Worse with a wheel and load cell pedals than a controller???

  • Thread starter Pablovi77
  • 34 comments
  • 3,056 views
35
Mexico
Mexico
I don’t know where to put this, and this is the game a play the most, so…

I’m extremely frustrated, I just bought a T300RS and a TLCM pedals, I figured it will improve my driving and enjoyment of the game. I was like 65% done with the the campaign, and was improving with the controller, still not the best driver. I couldn’t for the life of me even finished a race int he Formula car championship, in the amateur league, but tried the first two of the professional league championships, and altought hard, I could do it with a controller.

My wheel arrived yesterday, and I’ve just been very frustrated and regretted the money spent. I’m a lot slower with the wheel, like 2 seconds, and can’t even finish the races! I always spin and get out of the race. It’s even harder not to spin than with the controller, I can’t get the feel of anything with the wheel, or get the feel of the load cell pedals.

Do people get better? Or I just sell it and be done with it? I was getting better with the controller, and felt like getting better, and was a lot faster. With the wheel I don’t feel like I’m getting better or learning anything! Just don’t know why I’m spinning or not breaking enough. Does a wheel even makes a difference with this game? GTS.

Well, I had to vent, if you want to move it or delete, go ahead.
 
3,043
Canada
Canada
Kaizen-Teian
100% of people have reported/experienced the same. Not only do you have to learn to use a wheel. You have to "unlearn" using a controller. It takes a few weeks.

Experiment with the settings available, FFB, torque, ABS, TCS. Make sure your chair, wheel and pedals are secure.

It's worth it for the immersion factor according to the majority of comments here.
 
222
United Kingdom
United Kingdom
100% of people have reported/experienced the same. Not only do you have to learn to use a wheel. You have to "unlearn" using a controller. It takes a few weeks.
Agreed, it takes a long time, certainly not a day! to get up to speed again. It's not just, buy a wheel go faster, you have to learn to drive. Controller is playing a game, it's a very different thing (still fun and with challenge I'm not dismissing it).

It’s even harder not to spin than with the controller
This suggests you were spinning a lot even on controller? I very rarely spin unless I've been spun around by someone or hit something.. Have you tried messing with the brake balance, perhaps you have too much oversteer? Move it to the rear and see if that will help with your turn in.

Overall, practice out of a race setting, go to Tsukuba and Red Bull Ring and just drive laps and get used to the way the car feels entering and exiting turns before moving into more challenging circuits again, and before entering a race again.
 
13,670
United Kingdom
Not so Great Britain
Do people get better? Or I just sell it and be done with it? I was getting better with the controller, and felt like getting better, and was a lot faster. With the wheel I don’t feel like I’m getting better or learning anything! Just don’t know why I’m spinning or not breaking enough. Does a wheel even makes a difference with this game? GTS.

Been there, done that. Actually did sell my T500RS.

... then, realised even though I was slower and span more, going back to a controller felt incredibly 'thin', or 'empty', so I bought a T-GT and haven't regretted it. I'm never going to be that fast, GT Sport has taught me that... so I'd rather just have more fun!

Keep practicing, you'll get better.

This suggests you were spinning a lot even on controller?
Given one of the things people expect to be better at with pedals, is the application of power out of a bend, I'd say he's probably looping on the exit, or coming away from apexes. With a controller a literal fraction of a second is all it takes to apply some opposite lock, and the game will only deliver a certain amount of lock in a certain amount of time at a certain speed, so you really don't have to be that precise. It takes longer to react with a wheel, and you have to react accurately... this is why catching spins is harder once you move to a wheel IMHO.
 
1,288
Ireland
Ireland
Racerx_34
I don’t know where to put this, and this is the game a play the most, so…

I’m extremely frustrated, I just bought a T300RS and a TLCM pedals, I figured it will improve my driving and enjoyment of the game. I was like 65% done with the the campaign, and was improving with the controller, still not the best driver. I couldn’t for the life of me even finished a race int he Formula car championship, in the amateur league, but tried the first two of the professional league championships, and altought hard, I could do it with a controller.

My wheel arrived yesterday, and I’ve just been very frustrated and regretted the money spent. I’m a lot slower with the wheel, like 2 seconds, and can’t even finish the races! I always spin and get out of the race. It’s even harder not to spin than with the controller, I can’t get the feel of anything with the wheel, or get the feel of the load cell pedals.

Do people get better? Or I just sell it and be done with it? I was getting better with the controller, and felt like getting better, and was a lot faster. With the wheel I don’t feel like I’m getting better or learning anything! Just don’t know why I’m spinning or not breaking enough. Does a wheel even makes a difference with this game? GTS.

Well, I had to vent, if you want to move it or delete, go ahead.
Took me a couple of weeks to level back to where I was and probably about a month to find a few extra seconds. Still learning mind but hang in there. Your style of driving will have to adapt
 
35
Mexico
Mexico
Thanks everyone!

Yeah, I know I have to practice, still, I was having more fun with controller and felt I was learning and improving. Right now I feel I’m getting worse, and it’s not fun it’s just frustrating. And since you cannot really practice with GTS, you have to start a race.

Yeah, it’s very easy to spin most cars, specially FR and MR cars. A little too much throttle with the wheels not straight and you’ll spin, too much speed in a corner, and you’ll spin, etc…
With the controller I could correct it, I can’t with the wheel just yet, can’t even feel it right now, or tell it’s going to spin.

I guess I’m just frustrated I cannot longer advanced in the single player game, neither the championship nor the missions or course experience.

I’m at the mission stage6-8, it’s a 30 laps race in Lago Maggiore, and it was hard with the controller, have never even made it half the race, but now, there’s no way I’ll make 30 laps without spinning, don’t mind finishing 1st. Just finishing the race is going to be tough, I had a hard time driving with the controller with worn tires!
So, I feel like I’m stuck.

The wheel did improved Assetto Corsa a lot! It was very hard keeping the car straight with the controller, it took a lot of micro adjustments with the thumb stick to do it. Now I can hold a proper racing line. And I do feel like O can improve in that game. But on GTS it just feels different, but not an improvement at all.

Been there, done that. Actually did sell my T500RS.

... then, realised even though I was slower and span more, going back to a controller felt incredibly 'thin', or 'empty', so I bought a T-GT and haven't regretted it. I'm never going to be that fast, GT Sport has taught me that... so I'd rather just have more fun!

Keep practicing, you'll get better.


Given one of the things people expect to be better at with pedals, is the application of power out of a bend, I'd say he's probably looping on the exit, or coming away from apexes. With a controller a literal fraction of a second is all it takes to apply some opposite lock, and the game will only deliver a certain amount of lock in a certain amount of time at a certain speed, so you really don't have to be that precise. It takes longer to react with a wheel, and you have to react accurately... this is why catching spins is harder once you move to a wheel IMHO.

Yeah, I’m spinning when I apply too much throttle. But not only then, with turning as well. When I’m going to fast and turning. Before, I could let go of the thumb stick for a fraction of a second and save it, just doesn’t feel right letting go of the wheel of a car, and turning the other way won’t do it, or is a lot more sensitive than on a real car.

I used to have a Leon Cupra R, and raced some road rallies back in the day, even took a driving school thing with open wheel cars and high end sport cars in the mid ‘00. So, I know the theory and could actually do it on real cars back in the day.
 

RACECAR

Owner/Promoter/Organizer/Driver/ETC
Premium
33,009
United States
Dallas,Texas
GTP_RACECAR
I don’t know where to put this, and this is the game a play the most, so…

I’m extremely frustrated, I just bought a T300RS and a TLCM pedals, I figured it will improve my driving and enjoyment of the game. I was like 65% done with the the campaign, and was improving with the controller, still not the best driver. I couldn’t for the life of me even finished a race int he Formula car championship, in the amateur league, but tried the first two of the professional league championships, and altought hard, I could do it with a controller.

My wheel arrived yesterday, and I’ve just been very frustrated and regretted the money spent. I’m a lot slower with the wheel, like 2 seconds, and can’t even finish the races! I always spin and get out of the race. It’s even harder not to spin than with the controller, I can’t get the feel of anything with the wheel, or get the feel of the load cell pedals.

Do people get better? Or I just sell it and be done with it? I was getting better with the controller, and felt like getting better, and was a lot faster. With the wheel I don’t feel like I’m getting better or learning anything! Just don’t know why I’m spinning or not breaking enough. Does a wheel even makes a difference with this game? GTS.

Well, I had to vent, if you want to move it or delete, go ahead.
I know I'm repeating what many in the thread have said but as someone who spent basically their entire childhood well into adulthood on the controller, I struggled with that adjustment myself: Once back in 2014 on my PS3 and then again around this time last year when I finally got a desk and could actually use my G29. One thing many people don't mention is that the learning curve is really steep, you have to unlearn all the habits you got with the controller and fully learn the peculiarities and nuances of the feel with the wheel. Believe me, you will notice a massive improvement the more time you'll put in as I have after overdriving for abit (Again, old habits dying hard there). GTS in particular can be rough to transition from controller in my personal experience because of the physics so it can take quite abit to grasp.

So basically, give it more time and you will get better.
 
2,324
Scotland
Scotland
stpatty
When I got my G29 I'd been playing the game regularly for about a year & three months. I knew I was going to keep playing the game regularly, I knew that using a wheel would make me a better driver. Two years later, it has. Here's a thread I made at the time looking for advice: https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/tips-for-changing-from-controller-to-wheel.391481/

There are lots of similar stuff too in the, er, Similar threads section at the bottom of the page which will give you lots of good advice.

It's worth it, I promise.
 
35
Mexico
Mexico
When I got my G29 I'd been playing the game regularly for about a year & three months. I knew I was going to keep playing the game regularly, I knew that using a wheel would make me a better driver. Two years later, it has. Here's a thread I made at the time looking for advice: https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/tips-for-changing-from-controller-to-wheel.391481/

There are lots of similar stuff too in the, er, Similar threads section at the bottom of the page which will give you lots of good advice.

It's worth it, I promise.
Thanks! Will have a look.
 
554
United States
United States
Blood_Raven_70
That's one of the (several) reasons I haven't gotten a wheel. Also, the last time I had a wheel, I was abysmal with it. And I had it for a long time and used it all the time. But I was just horrible with it. It was like it wasn't sensitive enough, then it was hyper sensitive and would turn the car a full 180 if you barely turned the wheel. Later, you had to turn it almost full to the left or right just to follow a bend in the road. And the center wasn't very.....centered. I couldn't keep a car going in a straight line to save my life. That experience turned me sour on wheels. I had a friend who had the exact same wheel, and he was damn fast with it. But me? It was like I was a 3 year old trying to drive for the 1st time. I was yanking the wheel back and forth just to keep the car on the road. And it was supposed to be one of the better wheels at the time.
 
Last edited:
13
Australia
Australia
I did all the beginner and intermediate and expert races to learn the controller and when I got the wheel i was terrible. So I did all the intermediate and expert races again. I was way better after that and could actually do daily races, with practice, quite well.
 
652
Italy
Under some Risotto
In 2011, I switched from my controller to the G27 I'm still currently using and it was PAINFUL the first times I've used it.
Really, it was awful, I couldn't even turn in a corner...
Fortunately I persisted and praticed a bit, and eventually I shaved off a bunch of seconds on my best laptimes
 
35
Mexico
Mexico
Thanks again everyone! I did a lot of practice today, and finally could beat the Mission Challenge stage 6-8, but had to use TC in order not to spin. That way and using soft tires, I beat it easily, I had like 45 seconds on the second place car, but I did spin out with 2 laps to go. Since I had all the time advantage I could continue with the race and ended up winning by 15 seconds.
 

CBH

Premium
7,560
Australia
Adelaide
fordlaser777
Thanks again everyone! I did a lot of practice today, and finally could beat the Mission Challenge stage 6-8, but had to use TC in order not to spin. That way and using soft tires, I beat it easily, I had like 45 seconds on the second place car, but I did spin out with 2 laps to go. Since I had all the time advantage I could continue with the race and ended up winning by 15 seconds.
Good job my friend :cheers: , and using TC on 1 is a good way until you get confidence with your new wheel, and then set your TC to OFF.
 
250
Netherlands
Netherlands
When I went from controller to wheel it took me a long time to get good again, but once I did I became even better after that, I'm faster now than I ever could have been with a controller.
 
162
United Kingdom
United Kingdom
Ian Bick
Hi,

Stick with it. When I bought my wheel in January, I was convinced I was trying to drive a bowl of rice pudding... Totally out of control. I listened and learned from others here. Now my rankings have improved beyond my wildest dreams. My times are 3 seconds a lap quicker ( on average! ) and I am only a whisper away from gold on the Lewis Hamilton challenges.

Regards.

Ian.
 
617
New Zealand
NZL
colinnola
As others have said: it takes a little bit of getting used to. When I switched from controller to wheel (G29) I was awful, so I just ran time trials for a few days, learning how the different cars reacted to my inputs with the wheel. After this, I went back and drove the easy races again... etc.

It took me 2-3 weeks to get back to where I was with the controller. A few weeks after that I was definitely faster.
 
2,002
United Kingdom
Gateshead
JamboGT/GTP_Jambo_GT
As has been said, it just takes time. I recommend picking your favourite car and track combo go to time trial and just do laps for the fun of it for a while, then start to concentrate on where you are having issues. FOr me when I swutched that was getting fully on the brakes straight away and then coming off them enough as I turn in, when trail braking basically. Then the next step ws cotrolling throttle on corner exit and balancing the amount of throttle with wheel angle.

The main thing though is to have fun and the time will come :)
 
43
Norway
Oslo
SuperGT did a video on Controller vs Wheel and his conclusions are may be what others are missing here. You may not be faster over a single lap, but feedback from wheel coupled with better precision, you'll be faster over race distance. Smoother, smaller inputs will cause lower tyre wear for a start.
 
Last edited:
320
Austria
::1
Thanks again everyone! I did a lot of practice today, and finally could beat the Mission Challenge stage 6-8, but had to use TC in order not to spin. That way and using soft tires, I beat it easily, I had like 45 seconds on the second place car, but I did spin out with 2 laps to go. Since I had all the time advantage I could continue with the race and ended up winning by 15 seconds.
Some cars are very hard to control with traction control completely turned off. Don't be afraid or ashamed to turn TC on to help out.

Gran Turismo's controller input logic smoothes out the inputs to some extent to make it more bearable for the player, but also to make it more realistic. With a controller, you can turn the steering input from full left to full right in a few milliseconds. With a real car, it's not possible to turn the wheel so quickly, so the game smoothes/delays the controller inputs a bit so that it maps the real car model. I feel that Gran Turismo smoothes controller inputs so much that it's easier to control a car with the controller than with the wheel and pedals. Some other driving games don't have as much controller input smoothing (e.g. Project Cars), and in those games it feels much easier to control the car with a wheel and pedals than with a controller.

As others have said, stick to it, you'll have more fun once you get used to it. I was also slower in some games when I started playing with a wheel. I remember being a lot slower in Forza Motorsports, because like Gran Turismo, its controller input logic was also very forgiving.
 
Last edited:

Thorin Cain

Premium
2,277
Scotland
Glasgow
THORIN-RAYVEN
SuperGT did a video on Controller vs Wheel and his conclusions are may be what others are missing here. You may not be faster over a single lap, but feedback from wheel coupled with better precision, you'll be faster over race distance. Smoother, smaller inputs will cause lower tyre wear for a start.
This is discounting the point that you need to learn to drive all over again first.

This thread was started because someone had recently made the switch to a wheel and was finding it incredibly difficult, as they should.
Driving with a wheel and playing with a pad are two completely different skillsets and it does take quite a bit of time to get up to speed, so to speak, when learning to use a wheel.

Coming from someone who played Gran Turismo since day one with a pad until I made the wheel switch, and someone who has been driving for real for 20 years or so. It's not something that you get use to quickly. Even if you have decent coordination, it takes a while to explore how the game translates things to you and it physically takes you longer to perform the inputs when required. Making catching spins in high powered cars quite the challenge at first if you've never had to do it in a real car.
It can be a very frustrating experience, but I agree with the others here, it's definitely worth it for the immersion and it is more fun once you find your rhythm with it.


As for Steve's conclusions and nothing against him. But it's hardly breaking news, and I'd be surprised if anyone here is missing his point. The newer member here may be different, but most of the guys and gals around GTP (At least the ones I've ran into in the Gran Turismo side of things) have had this discussion many times over and are pretty familiar with the differences, most of them having had prior experience similar to the OP.

:cheers:
 
104
United States
United States
I remember when i got the game and it took a while like months to get the controller dialed and when i got my wheel it was like learning the game all over again but thats the cool thing about video games …redoing to see if game still holds with different contexts
 
429
United States
United States
You have to make a individual choice do you want to play a game with a game pad or simulate driving a car with a wheel setup this is what most racing games give us. There is a big difference in controllers and I am not the one who can help you with the choice.
 
Last edited:
181
England
NW England
You have to make a individual choice do you want to play a game with a game pad or simulate driving a car with a wheel setup this is what most racing games give us. There is a big difference in controllers and I am not the one who can help you with the choice.
Seems to me that it’s a game played on a gaming console no matter the style or shape of your input device.
 
429
United States
United States
Seems to me that it’s a game played on a gaming console no matter the style or shape of your input device.
If your Government bans all PCs you will be able to actress the internet and message friends on your a gaming console because it is a computer . The difference is one is better playing games and the other is a better workstation and both share the same internet. The choices of controller will make a computer easy to control for your use.
 
Last edited:
1,029
United States
Grand Rapids,MI
HaydenFan69
If your Government bans all PCs you will be able to actress the internet and message friends on your a gaming console because it is a computer . The difference is one is better playing games and the other is a better workstation and both share the same internet. The choices of controller will make a computer easy to control for your use.
2B410BE0-40A4-4CB8-A5E9-E89DECFE2172.gif
 

Scaff

Moderator
26,623
United Kingdom
He/Him
ScaffUK
ScaffGTP
You have to make a individual choice do you want to play a game with a game pad or simulate driving a car with a wheel setup this is what most racing games give us. There is a big difference in controllers and I am not the one who can help you with the choice.
Oh 'insert deity of choice', not this nonsense again.

It's a game regardless of which input you use and the simulation doesn't change regardless of what input you use either.

Do not drag this thread off topic like you have others. That's not a request either.
 
Last edited:
1
Germany
Germany, Hamburg
hrnyms
Hey,

I am so thankful for this threat. I was a very decent daily race drive up to an A DR. Then I switched to an T300RS GT and I was shocked that I am not able to reach my times, not even close (2 secs/round) only in the rain of Spa this week I could compete.

I was so frustrated, but after reading this I will continue my wheel journey and hopefully will become an even better driver in the end... but it`s very hard to be slow again :(

hrnyms (hieronymus)