Toe Angle: What difference does it make to you?

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Drift_Monkey

Drift_Monkey

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MLD_DriftMonkey
Hey guys,

I've been reading a lot of posts and seeing some people post their tunes but I don't see any modifications to the toe. Sometimes the toe angles on both front and rear are set to 0.0.

My tunes usually are setup with more extreme toe angles for slower cars(300-550hp) and moderate for higher horsepower cars (550-1000hp). I use it as a way to stabalize my car while in drift so that I don't over correct or over rotate while transitioning. Also it helps me keep more angle and maintain it as long as I can. It also affects my speed so depending on the car I can slow a car down if I need to or make it slightly quicker.

But with 0.0 toe angles, how does this benefit the driver? To me with no toe angles my car feels to stiff and it's hard to achieve any extreme angle and hold it without correcting.

My question is what are your toe angles usually at (if you're willing to say) and why do you prefer that method. What does it do for you that adding/taking out toe will take away?
 
Front: .25 to .50 and rear .05 to .1 (all positive). It gives me more control with huge angles.
 
I did run .25 on the front and -.010 on the rear, then I found out I had it backwards so I switched and my cars feel a lot more stable and gripper. Try -.20 to -.30 on the front and .05 to .015 on the rear.

This is from Dai Yoshiara

Front Toe
You want to run a slight amount of toe out, typically about 1/8-inch total; this will help your car initiate better by turning in sharper. This makes a big difference when you’re trying to feint. Too much toe out makes the car twitchy, so I don’t recommend more than ¼-inch toe out.

This is a subject that has a lot of misconceptions, as many people try to tune how the car is balanced in drift by adjusting the rear toe. You shouldn’t run too much rear toe-in on a drift car. By doing so, you’ll have a car that will straighten up if the throttle is lifted or modulated. This is the leading cause of serious drift car crashes. A car’s understeer/oversteer balance should always be adjusted in the suspension, not by using the toe. If you want the car looser, with more oversteer, increase the rear bar stiffness and/or rear spring rate and stiffen the rear shock. If you want to tighten up the car, with less oversteer, run softer rear bar, spring and shock.

Rear Toe
Run a little toe in — usually, you want to run about 1/8-inch. Cars with semi-trailing arm rear suspensions like BMW E30s, Nissan Z31s and S12s can run more like ¼-inch toe in, as these cars will toe out under roll. If you’re having trouble making angle in high-speed turns, run zero rear toe, but never run rear toe out — that will make your car very twitchy.
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Toe out is negative and toe in is positive. 👍
 
^ +1

Pretty much how I have my toe angles tuned. I do make my rear toe more positive, though, if the tracks have a lot of banked turns (ie, Deep Forest, Cape Ring). To me, increasing toe helps control the car through the banked turn.

Front toe: I usually run -.5 to -.3 for lowered powered cars. -.3 to -.15 for higher powered
Rear toe: 0.05-0.1 (at most)

Usually I can control transitioning speed with throttle modulations. But having a certain setting of negative toe angle, as explained above, can help with making snappier, more quick transitions.
 
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Thank you eric and marc! :dopey: 👍👍

Toe out up (-) front makes my car smoother while drifting but also slows it down, toe in, in the rear (+) stabilizes the car in the straights and corner exits.

I am extremely surprised people are running opposite of what you are supposed to run on a car. I mean why would you want toe out out back that doesn't do anything except make you car extremely unstable. 👍👍
 
CJDA9
Thank you eric and marc! :dopey: 👍👍

Toe out up (-) front makes my car smoother while drifting but also slows it down, toe in, in the rear (+) stabilizes the car in the straights and corner exits.

I am extremely surprised people are running opposite of what you are supposed to run on a car. I mean why would you want toe out out back that doesn't do anything except make you car extremely unstable. 👍👍
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Lol I did that for awhile until Fast pounded on me that it messing me up. I did research and found he was right.
 
CJDA9
Thank you eric and marc! :dopey: 👍👍

Toe out up (-) front makes my car smoother while drifting but also slows it down, toe in, in the rear (+) stabilizes the car in the straights and corner exits.

I am extremely surprised people are running opposite of what you are supposed to run on a car. I mean why would you want toe out out back that doesn't do anything except make you car extremely unstable. 👍👍
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I run very negative in the rear and I get really smooth runs with it. Though the only problem I do have is in a straight line there is some wobble but when it's in drift it's as stable as ever! Maybe the negative rear toe helps me squeeze some wheel spin out my car since i dont have much torque?
 
Dm run negative on front and positive in the rear. Give drive me more turn in and ability to drive out the corner alot harder.
 
Negative toe in gt5 is toe out meaning the front of your tires are pointing out. I have been doing some research and it seems toe out in the rear actually gives you less grip in your rear tires making it easier to get your car loose.

Also I am going to have to somewhat retract the last post I made here. People have and do use toe out in the rear for drifting in a real car but it seems like with most things, to much of a something can be bad. sure if you have toe out it will make your car loose but to much of it will make your car slow, unstable, and want to spin out. It all just comes down to personal preference I think. 👍👍

edit: I dont really know how toe in (+) up front would effect a car but I choose to run toe out (-) up front. It just makes the car smoother, and of course the toe in out back makes your car faster on the exits of drifts at least that's what I feel through the wheel.
 
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Well this only seems to benefit those that use a wheel. I had a couple friends try it on DS3's and they did not like the response.
 
I mostly use toe angle in racing. Haven't really looked into drifting with it.
Something i should try maybe 👍
 
I use Negative toe on both. It really depends how you like your car to behave. All you really need to do is experiment I guess see which you prefer? Tuning isn't something someone can tell you that is wrong, it's all about the feel!
 
D-Max
I use Negative toe on both. It really depends how you like your car to behave. All you really need to do is experiment I guess see which you prefer? Tuning isn't something someone can tell you that is wrong, it's all about the feel!
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Suspension maybe, but diffs need to be locked imo :p No way out of it :)
 
DS3 users tend to have neg ative up front and positive in the rear. Wheel users I have noticed use positive at both ends.
 
anthaliscious
Well this only seems to benefit those that use a wheel. I had a couple friends try it on DS3's and they did not like the response.
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I tried both (f) -1.00, (r) +1.00; and (f) +1.00, (r) -1.00 after you shared your settings with me. The latter was very difficult to control on the ds3. The other one was actually very stable, yet still responsive (as would be expected, if my understanding of toe is correct)...but it was also quite unpredictable at times, most notably when feathering the throttle. I would get very random snap-back during transitions.

I believe the reason for this is explained in Dia's explanation of toe (the part where he's describing settings that lead to a lot of really bad drift crashes).

As most other ds3 users have said, I tend to use -0.20 to -0.50 up front, and 0.00 to +0.10 in the rear. I didn't arrive at these parameters on my own though...learned them from the guys on my team.
 
That's how my car handles, really hard transitions. Mainly what the problem is for DS3's is not being able to achieve as much steer lock as a wheel user.
 
I have my front toe usually at excess -.20 to compensate for the wheels being so flappy when i counter steer the car due to using the ds3, at the same time transitions are much more sensitive to the steering input, which is good to a certain extent. When i put even more negative toe, I feel that transitions are way too sensitive.

Rear toes run from near stock numbers to +.10 for rear stability, as i don't like the continuous twitch that usually occurs when you run negative rear toes.
 
seems like we can all agree that average wheel tunes have -0.2 to -0.0 front toe and 0.0 to 0.2 in the rear.
 
Well really a little more toe on the front. I've ran all the way up to -.50 on the front. It depends on the car.
 
Well if its a really under steer car like bad cant even get sideways ill lower it in the rear to about 0.05 and don't EVER go as high as 0.57 other wise my cars feel's to stiff and just about every car is at -1.00 in the front even though its slower i make my car faster in different ways lol anyways you pretty much know how me and Dan tune DM :p

Also this has nothing to do with drifting but i always go positive in the rear on FWD when i touge so my car doesn't understeer as bad and rotates the rear end thus why i never go into the positives in the rear when drifting. Its causes to much oversteer BUT i have put it in the positive to drift a 150 HP 86 on NUR
 
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Gonales
Suspension maybe, but diffs need to be locked imo :p No way out of it :)
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Why of course :)

Major thing I've noticed, is that without a decent diff setting, wheel drifting is very difficult. DS3, I didn't even tune the diff lol
 
I usually try to run 0 toe on my cars because I don't like how most of them feel and react but my best car that does everything I want it to do has positive toe front and rear. But this has changed with the updates as they keep changing things that affect how the car feels. I have had it at 0, positive front 0 rear, negative front positive rear, and now positive and positive.
The car can hold massive angles easily, and I drive it on full lock. (G25 user) I honestly hate mustangs but it has been my main drift car for a long time now because of the torque and how surprisingly good it feels. Even with it weighing over 1500kg.
 
For my lower powered cars I run about +20 on front and -5 to-15 on the rear to make it more slidey but with more powerful and torquey cars which need to be more stable and controllable I run +5 to +30 up front (depending on car weight and how understeery it is) and +5 to +15 on rear. The toe in a car can change a lot about how stable the car can drive in a straight line and initiate a drift, especially on the rear tyres. Front toe is more about subduing understeer.
 

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