastic about cars and driving and try to explain them how fun and engaging rowing your own is. They either will shrug it off or see you as some annoying Jehovah witness-like guy going all like "EXCUSE ME, DO YOU HAVE A MINUTE TO TALK ABOUT OUR LORD AND SAVIOR, MANUAL TRANSMISSION?".

tl;dr: stick shifts are becoming more and more niche, hence why they're dying, and it makes perfect sense; it's fine if there will be niche market for them, but it will be a niche market for car enthusiasts like us, not something an average person would buy.

My mother. She doesn't care about cars but she enjoys driving manuals because of, among other things, engine braking.

 

[Danoff]

tl;dr: stick shifts are becoming more and more niche, hence why they're dying, and it makes perfect sense; it's fine if there will be niche market for them, but it will be a niche market for car enthusiasts like us, not something an average person would buy.

That part will go away too.

Over time, fewer and fewer people will learn how to drive stick. And you're not going to learn to drive stick in your brand new $100k Porsche. Plus you want to be able to sell it when it's time to buy the next one, so you want to make sure that you have people you could sell it to. Eventually there will be few enough people buying them that manufacturers will stop making them for enthusiasts as well. We already know that car enthusiasts can be talked out of buying them... it's just a matter of time before they're gone.

In fact, it's just a matter of time before the ICE is gone and the transmission with it. Of course, that's slightly longer horizon. The manual is certainly making it a lot closer to the end of the ICE than I thought it would.

 

[CarreraGT]

If I'm driving a car on the highway or on a backroad or on an interstate, what difference does it make how the car got in the top gear to keep me from getting distracted?

You've completely missed the point...

 

[Tornado]

That's impressive. I've never managed to miss the point before when it was mine to begin with.

 

[SiriusR]

My mother. She doesn't care about cars but she enjoys driving manuals because of, among other things, engine braking.

I'm glad for her (no sarcasm here). Sadly, she still does seem to be in a minority.

That part will go away too.

(sorry for not quoting the entire post, I want to reply to this part specifically)
Looking at how things like pixel art video games and music on vinyls are still being made, there's a possibility that it won't. But only as long as car manufacturers will find a miche market for stick shift cars profitable, which will only happen if people are gonna buy new stick shift cars instead of used ones. I mean, why making cars for enthusiasts specifically if enthusiasts will stick to the used market, leaving car manufacturers without of their biggest motivation - profit?
In case if the niche market for stick shift cars establishes, there's a chance manual transmissions will stay around longer than ICE will, as transmissions don't need no fuel. However, only time will tell.

 

[eiriksmil]

My mother. She doesn't care about cars but she enjoys driving manuals because of, among other things, engine braking.

Modern autos do also engine brake though. The days of 3 speed auto slushboxes are gone, 8 speed ZF transmissions and similar are pretty intelligent things

As for me.. GFs 7 speed A3 2.0T is super nice and auto is great for commuting.. My manual Mirage is pretty clunky but prefer this x1000 over a similar CVT. Of course my turbo Daihatsu with 180 bhp/litre could never have been anything else than manual. Next daily I am pretty torn, but I wouldn't mind Focus RS or Volvo V90.. Former would have to be manual, latter would be wrong not to be auto.

A couple of the guys in this thread hit the nail on the head.. Consumers want autos, we enthusiasts who want manuals are also skinflints who do not buy performance cars new. So we just need to find some good classics and change gears until we are not allowed to drive our combustion engined death traps.

 

[DJShadesUK]

No one is stuck in traffic in Stoke on a cold night thinking their experience would be better with a manual.

No-one? Have you asked me?

 

[SlipZtrEm]

My mother. She doesn't care about cars but she enjoys driving manuals because of, among other things, engine braking.

To be fair, so long as your auto car has some sort of driver-actuated override, like paddles, that's still a thing. I did it in a rental Mazda 3 just yesterday.

Over time, fewer and fewer people will learn how to drive stick. And you're not going to learn to drive stick in your brand new $100k Porsche.

Thankfully there's a few places locally that will happily sell people manual driving training. I did it a few months ago just to see what it was all about, and the guy showed up to my place in a BRZ ready for driving. I asked him what his clientele was like, and it was all over the map. Retirees looking for a hobby, young folks, a middle-aged couple that wanted to try something different together... I was shocked.

I tend to make a comparison to horse riding when it comes to enthusiast driving, and I think that solidified it for me. There will be small pockets of people that just want to do it even if they know it's not efficient. But yeah, on the grand scale, you're not going to get Joe Public to re-adopt the stick.

We already know that car enthusiasts can be talked out of buying them... it's just a matter of time before they're gone.

Case in point: read the reviews about the 991.1 GT3. While people bemoaned the loss of the manual — and Porsche did end up re-introducing it in the 991.2 — it certainly wasn't the uproar this sort of thing presented a decade ago. There was talk about how much more focused a track day could be with the flappy paddles versus the third pedal. That gels even more with the spirit of the car (apparently) when it's an RS.

In fact, it's just a matter of time before the ICE is gone and the transmission with it. Of course, that's slightly longer horizon. The manual is certainly making it a lot closer to the end of the ICE than I thought it would.

Related: Volkswagen just announced the end date for its ICE development.

 

[Dobermann92]

While using manual transmission is fine when racing, in everyday use, I would prefer a car with an automatic one just because of pure lazyness.

 

[PocketZeven]

With cars going the electric route we will see the manual likely dissappear for day to day drivers.

 

[05XR8]

Maybe it might not die out with the popular selling small vehicles. Say,the Corolla, MX-5 and.Mazda3.
Mazda don't seem to be in a rush for EVs and if the Corolla isn't selling, I can see Toyota dropping that transmission.