ZR1 to set back brits £109k

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^^Maybe a little harsh, but I actually agree to some degree...
I do expect the ZR1 to have a more costly interior than a Getz, but I do not expect it to be as costly as a Ferrari. If the Vette is on par with BMW, Audi and Mercedes, they have done a good job with the interior.
 
From what I'm told the ZR1's interior is very nice and not the typical GM car. Magazines also seem to comment on how nice the interior is as well. The latest round of American mags all ran a test on it. Sure it's not a Ferrari but it costs half as much as one does.
 
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Jim Prower
$111,000, But you also must remember that the Porsche Carrera S starts at around $70K in the same market.
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Our Porsche 997 Carreras cost £63K, which is around $111,000.
 
So we just get better deals on Porsches, for some reason. I don't know why, but we do.
 
Joey D
Sure it's not a Ferrari but it costs half as much as one does.
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Except for the fact that it doesn't, not here, it's knocking on the F430's door and it costs more than a 911 Turbo. Which is why I'm saying the car just doesn't have that same ability to beat the market by being great value against cars that are held in much higher regard here. Than there's the fac that as a country and continent really we're not Corvette mad, the corvette is just another car to us, it's heritage just goes over our heads over here. But I get the feeling that one or two people in the US just don't seem able to grasp the concept that just becase the car is loved and a bargain in the US it isn't like that everywhere.
 
Joey D
From what I'm told the ZR1's interior is very nice and not the typical GM car. Magazines also seem to comment on how nice the interior is as well. The latest round of American mags all ran a test on it. Sure it's not a Ferrari but it costs half as much as one does.
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Keep in mind that Dave is referring to the UK market. With a pricetag of 109k pounds, I bet it's approaching price territory of Ferraris and Aston Martins.
 
Dave A
Except for the fact that it doesn't, not here, it's knocking on the F430's door and it costs more than a 911 Turbo. Which is why I'm saying the car just doesn't have that same ability to beat the market by being great value against cars that are held in much higher regard here. Than there's the fac that as a country and continent really we're not Corvette mad, the corvette is just another car to us, it's heritage just goes over our heads over here. But I get the feeling that one or two people in the US just don't seem able to grasp the concept that just becase the car is loved and a bargain in the US it isn't like that everywhere.
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I could say the same thing about Aston's to be honest.

I am not really a Corvette fan, I won't want one, nor do I really care if it's the fastest thing out there. The ZR1 though wasn't targeting the F430 in the luxury department, all it was doing was going after the performance aspect, which it did.
 
And if all I'm bothered about is performance I can get a faster car for a lot less than the Z06. I could get a faster car and a BMW M3 and pay the insurance for them both for a couple of years for less. My argument has nothing to do with how good value the Vette is in the US, the thread is about the price in the UK and in the UK it's price begs the question, why would anyone buy one?
 
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Dave A
And if all I'm bothered about is performance I can get a faster car for a lot less than the Z06. I could get a faster car and a BMW M3 and pay the insurance for them both for a couple of years for less. My argukment has nothing to do with how good value the Vette is in the US, the thread is about the price in the UK and in the UK it's price begs the question, why would anyone buy one?
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Why would anyone buy a lot of cars? Ask yourself that. Take TVR for example, why would anyone bother to buy one? You can probably buy a much better car for a lot less. You see you fail to realise that not everyone cares about cost to performance ratio, rather they want something that they enjoy. Which is why someone would buy a Vette or something else.
 
You buy a car for several reasons, reputation and prestigue being a bigger one than a lot of people give credit to on forums. You can add a lot of factors into why someone would buy a car and depending on why their buying it different levels of importance would be applied to each factor. Things like practicality, looks, image, repuatation, prestige, comfort, spec, performance, cost of ownership, value over x years, collecatbility. The only area the Corvette is better than a car like say the 911 Turbo is track perfomance and the only track that's proven so far is the Ring unless someone can show me otherwise, not that I beleive the GT2 is a faster car overall but there's not much a gap if the Ring times are anything to go by. The same goes for the GT-R, it's almost as fast on the Ring yet half it's price. If the ZR1 was £20k cheaper it would make sense, but it's not. It's in the wrong company at £109k, it's going to be compared with fast cars that offer more than just performance.
 
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You are still missing the point of what I'm saying. There is a reason to buy a Vette, it just isn't a good cost to performance ratio for certain markets. That doesn't mean there won't be people in the UK wanting to buy one. Many things about a car a purely subjective, say when cross shopping with a GT2 people like the idea of a V8 engine better or they like the way the ZR1 looks better. There are many factors but you seem hung up on this performance to cost ratio for whatever reason.
 
Is price not the biggest factor when buying a car? If a car is deemed too expensive for what it is, in general do people buy it when there are better or at least alternatives with better images and reputations easilly accable? The answer is a generaly no. Do you think the Aston V8 Vantage would sell as many as it does if it was £20k more expensive than it is? Do you think the BMW M3 would sell if it cost £80k instead of £55 or the Ford Focus if the starting prices were around the £18k mark. Not at all. Price is a huge factor in this and anyone that say's otherwise is arguing for the sake of arguing. If your spending big on a car by and large the biggest factors behind the purchase are price, image and reputation. Why else do Lamborghini's sell if that wasn't the case. It's a trend that perfomance is generally not the main factor in buying a car, even when it comes to buying supercars and what not, performance is usually a long way behind these other things. If it wasn't then supercars wouldn't exist. I don't know if you've noticed but I am not arguing that the ZR1 is'nt quick enough. I'm saying that it's price puts it in the wrong market. There is a reason GM arn't bringing many over, it's because they are aware that at that price they won't sell. Which is strange because if GM lowered the price to around £89k but doubled the number they brought over they would probably make a larger profitt by selling more. Which brings me back to a point I made earlier, why would anyone but the seriously retarded pat £109k for a UK SR1 whenyou could ship one over for a little over half the price.
 
If you are well off enough to buy expensive sports cars, then are you really questioning price? Seriously if I had an extra $100k laying around which allowed me to buy an impractical, expensive to maintain, and fast then need be sports car then really I'm not hurting for money. I'm not arguing for the sake of arguing like you accuse me of, I firmly believe that when you get into the market where you can afford stupidly expensive car price no longer becomes a huge issue. We just all talk about it because most of us will never have the money to buy one.

Yes you aren't arguing the performance of the car, I'm not saying you are, but I am still confused why you think you aren't getting what you paid for. Sure the interior isn't as nice but the ZR1 is just as fast and just as impractical as it's competitors.

And you say GM should charge less, have you ever thought that maybe the can't? There are import laws and whatnot that companies must deal with when sending a car over. That's partly why my car cost so much to be shipped over from England. Sure you could come here and buy one to ship it over the the UK, but is that even possible?
 
If your well off enough yes price is still an issue. I remember seeing an episode of 5th Gear where they had a multi millionaire on and he'd asked for help choosing a new garage. They gave him several cars to try and he bought several of them. One of them he really loved was a Pagani but even though he could afford it he couldn't justify the price. So yes price is still a big factor. And once again, if money isn't the issue why would someone buy the ZR1 which has no prestige or repuataion here over a similarly priced Ferrari which has thoes things. People are shallow, people will choose image over so much else, to say othersie is simply being in denial. Why can't TVR sell thousands of cars a year, they're good value for money, it's because they don't have the same image as cars like the Boxster, Boxster has the prestige and image. Why do people buy the Fiat 500 over the Panda even when they have no intention of modifying the car (which is the majority), the Panda is the better car and it's cheaper. I'll tell you, image. The Corvette doesn't have the image, yet the cars it's priced with all do. If you want to sell and you don't have the image you have to offer sometihng positive to get people to notice. Being over priced is the opposite of that. As for cars costing more in the US, generally they don't. If you convert US prices into GBP you'll often find that the prices arn't that different. Certainly not 200%. There is simply no way to justify that kind of price hike and blame it on costs of shipping etc. It does not cost £50k to ship a car and sell it over here.
 
You are still missing the point. If money is no object some, people might buy the ZR1 because they like the idea of a V8 engine, maybe they like the way it looks, maybe they just want the car. You or I can't speak for people when buying cars. I'm not saying people will be beating down the door to buy the car, all I'm saying is that you have no idea what people are looking for when they have a huge chunk of money and shopping for a car.

People here in the states buy cars that are pointless too for whatever reason. Sure I don't understand why they would buy X car, but they do and obviously there was something that drew them to it. Sure some of it has to do with image but I think you are taking a lot of subjective observations and claiming them as fact.

And where in my post did I say cars in the US cost less? I'm talking about import fees that GM must pay to ship the car to Britain and have it legalised to sell their. I'm sure it has to go through some sort of safety test and emissions test before being allowed to enter the market. I have no idea how things work in the UK so I can't say for sure, but I'm sure GM isn't charging that much because they feel like it. There is a reason behind it.
 
Joey D
And where in my post did I say cars in the US cost less? I'm talking about import fees that GM must pay to ship the car to Britain and have it legalised to sell their. I'm sure it has to go through some sort of safety test and emissions test before being allowed to enter the market. I have no idea how things work in the UK so I can't say for sure, but I'm sure GM isn't charging that much because they feel like it. There is a reason behind it.
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Sorry I miss-read you. Regarding the price, it doesn't cost that much. People we're importing Skylines from Japan for years due to it being cheapre than buying one new here. If someone wants this car they will import it and save a huge sum of mony. The cars lhd only anyway, your getting exactley the same for less.
 
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Joey D
Why would anyone buy a lot of cars? Ask yourself that. Take TVR for example, why would anyone bother to buy one? You can probably buy a much better car for a lot less.
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TVR is quite a good analogy, as in the UK one of the principal reasons they sold well (at times) was that they offered a 'home grown' sports car that could in raw numbers take on some of the best from around the world, and at a price many people could afford (and a lot cheaper than a comparable car from the niche marques). TVR however did not do well (except for a very few exceptions - mainly RHD markets such as Japan) outside the TVR, they reasons are not simple, and never are for any analysis such as this, but do include a drop in perceived value for money and steering wheel being on the wrong side.



Joey D
You see you fail to realise that not everyone cares about cost to performance ratio, rather they want something that they enjoy. Which is why someone would buy a Vette or something else.
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Vey true, however by being dependent on buyers of this nature you will never shift volume at all.

In 2007 Corvette sold a grand total of 26 cars, in the period Jan to May 2008 they had sold 6 cars. Aston Martin in comparison had sold 861 (Jan to May '08).

So while I would agree with your point, it does have its issues, the main one being its never going to be a strategy that will ever establish a strong presence in a market place.


Source - http://www.smmt.co.uk/newsarticle.cfm?articleid=17573


Regards

Scaff
 
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Joey, you keep referring to the few and the some which is all well and good but with any product you can guarantee someone will buy it whether it makes any sense at all, hell, even if it is obviousley the worst object going. (And that is not a reference to the ZR1)

But what Dai is trying to make clear is that there is nothing that could even be termed a niche market for the ZR1, atleast not at it's price range. Of course a few sales will be made, a wealthy American business man, a collector or someone who has a love for corvettes. But that's not a market. And I'm pretty sure any imported car would find a home with someone aslong as supply was low.
 
ExigeEvan
Joey, you keep referring to the few and the some which is all well and good but with any product you can guarantee someone will buy it whether it makes any sense at all, hell, even if it is obviousley the worst object going. (And that is not a reference to the ZR1)

But what Dai is trying to make clear is that there is nothing that could even be termed a niche market for the ZR1, atleast not at it's price range. Of course a few sales will be made, a wealthy American business man, a collector or someone who has a love for corvettes. But that's not a market. And I'm pretty sure any imported car would find a home with someone aslong as supply was low.
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Coming from the profession I'm in, it's pretty clear there is a niche market out there for anything whether it be an overpriced Han Dynasty ceramic horse or an overpriced car. You never know who has money out there and if you don't at least attempt to cater to them you could miss out in the long run. I use words like few and some because that's all that will be looking at the car, it is a niche. Sure the ZR1 isn't for me, isn't for Dave, and I assume isn't really for you, but that doesn't mean there aren't a handful of Brits that want to buy it.
 
Well, looking at the vast number of cars that will be shipped to the UK market (2 this year, and single digits for next year), I think it´s pretty safe to say that all will be sold!
 
Why not buy from a US dealership and have it shipped over and registered?
 
Alex.
Why not buy from a US dealership and have it shipped over and registered?
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To quote a post on Autoblog:

Autoblog
Importing one to the UK means undergoing the cost of SVA Type approval conversion work to meet UNECE standards and paying import duty and VAT based on the value of what Customs think the car is, not what you actually paid for it. Add the cost of using a registered importer, plus shipping, demurrage and port fees, and insurance, you'll end up with the car costing the equivalent of over US$200K. Given that it isn't an official import, it will have no valid manufacturer warranty, be higher to insure, and suffer greater depreciation.
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Based on that article it looks like the £109K price tag is justified consider it equals $191K.
 
How do you work that out? Just becaues it turns out it will cost a crap load to import one doesn't mean we're not being fleeced by the list price over here. I'm wondering why it actually would cost that much though since importing an R34 GT-R didn't take the car close to it's £55k UK list price.
 
Look at the AutoBlog article TheCracker posted above my post, that's how I worked it out. And I went to www.xe.com to get the proper exchange rate.
 

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