Toyota gt 86: disappointment?

obsessive rules

obsessive rules

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warmachine277-
Recently I fell in love with the 86 after receiving the new brochure but, remember the concept?

Toyota%252CFT+86+Concept%252CToyota%252CToyota%252CToyota%252CToyota%252CToyota%252CToyota%252CToyota%252CToyota%252CFT+86%252CFT+86%252CFT+86%252CFT+86%252CFT+86%252CConcept%252CConcept%252CConcept%252CConcept%252CConcept%252CConcept%252CConcept+%252839%2529.jpg


Same power as the gt86 but 200kg less. It also lost some cool features like the wheels, TFT speedo and rear lights. Then this.

toyota_ft-86_ii_live_01.jpg


This design was "95% complete". I was impressed. Then I heard rumours of the weight an price gain (£5k!) over Toyotas original target and for what? A sat nav and luxuries to make it more bearable. The ft86 had a TFT screen with a map in it. Should of kept that, then Toyota (although these are rumours) push the cars production date back into 2012 from November 2011. I love the gt but... It's not all the car could be.

Rant over.
 
Using the Ford GT as an example is pretty bad as the GT's design is based on a car that was from 30 years earlier so there wasn't going to be much changed on it.
 
It's a little different comparing a mass-market coupe with a limited-run hundreds-of-grand supercar (edit - and what GTPorsche said above).

There are several reasons why cars don't make it from concept to production unchanged, and I expect some of those affected the GT86. I can't think of a car for less than double the Toyota's price that uses TFT dials in place of analogue ones. I expect the rear lights were too expensive to put into production too.

And I'm glad the production car didn't look identical to the FT-86 II concept - it was a bit overdone, a bit Fast & Furious for my liking. The production car is a much cleaner design.
 
homeforsummer
It's a little different comparing a mass-market coupe with a limited-run hundreds-of-grand supercar (edit - and what GTPorsche said above).

There are several reasons why cars don't make it from concept to production unchanged, and I expect some of those affected the GT86. I can't think of a car for less than double the Toyota's price that uses TFT dials in place of analogue ones. I expect the rear lights were too expensive to put into production too.

And I'm glad the production car didn't look identical to the FT-86 II concept - it was a bit overdone, a bit Fast & Furious for my liking. The production car is a much cleaner design.
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Im saying I would have preferred it to owe a lot more to the ft 86 rather than the ft 86 ii. Anyway TFT would probably add up to as much as the nav n analogue dials with the LEDs. And Toyota themselves estimated a 20k price tag. What caused the hike? Lights wouldn't make much difference as

Toyota_FT-86_Concept_studio_photoshoot_rear_lights_bumper_11.jpg


It would be simpler linking rear brake lights and the spoiler braking light together with red plastic. Instead they redesigned it all leaving pretty much no trace of the ft86 in the gt86.
 
Yeah, i think it's a shame the car lost it's resemblance to the original concept so much, i disagree with homeforsummer's personal opinion of it being a cleaner design.. the production version shouts far more: 'fast & furious' for me, though i do agree about the rear lights being maybe too expensive to achieve, it could also have been a compromise to appease Subaru (clear style lenses to tie in with their current language etc)... keep costs down, share the same, works for all approach.

Another thing to bare in mind is that, sometimes certain body panels and certain curves (although looking quite simple), can actually cause major headaches when it comes to mass production, (was discussing the topic several years ago with a guy that works within the industry and knows a lot about car design/manufacturing tooling). which could be another reason some production cars lose some resemblance to their concept version.
 
I'm just thinking what was the point in the original ft86 if Toyota didn't use the design. I still cannot understand where the 200kg and the price hike came from though.
 
Concept cars have almost never been similar in appearance to their production car versions. If you want to ask that question, you may as well ask "what's the point of concept cars?" first.
 
1241Penguin
Concept cars have almost never been similar in appearance to their production car versions. If you want to ask that question, you may as well ask "what's the point of concept cars?" first.
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True, though there are some remarkable exceptions.
 
Those weren't the cars i was thinking of, but yeah, they're good examples.. and mass produced too, i'm guessing the communication and relationship between the designers,engineers/tooling department & bean counters must have been pretty strong when it came to those 2 cars.
 
At 1ness
i disagree with homeforsummer's personal opinion of it being a cleaner design..
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That's because you read my post wrongly.

It's not a cleaner design than the original concept. It is a cleaner design than the FT-86 II concept, the bespoilered, LED-clad black car in the first post.

obsessive rules
Anyway TFT would probably add up to as much as the nav n analogue dials with the LEDs.
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I'm not sure what draws you to that conclusion. I'll say again: There are no cars under about fifty grand with TFT instruments. Off the top of my head, you can find them on the Jag XJ, the Range Rover, the new Tesla Model S, and possibly a small group of others. That being the case, it's a fair assumption that they're too expensive.

obsessive rules
And Toyota themselves estimated a 20k price tag.
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You may be right, but if they did, then bear in mind just how long it took to get the GT 86 to market - the FT-86 concept was first shown in 2009. Between then and release, there was very little information about the car, and even rumours at one stage that the car was to grow significantly to be a Supra-like GT with a much higher pricetag, as Toyota/Subaru couldn't justify a cheaper model.

That being the case...

obsessive rules
What caused the hike?
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Reality.

obsessive rules
It would be simpler linking rear brake lights and the spoiler braking light together with red plastic.
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Not sure what leads you to that conclusion. If it had been simpler, they'd probably have done it. There was almost certainly some cost/regulations requirement that made them go for the tail lights they eventually went for.

Instead they redesigned it all leaving pretty much no trace of the ft86 in the gt86.
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Apart from the general overall shape, and the concept itself.

obsessive rules
Mini coupe concept.
Mini coupe.

Focus st concept.
Focus st
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Those cars were essentially production cars anyway, you realise?

It's like saying "BMW M3 Concept"

bmw_m3_concept_1.JPG


Oh wow! It looks like the M3! Well yes, because their "concept" is essentially an actual M3 released a handful of months before the identical production car emerges. The Focus ST and the MINI Coupe were basically the same thing. More often than not, a proper concept car (i.e. not a production car with the word "concept" applied to it) is rather different from the eventual production car.
 
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homeforsummer
That's because you read my post wrongly.

It's not a cleaner design than the original concept. It is a cleaner design than the FT-86 II concept, the bespoilered, LED-clad black car in the first post.

My bad, not the 1st time iv'e done that.. probably won't be the last.



Those cars were essentially production cars anyway, you realise?

It's like saying "BMW M3 Concept"


Oh wow! It looks like the M3! Well yes, because their "concept" is essentially an actual M3 released a handful of months before the identical production car emerges. The Focus ST and the MINI Coupe were basically the same thing. More often than not, a proper concept car (i.e. not a production car with the word "concept" applied to it) is rather different from the eventual production car.
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Yeah, in hindsight probably not the greatest examples, personally, i was thinking more along the lines of the Honda CRZ concept car and the production version (not with regards to interior though), i feel that car in particular crossed over better than the Toyota concept/production car, that's not to say the CRZ has no changes to it's concept.. but i feel it's a lot closer.

[EDIT]

The original Audi TT (1995 Frankfurt Motor Show Concept), would be another fine example i think.

Honda SSM, changed the front lights (wouldn't pass headlight height regs i imagine), so add additional headlights.. replace original front lights with vents, slightly enlarge the rear clusters... Bingo!, practically an S2000, (probably not the best example, but still good, i feel).

Nissan's 'Pike' series cars (from the mid to late 80's), 4 went into production (with exception of the 'Chapeau') after interest was shown, all 4 were concept cars (albeit retro styled), very little-to-no changes were made exterior wise.

Oh, and funnily enough, the (1987 Tokyo concept car) Toyota AXV-II.. otherwise known as the Toyota Sera, a concept car that even kept the glass bubble top roof/gullwing doors.

I'm not disagreeing about concept cars rarely baring any resemblance to their production versions, just pointing out that there are a few exceptions out there.
 
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obsessive rules
I'm just thinking what was the point in the original ft86 if Toyota didn't use the design. I still cannot understand where the 200kg and the price hike came from though.
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Easy. The introduction of modern requirements & production design change. In turn, price hike.
 
This is like Citroën C1, Peugeot 107 and the
Toyota Aygo, (not in GT5), they're indentic, but the only exception is the badges.
 
R1600Turbo
Exactly. :dopey:
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Yes, this is a discussion thread about wether you think the 86 is disappointing whereas in that thread you can talk about anything and stuff like this would get buried under people asking what the 86 looks like in red or post about brochures Toyota sent you.
 
obsessive rules
Yes, this is a discussion thread about wether you think the 86 is disappointing whereas in that thread you can talk about anything and stuff like this would get buried under people asking what the 86 looks like in red or post about brochures Toyota sent you.
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The thread I made is more or less for this.

The fact you feel your disappointment is enough to merit a thread is telling. More so when even has made it pretty clear you'd have to be crazy to think a concept for a mass production car will ever be the actual final product. Especially for a car that has been in development for years.
 

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