Hey guys I have a quick question. Does moveing the ballast placement slider up or down without adding any weight change how a car drives.. I know adding weight and placeing it changes things but if the weight is left at 0 and the position is moved to say +50 does the handleing change any???
Ballast position does it work with no weight added
- Thread starter Taz69
- 41 comments
- 4,697 views
- 7,938
- LMSCorvetteGT2's Mom's House
- GTP_LancerEvo7
It might just be the psychological effect, but when I do it it seems to change the handling.
- 167
- italy sorrento
- frankiefly71/GTP_frankiefly
Hmm well thats just crazy.. So the game is letting you move weight around that you havent even put on the car. Ok well lets just say you have a car pushing. Would you move the slider toward that end or away from that end. Does moveing the slider towards the end that slips give it grip? Or do you move it the opposite way and move weight off of the end that is slipping???
- 3,359
- California
- PumpinNumbies
To the rear adds oversteer, to the front adds understeer. In most cases.
Just because you haven't added weight to the car, doesn't mean there isn't weight to be moved around. I look at it as the equivalent to a battery relocation.
Just because you haven't added weight to the car, doesn't mean there isn't weight to be moved around. I look at it as the equivalent to a battery relocation.
- 330
- California
praiano63
A friggin' shark with a friggin' laser beam attached to his friggin' head? I think so.
Back on topic, would a 5 kg ballast make a discernible difference?
- 167
- italy sorrento
- frankiefly71/GTP_frankiefly
This is because of the weight of the empty box. Picture below is the ballast box used by germans cars. There is also a difference if you use half empty or half full bottles...!!!!
That`s all as simple as this.
><(((((°>°°°°°°°°°°°°°°
AHAHAHHAHAAH
at first sight, I thought you had brought beers to clarify our ideas and better dissect the topic .. I was adding some pretzels
- 4,803
- Dearborn, MI
- MotorCtyHamilton
So with zero ballast and moving the +/1 slider, if it truly did move weight around the car, why doesn't it show up in the F/R weight percentages shown in the tuning screen? I thought we put all of this to bed when they added the percentage indicators?
- 3,359
- California
- PumpinNumbies
On the average car, it would take a minimum of a 70lb difference front to back to see a single percentage difference.
- 331
- Allentown/PA/US
- theycallmeherbie, GTP_Herbie,
I just did this. I have noticed difference in handling by just moving ballast alone. In fact my M3 GTR at 527HP and 1390kg at 550PP, ran better, handled better with weight to the front. I didnt notice much understeer but when moved to position +50 I understeered horribly. I think if your front to light your tires cant use the weight and start slipping. Just my exp for this car at nurburg.
Is + moveing it forward and - moveing it backwards cause if you noticed a bad push at +50 that is moveing all the weight over the front wheels.. -50 is moveing the weight over the rear wheels correct.?? I would think a front engine car like the M3 would do better with the weight moved to the rear -50.. And someone was correct moveing the slidder does not show the weight changeing front to rear on the bias scale but like all other things that are screwed up folks say it changes how the car handles even without the bias showing a difference.. Is that true do most of ya go faster with the weight moved from the middle of the car. Since you dont add weight they shouldnt of let this in the game. MOST cars dont have a moveable weight in them stock lol..
- 5,547
- Bel Air, MD
- NOVA-0479
Adrenaline
This is exactly how I percieve this to be. If you consider the average car battery weighs 40-50lbs, that weight and where its's placed can make a difference. Think of the seesaw effect. Most stock battery placement is on a front corner, forward of the front axle, or if relocated is moved into the trunk behind the rear axle. Now 40lbs sitting directly on the axle is 40lbs. Moving the same 40lbs forward or behind an axle and how much one way or the other has a leveraging effect which causes that same 40lbs to have a multiplied effect. Example: Take a bag of dog food, and place it on your shoulder (equivilent to axle), then try and hold the same bag in your hand. It feels like a ton in your hand compared to on your shoulder. Same effect with a car. I have noticed it makes a difference in handlng without adding weight. For me, if the car understeers, I move weight to the front, and if it oversteers its placed to the rear. Hope this helps.
I believe as other have mentioned adjusting the Ballast Position from zero to -50 or +50 as a fine tuning feature works for certain cars. Modifying a cars weight seems to be taboo for many however a necessary evil at times to achieve balance in a car. Adjusting ballast position with or without weight should fall under the fine turning category once the effort has been made to get a car driving to ones style.
- 5,812
- shmogt
It does nothing. All in your head. You are probably doing some laps getting used to the car than moving ballast with no weight and doing more laps and notice you are better. If you didn't move it and just did those extra laps you would of been better anyway due to more laps to get used to the car.
- 3,359
- California
- PumpinNumbies
- 3,359
- California
- PumpinNumbies
I feel like it's a simple decision. Try it on any car and track you feel you can consistently record lap times with. It will only be noticeable on cars that have a slight tendency to either under or oversteer. If you notice a difference, congratulations, you have an additional tool in your arsenal. If you don't notice a difference, congratulations, you never have to waste your time adjusting it again. It's literally a win/win, that only requires you to care enough to test for yourself. Even in the worst case scenario, if you can't provide a test consistent enough to feel or measure the differences (or lack thereof), then the point is moot anyways.
- 11,207
- Adrian, Mich.
- cargorat323
- CargoRatt
- 5,812
- shmogt
Ya pretty much drive 10 laps with your tune. That will give you more than enough laps to truly get to know the car. See what your fastest times are and the feel for the car. Than move just the ballast and drive another 10. I promise your times will not move. Maybe you will beat the top time of your last 10 laps, but it just be fluke and by a super small amount.
It used to but there was a patch that fixed it. Pre-patch you would see the distribution change on cars that were 'close' ie. a 55/45 car that was almost 54/46 would flip over if you moved 0 weight to the back and in come cases the PP would change to ( + 1 ) reflect the improved distribution.
Dont remember which patch addressed it, it was a while back.
Dont remember which patch addressed it, it was a while back.
- 12,641
- paracuru
- praiano63
I did a test.
I took a car very well balanced i`m tuning now, Ferrari california 550PP sport soft.
Put sport hard tires on it and went to Nurburgring GP/D. I know perfectly the track and i´m able to drive on it at the speed the tires allow with the tune, staying on the same good driving line during each turns.
1 test : lap with ballast position 0 and 0 kg ballast, stay all the test with this ghost.
2 test : lap with ballast position -50 front and 0 kg ballast, the direction is more heavy , the car show more under-steer, the ghost at same speed stay more inside the corner to apex, out corner the car show more over-steer tendency at acceleration.
3 test: lap with ballast position +50 rear and 0 kg ballast, the direction is lighter and more responsive with more eagerness and front grip ,can reach the apex more easy, but the car can over-steer a little if to fast on entry. Out the corner the rear is more planted and you can accelerate earlier without over-steer.
4 test: i repeat the stage 2 and 3 with 20 kg ballast and i feel the reaction of the car the same , but with more projection for the same tendencies.
My conclusion: Moving the beer box at position +50 or -50 with 0 kg ballast is the same like adding 20 kg ballast more or less, but without the handicap of some more extra KG.
Some cars needs ballast more than others.
><(((((°>°°°°°°°°°°°°°
I took a car very well balanced i`m tuning now, Ferrari california 550PP sport soft.
Put sport hard tires on it and went to Nurburgring GP/D. I know perfectly the track and i´m able to drive on it at the speed the tires allow with the tune, staying on the same good driving line during each turns.
1 test : lap with ballast position 0 and 0 kg ballast, stay all the test with this ghost.
2 test : lap with ballast position -50 front and 0 kg ballast, the direction is more heavy , the car show more under-steer, the ghost at same speed stay more inside the corner to apex, out corner the car show more over-steer tendency at acceleration.
3 test: lap with ballast position +50 rear and 0 kg ballast, the direction is lighter and more responsive with more eagerness and front grip ,can reach the apex more easy, but the car can over-steer a little if to fast on entry. Out the corner the rear is more planted and you can accelerate earlier without over-steer.
4 test: i repeat the stage 2 and 3 with 20 kg ballast and i feel the reaction of the car the same , but with more projection for the same tendencies.
My conclusion: Moving the beer box at position +50 or -50 with 0 kg ballast is the same like adding 20 kg ballast more or less, but without the handicap of some more extra KG.
Some cars needs ballast more than others.
><(((((°>°°°°°°°°°°°°°
- 4,803
- Dearborn, MI
- MotorCtyHamilton
Good test praiano. I trust your skills on the ring.
To the community: What is the consensus so far? There is a handling difference in moving less than 1% of ballast (a case of beer) around the car? Would 1% of ballast really make that much difference or is this just one more item that PD programmed poorly?
To the community: What is the consensus so far? There is a handling difference in moving less than 1% of ballast (a case of beer) around the car? Would 1% of ballast really make that much difference or is this just one more item that PD programmed poorly?
- 12,641
- paracuru
- praiano63
I will publish my ferrari california now, check it online, the tune is with 0 kg ballast at position + 50. Go online and check the diff between + 50 and - 50. Much clear more than offline. No doubt .
EDIT: https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?p=6714808#post6714808
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- 5,814
- Hillsboro Oregon
- XDesperado67
- XDesperado67
Very bad programming if it does have an effect. Last time I checked the result of moving nothing was nothing...
