Which motor means the most to import tuning? (Weekl

[High-Test]

After the V8 discussion was relatively successful, I'll start one for imports only (Ecotec, sure, but come now.).
the B series might initiate drooling for some, while for others there is no substitute for the 4G63T. Some say IJZ, others say 2JZ, some say that the only letters one should know are RB. GTPlanet, let's hear which one you think has made the biggest contribution to the multimillion dollar import tuning industry.


Ready?


Go!

Oh crud, I forgot to put the other option in the thread.. If your pick isn't listed, please post it anyway.


I voted for the Honda A series. THere were people in the 80's running around with mean civics long before F&F made big muffler burbles cool. Plus, that's about when it really took flight, as Japan was making cars that could embarass similar sized Domestics out of the factory, and some people wanted more. They didn't want their accords to just go faster than a buick regal, they wanted to get cavaliers and Fox bodies.

 

[Boz Mon]

Honda H series specifically the H22, was said to be one of the greatest 4cylinder engines ever created.

 

[High-Test]

Boz, are you sure it's the greatest 4 cylinder ever made? (we can open this can of worms up next week)

Don't get me wrong, the H series is an amazing machine. Strong internal parts, it puts out lots of power and torque, and is a rev happy little screamer that gets really good gas mileage.

But, why do you think the H series is the best tuner engine, as opposed to the B series, that has made an entire industry centered around the civic and integra.

 

[Rogue Ssv]

Yes, the GM Ecotec.
The RB--its in the GT-R!

 

[High-Test]

Ok, the RB does give the "almighty godzilla" it's godzillaness. There's not really an affordable tuning base for the RB, like there are cheap parts for the hondas, but maybe we can thank the entire import tuning industry to the RB, because it's clearly the most sought after of the bunch. Or, maybe it isn't. Maybe it hasn't done much for the industry because most people that have an RB feel that 300 horses are plenty for their normal buinessman selves.

say why you voted the way you did, that way there can actually be discussion in the thread, and we can keep it from becoming all "z0mg!!1! teh GT-R! RB b-cuz teh GTR is teh pwn"

 

[Rogue Ssv]

Ah... well I dont really know that much about it offhand, I forgot most of my info.

 

[Master_Yoda]

I say RB, cause I mean, how can you NOT vote for RB? I mean RB!
Real
Beuty

DURKA DURR!

 

[Boz Mon]

Boz, are you sure it's the greatest 4 cylinder ever made? (we can open this can of worms up next week)

Don't get me wrong, the H series is an amazing machine. Strong internal parts, it puts out lots of power and torque, and is a rev happy little screamer that gets really good gas mileage.

But, why do you think the H series is the best tuner engine, as opposed to the B series, that has made an entire industry centered around the civic and
integra.

I guess I'm a little biased because I drive a Prelude.

 

[High-Test]

Ah well, I'm biased towards 2JZs and smallblocks, because I own cars that have them.

There's no K in Duh-Duh-Duh, buddy.

This thread is swaying away from what I intended it to be, a discussion. Boz is putting forth some effort to have a discussion, but the thread seems to have been invaded by Skyline fanboys with no information or knowledge to back their posts up.

I guess this kind of thread was a bad idea.

 

[Jay]

I dont think this is a "Whats your favorite import engine thread" but "Which has done the most for the import tuning industry?"

I feel the SR20 has done the most for the import tuning industry as a whole, it has a large tuning base in Japan, Australia, New Zealand, Europe and I know its a common swap in the US for the 240sx. It makes good relatively easy and can handle quite alot.

The 2JZ to me seems more a engine for tuners that want to put big money for power. Not accessable to the average import owner. I think RB is not so common and world wide like the SR and similar to the 2JZ is not so accessable to the average import owner as SR20.

Honda engines seem to be quite rarely tuned in Australia, but the opposite can be said for the US.

 

[SRV2LOW4ME]

Honda B series, specifically the B16 and B18. 👍

Hands down these two engines have helped build what has become the tuner world. Their small size and high redlines which produced some serious N/A hp numbers is what helped start the tuner craze, and since day one the tuner market place has been gearing towards these two mini power houses. Everythng in the performance market from pistons to turbo's, cam's to performance intake manifolds are available for these two engines. You can actually buy a block from Honda/Acura and without even going to the dealership, build yourself one of these engines from nothing but aftermarket parts (and put out some serious hp numbers I might add). There isn't many engines that can do that, or with the selection of companies that the B series engines can claim, thats why they got my vote.

 

[YSSMAN]

...Okay, I'm going to wait to vote, as my choise is not up there:

As a Eurotuner snob like me, the Volkswagen AWM/AEB/ATW otherwise known as the 1.8T is my choise. Simply put, this is the engine to have in the Eurotuner world, and it has proven itself against the VR6 time and time again. All of the different variations, those being 150/180/200 BHP, served very well in the models they were used in, all of which can be modded very easily to make power figures well north of 200 BHP for very little money.

Now, I will concede to the fact that this is not the engine for everyone, as it is very expensive, and occasionally hard to find. Obviously, they arent used in everything like the Honda B, H, and K series engines either, so that obviously would not make the VW good for everyone.

...Again, it depends greatly on what kind of import you are into, and being that I am a VAG fan, I'm going with the VW AWM/AEB/ATW.

 

[IMADreamer]

I voted for the 4g63t because of it's ease to tune, and relative inexpensiveness to make big hp. I think the fact that it is found in three legendary tuner cars (here in America atleast) it has been very influencial.

 

[Revheadnz]

I think it really depends on which area of the world you are from and whether this poll encompasses the whole world.
To me, in New Zealand, the choice would probably be either the RB series.
The RB series is very, very popular in New Zealand for all sorts of uses, drag racing, circuit work and drifting.
The RB20DET is a really versatile engine which is very common, you see it in Cefiros, Gts-ts, GTS4s and sometimes in Silvias. It's not as tough as the later engines but the sheer popularity and low cost of them combined with relative ease of power makes them still very popular compared the new motors.
The RB25DET is coming into its own as a drift and drag engine as more and more R33 GTS25Ts come into NZ and the price comes down. They're a better engine than the RB20, they make more power and torque straight out of the box and are very strong too.
The RB26DETT, the gun of the RB series, is one of the best Japanese engines ever for making monster power for not huge sums of money and the fact that they power the fastest and 3rd fastest imports in NZ is enough to make them very important to import tuning.
And the RB30ET. It's not very popular in NZ since they're as rare as hens teeth but across the ditch they are one of the most important motors, powering VL Turbo Commodores across Australia deep into the 9 second range.

 

[Jay]

And the RB30ET. It's not very popular in NZ since they're as rare as hens teeth but across the ditch they are one of the most important motors, powering VL Turbo Commodores across Australia deep into the 9 second range.

And the great thing about RB30E's is you can slice the RB30 block with a RB20/25 or 26 head to make a RB30DET or TT. Which brings the engine upto 3.0L like the 2JZ without boring or stroking. (RB30 block is 38mm taller than RB25/26)

 

[niky]

I do love Nissans, but I'd have to nix the RB... great engine, but to be influential, you have to be accessible to the widest fanbase.

I don't know if it's in any of the series of Toyota engines up there, but my vote should go to the Toyota 4AGE and its various iterations (4AGZE, 20V, etcetera) as it's a powerful and flexible motor that's available in a zillion different orientations, and is friendly to both Toyota tuners and kit-builders.

Following that, the Honda B-series and Nissan SR-series are both very influential engines.

The Honda more so amongst "import" tuners because of its relative accessibility and availability... Whatever its detractors might say, the heady redline, angry buzz and light weight of this engine has pushed thousands of young un's into the wrench turning business.

The Nissan SR is influential because, like the older 4AGE, it is available in a variety of layouts and has helped the kit car industry in various regions. It bridges the gap between FWD and RWD cars (sadly, the AWD version is just too rare to count) and still sees production (albeit on a limited basis) today in various configurations (including MR). It's tuneable in a number of different ways, and can be had in high-revving NA tune (SR20VE swaps) or in insane turbo tunes (500+hp on stock bottoms... at last count).

The 4G63T comes in third because it's relatively more expensive than either block, and limited in application. Still a great motor, but if you want a 4G63T, you get it with the car... while the Honda B and Nissan SR both see homes in many different applications.

 

[Jay]

The 4G63T comes in third because it's relatively more expensive than either block, and limited in application. Still a great motor, but if you want a 4G63T, you get it with the car... while the Honda B and Nissan SR both see homes in many different applications.

4G63 has quite a few applications itself, Starion, Galant, Lancer, Eclipse etc.

 

[Revheadnz]

I do love Nissans, but I'd have to nix the RB... great engine, but to be influential, you have to be accessible to the widest fanbase.

I don't know if it's in any of the series of Toyota engines up there, but my vote should go to the Toyota 4AGE and its various iterations (4AGZE, 20V, etcetera) as it's a powerful and flexible motor that's available in a zillion different orientations, and is friendly to both Toyota tuners and kit-builders.

Following that, the Honda B-series and Nissan SR-series are both very influential engines.

The Honda more so amongst "import" tuners because of its relative accessibility and availability... Whatever its detractors might say, the heady redline, angry buzz and light weight of this engine has pushed thousands of young un's into the wrench turning business.

The Nissan SR is influential because, like the older 4AGE, it is available in a variety of layouts and has helped the kit car industry in various regions. It bridges the gap between FWD and RWD cars (sadly, the AWD version is just too rare to count) and still sees production (albeit on a limited basis) today in various configurations (including MR). It's tuneable in a number of different ways, and can be had in high-revving NA tune (SR20VE swaps) or in insane turbo tunes (500+hp on stock bottoms... at last count).

The 4G63T comes in third because it's relatively more expensive than either block, and limited in application. Still a great motor, but if you want a 4G63T, you get it with the car... while the Honda B and Nissan SR both see homes in many different applications.

Good point Niky, the 4AGE slipped my mind. 💡 I'm not sure that I would vote for it as the engine that means the most to import tuning but it is certainly a fine engine.
Quite often it is overlooked, undeservedly so, for more recent, more technologically advanced engines (B series, I'm looking at you) or forced induction motors.
The fact that there are so many more options availiable these days in the import scene means that the 4AGE doesn't have the popularity that it once had but there is still very much a loyal following through-out NZ.
In the early 90s the hot hatch of choice would have been the Corolla FXGT but more recently people have been turning to Honda power for hot hatches.

 

[GT4_Rule]

I'm not sure of the codes but the engine in the RSX, as well as the one in Integra contributed the most to the import tuning industry.

 

[niky]

4G63 has quite a few applications itself, Starion, Galant, Lancer, Eclipse etc.

There is that, but the following is not as great as the B-series... much cheaper and more widely used engine, although the number of models using it, admittedly, is limited to mostly Civics and Civic variants... and that includes the Integra...

or the SR - Sentra, SE-R, 200SX, Pulsar, Primera, X-Trail (SR20VET), various vans, etcetera... not to mention the TommyKaira ZZS (last I heard, it was being re-produced in the UK), the ASL Garaiya, various Super Seven kits, etcetera etcetera etcetera...

But, like I said, the 4G63T is a terrific engine and in terms of performance, is second only to the RB26 on that list. Still, it's probably a toss-up between it and the SR in terms of influence and availability, I guess... in terms of the tuner scene.

EDIT: Oh yeah, there are quite a number of B-swapped Lotus Elises about... and didn't the older Ariel Atoms have B-engines, too?

 

[Jay]

What ever the case still 4G63 is not a very limited application engine. Over here I would say its more common then many of these Vtec engines.

 

[niky]

My bad, then. It's not that common in my neck of the woods... but then again, we do have a FWD 4G63T powered Civic that's laying down 9's... pure unadulaterated silliness. Beautiful car.

 

[IMADreamer]

I'm not sure of the codes but the engine in the RSX, as well as the one in Integra contributed the most to the import tuning industry.

It's called the K-series. K20 I think. It came too late to the game to be really that important. Most of the engines listed have all been around since the beggining of import tuning while the K-series is pretty new. It's great that's for sure but it has a ways to go to be legendary like the B-series, 4G63, and the RB. Also many people don't know it because it's extremely overlooked but the Ecotec is probably a better engine then the K-series and is more likely to have a bigger impact on the future of tuning and racing then the K-series.

 

[YSSMAN]

^^^ Cheers to that. The K-Series, IMO, is a bit overrated, but all of the American Honda tuners are dropping them into their new cars. Adding to that, they have been dropping K-Series' into Lotus Elises as well, marginally boosting the car's performance, mostly due to the wider powerband and 20 extra BHP.

Surprisingly enough, despite how "crude" the ECOTEC lineup is in the United States, it has carved out quite a following. Sure, it doesnt make 200 BHP on 2.0L when naturally aspirated, but it packs a punch with progressive power delivery and a rather wide torque band for a four-banger.

I was thinking about this thread last night before I went to bed, and I got to thinking... Maybe in addition to my nomination of the VW 1.8T triplets, I think the engine that really started it all should get a nom...

The origional VW 1.8L 16V!

Yes kids, the good ol high-rev 1.8L, back before there were acres of computers running our cars, back when VW went crazy with the GTI, GLI, and Scirocco, etc. I've only had a drive with one of the engines myself (old GLI), and it was wonderful. There was plenty of power to be had across the powerband, and there was enough of it (about 130 BHP) to keep things interesting. The best part about the old 16V was that it was (technically still is) easy to modify, and rather cheap to do so. Of course, by the time the engines were being replaced by the larger 2.0L 8V and 2.0L 16V engines, the world was going VTEC-crazy...

I'm sticking with my VW picks, as I doubt I will be voting here.

 

[Takumi Fujiwara]

Note about the 4G, the Starion used a 4G54, not a 4G63, at least in the US market.

My vote goes for the SR. It was a major accomplishment in 1990 to see a 2.0l four producing over 200HP, and arguably was the first of its kind to be fully mass produced and placed in a mass-market car, rather than a limited production specialty model. Additionaly, it heralded the enterance of the "golden age" of Japanese sports models, appearing at the same time as the introduction of the R32 GTR and Z32 300ZX, and preceeding the Evolution and Impreza (both of which, notably, also used a 200+HP turbo four), the Si and Type R Hondas, the MkIV Supra and ST20x series Celicas, the later GTRs and SE-Rs, and the 3rd Gen RX7.

 

[Jay]

Note about the 4G, the Starion used a 4G54, not a 4G63, at least in the US market.

Interesting, the Australian market got them in 4G63.

*EDIT* just checked and read the Japanese Starion is also 4G63 while the US Starions are 4G54.

 

[MistaY]

Note about the 4G, the Starion used a 4G54, not a 4G63, at least in the US market.

My vote goes for the SR. It was a major accomplishment in 1990 to see a 2.0l four producing over 200HP, and arguably was the first of its kind to be fully mass produced and placed in a mass-market car, rather than a limited production specialty model.

I dunno, you could say the same thing about the 3SGTE used in the MR2 and Celica GT4, also making a simmilar amount of power with the same amount of displacement.

I don't know what engine would means the most to import tuning (god import tuning is a gay phrase) and it's a bit of a stupid term. Because to me a Camaro or a Mustang comes under the term of import.

I think maybe it would be to discuss what is the crem de la crem when it comes to Japanese performance engines. Then Maybe do another thread for European performance engines.

 

[Jim Prower]

I'd be tempted to Say Honda "B," seeing as most every kid's Civic has one.

 

[Takumi Fujiwara]

I dunno, you could say the same thing about the 3SGTE used in the MR2 and Celica GT4, also making a simmilar amount of power with the same amount of displacement.

I don't know what engine would means the most to import tuning (god import tuning is a gay phrase) and it's a bit of a stupid term. Because to me a Camaro or a Mustang comes under the term of import.

I think maybe it would be to discuss what is the crem de la crem when it comes to Japanese performance engines. Then Maybe do another thread for European performance engines.

The reason I say the SR and not the 3S is the production amount. The MR2 is, altogether, a specialty car, and the GT-Four is also a limited-production homologation model, mostly existing to legalize the WRC car. The Silvia/200SX, on the other hand, was a regular car, and was sold in large numbers, including, in large part, to non-enthusiast buyers.

 

[MistaY]

The reason I say the SR and not the 3S is the production amount. The MR2 is, altogether, a specialty car, and the GT-Four is also a limited-production homologation model, mostly existing to legalize the WRC car. The Silvia/200SX, on the other hand, was a regular car, and was sold in large numbers, including, in large part, to non-enthusiast buyers.

Just out of curiosity do you know the sales numbers for the silvia/200SX/240SX?

I'm not sure what counts as large numbers as you put it, because I know that they sold about 30000 cars in the uk, although thats including the MKI and excluding the MKIII.

Edit: NM it seems that they were partially hand built, so I suppose that some would say classes it as a specialty car.
Info here

I'd still like to see some S13/14 sales figures though, I can't seem to find any.