Bahrain race has been cancelled

[Ardius]

It would have been more likely to have happened back in the day when there was less money involved and the TV rights would have complicated things less. Where would the second UKGP take place (assuming it happened)? Two races at Silverstone, or one in silverstone, one elsewhere? Brands Hatch gp was always quite good, but I couldn't see the FIA granting it the correct licence. Let's get Boris drunk and have a rushed gp on the streets of london.

Snetterton, with the new circuit upgrades. Or even Donington with a proper backer.
Brands Hatch is limited as you say by not meeting the required safety regulations and also it is limited by noise levels.

If a replacement GP took place, it would be more likely at an un-used current/recent circuit which could find the money to pay. As it would be relatively short-notice (GPs are normally organised years in advance), it would be very difficult. San Marino, Jerez, Hockenheim, Fuji, etc would be the most likely places but all lack the money to pay for such an event currently on their own (hence their exclusion already).

I doubt they would run two races at the same circuit, though Abu Dhabi has offered this alternative.

 

[Akmuq]

Is Macau a possibility?

 

[Ardius]

No, its barely safe with F3 cars...

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Yes some minority of people may say it (but I'm not even sure it would be more than a handful of people).

Unfortunately it is the nature of these minorities to find an audience. Which only makes them shout louder.

Anyway, it's not really an issue because it's simply too difficult to move Belgium and Italy forward by two weeks each to accomodate the Bahrain race as the opening round of the final away leg.

 

[L.Hamilton]

Boring GP anyways

 

[Touring Mars]

Boring GP anyways

Bahrain is usually a snorefest anyway.

I don't understand this attitude... by that I mean, why do you feel the need to say this in this thread? This thread is not about how much you like or dislike the Bahrain GP... or any GP for that matter... it's about the fact that the season's opening race has been postponed and the issues that this unusual event raises... such as, will the race go ahead? Will it be relocated? When will it be rescheduled? Will there come a point in the season when Bernie has to decide whether to axe it? Will the teams/drivers know if the season is going to be one race shorter, and when will they know? All of these issues, and yet all you can say is, 'Bahrain is boring anyway'? And, by the way, any F1 track has the propensity to generate a boring race, and excitement in F1 is not solely governed by which track they are racing on.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

This thread is not about how much you like or dislike the Bahrain GP... or any GP for that matter... it's about the fact that the season's opening race has been postponed and the issues that this unusual event raises... such as, will the race go ahead?

Unfortunately, I've seen a lot of people take an attitude like this - they leap at the concept of the political uprising because it means a race they do not like will be called off. Never mind the fact that people are dying; the important thing is that we don't have to watch a race in the middle of the desert. I was cruising Facebook the other day and I saw a page called "Bring Moral Accountability to Formula 1 - Boycott the Bahrain Grand Prix" (or something of the like) and its entire pitch was that Formula 1 should not be associated with an oppressive regime (although incomparison to the likes of Libya, Bahrain is pretty tame), and so long as the sport could take the moral high road, anything that happened was acceptable. The people who joined that group didn't care for the protestors once the race was cancelled. It's the same with people calling for a viewing boycott. They were literally doing nothing and then claiming that they were helping the people of Bahrain. It's sickening that people can actually do this so that they can sleep well at night. If you want to do something about Bahrain, then you should actually do something. Don't just lie back and claim moral superiority like that - Formula 1 isn't a political soapbox.

 

[Ardius]

Personally I think Bahrain is one of the better "new" tracks anyway (in its non-2010 configuration), I much prefer it to say Abu Dhabi, Valencia or Singapore. I do prefer Australia being the season opener though, its a more exciting track and its (recent)traditionally been the opener, it also generates a more tangible excitment and atmosphere from the fans at the track, Bahrain will always struggle to produce the same kind of atmosphere in the middle of the desert.

 

[Sonzilla]

Thank goodness Bahoring track skip it and go to Australia or something I mean postponed, terrible outcome either way.

 

[Northstar]

Thank goodness Bahoring track skip it and go to Australia or something I mean postponed, terrible outcome either way.

Ughhh....What?

 

[Robin]

Is Macau a possibility?

I so badly want them to host F1, with a bit of extra investment in the track it would be an excellent race on the calendar. Macau's got tons of gambling industry money to spend and the facilities / accommodation are world class.

No, its barely safe with F3 cars...

Admittedly there are tons of crashes but I think its mainly due to lack of experience, F1 drivers could probably handle Macau if they can handle Monaco. The racing is spectacular!


Robin.

 

[Ardius]

There are several F1 drivers who are quite capable of emulating F3-level crashes. Sutil, Vettel, Webber, Schumacher all come to mind.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Macau is not possible simply because the Formula 1 cars would not be able to get through the hairpin on the back of the circuit. Formula 3 cars can barely make it, and Formula 1 cars are much longer than them.

 

[Akmuq]

The Fairmont Hotel Hairpin at Monaco seems quite a bit narrower though.
And the touring cars are able to make it through.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Formula 1 cars are much longer than touring cars. They can make it through the hairpin at Monaco because they're at full lock, but the hairpin at Macau is much tighter. It's also narrower. See if you can find a video of the infamous hairpin on the Beijing street circuit that A1GP used a few years ago. That's what Formula 1 at Macau would be like. If so much as one driver let the revs drop too low going through the hairpin at Macau and they came to a halt, the race would have to be stopped while they dug the car out. Macau simply isn't an option. FOM will try and get Bahrain back on the calendar at some point if they can, but if that doesn't work out, then there won't be a repalcement race. We'll just have a calendar of 19 races.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Personally I think Bahrain is one of the better "new" tracks anyway (in its non-2010 configuration), I much prefer it to say Abu Dhabi, Valencia or Singapore.

It's a shame, because with a few minor changes, I think each of those circuits could be fantastic. Run the perimeter version of Bahrain and the shortest configuration of Abu Dhabi (it cuts left halfway through the corners over the hill and rejoins halfway down the back straight, and then cuts out the second half by linking the first swtichback to the final corner) and run them over two hours rather than 300km. As for Valencia, iron out the chicane between the start line and the bridge, and condense the switchback at the bottom of the circuit to a single hairpin bend rather than three. And finally, dial Singapore's back straight out by 200m and go around the war memorial rather than down the inside, and make the section from Piquet's corner to the start-finish line flat out by removing the novelty chicane under the grandstand. And maybe reprofile turn ten to get rid of the chicane. Something like this.

 

[Ardius]

The short version of Abu Dhabi is terrible, how could you suggest that? Have you not seen the GP2 Asia races there?

 

[prisonermonkeys]

No, I mean the short version:

There are three problems with Abu Dhabi: first of all, that fiddly chicane before the hairpin at the far end of the circuit. Secondly, the section in and around the hotel. And thirdly, the switchback at the end of the main straight produces no passing because the second bend favours the defending driver.

The short version of the circuit cuts out the chicane before the hairpin entirely. Instead of a wallowing procession, the cars go left-right-left down a steep drop. Likewise, it avoids the yawnfest that is the section under the hotel by cutting it out completely. And finally, it fixes the problem with the swtichback. The switchback produces no passing because although it's a tight bend after a long straight, the right-hander means the complex favours the defending driver. However, this variation replaces the right with a second left, which should favour the attacking driver because he will have the inside line for both bends.

Alternatively, I'd just say build this circuit and be done with it:

 

[Ardius]

So you answered the question there then, you didn't watch the GP2 Asia. Although they used a slightly longer configuration which continues as normal around the hotel, the bits you specify are so much better are not.
The left-right-left section is not great to watch in my opinion, or at least not much better than the ordinary layout. It also doesn't help the racing because its quite narrow and very easy to lose traction behind other cars. Grosjean kept catching Bianchi there and completely losing out in the exit. By the time they got to the end of the straight, he had lost the ground he had gained.
Losing the switchback is pretty meaningless when the width of the track there is still quite narrow. The switchback works better in conjuction with the longer straight.

Ironically, the section that both of the short variations miss out is quite important for overtaking at Abu Dhabi - because it creates the uber-long straight for a nice slipstream and it features corners which the cars can follow each other as they are not downforce dependent. So its actually the best part of the track (it also happens to be my favourite section when playing F1 2010).
Also, the hotel section induces mistakes, not major ones, but enough for the driver behind to catch up a little. Problem is the circuit doesn't provide an oppotunity to capitalise on the mistake.

All off topic of course.

 

[Robin]

Macau is not possible simply because the Formula 1 cars would not be able to get through the hairpin on the back of the circuit. Formula 3 cars can barely make it, and Formula 1 cars are much longer than them.

Could they not just widen that hairpin?, I doubt it would be that hard a project to do especially if thats the only thing holding the circuit back from F1 use.

Its my life mission to get an F1 race held at Macau at some point! Bernie, where are you!

Robin.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

I saw this very interesting article over at PlanetF1 that suggests the Bahrain Grand Prix was not so much a victim of the riots in Bahrain, but a fundamental cause of them. Based on the opinions of some of the rioters, the race is little more than a toy to satisfy the Crown Prince’s desires, and something of a symbol of the problems within the country.

If this is true – and I admit to being sceptical because the article only quotes one protestor out of thousands, so it’s very difficult to gauge public opinion; even those who disagreed with me intensely over the past few days have to agree that a sample of one is not indicative of the opinion of thousands – then it’s unlikley Bahrain will ever return to the calendar.

Could they not just widen that hairpin?

Nope. There are buildings on the outer edge that butt up against the circuit. And they're also lower than the road level.

I doubt it would be that hard a project to do especially if thats the only thing holding the circuit back from F1 use.

It's not. The circuit is ridiculously narrow, has no run-off, very limited access for safety vehicles, a paddock that is far too small, and half a dozen places where a stopped car would force the race to be abandoned while it was retrieved because it blocked the track, and with simply no way to widen the circuit.

Formula 1 will never visit Macau.

 

[F1 fan]

Bernie to work on rescheduling the Bahrain GP

 

[Hun200kmh]

Well, it's a lot like Monaco in everything you said. Problem is ... it isn't Monaco so the local authorities would have to pay A LOT to get Bernie interested. And, for the sake of the people there, I really hope they never try that.

Macau is in a class of its own, and that should be kept.

But "Formula 1 will never visit Macau" is too bold as a statement. Throw enough cash Bernie's way and you'll have a F1 race in any place on Earth.

 

[F1 fan]

But "Formula 1 will never visit Macau" is too bold as a statement. Throw enough cash Bernie's way and you'll have a F1 race in any place on Earth.

Anywhere?

Welcome to Glasgow for round 2 of the 2012 FIA formula one world championship.

Granted, I took a bad example of glasgow, but you get the point...

 

[prisonermonkeys]

The Macau circuit barely meets the critieria for an FIA Grade-2 licence. Bernie himself has admitted that if Monaco sought to join the calendar today, he'd have to turn them down. The circuit simply doesn't meet the demands of the FIA. And without a Grade-1 licence, they can't host Formula 1.

 

[Touring Mars]

I saw this very interesting article over at PlanetF1 that suggests the Bahrain Grand Prix was not so much a victim of the riots in Bahrain, but a fundamental cause of them. Based on the opinions of some of the rioters, the race is little more than a toy to satisfy the Crown Prince’s desires, and something of a symbol of the problems within the country.

If this is true – and I admit to being sceptical because the article only quotes one protestor out of thousands, so it’s very difficult to gauge public opinion; even those who disagreed with me intensely over the past few days have to agree that a sample of one is not indicative of the opinion of thousands – then it’s unlikley Bahrain will ever return to the calendar.

At best, the presence of F1 is a mere symptom of the way the country has been operating, and it would take a monumental leap of twisted logic to conclude that F1 was the actual 'illness' or a cause (let alone the cause) of the unrest. Quoting a single protester as 'the view from the street' (as opposed to merely 'a view from the street') is the flimsy foundation upon which the rest of the article falls. Clearly, a protester in Bahrain will cease upon just about anything to malign their opponents, and the Bahrain GP, being the nation's highest profile international event, is an easy target for this kind of criticism. However, I would say it was totally unjustified. The article seems to be a faintly ludicrous attempt to politicise the event, and it reeks of opportunism.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

Well, I'm just paraphrasing the article there. I personally would say that the race has become symbolic of the government, but I wouldn't go so far as to say it caused the riots.

 

[Hun200kmh]

Anywhere?

(picture)

Welcome to Glasgow for round 2 of the 2012 FIA formula one world championship.

Granted, I took a bad example of glasgow, but you get the point...

All you need is cash. Bernie's way and to make the necessary improvements to the track (or track site). Singapore, Korea, Bahrain, Abu Dhabi ... the list is long.

But hey, let me make a twin brother of your post ... like this:

Anywhere?

Welcome to Austin, Texas, for round ... of the 2012 FIA formula one world championship.

Granted, I took a bad example of Austin, but you get the point...

See? Add (lots, and lots, and lots ... of) money to the equation and "voilá" ... the circus will visit your town.

 

[F1 fan]

See? Add (lots, and lots, and lots ... of) money to the equation and "voilá" ... the circus will visit your town.

I've seen that photo of Austin before... Doubt the Texans and tourists will flood the track with buckfast bottles... Although f1 circuits and wine bottles have been combined before...

 

[Robin]

Nope. There are buildings on the outer edge that butt up against the circuit. And they're also lower than the road level.

I kinda meant widen it on the inside, the hairpin barriers and drop doesn't have to be positioned like that, it just so happens to be how the public road is laid out. As for the narrowness the funny thing is its very wide in some areas (3 lanes round the reservoir) and super tight in others.

I can see a racing line through those trees so its good to go! 👍 Bernie would really host a track anywhere provided you pay him enough!

Robin.