Your opinion about Kaz establishing his own studio?

[Tenacious D]

And then the quality would drop (at least on consoles) and extra time would be needed (world wide release and so on) and because of compromises that needs to be made while making a multiplatform game.

Face it, exclusive games usually mean games with quality.

Precisely... comma edited.

1. The PS3 is probably being pushed farther than with any other game for the foreseeable future. PD is developing technology which will benefit every PS3 developer, as they share details with each other. And this is made possible to a large extent because GT5is being coded from the ground up for one extremely powerful architecture. One.

2. SONY writes big checks to Polyphony to support massive games with loads of content, and gameplay which spans months or years, when many new games last 10-20 hours.

 

[FishforRent]

Where do I vote reeeeediculas idea?

 

[lalaurentide]

Whether or not PD is his studio is not important, who owns the Gran Turismo intellectual property is. When you consider how Kaz is going about the game, media information, etc., it seems PD has the control, sure they are under contract with Sony, but Sony doesn't look like they own the GT brand. On the other hand, if Kaz and the lead designers don't own their work, they should have left as soon as possible, cuz Sony is nothing but a bank who "loaned" them money to develop the first GT.

 

[Radracing]

Same as Disney and Pixar, Disney being Sony and Pixar being PD. They want more control or a bigger cut from the proceeds of the GT series.

 

[Spagetti69]

And then the quality would drop (at least on consoles) and extra time would be needed (world wide release and so on) and because of compromises that needs to be made while making a multiplatform game.

Face it exclusive games usually mean, games with quality. And now most of the 3rd party studios need to make multiplatform games to survive.


I hadn't thought of that. Red dead redemption being a good example.

 

[Scaff]

Whether or not PD is his studio is not important, who owns the Gran Turismo intellectual property is. When you consider how Kaz is going about the game, media information, etc., it seems PD has the control, sure they are under contract with Sony, but Sony doesn't look like they own the GT brand. On the other hand, if Kaz and the lead designers don't own their work, they should have left as soon as possible, cuz Sony is nothing but a bank who "loaned" them money to develop the first GT.

Sony 'own' PD, it started as an internal development house for SCEJ. Its output is therefore owned by Sony and that will include the Gran Turismo brand (to have it any other way would be insane on Sony's part).

What many, many people now forget is just how big a risk the original game was and how low initial sales expectations for it were, hell Kaz had to make Super Toon GP before Sony would agree to the development of GT.

That is has grown to be such a huge brand has benefited both parties, and the success has given Kaz prominence within SCEJ, and allowed him to call the shots in regard to the GT series to an ever increasing degree.

However be under no illusion, should he leave, GT isn't going with him.


Oh and its because, not 'cuz'. The AUP is quite clear in regard to text-speak not being permitted.

Scaff

 

[cobraagent90]

corrected..happy now?
And this is not about what Kaz would gain but what would it mean for us gamers

Not at all, actually, since i haven't understood anything in your last few comments. I am not a grammar-syntax Nazi or anything, unless a comment doesn't make sense, at all. So, could you rephrase everything you said with proper english and some facts(with sources of course)?

 

[Rattlehead]

I think, Sony's support could be quite important, especially when developing a game of that scale.
The game has pretty big budget, you know. So it's a bit unclear if GT without Sony would be as luxurious as it always was.
Also, before bashing the 3D support, you better try it out for yourself. I was somewhat skeptical too, before I saw Motorstorm: Pacific Rift in 3D and realised how much more immersive can racing game become in this mode.

 

[The Vanishing Boy]

-> Unfortunately, Polyphony Digital or should I say Polys Entertainment SCEI Development Team is already a part of SCEI/J from the start (Motor Toon Grand Prix).

 

[Owen.C93]

If Kaz was in charge we would likely have longer delays.

 

[Hun200kmh]

If Hideo Kojima could establish his own studio then why should Kaz not? After all that raping from Sony, forcing them to add 3D and Move support and being victim of their wierd decisions. Maybe the game would be out right now but because of Sony it´s not. Imagine that Yamauchi Productions (working title) could do whatever they want and what they feel is the best for their games. Maybe they wouldn´t be so tight lipped and would be more communicative. Maybe we would even see some developer diaries and some english speaking PR manager. I wonder if Kaz has ever thought about this in the back of his head..

What do you guys think?

As already pointed out we do not know who is to blame for the fact that GT5 isn't out yet. Could be Sony for strategic reasons, could be Kaz because he isn't satisfied with what he got. The OP seems to think it's the former, I do think it's the latter. PD, as a developer that has based the rep of an entire franchise on their groundbraking graphics, "almost-sim" physics and game-size (number of cars, tracks, gt mode), and remained head and shoulders above any competition in the PS1 and PS2 era, is in this generation of consoles facing competition more fierce than ever.

PD, always focused in the graphics quality of their products, started to fall behind their still shy competition when the PS2 console life was approaching its end. GT4 is/was the swann song of the traditional GT "natural evolution". Graphically, you couldn't squeeze more than that from a PS2. But other game companies and devs were already setting their sights and doing better than PD in other aspects, such as physics (Enthusia), online (TRD3 and TDU), damage (TRD3), larger car fields (TRD3 again). GT4 still could beat them all (and it did) but I can only imagine how PD must have felt the need to "up" their game. Especially PD must have known by then that GT4 would forever remain as their last offline-only game.

I'm not sure (none of us can be, with the possible exception of Amar and other even more silent members) who is to blame for all the zigzagging that happened later. I really don't know if GT Vision was really nothing more than a trailer, or if indeed PD made a HD GT4 with more cars per race (and online-able?) with the possible intention to release it for the PS3. THen we had GTHD announced, with premiium and standard versions IIRC. And a litle "demo" available for download on PSN. Still not online-able.

After, we had GT5P, and what was supposed to be nothing more than an appetizer to a full game (like GT4 was, released months before GT4) has had to do the honours (and it did, valiantly I might add) for a period longer than many other game's life cycle.

GT5P, however, has shown us exactly where PD had in 2007 still a lot of work to do. Online is the poorest you can find, even worse than what TRD3 already gave us in the PS2 era. Damage was still nowhere to be seen so was changeable weather or day/night cycle.

Since the release of GT5P what has PD been doing? My best guess is that apart from the development and release of GT-PSP (and that we can assume was Sony's demand), what really occupied PD was simply this: "how to make a game that respects GT's graphic quality standards and tradition while at the same time achieve fully functional and also "perfect" ONLINE, DAMAGE and WEATHER features.

And if you guys notice:
1 - ONLINE - we know nothing about the online features (apart from the promises of private lobbies and the glimpses we had from the LAN play reports and pics we got from the participants in the GT Academy National Finals);

2 - DAMAGE - All we got so far are very unclear reports about two kinds of damages implementation, and all we saw so far in clips is very, VERY poor, far behind well established competition (namely from codemasters just to mention the best I've seen so far regarding visual and mechanical damage). In fact, all we saw to this day is so poor it is worrying.

3 - WEATHER (random and changeable or fixed and the same from start to finish) and DAY/NIGHT (with or without cycle) - I didn't see anything truly significant so far.


So ... maybe all this is now - finally - ready. But, back to the question put by the OP, my belief is that PD (and Kaz) is the one mainly responsible for such a long period between the release of their last "full" main title (GT4) and GT5.

So, in short, I don't think it makes a difference if Kaz leaves Sony (and PD, owned by Sony and not by him) to start his own studio. Indeed, I think that would probably mean we would never see a GT6 being released.

Sorry for the long post, when I started it I didn't mean to write so much

 

[dxm8975]

Not at all, actually, since i haven't understood anything in your last few comments. I am not a grammar-syntax Nazi or anything, unless a comment doesn't make sense, at all. So, could you rephrase everything you said with proper english and some facts(with sources of course)?

I couldn't understand why he wrote "...to make cobraagent90 happy" as the main reason why he edited his own post, we usually do it when we make a mistake, to make ourselves understood. Not to make other people happy.

Sorry that my remarks have nothing to do with the subject of this thread, but I couldn't help writing this...

 

[bullie77]

As already pointed out we do not know who is to blame for the fact that GT5 isn't out yet. Could be Sony for strategic reasons, could be Kaz because he isn't satisfied with what he got. The OP seems to think it's the former, I do think it's the latter. PD, as a developer that has based the rep of an entire franchise on their groundbraking graphics, "almost-sim" physics and game-size (number of cars, tracks, gt mode), and remained head and shoulders above any competition in the PS1 and PS2 era, is in this generation of consoles facing competition more fierce than ever.

PD, always focused in the graphics quality of their products, started to fall behind their still shy competition when the PS2 console life was approaching its end. GT4 is/was the swann song of the traditional GT "natural evolution". Graphically, you couldn't squeeze more than that from a PS2. But other game companies and devs were already setting their sights and doing better than PD in other aspects, such as physics (Enthusia), online (TRD3 and TDU), damage (TRD3), larger car fields (TRD3 again). GT4 still could beat them all (and it did) but I can only imagine how PD must have felt the need to "up" their game. Especially PD must have known by then that GT4 would forever remain as their last offline-only game.

I'm not sure (none of us can be, with the possible exception of Amar and other even more silent members) who is to blame for all the zigzagging that happened later. I really don't know if GT Vision was really nothing more than a trailer, or if indeed PD made a HD GT4 with more cars per race (and online-able?) with the possible intention to release it for the PS3. THen we had GTHD announced, with premiium and standard versions IIRC. And a litle "demo" available for download on PSN. Still not online-able.

After, we had GT5P, and what was supposed to be nothing more than an appetizer to a full game (like GT4 was, released months before GT4) has had to do the honours (and it did, valiantly I might add) for a period longer than many other game's life cycle.

GT5P, however, has shown us exactly where PD had in 2007 still a lot of work to do. Online is the poorest you can find, even worse than what TRD3 already gave us in the PS2 era. Damage was still nowhere to be seen so was changeable weather or day/night cycle.

Since the release of GT5P what has PD been doing? My best guess is that apart from the development and release of GT-PSP (and that we can assume was Sony's demand), what really occupied PD was simply this: "how to make a game that respects GT's graphic quality standards and tradition while at the same time achieve fully functional and also "perfect" ONLINE, DAMAGE and WEATHER features.

And if you guys notice:
1 - ONLINE - we know nothing about the online features (apart from the promises of private lobbies and the glimpses we had from the LAN play reports and pics we got from the participants in the GT Academy National Finals);

2 - DAMAGE - All we got so far are very unclear reports about two kinds of damages implementation, and all we saw so far in clips is very, VERY poor, far behind well established competition (namely from codemasters just to mention the best I've seen so far regarding visual and mechanical damage). In fact, all we saw to this day is so poor it is worrying.

3 - WEATHER (random and changeable or fixed and the same from start to finish) and DAY/NIGHT (with or without cycle) - I didn't see anything truly significant so far.


So ... maybe all this is now - finally - ready. But, back to the question put by the OP, my belief is that PD (and Kaz) is the one mainly responsible for such a long period between the release of their last "full" main title (GT4) and GT5.

So, in short, I don't think it makes a difference if Kaz leaves Sony (and PD, owned by Sony and not by him) to start his own studio. Indeed, I think that would probably mean we would never see a GT6 being released.

Sorry for the long post, when I started it I didn't mean to write so much

110% Agree!

 

[Dan_]

Frankly, I don't like the idea.

Is Sony really responsible for adding features in a late development stage?

Sony's marketing decisions were determinant for postponing the release?

GT is a game whose sales are processed through all it's lifespan, does PD has the financial guarantee of constant revenue to support the development of a possible next title? Will this guarantee comes only from GT5 sales or the support of a financial company is required?

A possible scenario in which Kaz has an independent studio contemplates another possibility, a multiplatform game, so GT for XBOX and maybe even lame Wii versions , that alone would split even more the available development time to adaptions and thus reducing the quality of the final product or extending the development process, would the sensei agree with that?

Answers for most the questions are "maybe" or "not", so speaking rationally, would KY quit a good position in Sony, in which he enjoys endless credibility, has all the tools and ultimate tech available to develop his games, and a competent and focused team, to invest everything in an all new advevnture whose outcome can't even barely be guessed?

Again, I don't like the idea.

 

[SuperCobraJet]

This time last year, I don't think any of us could have imagined we would be here, past the 5 year mark and still no release date. Not to mention more definitive feature info. I thought we'd certainly be playing the the game by now.

Who is to blame? As they use to say; thats the 64,000 dollar question.
Sony...........PD?
So many possibilities, there's a good chance we'll never know for sure.

What we do know is prior to PD coming under Sony's wing they were able to crank out a new game every 4 years. Now we are 5+ and counting.
Of course one could argue that with the new gen console change, nascar, etc. etc. would add to the development time. Yea, I figured an extra year for that. Again, come and gone.

We also know the decision to get out GT on Sony's "Pip Boy" certainly couldn't have helped speed GT5 along.

Now there are rumors of possible delays due to 3D and the new motion controller.

It is also possible Kaz has bitten off more than he could chew. Then again Sony could be force feeding him.
I still contend GT5 should have been developed and released with a seperate NASCAR and possibly WRC games to follow.
The shear size of this game has to be enormous, or to quote Kaz, "dizzying".

As to Kaz going back to being a independent entity, I'm not sure.
As with anything else there are pros and cons either way.

Personally I don't see it happening. If he stays with Sony he will buck the trend and remain among the last single platform exclusives.
Bungie and MS parted ways, so you never know, although in Kaz's case there's probably less chance of it.

I do wonder if the GT5 situation, hasn't already stirred up some bad feelings between the parties involved.

Sometimes what is considered a "Dream Team" combo, just doesn't work out.
I guess time will tell.

That brings me to another thing we know for sure.

While blame be to whomever its due, time is being lavishly expended.