Are Nurburgring laps times relevant in 2008?

[neanderthal]

Thank you, Einstein. I hadn't realized that.

Sorry
I didint realise that your brief posit was indeed

.........how to objectively and quantitatively measure performance?

Perhaps i missed the secret handshake and ergo missed the the clue to reveal the invisible print detailing the rest of the "quantitative measure of performance."

My bad

 

[1X83Z]

Count yourself lucky. I drove a 2001? 02? - last year of the twin turbo 6 - S4, and almost bought it instead of my 3er.

Then I looked under the hood...

...and gently closed it again, then backed away slowly, and thanked the salesman for his time.

It was a great car, but it looked like an absolute gibbering nightmare for maintenance.

Yeah, you've mentioned that before, and it's an interesting remark. Most B5 S4s I see are driven by older people than same-age M3s (and are more often stock), and that may be the reason. Remember, though, with me, it'll be a gibbering nightmare for Jim Ellis Audi of Atlanta and McDonald Automotive Group to attempt to solve - not yours truly. Also remember that engine was used in a TON of Audi products including mid-level and very popular A6s and nearly every Allroad manufactured, so it can't be too unreliable even if it is hard to work on.

 

[Duke]

If you don't do it yourself, you have to pay other people to do it, and although I prefer to do it myself if possible, I'm allergic to doing either if I can avoid it.

I agree, I had no direct reason to suspect it would be unreliable, but - and it's a large BUT - anything that complex is bound to have problems. Especially something that begs to have the pants driven off of it like that manual-trans S4 did.

 

[1X83Z]

Especially something that begs to have the pants driven off of it like that manual-trans S4 did.

 

[YSSMAN]

Since I've been gone... I'll chime in...

I chose option three with a somewhat strong lean towards option one as well. In the end, it seems most-rational to understand that most performance scores a car is given often reflect little of what the car will actually do out in the real world. The problem is, using that method, no manufacturer is able to have bragging rights about their given vehicle.

The pro here is that the Nurburgring is a tangible way in which all manners of a car can be seen/tested, but at the same time, this also is something that does not take into account the differences of a car's layout or the driver behind the wheel... And to that end, it makes comparing lap times difficult.

Lets put it this way: Its a good tape-measure by which to see if the cars can perform well... But clearly there are limitations to the way in which that measurement can be applied.

 

[///M-Spec]

I agree, I had no direct reason to suspect it would be unreliable, but - and it's a large BUT - anything that complex is bound to have problems.

Your instincts were correct. B5 S4s are known for eating turbos around 75k miles. The wife's allroad has a slightly updated version of the same motor and they tend to eat turbos too.

That being said, I personally know someone that has 145,000 miles on his B5 S4 and he is still on his original turbos (and wheel bearings too!)

The consensus seems to be that some turbos will fail, while the majority of them will chug along without any problems. I personally suspect it's an oil quality and supply issue, since most of the turbo failures I've read about are heat/lubrication related.


M

 

[LoudMusic]

I think big track lap times are more important now than they've ever been. 0-60 times are being measured in hundredths of a second - that's imperceivable by the human brain. Top speeds are commonly above 150 MPH - no one drives that fast more than a couple times. There needs to be a new rule of measure for performance vehicles. Unfortunately there isn't an easy way to make an identical test available internationally, but the Nurburgring is one way to test them all in one place. I think we could use another big track on each coast of the United States, one in Japan, one in South America (Brazil?) and one in Australia. Then cars can be taken around to each track, tested, and overall scores be their general performance rating.

So, somebody build the tracks, k? (: