Upgrading from a Logitech G25, any suggestions?

  • Thread starter Marcus96
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Marcus96

Marcus96

53
United Kingdom
Doncaster
Supermarioking
Hello, I am a long term user of a Logitech G25 racing wheel which I purchased back at the 2009 new year. I managed to get the wheel for £150 (roughly $180 or €172.50) and have been impressed that I got a lot of bang for my buck with the wheel, shifter and pedal set all bundled together (unlike modern packages not including a shifter). I have been using the wheel quite heavily since purchase and I am happy to say that it is still going as strong as day one (that thing literally does not want to die). However unfortunately PS4 is not compatible with this wheel, so I will not be able to use it to enjoy GT Sport, ProjectCARS, DriveClub etc. so I am stuck playing them with a DS4 meanwhile my G25 and Playseat Evolution go to waste collecting dust in the corner of a room. Because of this, I am now looking for an upgrade.

I am currently torn between a few upgrade choices:

Logitech G29: Due to me being a long time fan of my G29, I initially started to research the G29. Apparently it is a slight upgrade to the G25 in terms of FFB and smoothness, however my budget does permit a more expensive wheel. My main concern is the notchiness of the gear driven wheel. I never noticed this with the G25 for all those years until I recently got my licence and now start driving a real car, the notchiness is very apparent and now difficult to not notice, resulting in the G25 now feeling a little toy like. My other concern is the centre deadzone (no FFB when the wheel is dead centre) which is apprently due to the twin-motor gear driven design. Also the Driving Force Shifter (while I do consider purchasing as a future add on) is apprently very toy like feeling (same case with G25 shifter compared to that of a real car) and will not work with the PS3, rendering it useless in GT6. However the pedal do look like a big upgrade over that of the G25 and the stock T300RS 2-pedal set. COST: £175 ($210/€200)

Thrustmaster T150 + G25 pedal adapter: This is a the next wheel I started to research after the G29. It is apparently much smoother than the G29 and better feeling FFB than the G29 also, however I have raised concerns for it's cheap and plasticky build quality. Making me uncertain of purchasing this wheel. COST: £150 ($180/€170)

Thrustmaster T300RS + G25 pedal adapter: I feel like this would be a big step up in experience to that I am having with my G25, with a much smoother belt driven system. The wheel also appears to be made of much higher quality than the G29 and T150 and I also like the Playstation branding on the wheel. I understand that the stock T300RS pedals are quite poor, however for £10 ($12/€11.50) I can purchase Thrustmaster's TRJ.12 to DB9 pedal adapter so I can continue using my G25 pedals. Which also sells me is the TH8A shifter (which I do also consider purchasing as a future add on), which is 100% metal in build quality and apprently feels like a real car shifter. This is the choice I am thinking of going for. COST: £225 ($270/€260).

Thrustmaster T300RS GT Edition (T3PA Bundle): This is the same wheel, however this one has Gran Turismo branding instead of Playstation branding and also includes a set of T3PA pedals with upgraded pedal faces. This one looks interesting however I am unsure of the GT branding. However the big question is, are the T3PA pedals a big upgrade to the Logitech G25 pedals with the GTEye brake spring (an upgrade I could consider), the T3PA could probably means more holes needing to be drilled in my Playseat Evolution to mount them. Also apprently the GT Edition has some reliability issues. COST: £300 (£360/€345)

What Should I Go For?

I think I am most considering the Thrustmaster T300RS + G25 pedal adapter. However I would like someone to give thier opinion on which one I should go for before I make the purchase.
 
I haven't tried those wheels - I have a T500RS with a TH8RS shifter. The TH8A is an update of the TH8RS - it is more lifelike than a Logitech shifter and adds to the immersion of driving, however the weight and resistance of the throw is not like driving a real car. I mainly do online racing and an H pattern shifter is not fast enough for online racing with a console so mine gets very little use. Whether to get a shifter or not depends on your budget and how much you are likely to use it.

I have a friend with a Thrustmaster T150 - it was good enough for him to win an online championship with against people with mainly more expensive wheels. The big advantage of the T300 over the T150 is that the wheel rims can be swapped - however, how often will you do that? I very rarely swap rims on my T500 because it is a bit of a faff to do so.

If you are happy with your current pedals, most of a sim racers speed comes from his pedal set, not his choice of wheel - therefore it probably makes sense to stick with your pedals so what you are proposing sounds sensible.
 
Sick Cylinder
The big advantage of the T300 over the T150 is that the wheel rims can be swapped
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The big advantage of the T300 over the T150 is the friction free mechanism.I now work on a friction free mod for my T150 and the difference in the force feedback is huge(the wheel is much more precise,smooth,fast and I can feel much more details in the force feedback,especially around the center)
Marcus96
However the big question is, are the T3PA pedals a big upgrade to the Logitech G25 pedals with the GTEye brake spring (an upgrade I could consider)
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Orayani
Are the G25 pedals the same resolution as the G29?

Animera, what do the T3PA pedals not do for you that the Logitech delivers? Hmm, don't like the sound of that. Logitech 8 bit, 256 steps. Thrustmaster 10 bit, 1024 steps.
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Animera
I prefer the resistance of the G29 pedals over the default and T3PA pedals.
Also, the Ricmotech adapter turns Logitech Pedals to 10-bit Resolution when used on 10-bit Wheels.
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Marcus96
Thrustmaster T300RS + G25 pedal adapter: I feel like this would be a big step up in experience to that I am having with my G25, with a much smoother belt driven system. The wheel also appears to be made of much higher quality than the G29 and T150 and I also like the Playstation branding on the wheel. I understand that the stock T300RS pedals are quite poor, however for £10 ($12/€11.50) I can purchase Thrustmaster's TRJ.12 to DB9 pedal adapter so I can continue using my G25 pedals. Which also sells me is the TH8A shifter (which I do also consider purchasing as a future add on), which is 100% metal in build quality and apprently feels like a real car shifter. This is the choice I am thinking of going for. COST: £225 ($270/€260).
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👍
 
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Going back to GT4, I've owned a Logitech DFP, then a G25, finally a G27. At GT5 release I bought a Thrustmaster T500, but now have a Fanatec Clubsport.

The Thrustmaster was one of the most unreliable pieces of electronics (or anything, for that matter) I have ever owned, and I could not in good faith recommend that brand to anyone.

They actually have you self install your own repairs (such as cooling fans) and when I asked for a shipping refund when I returned my F1 rim to them after it failed the 3rd time, they asked me for wiring details for my bank account! How's that for service?

In terms of initial quality, if you can afford a Clubsport, you might think of adding it to your list. If not, I would recommend the G29.
 
EDK
The Thrustmaster was one of the most unreliable pieces of electronics (or anything, for that matter) I have ever owned, and I could not in good faith recommend that brand to anyone.
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Luckily I'm still on the same T500 after 5 or 6 years of regular use. They do get hot and the fans need to stay on for about 40 minutes after you stop racing - this means leaving the console switched on.
 
Sick Cylinder
Luckily I'm still on the same T500 after 5 or 6 years of regular use. They do get hot and the fans need to stay on for about 40 minutes after you stop racing - this means leaving the console switched on.
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Might be mine was part of a bad batch, but @WRP001 and I had similar experiences. Lots and lots of use with running WRS, and he ended up buying a second one from a friend that effectively became a "parts wheel". :lol:

BTW, mine lives on with @Gravitron up in Seattle, I donated it to him when I bought the Clubsport. But I expect a lot more in terms of reliability, build quality and service for $500+.
 
EDK
Might be mine was part of a bad batch, but @WRP001 and I had similar experiences. Lots and lots of use with running WRS, and he ended up buying a second one from a friend that effectively became a "parts wheel". :lol:

BTW, mine lives on with @Gravitron up in Seattle, I donated it to him when I bought the Clubsport. But I expect a lot more in terms of reliability, build quality and service for $500+.
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The service to you from Thrustmaster was obviously very poor - hopefully their customer service and reliability have improved, but I remember from reading GTPlanet and other sites that Fanatec used to have lots of reliability problems and Logitech also had some problems - though probably less than Thrustmaster and Fanatec. I would be very upset if my wheel failed and definitely couldn't go back to a hand controller.
 
I am more of a console racer (PS4), however I do have one PC sim, that is ProjectCARS.

I strongly agree about Fanatec. Back in 2012 I tried to upgrade my G25 to a CSR Wheel, CSR Elite Pedals and CSR Shifter Set. Didn't like it and had countless issues with it. The one week I owned it before returning it for a refund was an absolute nightmare. It only lasted a few days until the force feedback stopped working and the rim started to fall apart.

In terms of Thrustmaster reliability, I am thinking of giving it a go (just for a change). Just noticed a problem with the T150, and that is that apparently it cannot be hard mounted, meaning it cannot be mounted to my Playseat Evolution. As for the T300RS, I am struggling to decide whether I should go the standard T300RS and get the G25 pedal adapter or go for the GT Edition, which includes the T3PA pedals.
 
Marcus96
I am more of a console racer (PS4), however I do have one PC sim, that is ProjectCARS.

I strongly agree about Fanatec. Back in 2012 I tried to upgrade my G25 to a CSR Wheel, CSR Elite Pedals and CSR Shifter Set. Didn't like it and had countless issues with it. The one week I owned it before returning it for a refund was an absolute nightmare. It only lasted a few days until the force feedback stopped working and the rim started to fall apart.

In terms of Thrustmaster reliability, I am thinking of giving it a go (just for a change). Just noticed a problem with the T150, and that is that apparently it cannot be hard mounted, meaning it cannot be mounted to my Playseat Evolution. As for the T300RS, I am struggling to decide whether I should go the standard T300RS and get the G25 pedal adapter or go for the GT Edition, which includes the T3PA pedals.
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I would get the Alcantara Edition - this includes the T3PA, but also get the adapter. If you prefer your Logitech pedals and they work fine you can always sell the Thrustmaster pedals.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B014UOF0S8/?tag=gtplanetuk-20
 
Thank you Sick Cylinder! You have now given me another consideration.

I have done further research regarding the T3PA pedals and it appears that they have 20% deadzone (which Thrustmaster did on purpose to ensure accurate calibration remains over the lifetime of the pedal set), which I would not be able to live with. Thus, I would sell the T3PA pedals.

So simply the cost of both wheels would come to:

T300RS: £225
T300RS Alcantara (after selling T3PA pedals): £335 - £75??? = £260

So the overall question would be, would the Alcantara rim be worth the extra £35?
 
It actually appears that the stock 2-pedal set that comes with the T300RS resale for £40+ on eBay (as I will not be using them).

The real question is, what does the rubber wheel feel like on the stock T500RS rim, is it a good quality rubber. The alcantara rim looks good, however I have raised concerns that the oils from my hands could change the colour and feeling of the wheel over time (as I do not wear gloves to race).

P.S. This isn't really matter, but I also feel a little unsure about the Ferrari branding (as I hardly ever race them).
 
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Basically it all comes down to reliability (Logitech) vs better wheel FFB (Thrustmaster). The G25 pedals with adapter is good enough for most scenarios, and you can mod the brake spring later on anyway if you need more resistance. The big loss is none packages a shifter with the wheel anymore, but for me I don't use the shifter with my G25 all that much anyway, so it's not a big concern.

Depending on your budget and/or whether you need the wheel absolutely right now, I'd advise to wait until GTS drops. There is still the mystery Thrustmaster wheel to be unveiled (possibly direct drive), possibility of a console version of the TS-PC Racer wheel, or even a higher end Logitech wheel.

If you need to buy one right now though, I would go with T300 RS GT Edition. That is the one I'm having my eye on. And pray to the reliability gods you don't get a dud batch.
 
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Thanks for all the support. I am unsure whether to go the G29, Thrustmaster or wait for a new wheel to be released approach.

Before I started searching for a new wheel, I initially did some research on the ChronuxMax (or MaxRace) adapters. This research only lasted for 5 minutes. They simple make your DFGT/G25/G27 wheels be recognised as a DS4. This means no real steering syncronisation, fake FFB, no H-Pattern, no clutch, etc. So I decided to drop that idea.

However I now have my eye set on something else! :-)

Cross Hair Converter!

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Cross-Hai...115074?hash=item4aeb2c16c2:g:Bf0AAOSwv0tVbrKs



By the looks of it, it appears that it makes your DFGT/G25/G27 wheels be recognised as a G29/G920 wheel. This allows real wheel behaviour (in terms of syncronisation), real FFB, 6+1 shifter and clutch support. Oh, and when I previous said "G920" I can also get my G25 to work with the Xbox One too! :D

I think this is well worth taking a gamble for the sake of £90 as I have no problems with my G25 (from the exception of no native PS4 compatibility of course).
 
Marcus96
Before I started searching for a new wheel, I initially did some research on the ChronuxMax (or MaxRace) adapters. This research only lasted for 5 minutes. They simple make your DFGT/G25/G27 wheels be recognised as a DS4. This means no real steering syncronisation, fake FFB, no H-Pattern, no clutch, etc. So I decided to drop that idea.
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While that may have been true a while ago, it's no longer the case with CronusMax Plus. They have a new PS4 Wheel Edition mode that allows you to use your G25 on PS4 via the G29 driver, & yes you get proper FFB & everything. Not treid it myself, but it's a cheaper way than buying a new wheel.

I also bought a G25 in 2009, & it's still going strong - awesome piece of kit. I managed to get a G29 for PS4 & have to say that I'm unimpressed with it. I also got a Fanatec GT2 & CSR & like them more than the Logitech gear, but Fanatec & $ony have done the dirty so they will not be supported for anymore games. I'm thinking about getting the CronusMax Plus with the PS4 Wheel Edition mode & using my Fanatec gear on PS4. Don't know what to do at present, my budget is severely limited.
 
Sick Cylinder
I haven't tried those wheels - I have a T500RS with a TH8RS shifter. The TH8A is an update of the TH8RS - it is more lifelike than a Logitech shifter and adds to the immersion of driving, however the weight and resistance of the throw is not like driving a real car. I mainly do online racing and an H pattern shifter is not fast enough for online racing with a console so mine gets very little use. Whether to get a shifter or not depends on your budget and how much you are likely to use it.
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Have you looked at the Richmotec short shifter adapter for the TH8A?

Its well worth the money as it transforms the throw distance and as a result the speed.
 
Marcus96
Thank you Sick Cylinder! You have now given me another consideration.

I have done further research regarding the T3PA pedals and it appears that they have 20% deadzone (which Thrustmaster did on purpose to ensure accurate calibration remains over the lifetime of the pedal set), which I would not be able to live with. Thus, I would sell the T3PA pedals.

So simply the cost of both wheels would come to:

T300RS: £225
T300RS Alcantara (after selling T3PA pedals): £335 - £75??? = £260

So the overall question would be, would the Alcantara rim be worth the extra £35?
Click to expand...

Those T3PA deadzones are brutal. As for the Logitech, they certainly have lovely feeling of the pedal faces. I put two of them on the T3PA Pro. Feels so nice. So many nice upgrades for the Logitech pedals as well from loadcell to alternate springs and custom springs/travel.





Alcantara review.
 
Now strongly considering the ChronusMax. The 'Wheel Edition Mode' really sells it for me! Thank you VBR and gt_fan!

It's amazing how not only the DFGT/G25/G27 wheels will work with PS4 but also all of the Fanatec wheels. The Fanatec wheels look good any many people say how they are better than Logtiech wheels, so I must of just had a bad batch wheel.

I also like how I can still play older style racing/arcade games if I wan't (i.e. Race Driver GRiD) because Thrustmaster wheels do not natively support legacy games like that (it emulated as DS3). It will also be amazing if I can get my G25 working on Xbox One with Forza Horizon 2. :-)
 
Marcus96
Now strongly considering the ChronusMax. The 'Wheel Edition Mode' really sells it for me! Thank you VBR and gt_fan!
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They're also working on an entirely new product exclusively for wheel users on console. Use any wheel on any console in any game type of thing. It's still in prototype/beta testing.

See post 6: http://cronusmax.com/forums/showthr...el-product?s=0a98296d699ff147274fbb2b908798d9

Don't know whether to get the CMP with PS4 Wheel Edition Mode, or wait for the new product.

Choices choices!


:D
 
Form post 6: It is a dedicated Racing Wheel product that will be compatible with Xbox One and PS4. The PS4 Wheel Edition fw of the CronusMAX is just a taste of what it is capable of.
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Now that would be something but I wonder if that is even possible.
 
gt_fan
Now that would be something but I wonder if that is even possible.
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It seems to be, as they've already made the prototype & are testing it as we speak.
 
I have just ordered the ChronusMax Plus, the Amazon Basics USB 2.0 Hub and a copy of DriveClub to test my G25's capability with the PS4. I will keep you updated when it arrives. :-)
 
Marcus96
I will keep you updated when it arrives. :-)
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Please do! I would love to know about how good your G25 feels, especially any latency of bugs etc. Just remember that DC isn't a sim, physics are unrealistic. But it's a great game.

All the best.

:)
 
I have had my ChronusMax for a few days and so far and I am happy to report that my G25 works fantastic with the PS4. FFB, H-Pattern Shifter, Clutch Pedal and all of the buttons work flawlessly. There is no input lag to what I notice (The menu navigation and camera changes are instant to me pressing a button on the wheel). Just plug your G25 and DS4 into the USB Hub (I use the Amazon Basics 4-Port Hub), then plug the USB Hub into the ChronusMax then into the PS4 and simply forget about it. :-) (Do not turn on the DS4, boot the PS4 by the power button on the unit itself).

PLEASE NOTE: The FFB in DriveClub is not very impressive. I doubt this is the ChronusMax/G25, I think it's just the game. It feels a bit like you are driving on ice in some cars and the FFB is not all that much. I will have to get ProjectCARS at a later date to further test this. I improved the performance of DriveClub by keeping the wheel rotation at 720 Degrees, setting FFB to 100, turning of steering assistance and setting the vibration to Medium.
 
Marcus96
I have had my ChronusMax for a few days and so far and I am happy to report that my G25 works fantastic with the PS4. FFB, H-Pattern Shifter, Clutch Pedal and all of the buttons work flawlessly. There is no input lag to what I notice (The menu navigation and camera changes are instant to me pressing a button on the wheel). Just plug your G25 and DS4 into the USB Hub (I use the Amazon Basics 4-Port Hub), then plug the USB Hub into the ChronusMax then into the PS4 and simply forget about it. :-) (Do not turn on the DS4, boot the PS4 by the power button on the unit itself).
Click to expand...

Thanks for the feedback, much appreciated. I may very well have to invest in one of these things in the not too distant future.


:cheers:
 
super_gt
The big advantage of the T300 over the T150 is the friction free mechanism.I now work on a friction free mod for my T150 and the difference in the force feedback is huge(the wheel is much more precise,smooth,fast and I can feel much more details in the force feedback,especially around the center)




👍
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Friction free mod? Got a link? I don't like the slow, grindy feeling of my T150
 

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