A pseudo-scientific test: Comparing the Le Mans cars on Sarthe II

Discussion in 'Gran Turismo 4' started by Zardoz, Apr 17, 2005.

  1. gumpy

    gumpy

    Messages:
    1,119
    The writeup includes "I also checked to see how many cars Bob could drive error-free on the "4" (Fast) speed setting. As it turned out, only two cars had that advantage: The Audi R8 and the Bentley Speed 8 (which occasionally got slightly off the pavement, but not often). Why Bob could handle these cars at the faster setting, and not others, is a mystery. It may say more about the cars than the B-Spec driver, I would think. (Oddly, the '03 Pescarolo was faster on "3" than it was on "4". I have no idea why.)"
     
  2. [empty space]

    [empty space]

    Messages:
    3,863
    if b-spec is going faster on 3 than 4 then its because hes making it through the corner, but, hes taking it too fast and not getting an optimium drive onto the long straights. or, just plain running wide. sears point is another track where you just need to stay online to be "fast".
     
  3. -= XplosiV =-

    -= XplosiV =-

    Messages:
    13
    Thanx for highlighting that guy's, i evan read that before i posted, i just must have forgotten - DOH
     
  4. sejtur

    sejtur

    Messages:
    3,545
    Great test, Zardoz. :tup:

    I think if you don't install turbo stage 4, you can just use pace 5 for almost every car.
     
  5. Zardoz

    Zardoz

    Messages:
    2,208

    Checked it on three cars, as I recall. Didn't seem to make a difference. There are six places on the track where Bob goes off on higher speed settings (Mulsanne Corner, Indianapolis, Arnage, Maison Blanche, Esses, Tertre Rouge), and the engine power didn't affect it.

    800 HP or 1100 HP, he motored off the road on those places just the same.
     
  6. soptom

    soptom

    Messages:
    218
    Have you or are you planning to test them on another course, namely one without a straight large enough to even out a poor handling car if it has a big enough speed advantage? I can appreciate it took you an awfully long time to do this though so perhaps someone else with most/all of the above cars can try it( I haven't got enough of them to bother). Also, are the default settings close to optimum for every car? I haven't looked into it but if a car has good default settings, would this give it an advantage over a car with bad default settings? How about adjusting the settings on each car to your own optimum and keeping them on the same "speed" strategy before testing. Good write up, I'm not questioning your reasoning, just trying to even it up even more so that a definitive result can be agreed upon, what do you think?
     
  7. sejtur

    sejtur

    Messages:
    3,545
    I know you got the NTSC version so I'll check it out also.
    My C cars only spin when they got red rear tires (well I've had a few races expierience and maybe they did went off the track sometimes I didn't notice) but those races were not on Sarthe.
     
  8. Zardoz

    Zardoz

    Messages:
    2,208
    I talked about that in the write up. Proper chassis setups for each car could very well change the results. It could possibly move some cars up the list, and it could re-arrange the order of the top cars.

    I tested them on Sarthe II because it seems like a lot of players want to run that race just to get the great prize car: The Bentley Speed 8. Certainly running the test on other tracks could yield different results.

    While I had a lot of fun doing it, once is enough. I think I'm out of the car-testing business, especially since the other group I was going to look at, the JGTC cars, has already been tested for us:

    https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?t=62799&highlight=JGTC

    http://boards.ign.com/Gran_Turismo/b5208/85969693/?2


    .
     
  9. The-BNA

    The-BNA

    Messages:
    317
    That's great :) I loved every bit of it
     
  10. Pink_the_Floyd

    Pink_the_Floyd (Banned)

    Messages:
    4,041
    This not count for everyone,


    For me, the Toyota 88C-V is by far the best, in second the Sauber C9 and in third the Audi R8 followed by the BMW V12 LMR.



    But, good info, thanks :tup:
     
  11. VyPeR

    VyPeR

    Messages:
    154
    Yea I know what you mean with the Vertigo, I spent countless times tuning it up to make it "competitive". This car is tough to use, but looks like a beauty, and sounds ultra cool.
     
  12. VeilsideR33sub

    VeilsideR33sub

    Messages:
    123
    For some reason the Toyota 88C-V makes LeSarthe I seem unrealistically easy ; it bombs the straight , takes the dunlop or whatever at the end without braking problems and then eats up the back esses.
    I much prefer the Audi ; it is crisper it terms of handling and in Zardoz's testing it comes out as the only flawless AI handler . It is a little more work , both on the straight and taking the long curves but it's direct feel keeps you awake .
    In general , I Lap in a tighter coil with the R8 and this is what raises the usefullness of the machine over the Toyota which spams all it comes into contact with . . .
     
  13. barryf1fan

    barryf1fan Premium

    Messages:
    2,258
    Location:
    United States
    I may be a little late to this but I just wanted to say thanks for the info. I will definitely benefit from it. I hope you had fun doing it because that seemed like work. :)

    Feel almost guilty being able to "just" read through it and get all the stats without the work. Your a great person for sharing this.
     
  14. whatupdet

    whatupdet

    Messages:
    131
    This is a little off topic but I'm wondering if you race a race in B-Spec mode after you've done it in A-spec will you still receive B-spec points/stats? Or how about if you repeat a race over and over again?
    Lastly if you use the Race speed X3 option do you still receive points? I wonder because I've been repeatedly doing the El Capitan in B-spec to get an easy 1M in credits but my stats haven't changed. Maybe it's because I'm using a severally overclassed car for the race, I don't know?
     
  15. zondahelmet

    zondahelmet

    Messages:
    207
    what about the Zonda LM race car and the Nissan GTR Concept LM
     
  16. Moxy

    Moxy

    Messages:
    33
    Just what I needed! Cheers, I think this will help all 'N00BZ' like me in the future a great deal :dopey: :tup:
     
  17. T4 GTR

    T4 GTR

    Messages:
    165
    Location:
    Scotland
    Well, I'm a skyline R34 owner (60 Grand! 60 GRAND) and I'm actually quite surprised on how realistic it handles to the real thing on GT4. So I don't see why any other car should handle any different.

    After all GT4 Is a realistic game, graphics, sounds, feel.

    Cheers

    T4 GTR
     
  18. BMWteamPTG

    BMWteamPTG

    Messages:
    845
    great post. i learned a ****load of info here. as i started, in my head, i pre-guessed the results and was surprised by my guessing and your results. i was close. thanks for your hard work, and hopefully more of these psuedo-scientific tests
     
  19. tigre_hobbes

    tigre_hobbes

    Messages:
    71
    You're right. PD tranform the 88C-V in a bomb and the 905 in bull**** :guilty:
     
  20. F310B

    F310B

    Messages:
    581
    Nice experiment, I take my hat off to you. The only complaint I would have is that those ridiculous turbo upgrades were used. I would never use them, because I want to drive the cars like they would have raced at Le Mans, not like they would have raced with rocket boosters attached to the back.

    I also repeatedly find that the Sauber C9 is the fastest car in both B-spec and A-spec, apart from the F1 car, both over a single lap and over longer runs. It's way ahead of the Audi R8 and Bentley and other modern LMPs. R92CP would be second over a single lap, and 787B would be second over longer runs. The 88-CV is probably third in both categories.

    Why is the 88-CV so fast? I think it's because the developers took 50kg off the weight to make it faster. Probably just nationalistic bias on the part of PD - make the Japanese cars seem better.
     
  21. VyPeR

    VyPeR

    Messages:
    154
    My all time faves on the LM 24 hr endurance, or just normal racing on LM, are the:
    Bentley Speed 8
    Nissan R92CP
    Pescarolo Judd
    Audi R8



    The Toyota 88C V, though very fast, has (in my opinion) weak brake response
     
  22. Ebon

    Ebon

    Messages:
    7
    usually to compromise that I up the brake controller to 24/22 and raise the front ever so slightly, along with lowering the front spring rate. while these adjustments might not make this car the fastest thing ever, I find that that it's much more pleasent to lose speed than do 228 into a steel barrier while the rest of the field passes you laughing
     
  23. fdRX7

    fdRX7

    Messages:
    6
    empresseve work but i have a question could u please tell me what is the old "tranny trick"?
    i found it sorry about that
     
  24. DeSwyft

    DeSwyft (Banned)

    Messages:
    137
    Are there any other Lemans cars you haven't covered, or is that all of it?

    What about Pagani Zonda LM Race car or Toyota 7 Race Car?
     
  25. Rzeractor

    Rzeractor

    Messages:
    172
    Ahh, go the Pescarolo.
     
  26. Famine

    Famine Administrator

    Messages:
    70,033
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    The Zonda LM sort-of doesn't exist, and the Toyota 7 is a CanAm car.

    All of the cars in the test have really run at Le Mans in Le 24 Heures Du Mans.
     
  27. Zaine2

    Zaine2

    Messages:
    128
    OMG WOW

    This is really useful
    I don't think i'll bother buying another car now i have the minolta, theres not that much difference. Also i'd prefer to buy the audi rather than that French car. It's because i think french cars are unreliable in real life and have seen bad problems with them. Also that car is not that good in rela life!

    And german enginering is the dog b***cks :)

    Just one question though cause i'm new u see. I don't undertsand ur terminology on R2/R3 tires and those tire terms.

    Does this mean have hard tires on the back and medium on the front.
    Sorry it's probally a really newbie question.

    Great Work! Should diffinetley be a sticky!:tup:
     
  28. PeterJB

    PeterJB Premium

    Messages:
    8,137
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    If this was intended for Le Mans cars why did you use the Gillet Vertigo and the Chaparral 2D? Because to my knowledge neither of them ever competed in the Le Mans 24 Hours. Amazingly the Minolta never did either!
     
  29. daan

    daan Moderator

    Messages:
    33,876
    Location:
    Scotland
    A Vertigo attempted to pre-qualify in 1997 and a Chaparral 2D took part in 1966.
     
  30. evantri

    evantri

    Messages:
    10
    Hi all,

    Sorry for the noob question, but how to obtain the playstation pescarolo cars?

    It seems I can't find it anywhere..

    Thanks for the info