2016 Formula 1 Shell Belgian Grand PrixFormula 1 

About a year ago a lot of F1 spectators complained that F1 became 'dull'. At least we now have a new rebel kid in the arena. Live life to the Max. He is a rough diamond which needs some polishing (and Horner and Max' grandpa will take care of that). We now have more to discuss, more action on the track and a new champ!
And yes his first emotional/adrenaline reply immediately after the race was not that smart of Max. Max wants to talk to Vettel after Vettel analyzed turn 1 on TV. Vettel had a clear answer on the Max/Kimi duels but when the reporter asked him what he thinks of his first turn, his response was "I have not seen the replay". yeah right....

Smart advise of Horner to Max: "don't tell the Italians the name of your hotel in Monza next week" ;)
Have you also read the epic response of Renault: "Kimi never talked over the radio so much when he raced for us, ever" :)

Hamilton is the real king of this episode!
 
Let's hope he does clean up his act because he is one hell of a driver and he has a very bright future if he grows up.
Absolutely. Some ex-drivers are again using this to suggest his move up to F1 was too rapid, he would have got this attitude and manoeuvres out of his system in junior formula like most drivers but he skipped all that.
 
About a year ago a lot of F1 spectators complained that F1 became 'dull' ... we now have more to discuss
And while that's not intrinsically a bad thing, it'd just be much more appreciated if the thing we had to discuss wasn't a death. At the moment we don't, but it's one of those things that's never all that far away when you have a loose cannon discharging everywhere.

It is possible to be exciting without being reckless. "I'd rather run them off the track" is not it.
 
Looks like the golden child isn't as golden anymore

I've never seen 3 into 1 at the first corner at spa, the gap Max was going for was always closing, in my opinion if he wasn't there the Ferraris don't clash, Kimi can then move out of the way of whatever Vettel was trying to do.

There's been loads of people criticising drivers for driving into a gap that was always gonna close and yet I haven't seen anything criticism of Max doing it. (I was watching C4 but doubt sky would say anything about it)

Would love to know what Max was thinking at 200+ (ish) you can't react after the driver behind. It's only a matter of time before it goes horribly wrong, I hope it's not at Monza and that both drivers will be ok. Yeah we might do it sometimes on our games but to actually do it on a track?

It was a decent race and not mind numbingly boring for a change, but Ham getting 3rd was always on the cards after turn one, it took out Seb Kim and Max arguably 3 drivers he would find harder to pass. If anything it shows how good the CAR is more than how good Ham is. (Before anyone jumps on me for saying #blessed is rubbish I'm not, he is a good driver, but the car is a class apart)
 
Also I see what @prisonermonkeys means with Crofty, he makes a big huge upheaval about Rosberg turning up the heat in the championship...even though in reality he was given a pretty easy task considering his team mates situation.
To be fair, it was exactly the kind of race Rosberg needed to get his title bid back on track. It reminded me a lot of Mexico - no pressure; a chance to focus and regain composure.

But yes, Croft does seem to think that everything needs to be turned up to eleven.
 
Max is quickly going to fall out of favor if he carries on like this. Unbelievable talent but you can't go around saying stuff like that and not expect any comeback. Needs to sort his defending out as well.

He seem's to be taking notes from the Schumacher school of defending. His talent is obvious however he's ruthless as hell, he's really gonna get himself a bad rap before long at this rate.
 
Today was definitely a learning experience for Max. How much he'll change, well, I doubt it will be anything but gradual. Remember that we're talking about an eighteen year old that has talent and a top-level machine to match. Too early to be in that position? Perhaps but let's not forget that those that decided to have him out there in the top level of F1 share some of the responsibility.

On a side note, F1 continues to allow teams to change tires during a red flag. Still not a fan of that, personally.
 
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The way he's driving at the moment, Max will either be World Champion in the next few seasons or he'll kill someone. Literally all or nothing, no 🤬 given racing.
At the first corner he shouldn't really have gone for that gap, which was always closing. Vettel was at fault for the collision though.
As for the swerve, that was just dangerous and stupid, had that been someone less experienced there would have been a huge accident.
Unless he cleans it up, people will forget his talent and lump him in with the likes of Maldonado for causing unnecessary crashes.
 
He seem's to be taking notes from the Schumacher school of defending. His talent is obvious however he's ruthless as hell, he's really gonna get himself a bad rap before long at this rate.

I think so too, but you have to be ruthless sometimes. Maybe Max is doing it a little too much a little too obvious at the moment, if the RB team steers this ruthlessness in the right direction he's pretty much unbeatable in the future. Doing this right for example, look at Rosberg and Hamilton in Austria, last lap. Hamilton steering into Rosberg is just Hamilton saying; I'm the number one driver, you can't fool around with me (read: if you're going to push me off track, you're gonna have a bad time). Difference is, Hamilton is a multiple world champion, he doesn't have to prove himself, he already did. His driving is confident unlike Rosberg, so he can be ruthless without looking bad.

Not saying the move from Max on Kimi was not dangerous, but if Kimi had the time to brake (avoid crashing into him) then he also had the time to move back to the left and go around. It's about expecting the unexpected, Kimi should know Max can pull of these moves. And it happens more in modern F1. Actually, Kimi had sort off the same experience a few years ago.

Go to 01:30 if it doesn't start around there. Then go to 02:40 for another one alike.

The reason why Kimi didn't crash into Max was because he did the move too early. He gave Max the time to defend. It is also possible Max planned the move before Kimi went to that side what could make it look reckless *orange tin foil hat* :P
 
I must admit I'm getting quite tired of seeing people use Max's age as an excuse for his questionable race craft. Talk him up all you want but neither is the excuse that "oh Senna and Schumacher did the same thing" a viable one. I wouldn't feel comfortable as a driver trying to overtake him, at this rate he is likely to seriously injure another competitor. Is that really the "excitement" you want from F1?
 
I think so too, but you have to be ruthless sometimes. Maybe Max is doing it a little too much a little too obvious at the moment, if the RB team steers this ruthlessness in the right direction he's pretty much unbeatable in the future. Doing this right for example, look at Rosberg and Hamilton in Austria, last lap. Hamilton steering into Rosberg is just Hamilton saying; I'm the number one driver, you can't fool around with me (read: if you're going to push me off track, you're gonna have a bad time). Difference is, Hamilton is a multiple world champion, he doesn't have to prove himself, he already did. His driving is confident unlike Rosberg, so he can be ruthless without looking bad.

Not saying the move from Max on Kimi was not dangerous, but if Kimi had the time to brake (avoid crashing into him) then he also had the time to move back to the left and go around. It's about expecting the unexpected, Kimi should know Max can pull of these moves. And it happens more in modern F1. Actually, Kimi had sort off the same experience a few years ago.

Go to 01:30 if it doesn't start around there. Then go to 02:40 for another one alike.

The reason why Kimi didn't crash into Max was because he did the move too early. He gave Max the time to defend. It is also possible Max planned the move before Kimi went to that side what could make it look reckless *orange tin foil hat* :P

Not one of the examples are the same as what Verstappen is doing, because whilst they may move late they don't force the driver to push the brake to avoid a crash, Verstappen moves late and then leaves no room.
 
Alonso was incredible same with Lewis. Hopefully McLaren Honda can give Fernando the package next year.
 
Not one of the examples are the same as what Verstappen is doing, because whilst they may move late they don't force the driver to push the brake to avoid a crash, Verstappen moves late and then leaves no room.

It looks different because the timing from Kimi on Max is wrong. It gives Max the time to defend completely while in the two examples the move made was so late that the defender couldn't move more because the attacker had his front wheels already next to him. You can time it even more wrong, like Hamilton and Rosberg in Spain.
 
It looks different because the timing from Kimi on Max is wrong. It gives Max the time to defend completely while in the two examples the move made was so late that the defender couldn't move more because the attacker had his front wheels already next to him. You can time it even more wrong, like Hamilton and Rosberg in Spain.
The difference is Hamilton and rosberg was just a situation where both drivers went at the same time into the same place, Verstappen does this every time he defends, it's a consistent pattern.

His blocking into the corner entry was highly contradictory stewarding as well, Rosberg got a penalty for much less at Germany last round as he even stayed on track, Verstappen does the same and doesn't even make the track and not only does he not get a penalty he gets to keep his place.

Things need to change.
 
Stupid question: why has Ricciardo taken to drinking champagne from his shoe? Because the races are on late, and because I have to get up at six in the morning to go to work, I tend to go to bed once the final classification has been shown, and so I miss the podium.

Is it a reference to David Reynolds?
 
if Kimi had the time to brake (avoid crashing into him) then he also had the time to move back to the left and go around.

No. Just no.

Racing drivers are supposed to have an understanding, a respect, that allows them to safely race wheel to wheel with each other. What Max keeps doing is something that is universally agreed you do not do. Listen to the very first words of Martin Brundle, "You can't do that".



Yes, it has happened in the past in similar situations and it wasn't on then, either. For example the lap before the famous pass on the same piece of track by Mika on Michael was not too dissimilar:



After the race Mika also famously went to speak with Michael and explain to him that manoeuvres like that were not acceptable.

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A different character would have ranted at the German, perhaps even tried to assault him, as Schumacher himself did to David Coulthard after they collided at the same race two years previously. Instead, Hakkinen calmly went over the incident with Schumacher, using hand gestures. He has never revealed what he said, but the message was clear - that was out of order; don't ever try it with me again. Schumacher, stony-faced and chastened, merely nodded.

Michael listened, and accepted it, because he respected Mika. Max right now is not driving with respect and some of the things he has come out with afterwards are downright scary.
 
"Shoey" - It is one of the short list of Australia Inventions. (Just Kidding the world loves the Rotary Clothes line and those corks you tie to the bottom of a hat.)
 
Racing drivers are supposed to have an understanding, a respect, that allows them to safely race wheel to wheel with each other. What Max keeps doing is something that is universally agreed you do not do.
At the same time, I think there is a culture among the senior drivers that others will simply move over; that any defence is excessive.
 
Stupid question: why has Ricciardo taken to drinking champagne from his shoe? Because the races are on late, and because I have to get up at six in the morning to go to work, I tend to go to bed once the final classification has been shown, and so I miss the podium.

Is it a reference to David Reynolds?
He saw Jack Miller do it, who (I'd assume) saw Davey do it. So in a round-a-bout way, yeah a reference to Reynolds, but it seems to have taken off...for Aussies abroad at least.
 
No. Just no.

Racing drivers are supposed to have an understanding, a respect, that allows them to safely race wheel to wheel with each other. What Max keeps doing is something that is universally agreed you do not do. Listen to the very first words of Martin Brundle, "You can't do that".



Yes, it has happened in the past in similar situations and it wasn't on then, either. For example the lap before the famous pass on the same piece of track by Mika on Michael was not too dissimilar:


What Verstappen did/does is even more dangerous and unfair in my opinion, because he doesn't give any indication on what he's going to do. While in the case of Schumacher/Hakkinen the driver ahead gives clear indication that he's going to close that gap, in an aggressive but steady maneuver, before the driver behind begins his move. Other examples from Schumacher are the one on Barrichello, Hungary 2010, and in a more fair and less "evil" way on Hamilton at Monza in 2011, which in my opinion is probably the most brilliant and exciting example of defensive driving of the last decade. Rosberg provided some questionable blocks as well, this year in Barcelona and on Alonso, Bahrain 2012. I'm not saying it's fair or safe, but at least they give a reasonable time to the driver behind to realize that committing to that space could end quite badly. Verstappen waits the move behind him and moves accordingly with an abrupt flick of his steering wheel. He did exactly the same in Hungary some weeks ago on Raikkonen. The day he misjudges the timing and does it one split second too late or the driver behind doesn't react in time, cars will fly.
 
To be fair, it was exactly the kind of race Rosberg needed to get his title bid back on track. It reminded me a lot of Mexico - no pressure; a chance to focus and regain composure.

But yes, Croft does seem to think that everything needs to be turned up to eleven.

Yeah but even Rosberg said it best when asked a question that sounded Crofty esque. He said he didn't have the pressure of Lewis all weekend and thus it made it far more easy to get a result today because of it. He himself doesn't see it as a turning point, more so as a lucky break that wouldn't have come otherwise.

Now some may say this is just Rosberg not having the fortitude of a champion to see it otherwise, I see it a rational man who realizes what the weekend was, doesn't truly believe he was the honest best. He could have very well been, but who knows, he knows he'll have to fight hard soon.
 
Well, the difference is Schumacher, Hakkinen, Senna were all brilliant and experienced drivers - I love this overtake at Spa, you can tell Schumacher wants to pull the same thing again, but he can't, because there's another car (Zonta?) this time and Hakkinen is just like, well, thanks a lot! Just awesome.
 
Paddy Lowe made an interesting point in an interview with Motorsport that implies a question about RBR's pre-race preparation of Verstappen:

With those four strong cars behind Rosberg, Mercedes had discussed every conceivable outcome, but much of that went out of the window when 75 percent of the German's main rivals ruled themselves out of contention.

"It all changed after Turn 1," said Lowe. "We've got a chart of what line not to take into Turn 1, and that was exactly the one that Max took!"
Let's remember how quick a past RBR driver was to describe another driver as a "first-lap nutcase" based in part on his performance at the first corner at Spa.
 

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