What influences PD?

  • Thread starter Thread starter dtn23
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skubaben
But we are the site with moste GT players "gatherd" Atleast i think:sly:
So depends on how u see it
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No, not really. Just because you're in a loud group, that doesn't mean you get to have your way. Poli/Sci 101.
 
dtn23
I'm not sure if anyone can provide a true answer to this, but I can't help but wonder who is pushing PD into the actions they take. With the overwhelming negative response from some of their actions, why don't they listen more to the majority?

I just wanna know, if it isn't the fan base, who are they listening to when they do things like 1.07 and such?
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Great question. Personally I think they ARE listening to the boards and that any confusion in the message "we" (collectively) are sending out is due to people complaining louder about the things they don't like, when compared to praising the things they do like. Hence the "silent majority" go about enjoying the game whilst a small section barrack PD for changes which suit them. When the change is implemented, these people shut up and the new affected group start moaning - so PD either revert back to the original state of affairs, or make a compromise (ie seasonal events went from "too hard" to "too easy" to "set own level with guidelines", and from single high rate payout to repeatable lesser payout)

If they didn't know already, they are fast realising that the proverb "can't please all the people all of the time" holds more than a little water.

I'm waiting for patch 1.1 - where you set your own xp and credit payouts for all the races, set the gifting limit (if any), alter the gold/silver/bronze times in the challenges and decide the xp required to level up for each level. Best thing about it is - people will still moan. :banghead:

But should make for an easy platinum :lol:

What I find strangest about GT5 is that 3 months after release they doubled all xp payouts. Surely they would have / could have / should have realised way before release that the leveling up system was (at best) too tough and at worse broken? But then again others probably love it :dopey:
 
White & Nerdy
They seem very vunerable to relative minorities blowing non-issues (i.e. duping) out of proportion, but far less responsive to majorites complaining about the annoying changes made to please the minorities.
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Well said 👍

That seems to be what bugs me about most of their changes. There were a huge number of people trading and a small group complaining about it. But the whiners got their way :/ thanks for the responses though guys :)
 
Wonder_Pets
{Shake...Shake...Shake] Oh Magic 8 Ball...will I get another white Skyline with my 1000 Ticket????

Magic 8 Ball: "All Signs Point To Yes"
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I would love a skyline for my 1000 ticket, I think I got the dihatsu(however you spell it) midget
 
honestly, I think it went down like this:

PD was rushing to get the product on the shelf before the holidays. They had too much time in the making.

They had a list of what else they would add (DLC and updates)

but then a loophole was discovered(duping) so they had to sort of for-go the "future plans that they didn't have time to put in the game from the get-go" and concentrate on fixing the "oops" they didn't have time to fully 'scenario'

between the GT Academy spoof/changes, and the EBAY dupe sales, etc...PD was ready with new, but instead had to fix old.

That's what I think.

metaphor coming/warning:

sometimes you have to assemble the vehicle before you can fully test it. seems like the "vehicle" we know as GT5 had a few flaws PD didn't see coming. Before they can give you the options(floor mats, DVD head rests, etc) they have to go back and fix that darn vibration people are complaining about.
 
I'm surprised by the answers. Why has no one said "to keep you playing" ? They want you to keep playing so they got rid of things that make it easy to get the cars you really want and make you work for them. Its not about whether or nit you like the game. They don't care. Its about whether or not they can keep you playing for the next 2 years. If you 100% other all cars in 6 months then they have nothing left to keep you playing. At least that's the way I see it.
 
snowxdadx3
Sony. Obviously Sony makes money on hardware. The sooner the hardware wears out, the sooner Sony can sell the PS4. Explains grinding.
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It should be time people stop blaming Sony and look at the facts. The only reason we have GT5 now is because Sony said "enough!" to PD. The unfinished state of this game is clear evidence Kaz would have taken years longer to release it. In order to sell consoles Sony needed this title out as soon as possible, a long time ago.

In my mind, it is also clear the driving influence for GT5 is still Kaz. Even the best have limitations. Kaz has shown his with GT5. The way this title was released is shameful. Same old formula only worst, much worst. Hundreds of badly ported cars and the flaws/limitations of the previous versions. Horrible AI, boring repetitive events without challenge, idiotic and lazily implemented penalty system, sloppy environmental detail (i.e. the Monza concrete signs), horrific engine and car sound effects, etc., etc., etc..

Since the release we have had one good patch, 1.0.6, allowing for the online sharing of end user designed tracks, and a few other improvements. Other than that, the game seems to be headed in the wrong direction, stifling. I never got into the trading/selling of cars, I was happy to see it develop as an unintended and vibrant alternative to acquiring cars through mindless grinding. All the good features have either come from fan based suggestions (pressure) or by copying what other titles were doing. After 5-6 years of development, GT5 is one of the biggest disappointments ever.

There is still hope. With luck and continued fan based pressure, this title can still become entertaining. Regardless, Kaz should be promoted to Admiral, someone else should be at the helm as Captain.
 
Justdiver
I'm surprised by the answers. Why has no one said "to keep you playing" ? They want you to keep playing so they got rid of things that make it easy to get the cars you really want and make you work for them. Its not about whether or nit you like the game. They don't care. Its about whether or not they can keep you playing for the next 2 years. If you 100% other all cars in 6 months then they have nothing left to keep you playing. At least that's the way I see it.
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Ummm. Not quite. I have cut my play time down by like 75% because of 1.07, and I've seen several threads saying the same thing. If they want us to play longer, they should've put more time into a-spec and less into working with the moral police :/
 
same, i used to play GT5 every day for at least an hour, since these restrictions on how people can play the game, which i see them as, they didnt like the way people chose to do things so changed the game accordingly, they have left a bitter taste in my mouth with regards to not just GT5 but PD aswell. Updates should add features, not take them away.

now PD can consider themselves lucky if i start up their game once or twice a week
 
Mobs want what they want without seeing the big picture or knowing the consequences. Their logic is determined largely by conformity of their immediate shared desires. Often only the smaller groups have the ability to harness impartiality because they can put reason before desire.
 
Voltaic, I totally agree with you in a lot of ways. But, while people complain about how "horrible" GT5 is, we still play games like FIFA11 or NHL11...that have the SAME glitches in them that they have had for several years. I'm not sticking up for GT5 by any means, because I think they did a lot wrong...no matter if it's their fault...or Sony's. But, it seems like there really isn't a video game company that cares about what they are doing. You can't honestly tell me that EA doesn't know about the curve shot, or the wrap-around glitches that are in every NHL title from the past 5 years...at least. They care about money, and know that no matter what, we the public will still buy their half a**ed products. Until video game companies actually start to care, we're going to continue to get half finished games, games with exploits, cheats, etc. It's sad, but true.
 
Hastatus
Mobs want what they want without seeing the big picture or knowing the consequences. Their logic is determined largely by conformity of their immediate shared desires. Often only the smaller groups have the ability to harness impartiality because they can put reason before desire.
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Mobs? Mobs aro those who follow blindly. I didn't necessarily agree with all the craziness of the car trading, but it sure was an alternative to mindless grinding in the hope you will have the money to buy that car you want when it posts in the used car dealership. I've been looking for the Vertigo and Esperante since the game came out, all I get are infinite Miatas and NSXs models in different colors/years. If you are going to remove the ability to trade the cars people are seeking, then make the availability of cars more rational and race money rewards more inline with real life. Everyone wins.

Logic? Logic this game has little. You buy a used car ¢xxx.xxx, if you sell it you get ¢xx? 24 hour races straight (without saving)? Right, that's real life. Waaah... weeeh...weeeh engine sounds for a game that arrogantly claims to be "the real driving simulator"? The sound effects immersive are not, a turn off they are. Hundreds of low polygon identical (and heavily pixellated graphics) cars changing only the year or the name?

These guys don't have a clue. A well designed game has good ground rules. Once in the wild, if it is to endure, it is supposed to develop a life of its own.
 
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Wonder_Pets
Voltaic, I totally agree with you in a lot of ways. But, while people complain about how "horrible" GT5 is, we still play games like FIFA11 or NHL11...that have the SAME glitches in them that they have had for several years. I'm not sticking up for GT5 by any means, because I think they did a lot wrong...no matter if it's their fault...or Sony's. But, it seems like there really isn't a video game company that cares about what they are doing. You can't honestly tell me that EA doesn't know about the curve shot, or the wrap-around glitches that are in every NHL title from the past 5 years...at least. They care about money, and know that no matter what, we the public will still buy their half a**ed products. Until video game companies actually start to care, we're going to continue to get half finished games, games with exploits, cheats, etc. It's sad, but true.
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I hear what you are saying, and you are right. However, this is Gran Turismo, we all had a right to have high expectations, ~6 years and a lot of hyping gives us that right. Those expectations can still be met to a degre, if they listen. The choices PD brass are making are not encouraging.

Cheers
 
dtn23
Ummm. Not quite. I have cut my play time down by like 75% because of 1.07, and I've seen several threads saying the same thing. If they want us to play longer, they should've put more time into a-spec and less into working with the moral police :/
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more bonus races, and more new cars/tracks.....👍
 
Voltaic
In my mind, it is also clear the driving influence for GT5 is still Kaz. Even the best have limitations. Kaz has shown his with GT5. The way this title was released is shameful. Same old formula only worst, much worst.
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I think this sums up some of the biggest problems; centralized control over the strategy of GT by someone that is stuck in the past.

So much of the game and underlying philosophy is glaringly outdated. It's most apparent in the primitive online and community implementation, the fragmented, and let's be honest, f'd up "marketplace", the unintuitive UI with crippling load times, the RPG "Monster Hunter-like" grind philosophy, the ungodly long "walled-garden" development cycles, etc. etc. ad nauseum.

It isn't enough anymore to have a quality product out of the gate. You also need sustained improvement through iterative development cycles, and continuous care and feeding of your community.

go4gold
same, i used to play GT5 every day for at least an hour, since these restrictions on how people can play the game, which i see them as, they didnt like the way people chose to do things so changed the game accordingly, they have left a bitter taste in my mouth with regards to not just GT5 but PD aswell. Updates should add features, not take them away.
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If the dwindling MP activity here is any indicator, you're not alone. The level of buzz and community interaction in the MP was pretty phenomenal at launch. There was a huge opportunity to implement features that would have taken it all to the next level, but instead they decided to shut it all off.
 
Hastatus
Mobs want what they want without seeing the big picture or knowing the consequences. Their logic is determined largely by conformity of their immediate shared desires. Often only the smaller groups have the ability to harness impartiality because they can put reason before desire.
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Valid point, even if a little overspoken, but honestly, reason doesn't much matter in the world of video games. The driving factor is what will make the players happy, so maybe a small group of people enjoy knowing that people can no longer get their favorite cars easily, but most people would rather be able to get that 20 million car for a gold chrome. It may not be "right" but it makes the people happy.

Some people might be happy if we brought back prohibition, it would surely reduce driving fatalities, alcaholism, etc...which is a solid argument. But the money to be made and the demand from the public means that will probably never happen. That comparison is a stretch but it's a similar concept.

I say give me back trading and have a brewskie 👍 lol
:cheers:
 
Voltaic
Mobs? Mobs aro those who follow blindly.
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I was responding to the OP:

dtn23
I'm not sure if anyone can provide a true answer to this, but I can't help but wonder who is pushing PD into the actions they take. With the overwhelming negative response from some of their actions, why don't they listen more to the majority?

I just wanna know, if it isn't the fan base, who are they listening to when they do things like 1.07 and such?
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The fact is PD can't just listen to what people want: they must have the resources at their disposal and they obviously have an understanding of the bigger picture.

Kaz is the emperor and PD is Roman administration. There has been a bad drought and the grain harvest was hurt and is now limited. The Mob the majority of GT5 gamers are at the emperor's gates crying for their grain doles: the emperor can only do so much with the resources he has. For those who can't follow this: the PSN is the grain and the drought was caused by unforeseen trade complications (trade between strangers, duplicated cars with no value, "GT Anywhere", the popularity of GT5 in Brazil where there is no official PSN, true sharing of cars, etc) and by the mob all wanting their grain at once (clearly seen during the panic before the limit was reimposed). Now there is not enough PSN to go around: why do you think so many "failed connections" have been happening online? The PSN is a delicate ecosystem that can get out of balance with disasterous consequences. If you asked the mob to start paying for it, they would be up in arms. They want it free and yet want to strain the hell out of it. I bet you there were millions of trades per day when PD had only anticipated thousands.

Also think about the programming: PD made a game that takes forever to load on a PS3 because of the way it is coded, don't you even wonder if maybe the coding involving the online gifting was just as unnecessarily bulky?

If you can't understand that there are often factors that you do not know which are beyond PD's control or for legit reasons that are not told to you, then you are a member of the mob. Maybe they can't mention a strained PSN because Sony's stock shares would drop in value. I have heard some people say that PD is so bending to public opinion trying to keep as many people as happy as possible. Why is that when Kaz and PD does something that upsets the mob, the mob just naturally assumes that it was done just for the fun of it and Kaz must be on a power trip and is sticking it to all you ungrateful brats? (sarcasm where Kaz would be considering you ungrateful brats; not me lol) Maybe there is a plan to allow easier access to those favorite cars in the future, but there are other more immediate, less apparent issues for them to deal with first.
 
There is no need to insult anyone's intelligence. I'm not asking for any monitary handout like you're stating. And I highly doubt that trades are that huge of a strain on PSN. I have to say you come across a little smug, it is possible to keep your head high without putting your nose up to others.
 
Lets look at this from a different angle. We cannot change the past. But what we can do is change the future. My idea would be to set up a web site which would be the central hub for all that relates to GT feedback. Call it "GTfeedback.com or something. Now everyone(worldwide) would have one location to voice their concerns and PD would have one place to look instead of many boards across the net.:sly:
 
if they wanted that theyd have a forum on gran-turismo.com, and i think he only tweets in japanese for a reason
 
@ Hastatus

Funny how, in quick order, PD had resources at the ready to patch/disable the car trading. Never mind all the bugs and deficiencies GT5 has. PD's priorities sure are in the right order.

I never used the trading to give/sell cars to anyone but myself, through grinding with a second PSN ID. I did this in the desperate hope the cars I care about would pop in one or the other account. Where was that wrong? With GT5p you could clone the entire game from one of your accounts to another, all the cars and experience. Who was complaining then?

I say, depose the Emperor and dissolve the Senate.
 
Voltaic
@ Hastatus

Funny how, in quick order, PD had resources at the ready to patch/disable the car trading. Never mind all the bugs and deficiencies GT5 has. PD's priorities sure are in the right order.

I never used the trading to give/sell cars to anyone but myself, through grinding with a second PSN ID. I did this in the desperate hope the cars I care about would pop in one or the other account. Where was that wrong? With GT5p you could clone the entire game from one of your accounts to another, all the cars and experience. Who was complaining then?

I say, depose the Emperor and dissolve the Senate.
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Pretty much everything you said is where I'm at. Kinda reminds me of middle school where two kids throw airplanes so we all get our recess taken away :/
 

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