Best British Car (National Car Thread 1, Now With Poll)

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Thus Far: What is the Best British Car?

  • Jaguar XJ

    Votes: 2 4.3%
  • Jaguar XKE

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Lotus Esprit

    Votes: 2 4.3%
  • Lotus Elise/Exige

    Votes: 3 6.5%
  • MINI

    Votes: 2 4.3%
  • TVR Griffith

    Votes: 2 4.3%
  • TVR Tuscan

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Vauxhall-Lotus Carlton

    Votes: 3 6.5%
  • McLaren F1

    Votes: 7 15.2%
  • Ford Transit

    Votes: 4 8.7%
  • Ford Escort

    Votes: 2 4.3%
  • Ford GT40

    Votes: 3 6.5%
  • Ariel Atom

    Votes: 2 4.3%
  • Aston Martin DB7

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Aston Martin DB9

    Votes: 2 4.3%
  • Aston Martin V8 Vantage

    Votes: 1 2.2%
  • Lotus Elan

    Votes: 2 4.3%
  • Bentley Arnage

    Votes: 1 2.2%
  • Bentley 8 Litre

    Votes: 1 2.2%
  • Rolls-Royce Phantom

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Original Mini

    Votes: 6 13.0%
  • Range Rover Mk1

    Votes: 1 2.2%

  • Total voters
    46
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YSSMAN

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YSSMAN
In order to pick up some responces on this board, and in hopes of once again bringing up some great conversation pieces, I have embarked uppon the creation of a series of "National Car Threads." Although the exact future of the threads has not been completely laid out, plans include a stop in every major automotive nation over the next few weeks, and then a collection of "winning models" will compete in a "World Series of Automobiles" thusly deciding what could be one of the best cars made worldwide. The thread is open to makes and models from the given country, and all years at which the cars (or truck, SUV, etc) were produced.

First to go will be Britain, as a good number of users on this thread are indeed British, and given that we Americans owe a lot to them for setting up our country, I shal give the honor to them.

However, unlike the Top Gear search for the best British car, I shal change the rules just a bit. ALL British marques will be included, even those owned by foreign companies. Thusly Aston Martin, Rolls-Royce, Bentley, Vauxhall, Lotus and Jaguar (to name a few) are included.

So, what will it be? Will it be the estates and roadsters that Britain has been known for, or will the new sports cars of the modern Britain rule the day?

---

For this first thread, I nominate the Jaguar XJ, in particular the current-generation XJ V8. Jaguar has had a long historic value not only to British motoring, but to the rest of the world as well. Although the E-Type is undoubtedly the most-famous Jaguar, the XJ has been the bread-and-butter model in their lineup for decades.

To me, the car has always been British both in look and demeanor. The car oozes presence, and has twice the character of any BMW or Mercedes. The use of fine leather and wood in the interior makes their interiors some of the most appealing in any automobile, and often times has some of the most beautiful combinations of colors in any model I have ever seen before.

The car has a very relaxed presence to it, as it does without the "Pomp and Circumstance" of most Rolls-Royce models, and it isn't overly outrageous like most TVRs and Nobles I know. If the Chevrolet Impala (the good ones) embodies the American man, it is certainly the Jaguar XJ that does so for the British Man.

But then the question becomes, what Jaguar XJ is the best British Car? Do you settle for the origional, or do you go for the newest version? Somewhere inbetween?

To me, it came down to the MKI Series 3 XJ and the current MKIII models. While I do find the MKI S3 to have the look, overall I think it has been the MKIII to bring me back to Jaguar. The MKIII has the looks, speed, luxury, etc to make it a world-class car. Although it might not have the respect of a German model, it has the unquestionable legacy of a Jaguar.

jg2006xj1768337m.jpg


Long live Jaguar!

---

Now its up to you folks...
 
I have a question: When we get to the Italian car thread, would Bugatti SPA be allowed in? Could we nominate the DeLorean for the British car thread? (these are serious questions, the second being less serious)
Also, Lotus Esprit. Yeah yeah, you complain about how heavy the car is and blah blah. But last I checked, a max of 1380 kg really isn't that heavy for a car. Especially not when the car was so fast regardless. As shame the Renault gearbox held it back from being the 500 BHP monster that was planned, adn also led to it's death. Oh well. It still wiped the floor with everything it competed with until the NSX-R and Ferrari 360 came out. And those looks. Refined over 20 years, along with the chassis.
sport300redsideey2.jpg

 
Ummm, yes DeLorean would be included in the lineup. As for Bugatti, I think I would want to put it at it's roots, thus making it a French car company. We aren't there yet, so feedback (albeit while staying on topic) would be nice.
 
Bugatti Automobili SpA was an entirely and completely Italian company, and still is to this day (it's just bankrupt). The factory was in Modena, and the car was designed by Gandini. Bugatti Automobiles SAS is the VAG subsidiary, and Bugatti is the old, actually French company.
 
I'll have to toss in the Lotus Elise for this one.

The Elise, from its conception, has been hailed as one of the best handling cars of all time. The use of aluminum in the original chassis design keeps weight down, and its super-stiff and responsive characteristics still manage to steal your breath and donate a smile, 10+years later.

The Elise chassis has also spawned other models, including several Elise trims (190, 111S, 111R, 'Type' model series), two Exiges, track-specific models like the Cups and the Circuit Car, wild yet engaging 340R, segment-leading cross-marque models Speedster/VX220/Turbo etc etc.

Lotus as a company was a powerhouse in motorsport history from it's conception with the early single-digit racers (leading up to the 7 - another marvel in engineering for its time), a dominance and massive influence in Formula 1, still seen in present-day racers.

Lotus's engineering cunsultancy department is also a major force in the automotive industry and as well the aeronautic sectors. They have large roles in several company's projects including Ford, Toyota, GM, Proton etc etc.

Lotus definitely has the credentials to craft a massively-successful and loved model, which is all aparent in their Elise. This car is about what all of us are looking for - the thrill of driving. Matching the experience is rarely demonstrated by cars tripple the price (another major plus) of the little Elise.

The Elise is the pinnacle of pure motoring enjoyment. That's what it all comes down to.

 
I'm a little unclear as to what Best means in this competition...

Are we saying Best as in the car we would like to own or think is the best car or are we saying Best as in best car for the industry...?

If the competition is for the former, I'd consider the Lotus Carlton (I really do like it that much), if it's for the latter I'd say the original Mini.
 
i'd have to go db9, not only is it beautiful and fast, but in the game you can make your own dbr9 that can do under 3.30 laps of lemans (with chickanes)
 
amp88
I'm a little unclear as to what Best means in this competition...

Are we saying Best as in the car we would like to own or think is the best car or are we saying Best as in best car for the industry...?

Good question, as I suppose you can look at it from different ways...

Maybe my inspiration will help:



I suppose that in my assumption of the best British car, I took more of the James May route, looking for the car that was indeed British in looks and attitude. However, I completely agree with Clarkson and Hammond here as well, but I'd still argue that the Jag is the best.

Your choises here folks, car with the most nods makes it to the next round...

EDIT:

Adding a picture would be nice as well. It helps remind folks what you are talking about...
 
...I have a sneaking suspicion that the V8 Vantage/DB9 will be big contenders here...

They were in my mind second place only to the XJ, but the DB5 stands a better chance than those two as well...

(but thats just me)
 
YSSMAN
They were in my mind second place only to the XJ, but the DB5 stands a better chance than those two as well...
(but thats just me)
No, it's not just you. I personally hate the DB9 with a passion because of the bad job Callum did with the rear-end treatment. I hate the V8 Vantage for not being the flagship Aston.
 
I'll answer the question posed in the first post, and the rest of you can agree.

Vauxhall-Lotus Carlton

Lotus_Carlton_4.jpg


I'm sorry, but the vehicle debuted in 1989 and yet it was the fastest sedan ever built until a few years ago (when all this de-regulating crap came 'round). It did 176mph with 377 horsepower and 420lb-ft (made possibly by a stroked Vauxhall engine with twin turbochargers) and it did 0-60 in five flat - quicker than the Ferrari Testarossa. The media called it irresponsible. It was a second and a half quicker to 60mph than the period's M5, and it was 20mph faster, AND had over 60 more horsepower. Other competitors? None. You could say it truly invented the super-sedan.

I realise it's been passed up today by various super-sedans (which I maintain it paved the way for), but in truth the deal is this: if this car were being produced today it would:

- have 600 horsepower (ie 20% more powerful than the M5)
- cost $130,500 (ie 60% more expensive than the M5)
- do 0-60 in 3.7 seconds (ie 20% better than the M5)
- do 211mph (12% better than an unlimited M5)

Imagine that from a sedan and that's basically what you had back in 1989, merely adjusted for today's standards. Less than 1,000 built (only about 400 of which were Vauxhalls - the other 60% were Opel-Lotus Omegas) and yet the best all-rounder ever to come out of the UK.

EDIT: I think the real kicker here isn't the performance numbers, though, but the absolutely unbelievable base car. The other comparison for today is this: imagine if Chevrolet took an Impala and gave it 600hp, a $130,500 base price, the capability for 0-60 in 3.7 seconds, and a 211mph top speed. That's just how crazy it was back then, too.
 
YSSMAN
...I have a sneaking suspicion that the V8 Vantage/DB9 will be big contenders here.
I think your suspicion is correct, at least regarding personal faves. The DB9 is the best looking car on sale now and one of the best looking ever imo. Aston Martins are synominous with quality at the moment, as they were in the past, they're fast, powerful, comfortable and refined looking GT's, it's almost the perfect car, maybe when the Rapide comes out that will be the perfect car, we'll have to see. The most important ever is probably the original Mini.
 
Toronado
Bugatti Automobili SpA was an entirely and completely Italian company, and still is to this day (it's just bankrupt). The factory was in Modena, and the car was designed by Gandini. Bugatti Automobiles SAS is the VAG subsidiary, and Bugatti is the old, actually French company.
:rolleyes: Give me a BREAK. I repeat what I said about that annoying font not making you appear intelligent. Bugatti Automobili SpA was created in 1987 (more than eight decades after the brand was founded in France) and was bankrupt eight years later after having produced ONE model, the EB110. You set him up for that answer to show your "superior" knowledge. Congratulations - you made yourself look like a fool.

Bugatti itself is, of course, a French manufacturer and would be in that country's "best car" thread.

amp88
You said it better than I did 👍

Thanks - but it's easy to talk that car up. Absolutely astonishing vehicle. :) Have you ever seen one?
 
Its a bit of a shock that the car Poverty picks is German, isn't it? :rolleyes:

And, I do believe I win

71-mclaren-f1.jpg
 
M5Power
Thanks - but it's easy to talk that car up. Absolutely astonishing vehicle. :) Have you ever seen one?

Yeah, one went past me a while ago when I was walking by the road and I've seen one at a car show too, in the car park. The presence they've got in real life is impressive too, nevermind the stats :)
 
daan
And, I do believe I win

71-mclaren-f1.jpg
No not really, I could always pick something faster and more powerful and more British ;).

But personally, that's not what the best car is about for me.
 
M5Power
Carlton stuff

But would you buy one?

It may have been faster to 60mph than a Testarossa, but it also broke down more often, depreciated quicker (in terms of percentage, at least), cost more to service and cost more to insure. The chances of finding one today NOT on its second engine is marginal-to-slim.
 
daan
Its a bit of a shock that the car Poverty picks is German, isn't it? :rolleyes:

And, I do believe I win

71-mclaren-f1.jpg

I was just about to say that about the MINI.

Quite agree on the F1 as well.

Scaff
 
live4speed
No not really, I could always pick something faster and more powerful and more British ;).

Speed 12 was faster than a Mclaren F1? Got any official figures?
 
Famine
But would you buy one?
This one on autotrader seems fairly decent...
Autotrader Advert
1991 LOTUS CARLTON OPEL LOTUS OMEGA,
12,000 miles, Totally original and immaculate version of this 377bhp iconic super-saloon. The only way to describe it is 'as new'. For an unbiased view of this actual car see June edition of Classic and Sports Car magazine, p205, in the 'Case Histories' feature. This is absolutely not the usual rusty and mechanically dubious offering; if you are looking for a genuinely faultless, totally immaculate and definitive version of this classic, then this is the car for you! Build No 419, it came from a private collection, kept in dehumidified storage until I bought it in 2000 with 398kms on the clock. Since then it has been Monorep serviced, has been professionally rustproofed to a very high standard, and covered about 12,000 miles. It has won national concours competitions, and is well known in club circles. It comes with all documentation, including the Ian Adcock limited edition book (itself worth at least £300), various brochures, two workshop manuals, etc etc. It is not cheap, but then perfection never is, and it's certainly a lot less than the price that is quoted for a mint example in the recent 'Look At The Wheels On That' feature in Autotrader! I will only sell to an enthusiast who understands what these cars offer in terms of value, performance, and investment potential. Strictly no canvassers please; if you are seriously interested give me a call to discuss this opportunity. £21,995
 
VIPERGTSR01
Speed 12 was faster than a Mclaren F1? Got any official figures?

It was never proven to be, the only top speed figures I have seen for the Speed 12 are estimates or factory claims.

Scaff
 
VIPERGTSR01
Speed 12 was faster than a Mclaren F1? Got any official figures?
Official, no it has been privately tested though and Evo are hoping to be able to publish the results, as it stands it's unofficially 240mph+ and under 20 seconds to 200mph, the original 12 hit 60 in 2.9 seconds in testing, the Cerbera Speed 12 does it in 3.5 thanks to it's diff.

But who said anythnig about the Speed 12?
ssc_500x446.jpg
 
live4speed
No not really, I could always pick something faster and more powerful and more British ;).
But is it better? And considering you've already made a post without mentioning it, I'll take that as a "no"...
 
live4speed
Official, no it has been privately tested though and Evo are hoping to be able to publish the results, as it stands it's unofficially 240mph+ and under 20 seconds to 200mph, the original 12 hit 60 in 2.9 seconds in testing, the Cerbera Speed 12 does it in 3.5 thanks to it's diff.

But who said anythnig about the Speed 12?
ssc_500x446.jpg

Now that one I would be more than happy to agree is faster than a Macca F1 (in a straightline).

LOL

Scaff
 
daan
But is it better? And considering you've already made a post without mentioning it, I'll take that as a "no"...
that depends if you want to break a land speed record or not :lol:.
 
Scaff
Now that one I would be more than happy to agree is faster than a Macca F1 (in a straightline).
0-100mph in 4 seconds? 0-600mph in 16 seconds? Pah! I laugh at your straightline performance! :lol:

But surely a "car" should be road legal and be able to go round corners... 💡
 
Well whatever it classes as, it was pretty important, yet still outshone by the importance of the original Mini imo.
 
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