A GT veteran, past her prime... or so I feel.

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CTznOfTime
Any sport is a contact sport....
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Actually all motorsports are non-contact sports, except rallycross and maybe a couple odd others. The fact that contact happens to different degrees doesn't mean is fair game all the time.

Also, contact physics in GTSport is laughable. A small touch that you may think is "fair" and "part of racing", might send your opponent flying into the wall. Just avoid it at all costs.
 
CTznOfTime
No I won't.

This is happening all the time in F1, it's part of the competition... Drivers nudge each other all the time:
Trying to point out they are faster and to add some pressure....

You will never be able to erase or eradicate it entirely...

Any sport is a contact sport....
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I can tell you with 100% confidence F1 drivers do not intentionally rear end each other, that’s an absolutely ludicrous assertion.

Yes, ‘rubbing is racing’ and vehicles contact each other sometimes. But if the speed differential is such that you can contact someone’s rear, why would you not go for the inside lunge or pass? THAT is what F1 drivers do.
 
Alright, I see I've sparked a bit of an argument with my opinions with people on both sides of the fence. I just want to say that it's pretty much a pointless argument because they are simply opinion based arguments; some think small taps and agressive driving or the "rubbing is racing" is okay and others don't. All I want to say is that I do not wish to spark any actual fights over this!

On another note; I have completed two races of Daily Race B; one in the FT-1 and another in the 911, trying to keep it crisp clean. And to say the truth, it was fun!

I constantly thought of the race as a license test, and of the other racers as cones. Trying not to tap them in the slightest while passing cleanly was a bit more difficult yet manageable and actually satisfying! I got into a three-way battle for second place in both races with the same opponents who were fast and clean, I finished in second once and third in the other race. The leaders darted out at the start; nigh uncatcheable, but... damn me if it wasn't satisfying to race those two guys, or girls.
 
@zzz_pt
@ARTAsean
@watto79


I am not saying intentional contact to push your opponent out of your way is legitimate...

But merely saying at our level, being NOt f1 drivers, it is impossible to expect no contact...

We are taking about real world people on their console, with the lack of skills to go along with it.

Most Everyone here know and understand not to contact, but as said, with various degree of skills, there will always be tendency of misjudging and in turn contacts, into a curve way too hot...

It is part of the learning experience...

Good that you are ablet to avoid contact, but not eveyone has the same skills as you at the same moment...

I don't say I am better than you...
I don't say I am worse than you or play dirty... I don't.

Right now right here. None of us know...

I am just saying don't be putting everyone in the same category of dirty driver just because they slightly sound or hint at it on the forum...
 
CTznOfTime
@zzz_pt
@ARTAsean
@watto79


I am not saying intentional contact to push your opponent out of your way is legitimate...

But merely saying at our level, being NOt f1 drivers, it is impossible to expect no contact...

We are taking about real world people on their console, with the lack of skills to go along with it.

Most Everyone here know and understand not to contact, but as said, with various degree of skills, there will always be tendency of misjudging and in turn contacts, into a curve way too hot...

It is part of the learning experience...

Good that you are ablet to avoid contact, but not eveyone has the same skills as you at the same moment...

I don't say I am better than you...
I don't say I am worse than you or play dirty... I don't.

Right now right here. None of us know...

I am just saying don't be putting everyone in the same category of dirty driver just because they slightly sound or hint at it on the forum...
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I never said @gtp_Lee is a dirty driver. I think she might be a bit reckless though, given the difference between her SR and DR. Also, if you take into account the fact that she likes driving the Hyundais, it will be pretty hard to win since the cars are hardly if ever the best cars at any track. That's why I suggested it would be better to focus on racecraft and clean driving first and raw pace later. I mean, DR A is already pretty good.

As as I've said before, without video footage, it's kinda pointless to give specific tips. Focusing on clean driving is always good though.
 
I'll stop by to say that @zzz_pt , if you watched me race back in the GT6 days specially, around certain tracks that I was personally confident in such as Tokyo R246 and Circuito de La Sierra, I will admit that sometimes I got a bit into the "kamikaze style", but pretty much when I was just getting the battle adrenaline and in cars that handled well like the track toys, the Elise 111R and to some extent the Opera S2000. It was obviously a double edged sword since in those tighter tracks it is pretty dangerous to go for passes in the slightest especially around La Sierra.

However, I'm currently in an open lobby of Gr.4 racers and we're having fun. Everyone is being clean and the battles here are quite rewarding. I'm very much considering dedicating myself to practice being cleaner. :cheers:
 
gtp_Lee
I certainly don't feel burnt out with Gran Turismo, mainly because I alternate it with Grand Theft Auto Online every once in a while and it's fun to return to it. I simply feel like my level and to a lesser extent, my driving style, are outdated; things that would belong in the previous GT games.
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First off, Welcome to GTP! My advice would be to give this book a read, it helped me a lot! It’s only $10 on Apple Books and it’s got a lot of great info in it. Hopefully it can also be helpful to you too. :cheers:
0DB48A7E-EE79-4936-9C51-0AAA5CFDCEAF.jpeg
 
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CTznOfTime
It is not where it started... Pence just happened to apply the racing turn to politics... Cross Pollination..
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That's what I though at first. It feels like the term has been around a long time. But have to disagree.

The term "rubbing" has been used a lot in NASCAR. But the claim is the 3 words "Rubbing is Racing" was first logged in 2004. Sounds plausible.
 
gtp_Lee
I'll stop by to say that @zzz_pt , if you watched me race back in the GT6 days specially, around certain tracks that I was personally confident in such as Tokyo R246 and Circuito de La Sierra, I will admit that sometimes I got a bit into the "kamikaze style", but pretty much when I was just getting the battle adrenaline and in cars that handled well like the track toys, the Elise 111R and to some extent the Opera S2000. It was obviously a double edged sword since in those tighter tracks it is pretty dangerous to go for passes in the slightest especially around La Sierra.

However, I'm currently in an open lobby of Gr.4 racers and we're having fun. Everyone is being clean and the battles here are quite rewarding. I'm very much considering dedicating myself to practice being cleaner. :cheers:
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Great times! I must have spent most of my online racing around that track with a Mazda RX500 tuned to 550pp.

Do you drive on a wheel or a DS4? Cuz that's one of the main factors that allows people closer racing without contact.
 
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O604
That's what I though at first. It feels like the term has been around a long time. But have to disagree.

The term "rubbing" has been used a lot in NASCAR. But the claim is the 3 words "Rubbing is Racing" was first logged in 2004. Sounds plausible.
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Ok now my head hurts...

I feel it's starting to be an inception type of situation....

Racing giving credit to Politics for using a car racing terms in order to describe political races...

Sure why not...
 
Haha, those were the good old days, weren't they! :cheers:

I play on the Dualshocks for every GT game. I've tried wheels, and some damn good ones at that, but my reaction time is simply better on the controllers. To be fair though, VR with wheel in GT Sport is something else!

And oh, the RX500 was the bane of my existence around that PP range! Everyone seemed to run it, I just had to ban it from my lobbies! :crazy:

My main toys for the 550PP were unusual ones at that, the third-generation Camaro SS (my first actually tuned car, kicks ass and it's a jack of all trades), the Genesis Coupé (pretty nervous in the corners but it was nice to drive, had it matte black) and the Initial D Sprinter Trueno (it had BEAST acceleration and traction on the tight courses, seriously underrated :bowdown:)

@zzz_pt edit, forgot to @ you or quote you, lol! Still getting used to this.
 
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I've posted about this before. We all need a refresher no matter how experienced any of us are.


The first video says motorsport is a non-contact sport. Also, to prevent doing things that make you look bad. The tapping and passing is pretty much a bump and run, which is a no no. The problem is magnified in this game, due to lag, the damage model and tyre model.
Depending on all those factors, a slight tap from the car behind, can be more of a ping pong punt to the car receiving the "light tap". This is why I avoid as much contact as possible. I'm S/S and still wind up with players that continuously block, divebomb, tap, can't control their cars(which is usually the META for that week- and most likely a car they rarely use).

I rarely get a win due my mid-pack starting positions. However, I'm competitive, but fair. It's not worth the drama to move up one spot, at the cost of either slowing me and the cars around me that I'm racing or the risk of ruining someone else's race. When I am battling for podiums, If I've tried a few CLEAN moves to no avail and have to finish 3rd, I finish 3rd.

Lastly, the style of racing in GT5/6 doesn't translate, due to the new rules/penalties of GTS. In the end, it comes down to ruing someone else's race and making you look bad. Even with good intentions. Just food for thought.
 
05XR8
I've posted about this before. We all need a refresher no matter how experienced any of us are.


The first video says motorsport is a non-contact sport. Also, to prevent doing things that make you look bad. The tapping and passing is pretty much a bump and run, which is a no no. The problem is magnified in this game, due to lag, the damage model and tyre model.
Depending on all those factors, a slight tap from the car behind, can be more of a ping pong punt to the car receiving the "light tap". This is why I avoid as much contact as possible. I'm S/S and still wind up with players that continuously block, divebomb, tap, can't control their cars(which is usually the META for that week- and most likely a car they rarely use).

I rarely get a win due my mid-pack starting positions. However, I'm competitive, but fair. It's not worth the drama to move up one spot, at the cost of either slowing me and the cars around me that I'm racing or the risk of ruining someone else's race. When I am battling for podiums, If I've tried a few CLEAN moves to no avail and have to finish 3rd, I finish 3rd.

Lastly, the style of racing in GT5/6 doesn't translate, due to the new rules/penalties of GTS. In the end, it comes down to ruing someone else's race and making you look bad. Even with good intentions. Just food for thought.
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since starting GTS 2 months ago, and you can view how (little) far i have gone in the game from my psn status, i have NOT yet gone through the 'racing etiquette' section... saving myself for it for when i am completely done with the 'training' section... i am following methodically the intended chronological order of the game...

soon enough i will be assimilated and in the same mindset as you... resistance is futile...
resistance-is-futile-5kizkv.jpg
 
I mean, it can be certainly seen as a scummy technique, but it is applied specially in touring car racing and rallycross. However, I will stop playing devil's advocate and just say that it's pretty opinion based; it feels cheap, but it doesn't ruin the other person's race, so it is basically a very controversial midpoint in terms of racing etiquette. Some curse it and others justify it; but I certainly don't get mad when it's used against me.

Also, the DR / SR aren't the best indicators of someone's skill. As we have established, you can win races dirtily and stay at the back, racing alone, to improve both statistics, which is why incompetent drivers like you described end up at such high levels. These are workarounds PD's system can't compensate for or at the very least, would be seriously difficult to fix and prevent. :sick:
 
gtp_Lee
but it doesn't ruin the other person's race
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I’ve told you 3 times now, even slightly tapping into someone’s rear end lowers their SR. How is lowering someone else’s rank not ruining their race?

I don’t understand why you keep defending this position.
 
I mean *race* as in their overall placement and position; ruining a race is stuff like downright slamming them off the track, pit maneuovering and the like. And I clearly stated that I'm in a middle ground regarding this whole thing now, seeing as how I've experienced genuine clean racing and had fun while doing so.
 
gtp_Lee
I mean *race* as in their overall placement and position; ruining a race is stuff like downright slamming them off the track, pit maneuovering and the like. And I clearly stated that I'm in a middle ground regarding this whole thing now, seeing as how I've experienced genuine clean racing and had fun while doing so.
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I know what you mean. Rubbing is racing . As you said, you're gaining more understanding with recent races. I try at least to finish with the "Clean race bonus". At the very least. If I'm not gaining a position or trying to survive a bit of mayhem, the extra bonus is an achievement. That tap I get from someone, ruins that. I may not have been speared off or lost time, but it costs me something. If you get that meaning.
 
05XR8
I know what you mean. Rubbing is racing . As you said, you're gaining more understanding with recent races. I try at least to finish with the "Clean race bonus". At the very least. If I'm not gaining a position or trying to survive a bit of mayhem, the extra bonus is an achievement. That tap I get from someone, ruins that. I may not have been speared off or lost time, but it costs me something. If you get that meaning.
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Yes, I do understand the meaning. For me though, it's not much of an issue; if I get tapped intentionally, I'll surely hand the tap back in the next few corners. But yes, clean driving has opened my mind to a better driving style. :cheers:
 
kilesa4568
Ever get the verdict wrong about the 'intentional' tap? In the heat of the moment, most people do.
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I mostly ask after the race, to see if it was deliberate. But most of the time, people quickly leave lobbies, especially in dailies.
 
gtp_Lee
Being a dirty racer, and being an agressive one are different driving styles. Tapping someone without making them lose control to create an overtake opportunity surely will raise a few eyebrows, but I consider it a legal move; although I don't abuse it. Now, punting someone off the road is obviously something I won't do.
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gtp_Lee
I mean, it can be certainly seen as a scummy technique, but it is applied specially in touring car racing and rallycross. However, I will stop playing devil's advocate and just say that it's pretty opinion based; it feels cheap, but it doesn't ruin the other person's race, so it is basically a very controversial midpoint in terms of racing etiquette. Some curse it and others justify it; but I certainly don't get mad when it's used against me.
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These are the perfect examples of how the average GT sport player thinks. As well as the perfect examples of why I stopped playing to GT sport.
So many people doing things they think is ok even though the racing etiquette videos clearly states it is forbidden.

IRL No top/smart/good racer does this in touring car, GT, F1, F3, cup or whatever, because most road racing cars are not made to sustain contacts. The suspensions break, the aero gets bad, the cooling system gets damaged... So you either abandon, or lose time as a result of contacts.

In GT sport, no matter what you think, contacts (depending on the SR system update) might give SR- to the other racer that did not ask for it. (i.e. it pisses me off to get SR- because some guy thinks it's an ok move to punt when im trying to keep my SR always to the max.)
In addition, even if the other guy was not losing control, and not getting SR-, if he is a clean racer, he will start thinking that he has someone dirty behind him, and he will lose his focus.


tl;dr making contact is dirty. If you gain a position thanks to a contact you provoked, you have give it back.
 
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While I totally agree with you on the GTS part all you have to do is take a look at the 1990's DTM to realise it is very much a factor in some IRL racing classes. Look at Audi and Mercedes and how their second drivers ran into the other teams cars to block, damage and in some cases wreck each other to win the series. Also happened in BTCC and the likes.
 

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