British Pronunciation of words ending in "r"

[Sprite]

Stephen Fry is wrapping up a new series on Language from around the globe so maybe he will have the answers. I personally pronounce Day-ter too and Water as Wat-err that really gets on the Fieance's nerves.

I find coming from Yorkshire we tend to remove T an H from allot of words like Hospital we tend to say Oss-pi-ell, my mum however who was originally from Bolton Lankashire she say things like Scoo instead of School Buzz instead of Bus and Sters instead of Stairs and that difference of language change is only separated by a small set of hills called the Pennines.

 

[Famine]

If anyone needs advice on English pronunciation just switch on the BBC London news.

Perhaps when they stop saying Wens-deh, Sekke-terry and Droh-ring instead of Wednesday, Secretary and Drawing.

 

[Blitz187]

Well, if you want to talk about spelling vs pronunciation reform, it is Mark Twain, that most American of wits who hit the nail square on the head:

For example, in Year 1 that useless letter "c" would be dropped to be replased either by "k" or "s", and likewise "x" would no longer be part of the alphabet. The only kase in which "c" would be retained would be the "ch" formation, which will be dealt with later. Year 2 might reform "w" spelling, so that "which" and "one" would take the same konsonant, wile Year 3 might well abolish "y" replasing it with "i" and Iear 4 might fiks the "g/j" anomali wonse and for all. Jenerally, then, the improvement would kontinue iear bai iear with Iear 5 doing awai with useless double konsonants, and Iears 6-12 or so modifaiing vowlz and the rimeining voist and unvoist konsonants. Bai Iear 15 or sou, it wud fainali bi posibl tu meik ius ov thi ridandant letez "c", "y" and "x" — bai now jast a memori in the maindz ov ould doderez — tu riplais "ch", "sh", and "th" rispektivli. Fainali, xen, aafte sam 20 iers ov orxogrefkl riform, wi wud hev a lojikl, kohirnt speling in ius xrewawt xe Ingliy-spiking werld.

Just reading through this thread and have to say that this post here is GENIUS... 👍 Wish I could quote that in my Sig...

 

[PureAwesomeness]

I'll admit I haven't read the whole thread but my guess from reading the OP and the example quote from Star Trek is that pronunciation of a word like 'data' will change depending on the word that follows it. In the example quoted the following word also starts with a vowel sound 'and'. It just feels unnatural to have two vowel sounds next to each other in an utterance like this - you have to force yourself to stop mid sentence in order to make both vowel sounds. That 'r' sound is inserted to maintain the flow of speech.

*edit* Just had time to read through the whole thread and I see a couple of people had already made the same point as me.

 

[W3H5]

Perhaps when they stop saying Wens-deh, Sekke-terry and Droh-ring instead of Wednesday, Secretary and Drawing.

Errrr.... Good point.

 

[Famine]

I've genuinely never heard anyone except my wife pronounce Wednesday correctly - with both Ds.

 

[blaaah]

Perhaps we should change days of the week to:
Oneday Twoday Wensleydale Turdsday Fryday, Edam and Chedder.

Don't ask me why.

 

[Famine]

Or just remember that "Wednesday" derives from "Woden's Day" and isn't said in a manner that is significantly different.

As a Sheffield Wednesday supporter, this one irks me. Moreso when sports coverage and publications contract my team's name to "Sheffield Weds", which is moronic.

 

[Liquid]

Or just remember that "Wednesday" derives from "Woden's Day" and isn't said in a manner that is significantly different

Is that true? I did not know that. I just assumed the first D was a silent letter. I use 'Wednesday' as a contraction of Sheffield Wednesday but I don't pronounce the first D. Sheff Wed is definitely an odd contraction.

Reading is a homonym. Words that are spelt the same and therefore look the same but pronounced differently. Different to homophones, which sound the same but look/are spelt different.

Reading is a slightly odd homonym though because it's other meaning is a pronoun, and not a 'conventional' noun or adjective etc. Bank and Tire are better examples. Bow is special because it's both a homonym and a homophone at the same time.

 

[blaaah]

Does anyone else get that feeling sometimes when you think of a word, usually a short one, and as you think of it and say it the less it makes sense and just sounds weird and you wonder how you used to use it so normally for years.
I remember repeating the word EGG to myself many times thinking it ridiculous..

 

[daan]

I find the name "University of Reading" amusing. I would have thought that most students would be able to read by the time they go to university.

 

[Famine]

Is that true? I did not know that. I just assumed the first D was a silent letter.

Absolutely no-one would notice if you missed the first D. On the basis that language evolves through common use, it's probably now the correct way of saying it. But yes, the "correct" way of saying it runs the D and N together as you would with "Woden" (itself an Old English corruption of "Odin")

Amazing, the Norse and Germanic influence on our days of the week... We accept "Sun day", "Moon day", "Woden's day", "Thor's day", "Freya's day" and "Saturn's day" - but few people have ever considered why "Tuesday" is called "Tuesday". What's a Tue and why do we need an entire day for it*?

I use 'Wednesday' as a contraction of Sheffield Wednesday but I don't pronounce the first D. Sheff Wed is definitely an odd contraction.

Wednesday is fine. Sheffield Wed/Sheff Wed is fine. Sheffield Weds isn't.

Personally I use "crap" or "nil" as a contraction of Sheffield Wednesday.


*Tiw/Teiws, the Germanic equivalent of Tyr, the Norse god of fighting and victory. Germanic and proto-Germanic languages use Tyr for Tuesday - tysdag (Norwegian), tirsdag (Danish), tisdag (Swedish), thrijudagur (Icelandic). Tyr's Roman equivalent is Mars and Romance and Celtic languages call Tiw's day "Mars day" - mardi (French), Martes (Spanish), Martedi (Italian), dies Martis (Latin), di-mairt (Gaelic), dydd mawrth (Welsh)

 

[Blitz187]

Thats interesting that Thursday = Thor's day... Now I understand why in Dutch they say "Donderdag"... "Donder" meaning "thunder" by itself... Thanks Famine... Learned something new again 👍

 

[Owen.C93]

Or just remember that "Wednesday" derives from "Woden's Day" and isn't said in a manner that is significantly different.

As a Sheffield Wednesday supporter, this one irks me. Moreso when sports coverage and publications contract my team's name to "Sheffield Weds", which is moronic.

I only say it the "correct" way because in school to help with spelling we were told to say it like wed-nes-day.

Weirdly we were told not to pronounce it like that though.

 

[Liquid]

Thats interesting that Thursday = Thor's day... Now I understand why in Dutch they say "Donderdag"... "Donder" meaning "thunder" by itself... Thanks Famine... Learned something new again 👍

Donnerstag in German meaning Thunder too.

Going on 'Tuesday' it's interesting that you Famine mention Teiws being a Germanic version of Tyr, but German has Dienstag for Tuesday. Dien being a stem of 'dienen' which means 'to serve'.

Mawrth, Welsh for Mars, does mean Tuesday (Literally, Dydd Mawrth = Day Mars) but Mawrth is also the name for Mars the planet and March the month, with the English word March also deriving from Mars.

 

[W3H5]

As a Sheffield Wednesday supporter, this one irks me. Moreso when sports coverage and publications contract my team's name to "Sheffield Weds", which is moronic.

I'm a wezstam fan. < It throws off a lot off people with this pronunciation.

And for the record according to Wiki -

The English name is derived from Old English Tiwesdæg and Middle English Tewesday. This was a loan translation of Latin dies Martis, originally associating the day with the planet Mars. The Germanic name translates Mars, the god of war, as Teiwaz (Old English Tiw).

 

[maSonn09]

I find the name "University of Reading" amusing. I would have thought that most students would be able to read by the time they go to university.

I can see you've been reading the book of smartassery.

 

[Famine]

It's a better read than the book of dumbassery - but with fewer pictures.

 

[maSonn09]

It's a better read than the book of dumbassery - but with fewer pictures.

Won't appeal to me then. 👎

 

[dabest2500]

As an Asian, I find it hard to pronounce "r"
I would say "rock" as "wok" and "wrong" as "wong".
So now I have to use the word "incorrect"

 

[Aldo]

As an Asian, I find it hard to pronounce "r"
I would say "rock" as "wok" and "wrong" as "wong".
So now I have to use the word "incorrect"

Incowect?

 

[dabest2500]

Incowect?

I have no problems saying "incorrect" for some reason