Cars pushing in the corners recently

[Racecar2020]

Is it just me, or are all the cars pushing way more since a couple of weeks ago?
It is most noticeable on the Suzuka daily race. Every turn, not just the hairpin, I struggle to get grip in the fronts. And once it's pushing there's no way to get any grip back till the next turn.

 

[bduddy]

It's just you. Are you driving faster?

 

[Racecar2020]

I'm driving as fast as always.
I play with controller btw.
It's like, when the car used to push it would still turn, just not as quickly, and letting off the gas would give the front wheels grip again.
Now letting off the gas doesnt even give anymore grip, even if I try not steering as much. The only way to turn remotely fast is getting the car loose, which is not much of an option because loose is almost impossible to control with a controller.

 

[eran0004]

I haven’t noticed any change.

 

[kjeldsen]

delete

 

[GT PRO-AM]

I had the GR3 Mercedez 20 with a 3 bias to the rear tires. In Race C that made it easier to turn into corners.

This BB setting (towards the rear) also helps for tyre wear on front tyres and, on hybrid cars, for KERS, IIRC.

 

[Pigems]

If you’re still dragging a small amount of brake, you won’t get full rotation, gotta get fully off the brakes mid corner, or the cars won’t turn. It’s a GT quirk, it shouldn’t work like that realistically.

 

[TumeK5]

If you’re still dragging a small amount of brake, you won’t get full rotation, gotta get fully off the brakes mid corner, or the cars won’t turn. It’s a GT quirk, it shouldn’t work like that realistically.

I actually hate this, I'm so used to trail braking from the time in other sims, but it's hard to break the habit of slightly pressing the brake. It's one of my weaknesses in GT7.

 

[Pigems]

I actually hate this, I'm so used to trail braking from the time in other sims, but it's hard to break the habit of slightly pressing the brake. It's one of my weaknesses in GT7.

Same, dragging the brake should shift weight forward and give me more front end grip, not less, it’s pretty dumb. I combat it by having 12.5-15.5% dead zone at the start of my brake pedal, because I just can’t seem to brake the habit of dragging brakes mid corner lol. It’s annoying, but it works.

 

[kjeldsen]

delete

 

[Pigems]

How does it work without ABS or with ABS Light?

I’m not sure about No ABS. I’ve been running ABS Weak for a few months now, apparently it’s the new meta over Default. Trail braking is slightly worse than default, but straight line braking is better. I’m not sure about no ABS, it’s never been the meta setting before, so I’ve not ever spent much time driving without it. 🤔

 

[newmedia_dev]

I wouldn't recommend no ABS on controller or wheel if I'm honest. It's nigh on impossible to use in close racing situations where a simple quick panic stab ends up in a full lock up.

Interestingly ABS weak should be better for trail braking as you can control the rotation better (and why in the real world you want ABS and TC off for most cars on a track day)

Being completely honest I don't think most people would notice the difference between weak and default in the game.

 

[eran0004]

If you’re still dragging a small amount of brake, you won’t get full rotation, gotta get fully off the brakes mid corner, or the cars won’t turn. It’s a GT quirk, it shouldn’t work like that realistically.

I think the problem is that you apply too much brakes. With ABS on it’s difficult to tell how hard you’re actually braking, I would suggest turning it off when practicing trail braking.

Interestingly ABS weak should be better for trail braking as you can control the rotation better (and why in the real world you want ABS and TC off for most cars on a track day)

ABS on default adjusts the brake pressure to allow you more steering under hard braking. ABS on weak doesn’t take steering into consideration, it just adjusts the brake pressure to prevent lockup. So when trail braking with ABS on weak you need to adjust the brake pressure manually.

 

[fastone371]

I think the problem is that you apply too much brakes. With ABS on it’s difficult to tell how hard you’re actually braking, I would suggest turning it off when practicing trail braking.


ABS on default adjusts the brake pressure to allow you more steering under hard braking. ABS on weak doesn’t take steering into consideration, it just adjusts the brake pressure to prevent lockup. So when trail braking with ABS on weak you need to adjust the brake pressure manually.

If I have a car that seems a little more difficult to turn sometimes I turn ABS off to set brake balance then switch ABS back to weak. It's kinda hard to tell if you too much front or rear brake with ABS on.

 

[Pigems]

I think the problem is that you apply too much brakes. With ABS on it’s difficult to tell how hard you’re actually braking, I would suggest turning it off when practicing trail braking.


ABS on default adjusts the brake pressure to allow you more steering under hard braking. ABS on weak doesn’t take steering into consideration, it just adjusts the brake pressure to prevent lockup. So when trail braking with ABS on weak you need to adjust the brake pressure manually.

It’s not too much brake, it’s just holding that last 5-10% on too deep into the corner. You can literally feel/watch the car rotate more the moment you release that last little bit mid corner. It’s just a GT thing, you go ask any alien, and something one must learn to work around to be fast in this game. Much like the quickly shifting in some cars, the tuning, adjusting the cockpit cam to shift CoG in the car, or even just using every last pixel of allowable “track”.

 

[jrbabbitt]

The Limited Slip Differential if set differently will cause this "pushing" or understeer as it is known...

 

[eran0004]

It’s not too much brake, it’s just holding that last 5-10% on too deep into the corner.

Try ABS off and see how the car reacts with those 5-10%.

 

[newmedia_dev]

I think the problem is that you apply too much brakes. With ABS on it’s difficult to tell how hard you’re actually braking, I would suggest turning it off when practicing trail braking.


ABS on default adjusts the brake pressure to allow you more steering under hard braking. ABS on weak doesn’t take steering into consideration, it just adjusts the brake pressure to prevent lockup. So when trail braking with ABS on weak you need to adjust the brake pressure manually.

That's not true.

ABS default is like a road car, it intervenes at the first sign of slip.

ABS weak waits a bit before cutting in, allowing more pressure/slip before cutting in. This allows you to deliberately overstep the front end grip. But eventually it still cuts the power or releases the calipers to allow the wheels to rotate for grip vs slip.

Both are steering independent in the game as they measure wheel slip grip, now combined with ASM then that makes sense but it's ASM that is looking at steering angle vs velocity and direction.

 

[eran0004]

That's not true.

Both are steering independent in the game as they measure wheel slip grip, now combined with ASM then that makes sense but it's ASM that is looking at steering angle vs velocity and direction.

ASM uses differential braking to control the yaw of the car, i.e. reducing excessive over- and understeer. The ABS default setting reduces the brake pressure to give you more grip while turning.

 

[newmedia_dev]

That is literally what I said?

Edit:

To be very clear "Anti locking Braking Systems" rely on the tire turning to provide grip.

That is what they do default or weak, they allow a wheel to rotate which gives control grip.

It's when they cut in is the difference, with weak it cuts in later.

There are pros and cons. I'd argue that a good percentage of players just stick to default and it's not brake fidelity or trail braking that is causing their understeer or their performance.

View attachment 1329183

ASM uses differential braking to control the yaw of the car, i.e. reducing excessive over- and understeer. The ABS default setting reduces the brake pressure to give you more grip while turning.

 

[eran0004]

That is literally what I said?

You said it was not true.

That's not true.

 

[newmedia_dev]

ABS on default adjusts the brake pressure to allow you more steering under hard braking. ABS on weak doesn’t take steering into consideration, it just adjusts the brake pressure to prevent lockup. So when trail braking with ABS on weak you need to adjust the brake pressure manually.

That is not true. It has nothing to do with brake pressure.

It has to do with wheel slip.

Edit:

Go do a wet race, and tell me if it's pressure or wheel slip that triggers ABS

You obviously have to use the brakes for anti lock braking to work

 

[fastone371]

The way that ABS works in real life is that each wheel has a wheel speed sensor, when this WSS sees 1, 2, or more wheels not spinning it temporarily pulses brake pressure to the affected wheels until they are all rotating at the same speed. The programming of the ECU that controls ABS is a lot more complicated than what I explained but that is the gist of it. ABS never increases grip, it just reduces the amount of grip lost by locking a wheel.

 

[eran0004]

That is not true. It has nothing to do with brake pressure.

It has to do with wheel slip.

The ABS controls the brake pressure. It’s triggered by wheel slip, but it doesn’t control the wheel slip, not in a direct sense. The wheel slip, in turn, is influenced by the brake pressure (among other things).

Edit:

Go do a wet race, and tell me if it's pressure or wheel slip that triggers ABS

You obviously have to use the brakes for anti lock braking to work

I think you have misunderstood something. What do you believe such an experiment will show and how is it related to the discussion we’re having?

 

[Racecar2020]

If you have ABS active going into a corner then cars will push, soft tires will help or with some cars playing with the brake balance also helps. I had the GR3 Mercedez 20 with a 3 bias to the rear tires. In Race C that made it easier to turn into corners.

The way that ABS works in real life is that each wheel has a wheel speed sensor, when this WSS sees 1, 2, or more wheels not spinning it temporarily pulses brake pressure to the affected wheels until they are all rotating at the same speed. The programming of the ECU that controls ABS is a lot more complicated than what I explained but that is the gist of it. ABS never increases grip, it just reduces the amount of grip lost by locking a wheel.

Thank you so much. That's very informative, and I will try some races tonight.

 

[ILLEAGLE_34]

It’s not too much brake, it’s just holding that last 5-10% on too deep into the corner. You can literally feel/watch the car rotate more the moment you release that last little bit mid corner. It’s just a GT thing, you go ask any alien, and something one must learn to work around to be fast in this game. Much like the quickly shifting in some cars, the tuning, adjusting the cockpit cam to shift CoG in the car, or even just using every last pixel of allowable “track”.

So what’s the deal with the cockpit cam position and CoG? I’ve only heard about it once briefly 🍻

 

[Pigems]

So what’s the deal with the cockpit cam position and CoG? I’ve only heard about it once briefly 🍻

I can’t say I’ve noticed any/much difference when I tried it. But the just of it is, and this is for each car individually, adjust the cockpit cam, to adjust the CoG of the car slightly. As if the camera PoV, is the CoG, and where you move it up/down/front/back, it slightly adjust the cars CoG along with it. Allegedly/Supposedly.

 

[ILLEAGLE_34]

I can’t say I’ve noticed any/much difference when I tried it. But the just of it is, and this is for each car individually, adjust the cockpit cam, to adjust the CoG of the car slightly. As if the camera PoV, is the CoG, and where you move it up/down/front/back, it slightly adjust the cars CoG along with it. Allegedly/Supposedly.

Interesting 🧐. I heard that about the front/back camera position. Tried it out a few times and I thought I could feel a difference between max front/max back settings🤷🏼‍♂️ kinda felt like an even milder version of BB.Good to know that it’s car specific which makes sense now that I think about it. The up/down part is new to me. So thanks a lot now I have a few more settings to fiddle **** around with constantly🍻

 

[Meythia]

As if the camera PoV, is the CoG, and where you move it up/down/front/back, it slightly adjust the cars CoG along with it. Allegedly/Supposedly.

This could propably be verified by watching tyrewear with different camera settings.

 

[bigmull]

Seems to me like you need to look at your LSD settings.They can usually mitigate or even eliminate under or oversteer when applied correctly.