Need a Break from Gran Turismo?

  • Thread starter Haitauer
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I don't know why you are discussing the Forza series as an alternative when looking for a serious improvement in physics.

Both games' target audience is kids using a gamepad, sitting in a couch and bumping into everyone. No you won't get attention to detail in physics in games with several hundreds of cars.

The PC sims have always been and are 10 years ahead in that matter and you all already knew that. So if you want physics, you play Assetto Corsa and iRacing, not Forza or Gran Turismo. They are the closest (publicly available) you can get to driving a real car, because they aim for that.
 
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I don't know why you are discussing the Forza series as an alternative when looking for a serious improvement in physics.

Both games' target audience is kids using a gamepad, sitting in a couch and bumping into everyone. No you won't get attention to detail in physics in games with several hundreds of cars.


The PC sims have always been and are 10 years ahead in that matter and you all already knew that. So if you want physics, you play Assetto Corsa and iRacing, not Forza or Gran Turismo.
Do you realize how wrong your statement is... like really?
 
Do you realize how wrong your statement is... like really?

Ok lets do put this in points. The first two are on the part you quoted in bold.


1.-Do you know how many GT players use a force feedback wheel? This so they aren't sitting with a gamepad.
Do you know how many of those disable all assists, including ABS as that has a noticeable effect that goes above what ABS is? Not even the vast majority of this site -enthusiasts- notice that.

I'll tell you how many: not enough to be a target audience. That's quite obvious when playing the game, clearly catered towards the casual player using a gamepad.

As for the "bumping into each other statement", hop into any random server (that isn't a private group). Furthermore, in the game itself you can see the game does not discourage that, as it completely lacks racing flags and has a complete lack of consequences.


2.- Secondly, how come can you have the same attention to detail in physics in a game with over 1000 cars, than in a game with 50? Can you have a real attention to detail in anything, of quality, when what brings them sales is quantity?

Answer to both: you can't. This is the reason why F355 had such good physics back in the day.

This is applicable to all other aspects as well. Tracks in GT6 are of quite bad quality when compared to the current industry standard, because they have to keep making them as fast as possible, unlike other games. For instance in GT6 there's tracks that come straight from GT4, like Laguna Seca and Motegi, and even the new ones are not laser scanned, with millimetric detail and including all bumps of it, on the standard of iRacing, Assetto Corsa and now Forza5. Reason is that attention to detail requires more resources, that instead PD (correctly) uses into getting more tracks instead.

Cars are praised here, but in actuality GT6's car modelling was surpassed by the same said games and others, like Project Cars that model the whole car (bottom, engine, etc.). As I said, reason is the GT series focuses on quantity and in good quality, but not on the best quality they can offer.

That deals with your "Do you realize how wrong your statement is... like really?" reply.


3.- Focusing on realistic physics is incompatible with what console players want, which is driving and having fun doing so, without consequences. In real life cars would spin out and stop working all the time if driven like in GT6. This is why PD chooses to be in a point in the middle, a "sim-cade" if you want.

Remember Kaz talked about the possibility of having a sim version of the GT series. That not only means cutting the amount of content, but maybe more importantly not catering towards the kid on the couch. If the car should spin then it will in game.

If you want an in-game example, GT6 has many default and hidden assists. If you use a gamepad you cannot disable them, and with wheels they are the default, can be disabled but are under different labels to what they really are (ABS and SRF).


4.- For the said points is that "the attention to detail" and the "real driving simulator" phrases are just marketing slogans. They are incompatible with the numbers race and with the target audience.

For example, Have you seen the replays of GT Academy? They are laughably bad physics-wise. They truly look like mario kart, yet lots of people here are really caught on marketing premises.


5.-Finally, for those reasons is that the Forza and GT series will never, ever match the physics of PC sims. They simply cannot focus on real physics, as all cars have to be approachable in those and they can't focus on each as much as they wanted.

Furthermore, the GT series has never been close to PC sims' physics and on this thread people are now realizing that even on consoles the GT series was previously surpassed by other games that could focus on physics, like Enthusia and F355 challenge.




I don't mean this as criticism, but as an advice. People here are looking for an alternative to the GT series, as a break or permanently. If they look for physics then they should play the games that strive to have the very best, not the ones that have compromises and don't strive to the best. Those games are the ones I already listed on the previous post, among others.

In other words, the GT series is indeed the best at the numbers game, of driving whatever car you want, in many places around the globe and taking pictures, all within approachable hardware and software (means), menus and with approachable yet sort of realistic physics; the best sunday drive. However, that necessarily means the quality of each content and of physics won't be the best, and it certainly isn't out there. If you want to experience the quality game, of driving (on the PC) a specific car with the best physics and with the best attention to detail, without compromises to attract the masses, then try out the games that strive for that, not for the numbers.

Both are different approaches and different experiences. GT6 might be the best driving game to fool around with friends, but certainly is not the "best driving simulator" in any aspect, because it's not the best in terms of quality in any of those and it's not the most realistic in anything. For a break from GT6 then might as well go for those, then come back (or not)* if you want a good fun driving.
*The iRacing subforum is filled with threads and posts about wanting to come back to GT, due to its excellence in terms of quantity, but can't bear the downgrade of quality.
 
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Not really related, but I love the control in FM4. You give inputs, and cars react the way you'd expect them to, in contrast to actual driving.

Oh this just came to mind: try turning off motion effects. You might be able to see better around corners.
Don't know about any motion effects, my issues is more with control. Anyway decided to play again, rivals still not working as servers down so just drove a few laps around Laguna Seca and found that on Normal steering worked better with car I'm driving, Simulation can be better depending on car and track.

I found that it is easier to drive on tracks like Laguna Seca where there is braking before corner entry as when you press brakes, the steering system allows you to turn the car into the corner. On something like Bathurst I find it a lot harder as there are flowing sections where you carry speed in but no good if steering does not allow you to turn. They should add a third steering option to the game for normal controller users that lets the player decide when to turn in and how much with option of steering rate adjustability.
 
Don't know about any motion effects, my issues is more with control. Anyway decided to play again, rivals still not working as servers down so just drove a few laps around Laguna Seca and found that on Normal steering worked better with car I'm driving, Simulation can be better depending on car and track.

I found that it is easier to drive on tracks like Laguna Seca where there is braking before corner entry as when you press brakes, the steering system allows you to turn the car into the corner. On something like Bathurst I find it a lot harder as there are flowing sections where you carry speed in but no good if steering does not allow you to turn. They should add a third steering option to the game for normal controller users that lets the player decide when to turn in and how much with option of steering rate adjustability.

Right. Do you also let go of the brakes completely before starting to turn in? That's very important.
 
Scored Autosport on father's day, for a bit of a change.

The sounds are quite good, esp backfire on the down change, and the gameplay is fun. But the visuals are 720p and look like TOCA on PS2. Retro look. No rear vision just the arrow. Interior view is just gray fuzz.

The saving grace is the aggressive AI. Talk about slam the door, makes fun racing. That and Holden Supercars at Bathurst.

No where near GT6. Roll on 1.12.
 
Sometimes still braking slightly, sometimes not. Find it better when I'm still on brakes.

Right, some drivers just prefer to trail brake before a turn. Try slowing down and going off the brakes completely. Downshift, and start to turn. You should hit the apex. Try this for a while to see if it helps.

Scored Autosport on father's day, for a bit of a change.

The sounds are quite good, esp backfire on the down change, and the gameplay is fun. But the visuals are 720p and look like TOCA on PS2. Retro look. No rear vision just the arrow. Interior view is just gray fuzz.

The saving grace is the aggressive AI. Talk about slam the door, makes fun racing. That and Holden Supercars at Bathurst.

No where near GT6. Roll on 1.12.

It IS a good racing game and offers a nice break from the more serious driving games like Forza/GT. Can't wait to see what these guys have in store for us on current gen (not counting F1).
 
^^ :lol::lol:

The first one? I tried the second one a few months back. The engine sounds are decent. The turbo sounds are very good. But lost interest fast. Wierd physics.
Yes sure, just for the sound. Many of my friends don´t buy/play GT because of it´s poor engine-sounds :( . They don´t pay so much attention on the physics :rolleyes:.
Maybe we should make the sound by ourselves like five-year-old kids playing with their toys :lol::lol::lol:
 
I play battlefield 4 as a break from GT6. I litterraly havent been on GT6 throughout August and it was my first time back on yesterday.
 
Right, some drivers just prefer to trail brake before a turn. Try slowing down and going off the brakes completely. Downshift, and start to turn. You should hit the apex. Try this for a while to see if it helps.
Going off brakes before turning sometimes stops the steering working from putting enough lock in to make the corner. I'm waiting for rivals to work to see how far off the pace I am, hoped rivals would be resolved today at least given it was Saturday when it stopped working. Seems like a really long downtime especially as it seems the game has a bug for offline gameplay if the servers don't work unless you set console offline.

I play NFS shift when I´m too frustrated from GT´s engine sounds. :lol:
Test Drive: Ferrari Racing Legends is a game that might interest you too.
 
Yes sure, just for the sound. Many of my friends don´t buy/play GT because of it´s poor engine-sounds :( . They don´t pay so much attention on the physics :rolleyes:.
Maybe we should make the sound by ourselves like five-year-old kids playing with their toys :lol::lol::lol:

:lol::lol: In fact, let's pair up: you do the engine and exhaust, I'll do the turbo sounds! We'll flip a coin to select the track!

Going off brakes before turning sometimes stops the steering working from putting enough lock in to make the corner. I'm waiting for rivals to work to see how far off the pace I am, hoped rivals would be resolved today at least given it was Saturday when it stopped working. Seems like a really long downtime especially as it seems the game has a bug for offline gameplay if the servers don't work unless you set console offline.


Test Drive: Ferrari Racing Legends is a game that might interest you too.

I've heard good and bad about that game, but it is worth a shot. Never played it myself though. I hear they did good things with the engine sounds, and the cockpit views are killer simply because: you have FULL wheel animation! :D
 
Midnight Club 3 was for sale on the PSN last weekend, picked up for less than 3 dollars.
Having a great time with it while waiting for the gt6 update that is coming Soon™
 
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