Best of the Boring, "Maytag" Sedans: $30-40K

  • Thread starter Thread starter YSSMAN
  • 27 comments
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What is the Best "Maytag" Sedan Available Today?

  • Lexus ES350

    Votes: 2 8.7%

  • Buick Lucerne

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Ford Fivehundred

    Votes: 1 4.3%

  • Hyundai Azera

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Kia Amanti

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Lincoln Zephyr

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Mercury Montego

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Nissan Maxima

    Votes: 6 26.1%

  • Volkswagen Passat

    Votes: 5 21.7%

  • Volvo S80

    Votes: 9 39.1%

  • OTHER

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Total voters
    23
YSSMAN

YSSMAN

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After reading the recent review of the new Lexus ES350 I thought that we should get some bickering done over some boring sedans. Thats right, front-wheel drive, disconected, every-day, Maytag sedans...

So here are the options:
- Lexus ES350
- Toyota Avalon
- Buick Lucerne
- Ford Fivehundred
- Hyundai Azera
- Kia Amanti
- Lincoln Zephyr
- Mercury Montego
- VW Passat
- Volvo S80
- Nissan Maxima

Yes, I did not include many of the favorites in the sedan categories. It was purposly created to leave out any RWD option, as these are the cars that most average buyers look for.

-----

My vote was a tough one to cast, but I ended up following my VAG loving heart, and I went with the Passat.

Yes, she is VERY expensive. But with price comes great performance with stellar looks, extremely actractive and comfortable interior, and a powerful VR6 engine that rivals most other engines that have a larger displacement. Generally speaking, the elegance of the car is generally unmatched, and as the comercials state, it truely does have the "Lowest Ego Emissions" of any other car in it's class.

The only thing standing in the way of the Passat was the Buick Lucerne. Start the flame war now, but I just can't help loving that car. The prices are quite low considering it's size and the available 4.6L Northstar V8, as top models will most certainly never crest the $40K mark. The car is extremely comfortable, given the fact that so many old folks go for the Buicks, and I would say that the looks are quite nice as well. Lots of chrome make the car stand out just a bit in black or red, but otherwise, it is just another "Maytag" sedan fighting for the money of "Empty Nesters" and other retirees (or pensioners as the Britons would say).

So, what say you?
 
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I hate to start a fire, nor look like a Lexus Fanboy, but who in their right mind is ever comparing a Lexus ES to any BMW 3-series? Nobody, that's who. It's merely presented as a price comparison.

Trust me, ES = boring, but you get a loaner car. Avalon = boring, but it's cheaper. The ES finally loses that lousy "pause-o-matic" auto transmisson for a new 6-speed one that's 1000 times more responsive, but it's a bigger car, rides on more whipped cream, and has the vagued steering I've driven since the Mercury Grand Marquis. But damn, it's full of neat options and build quality is quite good so far. Personally, I was hoping for more of a Euro-R/TSX competitor, but instead we got...more "more", that's what.

I'd probably take the Passat too, having driven a few of them before (previous-generation models, though). But none of these choices are emotionally involving cars on any level other than reliability, convienence, and all-round day-to-day, A-to-B ability.

Shouldn't there be an Acura or Honda represented in your list?
 
I must say I agree with YSSMAN's assertion on the Lucerne, as it has come so far from the Regal that it makes it's overpriced brother the DeVille look like the contrived pig it always has been. However, I am on a firm standing that it is still not as good as the old Avalon. For old people, there is no substitute for an Avalon. But then came Hyundai. The Azera is so far ahead of the XG350 that it's like they are from two completely different eras. It's everything the Avalon is, but better looking (I love the lines on the front) and cheaper. The Passat is too unrefined in noise insulation to compare to either of the three. However, my personal best would have to be the Volvo S80. It's rediculously fast. It can handle if you need it to. And it can be fun.
One question: Wheres the Camry? It's about as exciting as a paper bag. It should be included in name as well. I mean, the ES350 is the same thing anyways.
 
Poverty, do you know what the S80's drag coefficient is? I'd assume it would be lower than the last one, being more swoopy in style, but the old one was about the lowest any production car has ever had (.28) besides the Lexus LS (which had .26), so I don't know.
 
-> I might say, that the Ford Five Hundred is the pinnacle of boredness. Just look at it, even compared to the cop-loving Crown Victoria, the Crown Vic looks cool. The Montego (500's twin/cousin) on the other hand, has HID's and LED tailights in which its a tad cooler. The S80 I think is more fun to drive than the roly-poly handling of the 500. The Avalon may boring to most people but not the touring edition, the car is just overly refined (just like the smaller ES350). And to top it all off, it only has 202hp and 207lb-ft for a car that weighs close to 4000 lbs. :indiff:

-> The Five Hundred is just that, pure blandness:

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The S80 for me. It's now a looker, a performer, and, ahem, it's safe as hel...err...heaven. It's simple yet has high quality like the Passat. And it's use-it-all-year-and-not-get-stuck-in-the-snow-even-with-your-summer-tires AWD. It may be a Volvo and therefore a liberal-pansy-machine, or it may be a Volvo, thereby being different from everything alse and standing out in a crowd. In my mind it's the latter. Blame it on Gran Turismo. And you know, that dash is even more modern looking than the 2006 Maytags. Sweet.
 
Wow, I'd figure this would be an easy victory for the Maxima. The 6spd SE model is just fast as **** period--it feels like its ripping your face off. It's not boring, it's got great build quality, it looks fan-freaking-tastic, and it's Japanese. The S80 takes a VERY close second place--and I love Volvos, but the Maxima to me just is more fun to drive and is anything but BORING. How can a car with this much torque-steer be boring! The S60 gets my vote over any Altima (including SE-R) if we went down a "notch" in the model line.

P.S. I loved the new Maxima before I actually both either one of mine--after buying both of mine it solidified the fact that I love my Maximas. :sly:
 
It was a fairly close top four for me, followed by a bunch of other cars I wouldn't take a second glance at.
1. Nissan Maxima. VQ35 + six speed = Sedan heaven.
2. Volvo S80. Attractive styling, and very safe.
3. Volkswagen Passat. Refined and efficient, and it's German.
4. Buick Lucerne. It's playing catch-up, but that Northstar will whisk it up a few spots.
 
Sorry I haven't posted in a bit, I've been busy playing NASCAR with some friends of mine...

1) The whole comparison was meant to include the larger "full-size" seadans, so cars like the Impala, Camry, Accord, etc were left out.
2) RWD were left out because this is the "Maytag" appliance competition. I'm not looking for something fast, just a simple FWD/AWD sedan that 99% of most people will have in their lifetime. Thus cars like the 3-series, G35, TL, etc were left out.
3) Keep in mind that the price target is $30-40K, and certainly some of the best cars in their respective segments couldn't make the cut. Vehicles would have included the Acura RL and Audi A6 just to name two, but there are limitations here.

---

It would be an interesting comparison to get the new Volvo S8 V8 together with the ES350 and Lucerne CXS 4.6. All are packing nearly 300 BHP, and are considered to be segment leaders (in some respects) from their respective countries of origin.

...I think I'd be pulling for the Lucerne deep down inside, but if I had to pick one, I would probably spend the extra money on the Volvo as it certainly looks better on the inside and outside, and with that lovely Yahmaha V8, it can still pack a punch as well.
 
Subaru Legacy. Quality, performance, and great features for a great price. Good looking, as well.
 
Oops, I guess I forgot about the Legacy! But I think I would have gone with the Outback sedan and wagon over the Legacy, as the model is a bit "sporty" don't you think?
 
Why is that Lexus boring ? Really depends on what you like, if you put the Lexus in the list, put in the 3series BMW, the MB_class etc, personal taste, nothing more imo. I read that you want to leave out RWD cars, but that doesn't ake a lot of sense to me...
 
He's purposely eliminating the 'enthusiast' cars - limiting it to the FWD Consumer-Reports-mobiles only. The larger Mom & Pop cars.

On that note, I'm voting S80, though if we were limited to FWD but had a slightly more aggressive car list, I'd take the Acura TL perhaps. My next option would be the Maxima, after the TL. I'd have to drive the 3 of them back to back and see which felt the most in tune.
 
Duke
He's purposely eliminating the 'enthusiast' cars - limiting it to the FWD Consumer-Reports-mobiles only. The larger Mom & Pop cars.

.
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Oh well... We have a Honda Civic Type R in our family, that car is more fun than the average RWD car. But I understand that a Civic Type R is no 2 ton Lexus. But take the latest 3-series BMW. I've driven one recently and all the electronics pretty much kill the fun. ( I know that you can turn it off ;))
So what is YSSMAN'S definition of "boring"? The looks ? If that is at least a factor, there is no reason no leave oput RWD cars. Since I do not agree that FWD cars have to be boring. Civic Type R as I said, but I've also driven a 190 hp Accord, was fun, not doubt about it.

Don't get me wrong, it's his thread and he can limit the carlist just as he wants, but it doesn't make sense imo.
The Lexus above has a luxory setting. Of course it is not as sporty as a 3.30 BMW. But "boring" is not the right word imo. Different setup with hard suspension and that V6 might be a lot of fun. And I like the looks, both outside and inside. I don't think that it is boring. My personal opinion I know, but still....
 
Max_DC
So what is YSSMAN'S definition of "boring"? The looks ? If that is at least a factor, there is no reason no leave oput RWD cars.
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I chose to make this thread after reading the review of the new Lexus ES350. As it was classified as "unerwhelming" and "boring," I thought it would be fun to get a few punches thrown around by attempting to name the best of the "Maytag" (Maytag is a brand of washing machines and dryers in the US, appliances) sedans available in North America. I suppose I could have thrown in the C6/607 from Europe, as I want the big FWD sedans that older folks tend to drive.

...It may not make complete sense, but it is something different to bicker about being that there isnt a BMW or Mercedes in the mix. Those are "too exciting" and "too expensive" for people in this segment, and given the $30-40K price LIMIT in this test, it pretty much pushes out cars like the 3-series (too small, RWD) and the E-Class (right size, too expensive, RWD).

Most folks in the US (and presumably Canada) get to a point in their life when the fun is done. "No more!" they will scream from the rooftops, and immediately thereafter they will head for the local car dealer and buy the biggest, sloppy, uninvolving sedan money can buy. The segment used to be dominated by cars such as the Buick Park Avenue, Oldsmobile Aurora, Chrysler Concorde, etc. But with the deaths of Oldsmobile and the Concorde (now the be replaced by the 300C Long Wheelbase), Buick was left alone to fight against the rising star that is Lexus, and a sloo of other "boring" sedans.

It is hard to describe the feeling these cars generate without driving one yourself. It isn't necessiarily that they are bad, they are actually quite quiet and comfortble (hence why the older folks buy them), but they have sloppy suspensions, tires that roll over in a 15 MPH turn, and generally uncommunicative sterring that leaves one to the Sandman as to the fact if one will fall asleep at the wheel or not.

...So do you understand now?
 
just google imaged the lexus and my word it looks like a toyota. Where does that car fit in with the LS and GS?
 
YSSMAN
I chose to make this thread after reading the review of the new Lexus ES350. As it was classified as "unerwhelming" and "boring," I thought it would be fun to get a few punches thrown around by attempting to name the best of the "Maytag" (Maytag is a brand of washing machines and dryers in the US, appliances) sedans available in North America. I suppose I could have thrown in the C6/607 from Europe, as I want the big FWD sedans that older folks tend to drive.

...It may not make complete sense, but it is something different to bicker about being that there isnt a BMW or Mercedes in the mix. Those are "too exciting" and "too expensive" for people in this segment, and given the $30-40K price LIMIT in this test, it pretty much pushes out cars like the 3-series (too small, RWD) and the E-Class (right size, too expensive, RWD).

Most folks in the US (and presumably Canada) get to a point in their life when the fun is done. "No more!" they will scream from the rooftops, and immediately thereafter they will head for the local car dealer and buy the biggest, sloppy, uninvolving sedan money can buy. The segment used to be dominated by cars such as the Buick Park Avenue, Oldsmobile Aurora, Chrysler Concorde, etc. But with the deaths of Oldsmobile and the Concorde (now the be replaced by the 300C Long Wheelbase), Buick was left alone to fight against the rising star that is Lexus, and a sloo of other "boring" sedans.

It is hard to describe the feeling these cars generate without driving one yourself. It isn't necessiarily that they are bad, they are actually quite quiet and comfortble (hence why the older folks buy them), but they have sloppy suspensions, tires that roll over in a 15 MPH turn, and generally uncommunicative sterring that leaves one to the Sandman as to the fact if one will fall asleep at the wheel or not.

...So do you understand now?
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:lol: Got it... I know what you mean. Then again, has a Passat bad suspension and more room than a BMW 3 series/ MB c-class...
And is the Lexus really boring compared to other cars ? I mean, isn't it maybe just the personal opinion of the author ? But hey whatever, I now understand the purpose of this thread and therefor I don't need to go into this direction any further. I would vote, but I have too little knowledge about the American cars in that list and I'd just assume that there are "worse"(in terms of your boring definition) cars in that list than the brand new quality Lexus with nice styling imo.
 
@ Poverty: The Lexus ES350 share's it's basis with the Toyota Camry, and thus is the "base" Lexus in their North American lineup.

@ Max_DC: I probably should have thrown in a few more European models, but I really couldn't think of many that were large enough, cheap enough, and powered through the front wheels other than the C6/607. But isn't Hyundai selling the Azera there? And I'm sure the Lexus, VW, and Volvo are there as well...

Are there really that many good FWD models that go for that cheap in Europe? I suppose $30-$40K USD would translate to about the same ammount in Euros, but as for the equal in GBP, it doesn't make a whole lot of sense, given the strange exchange rates and the whole tax thing over there.

To give it a rough estimate in terms of BMWs, we would be looking for something that is about the size of a 5-series, but at the price of a 325 or 330 sedan.
 
If I may ask, where is that in relation to a BMW 3-series?

Our crappy exchange rates between the US and UK cause a lot of problems, added to that is your stupid taxes on damn-near everything. Good thing ya'all have high wages and the other socialistic stuff, as we couldn't pull it off in the US.

...Just to put things in perspective, the most expensive car listed above which I belive is the ES350 (when fully-loaded), would sell for £27K.
 

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