Fanatec CSW/CSR Elite Modders Thread *UPDATE February 2014*

  • Thread starter eKretz
  • 3,600 comments
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Ok that's the info I've been wanting to know...awesome. So do you provide any PDF step by step instructions? I am decently handy if I have organized instructions available and I can figure out about anything concrete with step by step or visuals.
I am ready to do this! Can't wait to feel the wheel once upgraded.

Side question...with the new motors equipped will I feel more TENSION in the wheel? That's what I Feel the stock wheel is missing is the feeling of TENSION when under load in corners, not necessarily the brute forces but the TENSION is what I've been wanting in a wheel.
 
Colt Rogers
Ok that's the info I've been wanting to know...awesome. So do you provide any PDF step by step instructions? I am decently handy if I have organized instructions available and I can figure out about anything concrete with step by step or visuals.
I am ready to do this! Can't wait to feel the wheel once upgraded.

Side question...with the new motors equipped will I feel more TENSION in the wheel? That's what I Feel the stock wheel is missing is the feeling of TENSION when under load in corners, not necessarily the brute forces but the TENSION is what I've been wanting in a wheel.
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Yes I have a set of instructions that gives step by step text instructions. I am probably going to do some YouTube videos eventually. The first post of this thread (and any current users of the mod like derickh) will give you an idea of the increase in torque from stock.
 
eKretz
Yes it does dampen it a bit. One of the guys running the Bühlers and air cooling setup has found a pump that he says works really good and is quiet; @geg1020 will hopefully come and post up about it for you guys.

I just used the plug from my stock supply for mine, so I don't have a line on where to get one exactly - I'm sure you can find something through the usual channels like DigiKey or Mouser. Perhaps even Amazon or eBay.
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Ok i will try to explain what are my researches/test on the air pump noise side. Excuse me for my bad English I am not a native English speaker.

Being very sensitive to the environmental noises and running those Büheler motors with no cooling is not possible, I bought the air pump recommended by eKretz which is a very good air pump at low price by the way. The first thing I did was to make a noise reducing box to put the pump in. See some pictures here: https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/thre...ate-february-2014.274631/page-49#post-9457740.

I wasn’t satisfied because the noise was not coming from the box, it was coming from my CSW base through the tubes. In my opinion there are two problems.

- First, if the motor pump is not silent enough, the noise reach back to the CSW base through the tubes
- Second, when you use a piston air pump the air flow is not steady, it is on/off very fast which produce extra noise. There is a lot less of that problem with a membrane pump.

Before looking for another air pump i tried to apply the same technique that is used for years in the cars industry for the exhaust gas. The technique consists of reducing the high frequencies of the passage of gas through a trap. The trap consisting of a perforated tube placed in a container chamber with acoustic insulating glass wool. My tests were not conclusive at all.

So I had to look for another air pump. The criteria were the following:

1. A silent as possible motor
2. At least 30 L/M
3. A membrane pump
4. As cheap as possible

Found a very quiet membrane pump. The brand is Aquaforte V series you can have the:

V-10 10 L/M
V-20 20 L/M
V-30 30 L/M
V-60 60 L/M

I got the 30 L/M and Bought mine in a pet online shop in Switzerland here: http://www.garnelenwelt.ch/shop/

The final result is not as quiet as I would like but I have reduced ¾ of the noise with this pump.

Hope it helps

Gérard
 
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I too believe, that it's the same motor. The differences are the mounted pulley on the front and the longer axle (13mm) at the rear.
Do you think it is possible to dissmount the pulley (for example with heat, or cut it off)?

I asked the seller for a datasheet...maybe I get some useful reply.


One question on the airpump for cooling: how much troughput (liter/minute) is enough for this purpose?
 
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It's definitely NOT the same motor but it may have close enough specs to work just as well. You can remove the gear/pulley - it will just be pressed on the shaft with an interference fit. You'll need a puller or careful application of heat to prevent damaging the motor. The motors I use are also extended shaft on the rear - part of the mod work is to cut that off flush.

On the air pump you want to go for around 30LPM to be safe.
 
Lol, SURE thing. I would try it for sure. Maybe it will give us some new motors to hunt for! Do you have a multimeter? Before going through all the work of modding and installing them it would be a good idea to check the stall current.
 
geg1020
Ok i will try to explain what are my researches/test on the air pump noise side. Excuse me for my bad English I am not a native English speaker.

Being very sensitive to the environmental noises and running those Büheler motors with no cooling is not possible, I bought the air pump recommended by eKretz which is a very good air pump at low price by the way. The first thing I did was to make a noise reducing box to put the pump in. See some pictures here: https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/thre...ate-february-2014.274631/page-49#post-9457740.

I wasn’t satisfied because the noise was not coming from the box, it was coming from my CSW base through the tubes. In my opinion there are two problems.

- First, if the motor pump is not silent enough, the noise reach back to the CSW base through the tubes
- Second, when you use a piston air pump the air flow is not steady, it is on/off very fast which produce extra noise. There is a lot less of that problem with a membrane pump.

Before looking for another air pump i tried to apply the same technique that is used for years in the cars industry for the exhaust gas. The technique consists of reducing the high frequencies of the passage of gas through a trap. The trap consisting of a perforated tube placed in a container chamber with acoustic insulating glass wool. My tests were not conclusive at all.

So I had to look for another air pump. The criteria were the following:

1. A silent as possible motor
2. At least 30 L/M
3. A membrane pump
4. As cheap as possible

Found a very quiet membrane pump. The brand is Aquaforte V series you can have the:

V-10 10 L/M
V-20 20 L/M
V-30 30 L/M
V-60 60 L/M

I got the 30 L/M and Bought mine in a pet online shop in Switzerland here: http://www.garnelenwelt.ch/shop/

The final result is not as quiet as I would like but I have reduced ¾ of the noise with this pump.

Hope it helps

Gérard
Click to expand...


I'll see if I can find a similar one in the US with 110v, any suggestions on that @eKretz?


Jerome
 
AttilaTheHUN
Yes I have a multimeter...I think it works up to 10 A. Don't know, if that's enough for measuring the stall current.

EDIT:
Is an aquarium airpump like this suitable for cooling? The benefit would be a nearly silent operation.
http://www.ebay.de/itm/370800327852?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649
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That should be enough if the motor is similar, but no guarantees. If it goes over 10A you'll blow your multimeter fuse. You should probably just check resistance across the motor terminals first and calculate what the stall amperage will be to be safe.

As far as the pumps go, I recommend 30LPM minimum, if you guys want to try lower that's up to you, just keep an eye on the temps. I don't know of any better quieter pumps offhand, that's why I was pointing out @geg1020 and his discovery of a nice quiet pump that works. I can't afford to buy a bunch and try them or I would.
 
Hello my name is sisco, I'm from Catalunya / Spain. Sorry for my English. Long time follow your work, and would be interested in acquiring your mod, my engine broke down three times, and I'm tired of sending the wheel to Fanatec every three months. I still have warranty until later this year, but seeing that Fanatec engine problems are persistent, I would like to know the price and conditions of delivery from your mod to make a decision.

Thank you very much.
 
We are currently working on a group buy off motors if you'd like to sign up to the list the link is on the last page or two. The cost for the most popular version of the mod work is also on the last page or maybe two before this one.
 
geg1020
I wasn’t satisfied because the noise was not coming from the box, it was coming from my CSW base through the tubes. In my opinion there are two problems.Gérard
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As I await delivery today of an air pump for the motor mod I too have been thinking about the pump noise issue. Not surprising Gerard didn't find enclosing the pump in a box would have much effect. Much like the internal combustion piston engine most of the sound generated comes from the air intake and exhaust. Sound generated from the surface of the unit due to vibration is relatively minor.

So it seems the best approach to sound control is to dampen the sound pulses in the air flow of the intake and exhaust. Sounds (hehe) like fertile ground for some creative experimentation. Geez now I have to buy a decibel meter. Oh wait, I have an app for that on my phone.
 
eKretz
Actually on mine it made a drastic difference. Ask @Derickh about the difference it made when I showed him.
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After doing some brief research on air pump noise I realized my comparison to piston engines is a bit off because I failed to consider their biggest source of sound. Explosions when the fuel is ignited. For aquarium type air pumps the mechanical vibration is a big variable.
 
Can anyone explain how to get the tension correct on stock setup? At this point I cannot for the life of me figure out if I have 1 motor burned up or if I have another issue...when performing the FFB test in. FANATEC property page it is at the normal strong level as always, it when in game the FFB and overall Tension is very weak and at some points completely Dead FFB...I'm confused. I pulled the pulley as hand tight as possible then tightened.

Anything else I can do to recheck the equipment to get it working properly or any specific tests I can run to see if I have a failed motor?
 
The noise I hear now since I have the pump in a box is the air coming out of the base by the motors. I am thinking of putting something to block or deflect the sound coming out the right side. If a person had a button box I believe that would work nice to deflect the noise.
 
Colt Rogers
Can anyone explain how to get the tension correct on stock setup? At this point I cannot for the life of me figure out if I have 1 motor burned up or if I have another issue...when performing the FFB test in. FANATEC property page it is at the normal strong level as always, it when in game the FFB and overall Tension is very weak and at some points completely Dead FFB...I'm confused. I pulled the pulley as hand tight as possible then tightened.

Anything else I can do to recheck the equipment to get it working properly or any specific tests I can run to see if I have a failed motor?
Click to expand...

You need to tension the belts so they are just tight enough not to slip and no tighter. If you have a multimeter you can check no-load and stall current with the motors out of the wheel. No load current will usually be under .1A on a good motor and stall should be around 3A. The way I get my belt tensions set is to set the SEN setting to 90 and turn the wheel to about 120° and give it a few joggles back and forth, (do this in both directions) then let it center and see if the belt moved or if I felt it move. (Marking the belt and pulley in line with a small ink mark or pieces of tape before the test will give you a good reference for movement). It's important to tension the left pulley first and the motors last because moving the left pulley will affect the motor belt tension also.
 
Ok excellent. So you are just hand tightening first the left pulley, then pulling the motors tight and tightening the bolts on the front. This is a huge help. Thanks a bunch Eric!
 
With regards to the new motors we are collecting numbers for. At what point do we accept that we have all the support were going to generate and just buy?
 
FatnSlo
I would like to know as well and if the gauge of the wire is similar to the stock power supply. I have a extra Turbo S power supply that uses the same size plug, but the wire feels like a smaller gauge than what my CSRE uses.
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Ok my friend I will definitely get back with info regarding the fit, I just wait until the hole motor/mod deal is done first before I order rest of the things I need like power supply etc so when I know I´ll post.

Regarding data sheet for Buhlers I found this but I don´t know anything about DC motors so maybe it´s not enough info or even correct models?

http://www.ien.eu/uploads/tx_etim/Page_8_Buehler_41384.pdf
 
Nah, that number doesn't match the one you have shown in the auction. You need to match that number exactly on the datasheet to know what you have.
 
Alex Bonner
With regards to the new motors we are collecting numbers for. At what point do we accept that we have all the support were going to generate and just buy?
Click to expand...

That's kind of why I was thinking we should do a poll of the guys who have signed up to see what the general consensus is.
 
Everyone who signed up is about to get an email from me. I used the bcc list as to not broadcast each others' email address to each other.

Within the email is a link to a very short and simple poll. Please take a moment to answer the 3 questions to help us decide on how to proceed.
 

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