What is the difference between the 240sx and the Silvia?

[Street Racer]

Silvia - RHD, sr20
240sx - LHD, ka24
What are the other differences, and why does gt5 have a '96 240sx and then a '96 240sx s14?

 

[sumbrownkid]

I like the Silvia, because of the engine. Other than that, they are pretty much the same. (Should I raise shield just in case of missing something that some Silvia expert would burn me on?)

And GT5 probably has two versions of the same '96 240sx to boost car count.

 

[Street Racer]

And GT5 probably has two versions of the same '96 240sx to boost car count.

Probably.
But, what is that chassis thing? Like the s-chassis? Does that have some thing to do with this? Or are the silvia and 240sx something similar to like the acura integra and honda integra?

 

[sumbrownkid]

Yeah pretty much. Just engine differences, and perhaps a few safety features.

 

[Street Racer]

So the '96 240sx and '96 240sx (s14) are just to have more cars? Why do they look different? the (s14) looks like a silvia s14 while the 240sx looks different? A little like a s13 mixed in it. Here:
'96 240sx
'96 240sx (s14)
the 240sx also says it weighs less
I don't know.

 

[sumbrownkid]

Oh wow brain fart. I can't believe I stumbled here.

The S14 240sx share the same chassis as the Silvia sans the motor.

When the S14 is not in the name, then the car is a different chassis that is more fastback in style instead of being a pure coupe. I believe the S14 is the second gen 240sx in the United States, while the S14 was sold alongside the other non-S14 model in markets elsewhere.

It was stuff like this really that hurt Nissan. Two different cars that shared the same name on the brochure? Their sports car segment at the time was really confusing to the consumer.

 

[Rotary Junkie]

Fun fact: Those aren't 240SXs.

They're a 200SX/Silvia (the S14) and a 180SX, respectively.

If they were 240SXs they'd have 2.4Ls with less power, instead they're SR powered.

 

[Street Racer]

Fun fact: Those aren't 240SXs.

They're a 200SX/Silvia (the S14) and a 180SX, respectively.

If they were 240SXs they'd have 2.4Ls with less power, instead they're SR powered.

What aren't 240sx's. What brown boy said? Now I'm confused, lol. Can someone clear this up?

EDIT: Oh, are they the links? I forgot to ask that before... The both "240sx's" have 200+ stock hp, but a true 240 has 'bout 150 hp stock. Ummmm... I'm really confused.

 

[Azuremen]

The 240SX was USDM variant of the Silvia/180SX that was sold elsewhere. The most noted models are the S13 and S14 versions, and the critical difference between the 240SX and what the rest of the world had is the 240SX is a equipped with the KA24 series motor, which was a rather boring 2.4L 4 cylinder. Meanwhile, the Silvia/180SX twins got different SR20 options, including the ever famous SR20DET.

 

[Perfect Balance]

The reason there's a '96 "240sx" is because it's actually a 180sx, which were actually made for a few years even after the S14 came out. Possible since the S14 was a replacement for the "Silvia" and not the 180sx, even though they essentially shared a chassis.

The reason they're both called "240sx" in Gran Turismo is simply because that game is for the US market. Technically there aren't any "240sx" in GT5 because it would need to have the ka24de/ka24e engines, which they don't in the game.

 

[CyborgGT]

Purely talking Japanese vs American markets (leaving out the European re-badges), the Silvias were always the coupes while the 180SXs were all hatchbacks, correct? Like with the S13, we got both cars, even though they were both badged as 240s here; and all of our "S14 240SXs" were Silvias, albeit with changes to the performance?

 

[Murcie_LP640]

Silvia - RHD, sr20
240sx - LHD, ka24
What are the other differences, and why does gt5 have a '96 240sx and then a '96 240sx s14?

Mechanically, there's not much else different. The 180SX/Silvia had an LSD which the 240SX didn't but they have the same chassis, the same transmissions, etc.

Cosmetically however there's a lot of difference between the Silvia and the 240/180SX. The S13 Silvia was only made as a coupe and had a different front bumper to the 240SX which came in coupe, fastback/hatchback, and convertible flavour. As Nissan themselves proved with the Sileighty though (Silvia front, 180SX fastback rear), body panels were interchangeable

Also, the S13 Silvia and 180SX, when they first came out, had the CA18DET rather than the SR20DET we all know and love (hence the 180 moniker). The SR20DET was introduced in '91.

 

[C_Raccoon23]

The 240SX was USDM variant of the Silvia/180SX that was sold elsewhere. The most noted models are the S13 and S14 versions, and the critical difference between the 240SX and what the rest of the world had is the 240SX is a equipped with the KA24 series motor, which was a rather boring 2.4L 4 cylinder. Meanwhile, the Silvia/180SX twins got different SR20 options, including the ever famous SR20DET.

So the car comes with a boring engine and a boring suspension system from what I heard in my thread asking about the car. I think I see why modified 240SXs are more common than stock ones. Don't know if I want one now.

 

[sumbrownkid]

If you can get one for cheap, they make for great hobby cars. It helps that many owners of these cars are online and well help a fellow out.

 

[C_Raccoon23]

If you can get one for cheap, they make for great hobby cars. It helps that many owners of these cars are online and well help a fellow out.

True, but the thing is, as much as I love cars, I know very little on how they work. Honestly, the only thing I know how to do to a car is change its oil and air filter. So I don't want to possibly spend thousands of dollars on a car and risk messing it up by trying to modify it. I'd rather just buy a car that's already decent in its stock form.

 

[Street Racer]

Turbo the the 240 and you'll get a homemade ka24det lol. But, it will make more power than that US-illegal sr20det. Much easier than an illegal swap.
But so the silvia s13? (or 14?) and the 180sx and the 240sx are pretty much the same, other than RHD or LHD, and type of engine right?

The reason there's a '96 "240sx" is because it's actually a 180sx, which were actually made for a few years even after the S14 came out. Possible since the S14 was a replacement for the "Silvia" and not the 180sx, even though they essentially shared a chassis.

The reason they're both called "240sx" in Gran Turismo is simply because that game is for the US market. Technically there aren't any "240sx" in GT5 because it would need to have the ka24de/ka24e engines, which they don't in the game.

Then they should've either named it 180sx or made a legit 240sx. So the GT5 240sx is sort of not real, right? Lol.

EDIT: 1.) So is the 240sx (S13), a RHD s13 with the ka24, and same chassis?
2.) & then, the 240sx (S14), a RHD s14 with the ka24, and same chassis?
3.) & then, the 200sx is the same as the 240sx except .4 smaller engine and LHD?
4.) 180sx = japan: RHD, 1.8 liter ca18 or 2.0 liter sr20
5.) 200sx = europe & australia: RHD, 2.0 liter sr20, or 1.8 liter ca18, or 2.4 liter ka24
6.) 240sx = usa: LHD, 2.4 liter ka24
Where am I wrong?

 

[SpartanG]

But so the silvia s13? (or 14?) and the 180sx and the 240sx are pretty much the same, other than RHD or LHD, and type of engine right?

Just to clear things up, I think the U.S. and Australia only had an "###SX" nameplate on the s14 chassis. In Japan the S14 was only called the Silvia. i.e. there is no Japanese S14 180sx. I'm not 100% on that but wikipedia seems to confirm this.

EDIT: So is the 240sx (S13), a RHD s13 with the ka24, and same chassis? & then, the 240sx (S14), a RHD s14 with the ka24, and same chassis?

Yes. The fact that they're all referred to as S13s mean that they have the S13 chassis. Same for S14.

 

[Street Racer]

Just to clear things up, I think the U.S. and Australia only had an "###SX" nameplate on the s14 chassis. In Japan the S14 was only called the Silvia. i.e. there is no Japanese S14 180sx. I'm not 100% on that but wikipedia seems to confirm this.

Just for the s14 chassis? How about europe with the 200sx. Or was that not a s-chassis, since

The fact that they're all referred to as S13s mean that they have the S13 chassis. Same for S14.

?

there is no Japanese S14 180sx.

So it the 180sx not a s-chassis?

And . . .
EDIT: 1.) So is the 240sx (S13), a RHD s13 with the ka24, and same chassis?
2.) & then, the 240sx (S14), a RHD s14 with the ka24, and same chassis?
3.) & then, the 200sx is the same as the 240sx except .4 smaller engine and LHD?
4.) 180sx = japan: RHD, 1.8 liter ca18 or 2.0 liter sr20; and the silvia is the 180, 180 is the silvia?
5.) 200sx = europe & australia: rHD, 2.0 liter sr20, or 1.8 liter ca18, or 2.4 liter ka24
6.) 240sx = usa: LHD, 2.4 liter ka24
7.) There is a 123sx, and then a 123sx (s13/s14/s15) for all sx cars (180, 200, & 240)? and all 123sx are the same with minor differences, and where they were sold? right?
8.) And if there is no (S13/S14/S15) after the sx, then is it without the s-chassis. So it not derived from silvia, any clue why they would change this?
9.) OMG , All this name changing.

Where am I wrong?
Thank you if you answer any of these questions. Just please say which number you are answering.

 

[Perfect Balance]

Just for the s14 chassis? How about europe with the 200sx. Or was that not a s-chassis, since ?

Typically the names refer to the size engine. In the US it was called a 240sx because it got the 2.4liter ka24 engine. In Europe it got the 2.0 sr20det, hence "200sx" and in Japan, the 180sx originally had a 1.8 liter ca18det, although when they went to the sr20det, the name didn't change.

So it the 180sx not a s-chassis?

Yes, it is an s chassis, but it's not a Silvia. Silvia is a ps13, whereas the 180sx is an rps13. Both are "s" chassis though.

And . . .
EDIT: 1.) So is the 240sx (S13), a RHD s13 with the ka24, and same chassis?
2.) & then, the 240sx (S14), a RHD s14 with the ka24, and same chassis?
3.) & then, the 200sx is the same as the 240sx except .4 smaller engine and LHD?
4.) 180sx = japan: RHD, 1.8 liter ca18 or 2.0 liter sr20; and the silvia is the 180, 180 is the silvia?
5.) 200sx = europe & australia: rHD, 2.0 liter sr20, or 1.8 liter ca18, or 2.4 liter ka24
6.) 240sx = usa: LHD, 2.4 liter ka24
7.) There is a 123sx, and then a 123sx (s13/s14/s15) for all sx cars (180, 200, & 240)? and all 123sx are the same with minor differences, and where they were sold? right?
8.) And if there is no (S13/S14/S15) after the sx, then is it without the s-chassis. So it not derived from silvia, any clue why they would change this?
9.) OMG , All this name changing.

Where am I wrong?
Thank you if you answer any of these questions. Just please say which number you are answering.

1. 240sx (s13) came only in left hand drive, only in the US, and only with the ka24. Shares the s13 chassis with all other s13s.
2. 240sx (s14) came only in left hand drive, only in the US, and only with the ka24. Shares the S14 chassis with all other s14s.
3. 200sx is basically the same car Japan got, either in s13 or s14 form, and the steering wheel side varied depending on where it was sold.
4. 180sx = Japan, correct. Either 1.8 ca18 or 2.0 sr20 depending on the year and trim. Shares a chassis with the Silvia (S13), but is different visually.
5. See #3. They were all called 200sx, just the s14 is the generation that came after the s13. They never had a 2.4 ka24 engine. Only the US got that engine, and that was the only engine the US got in any of these cars.
6. Yes.
7. There is no such thing as a 123sx.
8.
9. Not sure what's even being asked in the last two... None of the cars had "s13" "s14" or "s15" in the name. Thats just a way to distinguish the different generations. In the same way a Skyline is simply called a Skyline, but the R32, R33, and R34 is just a means of specifying which generation.

 

[SpartanG]

I think there's a bit of misunderstanding as to what all these terms mean.

S13 is to 240sx as AE86 is to Corolla GTS, or as E30 is to a 1989 325i. Or as JZA80 is to the last generation Supra.

The S13 and S14 are two different chassis in the same line that were made by Nissan. Various body styles and names were attached to these and sold differently worldwide.

S13 (1989-1994)
180SX (Japan/Aus)
Silvia (Japan) (fixed headlights. all others were popups)
200SX (Europe)
240SX (US)

Engines:
KA24 (US only)
CA18 (Non-US)
SR20 (non-us)
Thanks to nissan's engine naming system, the number designates the displacement.

S14 (1995-1998 in the US, 2000 elsewhere)
Silvia (Japan)
240SX (USA)
200SX (Europe)

I think the engines were the same, but didn't bother to check.

I hope this is right

 

[Street Racer]

. . .

Thank You.

7. There is no such thing as a 123sx.
8.
9. Not sure what's even being asked in the last two... None of the cars had "s13" "s14" or "s15" in the name. Thats just a way to distinguish the different generations. In the same way a Skyline is simply called a Skyline, but the R32, R33, and R34 is just a means of specifying which generation.

7. I was putting in 123sx to name the 180sx, 200sx, and 240sx. I didn't want to write them out. Sorry for the confusion.
8. GT5 has a 240sx '96, and then a 240sx (S14) From what you and SpartanG posted, S## just means what kind of chassis the car has. I was asking why there is the 240sx, and then a 240sx with a s14 chassis. Is that right?

 

[Perfect Balance]

From what you and SpartanG posted, S## just means what kind of chassis the car has. I was asking why there is the 240sx, and then a 240sx with a s14 chassis. Is that right?

Not so much "what kind" of chassis the car has, but simply what generation it was.

The reason there's two different 96' 240sx in the game is simply because in the US, that body style was called the 240sx in both cases, just the first one was made from 89-93, and the second from 95-98, and the game is for the American market. Technically speaking, neither of the cars in the game are a "240sx" and calling them that in incorrect. One is a 1996 180sx (even though a real 240sx in that body style wasn't made after 1993) and the other is a 1996 Nissan Silvia.

 

[Street Racer]

Then, what is difference between 240sx and 240sx (S14)? Does (S14) indicate it shares the same chassis as the silvia?
And is a 123sx (180, 200, & 240) just a silvia with different engine, different location of the steering wheel, and minor other differences?

 

[SpartanG]

Then, what is difference between 240sx and 240sx (S14)? Does (S14) indicate it shares the same chassis as the silvia?
And is a 123sx (180, 200, & 240) just a silvia with different engine, different location of the steering wheel, and minor other differences?

It's just a weird thing in the game. The biggest thing here is that Poly did something weird when they put these cars in the game. There is no difference between the two cars you listed. It's the same car, just listed twice. A 1996 240sx is a 1996 S14. does that help?

A more accurate statement would be that the 180/200sx is just a silvia with different body style. The Silvia is coupe only while the SX cars were mostly hatchbacks. The engines are shared between the silvia and SX cars, except for the KA24 which, again, was US only.

 

[Street Racer]

So, there is no such thing as a 123sx with a S## chassis? Do all the sx's have chassis from silvia?
And so a silvia is a 123sx, a 123sx is a silvia. Right?

 

[SpartanG]

So, there is no such thing as a 123sx with a S## chassis? Do all the sx's have chassis from silvia?

No, the SX cars are on the S13 and S14 chassis. The two cars share a chassis.

Based on your avatar I'm guessing you might understand musclecar talk. This is like the difference between the Firebird and the Camaro. Different body style, but underneath, they are the same. I'm pretty sure

 

[Street Racer]

Aaaahhhh, I see. That clears a lot up.

A more accurate statement would be that the 180/200sx is just a silvia with different body style. The Silvia is coupe only while the SX cars were mostly hatchbacks. The engines are shared between the silvia and SX cars, except for the KA24 which, again, was US only.

So, theres also minor body styling changes. Ok. So, the 180sx/200sx/240sx/silvia are like the holden monaro cv8, and the pontiac gto in a way. Right?
And no such car as a 240sx (S14 exists). Right? Or is the s14 just saying the generation.
I wonder why it is that PD made a non-ka24 240? And the car list does include a '96 180sx.
Wow, same thing??? :
180sx X '96
240sx '96

 

[Murcie_LP640]

S14 is just the generation/chassis code.

It's kinda like an extra code for people to differentiate between generations. Much like we have S13/S14/S15 there's R30/R31/R32/R33/etc. for Skylines, AP1/AP2 for the Honda S2000, E36/E46/E90/F30 for the BMW 3-Series, GG/GH Mazda6, CL9/CU2 Acura TSX, etc. etc.

 

[Street Racer]

Yeah, that helps. Thanks Murcie!

 

[Takumi Fujiwara]

I think what hasn't been clearly explained is that Nissan sold the S13 180SX and the S14 Silvia in Japan at the same time. The S14 Silvia replaced the S13 Silvia (which was a coupe with fixed headlights) in 1993, but Nissan kept making the S13 180SX (hatchback/fastback, pop-up headlights) until 1998. In the US, both S13 models were called 240SX (and the coupe had the 180SX pop-up headlight front), and both were replaced by the S14 240SX, which was basically the same as the JDM S14 Silvia, in 1994. That's why PD's people got confused and called both cars "240SX."

Here's a real S14 240SX. (Which used to be mine.) In the background are two S13 240SXs, one is a coupe with a Japanese Silvia front on it, and the other is a normal S13 240SX fastback.